Frugal Living: 25 new messages in 16 topics

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: An Allentown house
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9a111237f5724e25?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 12:18 am
From: nicksanspam@ece.villanova.edu

>We might have 2 motorized dampers, fully-open or fully-closed, like this:
>
> ----------------------------
> .a motor r motor . |
> .d <--> a <--> . |
> .a fd . | heat water with sunspace
> .m <== ai <== . 2' |
> .p na . |
> .e st . s |
> .r o 2' . u |
> |.......---r--sdamper-| n | s
> | | ^ | s | o
> | v | | p | u
> | room | a | t
> | air | c | t
> | | e | h
> . .s |
> . sunspace .d |
> . air .a ^ |
> . ==> .m | |
> . .p | |
> . .e |
> . .r |
> ----------------------------
>
>with this simple logic:
>
>house tank sunspace upper upper
><70? <140? >70? >140?| sdamp adamp fans pump notes
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>0 0 - - | up up off off default
>0 1 - 1 | down up on on heat tank
>1 0 0 - | up down on on heat house with tank
>1 0 1 - | down down on off heat house with sunspace
>1 1 1 1 | down down on on heat house and tank

We could lower the sdamper with an SPDT thermostat and 2 power darlingtons
when the sunspace is warmer than 80 F, like this, viewed in a fixed font:

sw* (open if ss<80 F)
+12 -------|----------------------------
| |
| sw 1K |
---X------------www---| |
| |
limit - open when - open when
switches | fully up | fully down
| |
| down |
| ----> |
|------sdamper------|
| |
| |----------------www---|
| | |
/ 1K / c |
-----www--| sw --www--|p TIP120 |
| \ \ e |
| | | |
| - - |
| |
---------------------------------------------

And lower the adamper whenever the house needs heat, with a setback thermostat
(the setback stores overnight heat in the house thermal mass):

+12 ------------------------------------
| |
/ 1K / e
hw* --www--| hw --www--|n TIP125
\ \ c
| |
| |
- open when - open when
| fully up | fully down
| |
| down |
| ----> |
|------adamper------|
| |
| hw | hw*
|------www---| |----------------www---|
| | |
/ 1K / c |
-----www--| +12 ---X--www--|p TIP120 |
| \ close \ e |
| | for heat | |
| - - |
| |
---------------------------------------------

And run the 2 12V fans when the house needs heat or (the tank needs heat
and the radiator is warmer than the tank) using a differential thermostat:

hw --------------------------------------->|--------- fans in series---|
open if |
tank > 140F |
------------- +12 --X--------|--------->|-------- f
|differential |-------uuu--- |
| | 120V relay | |--- tank
| thermostat |------------- w
------------- w
w
|
-

The pump would run with the fans, except when the sunspace is warm and
tank water is not being heated, with a NOR gate and a 12V relay:

f ---www------------ 120V
| |
/ u |
hw* ---www-----|p u X
| \ e u |
tank ---www-- | | --- pump
- -

As an alternative, we could control the system with a $99 Eway PC and
a single motorized damper and 5 one-wire DS18B20 temperature probes,
which would allow automatic passive room heating with less damper
motion and lower-power pumping after the pipes are full.

Nick

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bush To Let Illegal Aliens Get $40 Digital TV Coupons
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f941e4a655a77d3f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 2:27 am
From: "copeab@yahoo.com"

On Oct 10, 1:44 am, Rob Jensen <ShutUp...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 02:04:41 -0400, Thanatos <atro...@mac.com> wrote:
> >In article <rh0mg3dv69n0nnj27lqbsrh2t450b7e...@4ax.com>,
> > Rob Jensen <ShutUp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >> On Mon, 8 Oct 2007 12:32:57 -0400, William Grosvenor
> >> <billgru...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > I say that we vote for Fred Dalton Thompson and return
> >> > to traditional American family values.
>
> >> But aren't conservatives supposed to hate Hollywood and
> >> everything it stands for?
>
> >No.
>
> Well then, why do they?

Who are "they"? I don't hate Hollywood either.

Brandon

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:29 am
From: trader4@optonline.net

On Oct 6, 11:55 am, bearc...@cruller.invalid wrote:
> In article <atropos-575347.20492905102...@news.giganews.com>,
>
> Thanatos <atro...@mac.com> wrote:
> > In article <bearclaw-8B4B7E.17525205102...@news.supernews.com>,
> > bearc...@cruller.invalid wrote:
>
> > > In article <RPyNi.107992$GO6.96...@newsfe21.lga>,
> > > clams casino <PeterGrif...@drunkin-clam.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Any examples of which (illegal) groups are being over looked?
>
> > > How about the guys that piloted the planes into the WTC?
>
> > They weren't here illegally. They were actually documented foreign
> > nationals. Unfortunately.
>
> Really? So then, how about illegals who have plotted or carried out
> similar actions?
>
> What? There aren't any?

