http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* Bed Bath & Beyond - ridiculous gifts, laughable prices - 5 messages, 5
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3145bb7ec51f39ae?hl=en
* 10 Things the Food Industry Doesn't Want You to Know - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/255b376899016709?hl=en
* Doorbell always uses electricity! - 15 messages, 7 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3198294a289e9e57?hl=en
* anyone make a wifi finder with internet telephone capabilities? - 2 messages,
1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/81d9c571716583a4?hl=en
* Hello From New Member - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e9263bed5078e2a6?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bed Bath & Beyond - ridiculous gifts, laughable prices
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3145bb7ec51f39ae?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:21 pm
From: Bert Hyman
In news:i8gmi4hlq2n4sq3c0qt8034qb7r2qjpug3@4ax.com Patricia Martin
Steward <patstew@noteranews.com> wrote:
> And finally, my favorite: a "do-it-yourself electric BACK HAIR SHAVER
> for $40!!!!
Maybe they're trying to pick up the slack left by Sharper Image.
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN bert@iphouse.com
== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:25 pm
From: Vic Smith
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 19:16:26 -0500, Patricia Martin Steward
<patstew@noteranews.com> wrote:
>Got their flyer in the mail today, and I was laughing out loud at some
>of the "gifts" they're selling (I'm rounding prices up on those ending
>in .99):
>
>wine chiller - $100 (I put mine in the fridge for free)
>single-serve coffee brewer - $200 (my four-cup Mr. Coffee cost $14.99)
>espresso maker - $230
>knife set - $200
>Aerogarden to grow herbs - $150
>Proper Positioning bed pillow - $80
>Braun shaver - $250 AFTER rebate
>
>And finally, my favorite: a "do-it-yourself electric BACK HAIR SHAVER
>for $40!!!!
>
>I can only think they had this printed before the economy went down
>the drain.
Some common stuff seems pretty high too.
I was just pricing maple cutting boards, and dough boards.
In fact I just got my wife a dough board and the thing cost 28 bucks,
38 with shipping. Hers recently broke when she was tenderizing pork
chops.
Probably not too frugal.
But it guarantees she'll keep the pierogi coming.
That's a lot of value right there.
--Vic
== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:35 pm
From: itsjoannotjoann@webtv.net
On Nov 24, 6:25 pm, Vic Smith <thismailautodele...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Some common stuff seems pretty high too.
> I was just pricing maple cutting boards, and dough boards.
> In fact I just got my wife a dough board and the thing cost 28 bucks,
> 38 with shipping. Hers recently broke when she was tenderizing pork
> chops.
> Probably not too frugal.
>
>
They have 20% off coupons all the time and you can use 5 at a time for
5 purchases. They also have no expiration date even though one is
actually printed on the coupon. The coupons can save you a nice bit
of change.
== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:28 pm
From: BeaForoni
On Nov 24, 4:16 pm, Patricia Martin Steward <pats...@noteranews.com>
wrote:
> Got their flyer in the mail today, and I was laughing out loud at some
> of the "gifts" they're selling (I'm rounding prices up on those ending
> in .99):
>
> wine chiller - $100 (I put mine in the fridge for free)
> single-serve coffee brewer - $200 (my four-cup Mr. Coffee cost $14.99)
> espresso maker - $230
> knife set - $200
> Aerogarden to grow herbs - $150
> Proper Positioning bed pillow - $80
> Braun shaver - $250 AFTER rebate
>
> And finally, my favorite: a "do-it-yourself electric BACK HAIR SHAVER
> for $40!!!!
>
> I can only think they had this printed before the economy went down
> the drain.
>
> --
> "This is our moment. This is our time - to put our people back to work and open doors of opportunity for our kids;
> to restore prosperity and promote the cause of peace; to reclaim the American Dream and reaffirm that fundamental
> truth - that out of many, we are one; that while we breathe, we hope, and where we are met with cynicism, and doubt,
> and those who tell us that we can't, we will respond with that timeless creed that sums up the spirit of a people:
> Yes We Can." President-elect Barack Obama, November, 4, 2008
> ** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com**
You notice higher prices and I'm seeing lower prices. Gas for under
$2.00 a gallon. Then I saw a commercial for Chrysler, it had Sebring
convertibles for around $9,000 and PT Cruisers for less than $10,000.
Wish I had some money.
== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 6:22 pm
From: NoSpamForMe@LousyISP.gov
Patricia Martin Steward <patstew@noteranews.com> wrote:
>Got their flyer in the mail today, and I was laughing out loud at some
>of the "gifts" they're selling (I'm rounding prices up on those ending
>in .99):
>wine chiller - $100 (I put mine in the fridge for free)
And if your fridge is full? Given the proliferation of "refrigerate
after opening" on everything that's not too hard to do. Besides where
are you going to store the bottles? The "wine cellar" doesn't cost
much more than a new cabinet from (say) Ikea. Of course the
electricity to run it makes it uneconomical but you can always leave
the thing unplugged and just fire it up over the holidays.
>single-serve coffee brewer - $200 (my four-cup Mr. Coffee cost $14.99)
And if you happen to be a yuppie rushing off to his power job raping
the economy what use are the other 3 cups? Let's also not forget that
these "single serve" items are puck machines so the speed of making
that one cup vastly exceeds your el-cheapo anachronism... "Mr. Coffee"
indeed!
>espresso maker - $230
Much too cheap. A good espresso maker is in the $1500 and up range
although over about $5000 the improvements are mainly in the volume
(e.g., six cups at a time). The el-cheapo $230 machine doesn't have
the power to make a good espresso. Check out the "crema" (the froth on
the top); in a good machine there'll be a visible strong long-lasting
head: on a #230 special you'll be lucky to get any at all. This lack
of power manifests itself in cappuccino too. Insufficient power means
a lack of tight bubbles in the milk. Look at Dunkin' Donuts
cappuccino: dirty dishwater! OTOH lots of no-taste-buds Americans
actually prefer Dunkin' Donuts. Probably the ones who have Mr. Coffee
machines <g>.
>knife set - $200
What's wrong with this. You do realize you get what you pay for. The
poor quality of the 99 cent stores's chef's knife will soon become
apparent, something that's of critical importance if you're NOT a
world class chef.
>Aerogarden to grow herbs - $150
This one I agree with. The kids bought us one of these last year. I
wanted to junk it immediately after they left but the wife persuaded
me to keep it for a few months. Then we junked it! And these kids knew
that my wife keeps window boxes of herbs that she brings inside each
winter. Why would we need a herb garden?
>Proper Positioning bed pillow - $80
I don't know what this is.
>Braun shaver - $250 AFTER rebate
Sounds a little expensive.
>And finally, my favorite: a "do-it-yourself electric BACK HAIR SHAVER
>for $40!!!!
Ah, but you're not thinking like a now-unemployed (hopefully) mortgage
broking yuppie. He has to shave his back for his date with Mrs
Potential Yuppette. He could go to the spa where they'll do it for him
or he could use this machine. I mean how else do you expect him to
reach between his shoulder blades? Of course as a present this could
be a little like giving someone a box of deodorants. Get the hint!
>I can only think they had this printed before the economy went down
>the drain.
Probably but they have to unload all those imports in the pipeline.
Look for some big reductions.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: 10 Things the Food Industry Doesn't Want You to Know
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/255b376899016709?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:28 pm
From: Vic Smith
On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 00:15:46 +0000 (UTC), don@manx.misty.com (Don
Klipstein) wrote:
>In article <ggetu3$t94$1@aioe.org>, h wrote:
>>
>>"tyuj" <tyuj@apam.com> wrote in message
>>news:6p09ksF5jufhU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "tyuj" appears to me to be Rod Speed.
Ya think?
Hope that's not a pig ignorant lie.
If so
Your problem.
etc,etc.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:10 pm
From: "h"
"Seerialmom" <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b6dc861d-f083-4174-97f6-1e3597841c14@x16g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 24, 10:21 am, "tyuj" <t...@apam.com> wrote:
> h <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote
>
> > SoCalMike <mikein562athotm...@hotmail.com> wrote
> >> h wrote
> >>> Tim Campbell <timc...@sbcglobal.net> wrote
> >>>> 10 Things the Food Industry Doesn't Want You to Know
> >>> All you really need to do is declare high fructose corn syrup unfit
> >>> for human consumption, like most other civilized
> >>> countries.
> >> which countries have banned it? what are their obesity rates?
> > Canada and I believe most Latin American countries.
>
> You're wrong/lying.