Let's clear up one basic fact here that is incorrect. Three of the
911 hijackers had in fact VIOLATED US IMMIGRATION LAW. Here's an
excerpt from the 911 Commission Report:

""Of the five hijackers who entered the United States more than once,
three of them violated immigration law."

It's true they didn't just walk across the border, but 3 were here in
clear violation of US immigration law. One can only wonder if the US
didn't have what amounts to a "don't ask, don't tell" policy when
dealing with anyone who might be here illegally, if they would have
been caught, checked out and/or deported. But, besides ignoring our
borders, if someone is stopped by the police, in just about all
jurisdictions, they aren't allowed to even question their immigration
status. Here in NJ, the policy has been that even after being caught
and suspected of a felony, an illegal was not reported to INS. They
are routinely released on bail, without regard to their immigration
status, which is beyond belief. The whole purpose of setting bail is
to ensure that they return to court. Only a kook liberal would say
that whether they are here legally or not has no bearing on that
decision. Only after sentencing were they then usually reported to
the INS. That whole process has now come under scrutiny, following
an execution style murder of 3 college students in Newark a few months
ago, where the vicitims were shot and one beheaded. Of the 4
arrested for the murders, 2 were illegal aliens. One of the illegals
was out on bail, despite having been arrested twice before here on
felonies including assault, weapons charges and the rape of a child.

And if anyone with common sense thinks about it, why wouldn't wanted
criminals slip into the USA? In their own country, if they were
wanted and got pulled over, the police would very likely identify them
and arrest them. Here, you can start over again and be shielded by
the liberals, who deny police the right to even question who you are
and where you came from. And I'm sure I'll be called a racist too,
for citing the above Newark example. I think the families of the
victims, who happen to be black, however, would agree that race has
nothing to do with this. It's just common sense law enforcement to
know who is coming into your country and to deport those that are here
illegally.

For those that think allowing 1mil+ unknown persons to walk across the
Mexican border, I'd like to ask this question. Why should that
border be treated any different than any other entry point? Should
we remove all immigration and customs checkpoints at our airports?
And if some pro illegal immigration group wants to start chartering
Boeing 747s, load them up in any 3rd world country and start bringing
millions more uneducated, unskilled and unknown people here to the
land of freedom, is that a good idea? We could start in Haiti or the
Sudan,or parts of India. They are pretty bad off. And if not,
isn't it discrimination against them, by only allowing it to occur at
the MExican border? I expect that will be the next bogus claim and
step down the liberal kook path.

Oh, and one other thing from you, Bear, that I would like to
address. You try to paint anyone that wants to enforce our
immigration laws as racist, which the vast majority of us are not.
Yet in one of your other posts, you feel free to make this comment:

"Just like homosexuals, being a flaming racist doesn't make you not a
racist. "

While uniform enforcement of immigration laws is not racist, your
comment clearly shows you to be a bigot. Sounds just like Archie
Bunker.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Life Insurance - A Boon
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f72cb5482116f720?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 3:05 am
From: InsurInfo

We are living in a hefty world of pain. Who knows what will happen to
us
next?. Imagine, What will happento our family after we pass out? In
this
case Shouldn't we be more careful. It's better to take a life
insurance.
For that point, you need to know more on life insurance. I have a
website
that talks about Life Insurance and has great tips and a guild to
Guide
you to a better Life Insurance Policy. I suggest that everybody checks
it
out.

http://www.theinsurancezone.net

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 4:48 am
From: clams casino

InsurInfo wrote:

>We are living in a hefty world of SPAM. Who knows what will happen to
>us
>next?. Imagine, What will happento our family after we pass out? In
>this
>case Shouldn't we be more careful.
>

>So is it better to sit back and take all this spam or report it? I suggest that everybody report all spam.
>
>
>

Excellent points.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: They turned my electricity off! Geez . . .
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c205655129881297?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 3:26 am
From: Jeff

Tockk wrote:
> I went home tonight, and lo and behold, the power is off to my humble
> domicile. The adjacent apartments have power, so something's up.
>
> Sheesh . . .

Utilities generally let you go for a couple of months before they take
any action. It would be unualy for a disconnection after one month.

>
> As far as I can remember, I've paid my bills . . . so, I went to the Texas
> Public Utility Commission website, and buried deep within its pages is this
> little blurb under the heading "Disconnections:"

A little advice if you want it.

Call them tomorrow and be nice, don't go quoting disconnect terms
off the bat.

Ask the agent for help. Tell him/her that your power was disconnected
and you don't know why. Ask them to look into this and see what they can do.

They will want to help you if you ask for it and don't agravate them.
They get a lot of agravation and they have boiler plate ways of dealing
with that.

Now as far as your email, I've never found that emailing any company
does much of any good, let alone emailing a utility!