>
> > I don't know if it's completely banned in the EU, but they have strict
> > quotas on the production of non-sugar
> > (sucrose/cane) sweeteners,
>
> Pig ignorant lie.
>
> > so it can't be used much if at all in Europe.
>
> Another pig ignorant lie.
>
> > HFCS should not be consumed by humans.
>
> Another pig ignorant lie.
>
> > I can't believe anyone would eat anything with that poison in it.
>
> Your problem.
>
> > It's not like it even tastes good. Yuck.
>
> Your problem.
>>Is this Rod Speed in disguise??
Sounds like. I plonked Rod ages ago, but I seem to remember him loving the
phrase "pig ignorant lie". Of course, that could have been some other
plonker.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Doorbell always uses electricity!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3198294a289e9e57?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:36 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <koihi45tsffjvtj65ks30lpr9r7hbu0dqd@4ax.com>, letterman@inv*.* wrote:
>The thing is, there is a doorbell that does not need any electrical
>power. Simply mount a nice looking brass bell on the wall next to the
>door, using a bracket. Drill a small hole in the wall a couple feet
>above the bell, and attach a piece of nylon string to the bell. Push
>the other end of the string thru the hole in the wall and let it hang
>outside. Put a nice wooden bead on the end of the string. Then place
>a sign that reads "PULL STRING FOR DOORBELL".
>
>Cost: The price of the bell, bracket, string and bead. No further
>costs for life, and no electrical energy needed ever.
You just reminded me of the doorbell at "Neighborhood Bike Works", AKA
"The Bike Church". That outfit uses some space at a church.
There is a sign sying, as best as I remember: "Pull brake lever to ring
doorbell".
They have a handlebar mounted onto something or other close to the
handrail for the stairway for that offbeat entrance into the church
complex. The brake lever is connected to a brake cable, that is routed
through a small diameter hole in the exterior wall. Apparently, the other
end of the brake cable pulls the lever on a bicycle bell that is suitably
mounted.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 2 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:48 pm
From: "Craig M"
Raising the frequency also is easier to rectify and filter the sine wave
out, to give DC voltage.
"Gary H" <garyh@notspammable.invalid> wrote in message
news:hocli49h4tdjpafvbcn88cpa4ngaduug44@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 08:17:33 -0500, George <george@nospam.invalid>
> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
> >But the Chi Coms need to meet our requirements if it is sold here. I
> >can't remember the last time I saw a new walwart that wasn't a much more
> >efficient switcher design instead of an inefficient transformer.
>
> The new wall-warts are smaller, but it's NOT by eliminating the
> transformer. These new ones begin with an AC-to-AC converter, that
> operates on line voltage and raises the frequency. A higher frequency
> requires a smaller transformer.
>
> "Switcher" refers to a more efficient voltage regulator, that controls
> the DC output by turning it on and off rather than by wasting power
> like a linear regulator (as in older wall warts) does. This also makes
> it smaller by reducing the need for a heat sink.
== 3 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:22 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <40c66d71-3ccd-4ec0-9c63-d8a772443a55@x14g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>,
meow2222@care2.com wrote:
>Jim Redelfs wrote:
<SNIP what was already said>
>
>The other point worth making is that the power and cost figures for
>standby power are routinely exaggerated.
The ones I mentioned in this thread are actual measurements. I have a
watt meter!
> Those with political interest
>in having everyone else unplug everything are either not competent in
>the subject, or are happy to be lses than honest to try to motivate
>others to unplug.
>
>And of course, biggest of all... youve only got one life, try to spend
>the time doing something useful. Speaking of which.... later.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 4 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:38 pm
From: The Daring Dufas
Don Klipstein wrote:
> In <koihi45tsffjvtj65ks30lpr9r7hbu0dqd@4ax.com>, letterman@inv*.* wrote:
>
>> The thing is, there is a doorbell that does not need any electrical
>> power. Simply mount a nice looking brass bell on the wall next to the
>> door, using a bracket. Drill a small hole in the wall a couple feet
>> above the bell, and attach a piece of nylon string to the bell. Push
>> the other end of the string thru the hole in the wall and let it hang
>> outside. Put a nice wooden bead on the end of the string. Then place
>> a sign that reads "PULL STRING FOR DOORBELL".
>>
>> Cost: The price of the bell, bracket, string and bead. No further
>> costs for life, and no electrical energy needed ever.
>
> You just reminded me of the doorbell at "Neighborhood Bike Works", AKA
> "The Bike Church". That outfit uses some space at a church.
>
> There is a sign sying, as best as I remember: "Pull brake lever to ring
> doorbell".
>
> They have a handlebar mounted onto something or other close to the
> handrail for the stairway for that offbeat entrance into the church
> complex. The brake lever is connected to a brake cable, that is routed
> through a small diameter hole in the exterior wall. Apparently, the other
> end of the brake cable pulls the lever on a bicycle bell that is suitably
> mounted.
>
> - Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
My favorite doorbell buttons:
TDD
== 5 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:40 pm
From: Sam E
On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 05:27:10 +1100, "Rod Speed"
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip]
>
>They dont have any transformer that uses power all the time.
Possible with any wall-wart you add a switch to. Making it automatic
would be tricky, without power to turn it back on.
>
>> "Switcher" refers to a more efficient voltage regulator,
>
>Wrong. It always refers to what you listed above.
>
That's one of the many varieties of "always" that are strangely
non-inclusive. Maybe you've never heard of "switching regulators", but
I have a lot.
The AC-to-AC converter allows a smaller, lighter transformer (which I
expect draws less power with 0 load).. Perhaps you mistake "low power"
for "no power". That sort of mistake is very common.
[snip]
== 6 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:44 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <jim.redelfs-A71F17.08411224112008@news.west.cox.net>, Jim Redelfs said:
>In <slrngik5tt.2cu.don@manx.misty.com>, don@manx.misty.com wrote:
>
>> A household's idling load from low power constant loads
>> can somewhat easily be 30 watts or more.
>
>At .10/kWh, that amounts to ~$26.30/year.
And if I can reduce that by 60-75% or so with 2-3 power strips?
>I can EASILY live with that. If that figure were to triple, I might
>CONSIDER eliminating "idling load". (Nice term, BTW)
>
>I would more likely follow my own advice and hang out to dry a few loads
>of laundry that would otherwise be dried in the electric clothes dryer.
Many apartment buildings forbid outdoor clothes drying. If I was
very severely frugal in such places, I would use indoor clotheslines when
temperature and humidity are favorable for such.
Thankfully I have yet to experience having any of my clothes dried in an
electric clothes dryer at age well into the 40's. My experience is that
clothes driers got their heat from natural gas - although in one apartment
building I lived in, with electric stoves as opposed to gas ones, the
driers had a "fuel oil" odor.
Also consider that in the metro areas of NYC, Philadelphia and Chicago,
most residential electricity costs more like 14 cents per KWH. And in the
portion of the Philly area served by what was formerly PECO, during a
defined summer period monthly consumption past 500 or 600 or whatever KWH
gets billed at more like 18 cents per KWH.
(From memory - I did not actually drag into my view my electric bill
for last August. I will do so if my figures from my memory are disputed.)
Getting aggressive against "idling load" can somewhat easily reduce
power consumption by close to 10 KWH per month, plus another 2, maybe even
3 KWH per month during air conditioning season. At 18 cents or even if it
is 16 cents per KWH in most of the Philly area for electricity consumption
past 500-600 KWH per month during air conditioning season, I see a couple
bucks per month in savings. At other times of the year, I see $1.25-$1.50
per month in savings from being aggressive against "phantom load" in/near
Philly, NYC and Chicago.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 7 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:45 pm
From: Mark Lloyd
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 18:48:06 -0600, "Craig M"
<craig_6444@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>Raising the frequency also is easier to rectify and filter the sine wave
>out, to give DC voltage.
>
Yes, and there's also less iron in a high-frequency transformer,
making it lighter.
BTW, I have a new USB hub with a 5V2.1A wall wart that's MUCH lighter
than the "brick" we would have had once.
>"Gary H" <garyh@notspammable.invalid> wrote in message
>news:hocli49h4tdjpafvbcn88cpa4ngaduug44@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 08:17:33 -0500, George <george@nospam.invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>> >But the Chi Coms need to meet our requirements if it is sold here. I
>> >can't remember the last time I saw a new walwart that wasn't a much more
>> >efficient switcher design instead of an inefficient transformer.
>>
>> The new wall-warts are smaller, but it's NOT by eliminating the
>> transformer. These new ones begin with an AC-to-AC converter, that
>> operates on line voltage and raises the frequency. A higher frequency
>> requires a smaller transformer.
>>
>> "Switcher" refers to a more efficient voltage regulator, that controls
>> the DC output by turning it on and off rather than by wasting power
>> like a linear regulator (as in older wall warts) does. This also makes
>> it smaller by reducing the need for a heat sink.
>
--
31 days until the winter solstice celebration
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
"The government of the United States is not, in
any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
== 8 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 5:53 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <25e0d9b9-8c38-43f1-bf19-0814a1c84df3@v13g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,
hallerb@aol.com wrote:
>On Nov 23, 10:25=EF=BF=BDpm, d...@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein) wrote:
<What I said in favor of switching off idling loads>
>tv life expectancy and othewr deevices may be less,turned off from
>thermal cycle shock.
I find that highly overrated. I even find extrapolation from burnouts
of incandescent lightbulbs - disproportionately upon cold start. However,
incandescent lightbulbs that have aged into a condition unable to survive
a cold start have their remaining hours already numbered (in lower double
digits), and the main relevant filament failure mode progresses at a rate
that accelerates worse than exponentially!
>DTV boxes use idle time to download guide updates and other utilities.
Mine is constantly powered so far since I have yet to powerstrip it (and
my TV). I have yet to notice it being updated for anything since 1 hour
after I first successfully used it!
I oughtta get off my butt and get a power strip for my TV and my DTV
box!
>its not a free lunch
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 9 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 6:12 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <slrngikde2.ij9.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>, AZ Nomad said:
>On 11/24/08 04:51:49 +0 UTC, Don Klipstein <don@manx.misty.com> wrote:
>>In article <0p3ki4pdd1pm2ojaqa7qer3h3r69f27dql@4ax.com>, Jim Elbrecht said:
>>>On 11/23/08 15:18:47 -0800, "Bill" <billnomailnospamx@yahoo.com> said:
>>>
>>>>I've gone through my home and examined *every* electrical gadget,
>>>>appliance, etc.
>>>>
>>>>98% of the products I have use electricity when not being used! 98%!!!!
>>>-snip-
>>>
>>>I would be interested in seeing your list of 50 or 100 items and
>>>especially interested in seeing how much electricity they use.
>><SNIP from here>
>
>> If it's merely 60-70% of everything and their usage-while-off is 3-5% of
>>electric bill of 1/4-1/3 of people with electric bills, that is still
>>significant!
>
>Not really. You get far better return on your time and money by going
>after the 95-97%. Turn lights off when not in use.
I already do that.
> Unclog the line from the dryer.
I have yet to live where dryer exhaust lines spend any significant time
being clogged, and I have yet to know anyone allowing me to detect such
clogs!
> Go with a more efficient water heater and fridge if they're ancient.
I agree here - mainly for the fridge!
Spending a thousand dollars worth of time and supplies
>to trim off $2/month is insanity.
Spending $20-$30 in a high-spending-in-this-area-year is actually
frugal. If that is insane, then I am proudly insane!
> It is the high wattage items that matter. Not three dozen quarter watt
>items that don't add up to 5 watts or to a whole ten dollars a year.
But my contention is that "phantom loads" consist highly of items
drawing 1/2 watt, 1 watt, 2 watts, and in one instance 4-5 watts (my
computer when "off"), and in another instance 10-11 watts when off (my
TV).
I see sanity rather than insanity to buy a couple power strips to chip
down electric bill by $2 per month!
I also see how such contention of mine does not dispute need to reduce
energy consumption in "more major" areas!
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 10 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 6:20 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In article <ggdejc$312a$1@mail.fiawol.org>, J. Cochran wrote:
>In article <6ou6mrF5apobU1@mid.individual.net>,
>Bill <billnomailnospamx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>I've gone through my home and examined *every* electrical gadget, appliance,
>>etc.
>>
>>98% of the products I have use electricity when not being used! 98%!!!!
>>
>>Things which have no reason to use power when off! Things which used to have
>>a regular on/off switch.
>>
>>Seems to me someone wants me to be using more electricity!
>>
>>So I post on the internet that I am shutting this stuff off and I get a good
>>number of responses NOT wanting me to do this!
>
>And I can easily tell you why.
>Take a close look at your first article in this rather long thread.
>Now using just that article, don't you see a rather nasty potential for
>injuring or killing someone?
>
>So the immediate reaction from the people reading is
>
>"What an IDIOT! He wants to save a couple of cents per month at the risk
>of potentially killing someone! I have got to stop someone else from doing
>something this stupid and also potentially harming someone else"
Did not the idea suggested here involve "Romex" and an appropriate
v120V-rated pushbutton switch?
>Then later in the tread, you mention actually using a GFCI and wiring
>everything to code, etc., etc., etc. But you totally ignore anything
>involving return on investment. In order to save pennies, you spend 10s of
>dollars. Not a rational choice, but it is your choice.
Savings can easily amount to $1.50-$2 per year. Deepending on value of
labor to accomplish such, possibly even in a family's "entertainment
buidget", at least some families can find such a project to be more
worthwhile than earning money to put into "safer" investments/savings.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 11 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 7:01 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
Sam E <no.email@all.invalid> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>> Gary H <garyh@notspammable.invalid> wrote
>>> George <george@nospam.invalid> wrote
>>>> But the Chi Coms need to meet our requirements if it is sold here. I
>>>> can't remember the last time I saw a new walwart that wasn't a much
>>>> more efficient switcher design instead of an inefficient transformer.
>>> The new wall-warts are smaller, but it's NOT by eliminating the
>>> transformer. These new ones begin with an AC-to-AC converter,
>>> that operates on line voltage and raises the frequency. A higher
>>> frequency requires a smaller transformer.
>> They dont have any transformer that uses power all the time.
> Possible with any wall-wart you add a switch to. Making it
> automatic would be tricky, without power to turn it back on.
Makes a lot more sense to use a modern switchmode wallwart instead.
>>> "Switcher" refers to a more efficient voltage regulator,
>> Wrong. It always refers to what you listed above.
> That's one of the many varieties of "always" that are strangely non-inclusive.
I meant to say 'also' not 'always'. I dont proof read my posts.
> Maybe you've never heard of "switching regulators",
Fraid so.
> but I have a lot.
> The AC-to-AC converter allows a smaller, lighter transformer
> (which I expect draws less power with 0 load)..
You dont know they are AC to AC.
> Perhaps you mistake "low power" for "no power".
I never said anything about no power.
> That sort of mistake is very common.
There is no mistake except with the use of the word always.
== 12 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 7:03 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In article <bmhki49saq83nargbpombl5l59qev7eic2@4ax.com>, Vic Smith wrote:
>On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 00:37:48 -0500 (EST), jdc@mail.fiawol.org (J.
>Cochran) wrote:
>
>>In article <6ou6mrF5apobU1@mid.individual.net>,
>>Bill <billnomailnospamx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>I've gone through my home and examined *every* electrical gadget, appliance,
>>>etc.
>>>
>>>98% of the products I have use electricity when not being used! 98%!!!!
>>>
>>>Things which have no reason to use power when off! Things which used to have
>>>a regular on/off switch.
>>>
>>>Seems to me someone wants me to be using more electricity!
>>>
>>>So I post on the internet that I am shutting this stuff off and I get a good
>>>number of responses NOT wanting me to do this!
>>
>>And I can easily tell you why.
>>Take a close look at your first article in this rather long thread.
>>Now using just that article, don't you see a rather nasty potential for
>>injuring or killing someone?
>>
>>So the immediate reaction from the people reading is
>>
>>"What an IDIOT! He wants to save a couple of cents per month at the risk
>>of potentially killing someone! I have got to stop someone else from doing
>>something this stupid and also potentially harming someone else"
>>
>>Then later in the tread, you mention actually using a GFCI and wiring
>>everything to code, etc., etc., etc. But you totally ignore anything
>>involving return on investment. In order to save pennies, you spend 10s of
>>dollars. Not a rational choice, but it is your choice.
>
>I take issue with your assertion that this a long thread.
>We haven't even begun to put a value on "Pride of Ownership."
>Forget about the 120 volt welcome to strangers.
>That's a distraction from the real issue.
>Which is "Pride of Ownership."
>Whether it be your home or the apartment you are renting, consider
>this: The first impression you make on a visitor is your door, your
>doormat, and your doorbell or knocker.
I surely got a positive impression from the "Bike Church" in that area!
Use human power to burn off a few of the exxcessive calories that
Americans usually take in!
>Also your house/apartment numbering if you care to be found.
That I surely agree with!
>Take care of them and they will take care of you.
Do unto others what you want others to do unto you - the "Golden Rule"!
Whether you consider that originated by an embodiment of the Lord of All
Gods or by a "mere major prophet" (my words) or by someone who merely
managed to "channel The Force" about 2,000 years ago...
>I'm giving my daughter a new door mat for Christmas.
>Its color complements her home decor.
>Not the usual "Welcome."
>It says "Go Away."
>She may not think it appropriate. I leave the decision in her hands.
I like the non-worded doormats.
I also like the sign in the window of the front door (or posted on the
front door if the front door lacks a window and is owned by a landlord and
permitted by the landlord): NEVER MIND THE DOG - BEWARE OF OWNER! Such
as owner of the dog, or owner of defensive weapon should dogs only be
allowed on basis of "guide animals". The sign along that route usually
has a picture of close-range view down-the-barrel view of a large caliber
revolver. I do note that the "owner in question" often carries a handgun
other than a revolver, so I consider merely carrying a handgun of any kind
negates "any grounds of false advertising" on basis of mechanism or
caliber size of whatever sidearm is carried by the "owner" that warns that
a handgun is warned against in a posting!
>Whatever she decides, a doormat is the smile your entryway presents to
>the world at large. But maybe not that one.
>This doormat costs 5 bucks.
>Yes, for as little as 5 bucks you can present an image to the world
>that says what you want it to say.
I would still want my doormat to, if anything as to what it says,
"Please wipe your shoes here"!
Sign at eye level on the front door should say where permissible,
"Never Mind The Dog - Beware Of Owner!", along with a picture of
down-the-barrel view of a handgun.
Otherwise, have a sign saying "Beware Of Dog" - preferably with a
"Photoshopped" "somewhat reasonable" image of your dog (or the one you
don't actually have) causing grievous injury to someone, preferably in a
way likely to result in a hospital admission and days in the Intensive
Care Unit!
>That's many years of the transformer electricity savings being
>discussed. And much more valuable IN THE LONG RUN.
>Return on investment?
>What price "Pride of Ownership?" That's real ROI.
>Until the depths are plumbed trying our best to answer the real
>question - What price "Pride of Ownnership" - it is fruitless to waste
>time on transformer pennies.
>That's my strong belief. Others may disagree.
<SNIP a bit from here>
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 13 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 7:07 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In <334b57d1-782f-4d7d-b5a8-1038bc7f3495@s20g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>,
meow2222@care2.com wrote:
<SNIP to link quoted>
>proper analysis:
>http://www.wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=3DCFL_Lamps
I followed such link and my results were:
"There is currently no text in this page, you can search for this page
title in other pages or edit this page."
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
== 14 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 7:16 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
In article <C_ydnWF-CvyZmrbUnZ2dnUVZ_vninZ2d@posted.visi>, Dave Garland wrote:
>hallerb@aol.com wrote:
> > the outlet strip likely has a power on light of some sort wasting
>> power when its on..
>
>But not when it's off :) And that power is probably returned manyfold
>by virtue of the fact that the light reminds you that the other things
>plugged in are continuing to use power, so you turn it off sooner.
>
>In any case, mostly the power-on light is a switch with something like a
>built-in NE-2 (1/17 watt) bulb. No big deal.
>
>> individually the amount wasted is likely small, however nationwide for
>> everyone it must add up and waste is waste.....
>
>It's true. But we need to maintain a sense of proportionality. A
>single person running central air sucks as much power (3-20KW) as
>150,000 outlet strip indicator lights.
Sometimes true, usually less than true since a power strip light
consumes often around 1/4 watt. Merely 80,000 of such "lighted power
strips" (my words) amounts to high end of your range for "central air".
Also consider that "air conditioning" by most who have such is in a
minority of each year.
And furthermore, when "phantom loads" consume several watts, during air
conditioning season the A/C burden is increased by a few watts.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty,com)
== 15 of 15 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 7:24 pm
From: clare@snyder.on.ca
On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 01:22:33 +0000 (UTC), don@manx.misty.com (Don
Klipstein) wrote:
>In <40c66d71-3ccd-4ec0-9c63-d8a772443a55@x14g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>,
>meow2222@care2.com wrote:
>
>>Jim Redelfs wrote:
><SNIP what was already said>
>>
>>The other point worth making is that the power and cost figures for
>>standby power are routinely exaggerated.
>
> The ones I mentioned in this thread are actual measurements. I have a
>watt meter!
>
>> Those with political interest
>>in having everyone else unplug everything are either not competent in
>>the subject, or are happy to be lses than honest to try to motivate
>>others to unplug.
>>
>>And of course, biggest of all... youve only got one life, try to spend
>>the time doing something useful. Speaking of which.... later.
>
> - Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
I have quite an assortment of "wall warts" and other assorted power
supplies for devices that have been discarded over the years.
All of them work.
I tested 19 of them for idle current draw on a digital meter that
reeds to the closes 0.01 amp.
6 of the 19 registered no parasitic draw at all, and the rest varied
from .02 to .06 amps
Additionally:
My PC draws .05A
The charger for my Craftsman battery drill draws 0.05A
Both battery chargers for nicads / nimh batteries showed no idle
current at all.
A 200watt Variac shows no draw at all.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: anyone make a wifi finder with internet telephone capabilities?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/81d9c571716583a4?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:43 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Nov 20, 7:11 pm, Shawn Hirn <s...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In article <gg4ddp$uu...@aioe.org>, OhioGuy <n...@none.net> wrote:
> > > Not for $200 but closer to $299-359 you can buy one of those nifty new
> > > micro PC's. I picked up one at Target recently. The Asus EeePC runs
>
> > Hmm - was hoping for something a bit smaller. Anyone used a pocket
> > pc with voip?
>
> > Doesn't absolutely HAVE to be Yahoo Messenger, but I would prefer it
> > to be able to use any available Windows CE app. If I don't like one, I
> > could try something else.
>
> An Apple iPhone or an iPod touch might do what you want.
iPod Touch is definitely a "not" because it doesn't have a microphone
connector; just a speaker. Not sure about the iPhone.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:45 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Nov 23, 4:52 pm, SoCalMike <mikein562athotm...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> OhioGuy wrote:
> > I'm wondering if anyone makes some sort of pocket pc that is wifi
> > enabled, and has enough 'horsepower' to run Yahoo Messenger?
>
> > I'd like something like that that would work with a plain vanilla
> > headset, and let me do voice calls over the Internet whenever the thing
> > finds an open wifi hotspot.
>
> > Obviously, I can buy a laptop for $400 that will do this, but I was
> > hoping that by now there would be something smaller with the same
> > capabilities, and hopefully cheaper. ($200 or less)
>
> > Can anyone point me in the right direction?
>
> > Thanks!
>
> maybe not what youre looking for, but the acer netbook is a 2lb laptop
> and costs about $350. small, light weight, but not pocket sized.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I'm tellin' ya...it's a nifty looking device and if it's bought at
Costco you've got an automatic extended warranty as well. Plus the
keyboard is just the right size, not too small and not full sized.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hello From New Member
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e9263bed5078e2a6?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 24 2008 4:46 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Nov 24, 10:42 am, fruitpie <debmmm2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Nov 24, 10:32 am, Dennis <dg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 19:36:27 -0600, hchick...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 16:08:40 -0800 (PST), fruitpie
> > ><debmmm2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > >>Hi,
>
> > >>I'm new to this site because I thought I could learn something. But,
> > >>it seems the site is spammed with tennis shoe sales. Is this normal
> > >>or does this site really have interactive discussions?
>
> > >It used to. Set your filters to delete nike and rod, and you might
> > >see enough legit posts to continue.
>
> > >Was there something in particular you wanted to know?
>
> > I've been wondering where to find the best sales on tennis shoes. Any
> > ideas?
>
> > Dennis (evil)
> > --
> > "There is a fine line between participation and mockery" - Wally
>
> Oh Dennis, you are evil. I don't exactly have any questions yet but I
> am sure I will. I hope to move to Mexico in the next 15 months (to
> retire) and will want to look into different ways to use energy when
> building a home. But, with the way things are in the states right
> now, it may be longer then 15 months before I retire. Thanks for the
> filter suggestion. I will have to try that.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Not to try and discourage you from this newsgroup but there are some
"alternate" websites that address what you're looking for. Treehugger
comes to mind.
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