Good luck,

Jeff

>
> -----------------
> Prior to disconnecting your service, your REP must provide you with a
> written Disconnection Notice. This notice must be mailed to you separately
> (or hand-delivered) no earlier than the first day after the date your bill
> is due. The disconnection date must be 10 days from the date the notice is
> issued and may not fall on a holiday or weekend (or the day preceding)
> unless the REP's personnel are available to take payments and service can be
> reconnected.
> -----------------
>
> I sure didn't get any kind of disconection notice from these people . . .
>
> Ugh!
>
> Well, I just got through firing off an e-mail to the electric company (Green
> Mountain), and you can bet I'll be talking to them first thing in the
> morning, too.
>
> Anyone ever in a similar situation? Were you tempted to shoot anyone?
>
>
>

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 4:37 am
From: "Bill"

I *know* if I have paid my bills or not. I can see in my check register that
I wrote a check for the bill and the date.

I also *know* that the company received and deposited my check. I can check
my checking account on-line and see that the check has cleared.

I do this every month because in the past my outgoing mail was stolen. (So
companies never received my payments!) These thieves attempt to erase the
name of the company and amount from the check, then rewrite themselves a
check. I had to get a new checking account and the bank stopped payment on
these checks.

Anyway I now take my outgoing mail directly to the post office rather than
mailing outside my house.

"Tockk" wrote in message
>I went home tonight, and lo and behold, the power is off to my humble
>domicile. The adjacent apartments have power, so something's up.
>
> Sheesh . . .
>
> As far as I can remember, I've paid my bills . . . so, I went to the Texas
> Public Utility Commission website, and buried deep within its pages is
> this little blurb under the heading "Disconnections:"
>
> -----------------
> Prior to disconnecting your service, your REP must provide you with a
> written Disconnection Notice. This notice must be mailed to you separately
> (or hand-delivered) no earlier than the first day after the date your bill
> is due. The disconnection date must be 10 days from the date the notice is
> issued and may not fall on a holiday or weekend (or the day preceding)
> unless the REP's personnel are available to take payments and service can
> be reconnected.
> -----------------
>
> I sure didn't get any kind of disconection notice from these people . . .
>
> Ugh!
>
> Well, I just got through firing off an e-mail to the electric company
> (Green Mountain), and you can bet I'll be talking to them first thing in
> the morning, too.
>
> Anyone ever in a similar situation? Were you tempted to shoot anyone?
>
>
>

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 4:55 am
From: clams casino

Tockk wrote:

>I went home tonight, and lo and behold, the power is off to my humble
>domicile. The adjacent apartments have power, so something's up.
>
>
>Anyone ever in a similar situation? Were you tempted to shoot anyone?
>
>
>
>
>
We once came home from a week's vacation, only to find we had no power.
Our neighbors had no problems and the street light our front was glowing.

Something ate through the overhead power line leading to the house. We
were told it was likely a squirrel.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:55 am
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

On Wed, 10 Oct 2007 05:57:58 GMT, "Tockk" <tock1@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>I went home tonight, and lo and behold, the power is off to my humble
>domicile. The adjacent apartments have power, so something's up.
>
>Sheesh . . .
>
>As far as I can remember, I've paid my bills . . . so, I went to the Texas
>Public Utility Commission website, and buried deep within its pages is this
>little blurb under the heading "Disconnections:"
>
>-----------------
>Prior to disconnecting your service, your REP must provide you with a
>written Disconnection Notice. This notice must be mailed to you separately
>(or hand-delivered) no earlier than the first day after the date your bill
>is due. The disconnection date must be 10 days from the date the notice is
>issued and may not fall on a holiday or weekend (or the day preceding)
>unless the REP's personnel are available to take payments and service can be
>reconnected.
>-----------------
>
>I sure didn't get any kind of disconection notice from these people . . .
>
>Ugh!
>
>Well, I just got through firing off an e-mail to the electric company (Green
>Mountain), and you can bet I'll be talking to them first thing in the
>morning, too.
>
>Anyone ever in a similar situation? Were you tempted to shoot anyone?
>
>
Look for a main breaker that was thrown. Sometimes a breaker will
look like it is on, but isn't. You have to trip it to "OFF" and then
use a fair amount of force to bring it back to "ON."

My guess is that if the power company disconnected, it meant to
disconnect someone else in the complex and got the wrong apartment.

We lost power for days after Wilma. Didn't shoot anyone (that I can
remember).

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:30 am
From: Zuke

On Wed, 10 Oct 2007, Tockk wrote:

> I went home tonight, and lo and behold, the power is off to my humble
> domicile. The adjacent apartments have power, so something's up.

Did you check the fuse box?

My water company is quick to start threatening even if I am a day
or two late on the bill. But they always leave notices.

If they cut you off without notice that could be a problem for them.
Especially with all of those cases of t-bone steaks in your
freezer. About $1,000 worth I'd say. Ruined by their negligence.
Tsk, tsk.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: best service!lowest price!!!(www.alibabaunion.com)wholesale nike jrodan
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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/063d3c11f42c12ff?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 4:00 am
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TOPIC: Free post your Classified Ads to TakeAuto.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/61698b29d3354098?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:14 am
From: qingfanghe@sohu.com

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: best price on 2 GB SD card?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3e1069e27c061244?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:15 am
From: qingfanghe@sohu.com

On 10 10 , 2 46 , Dennis <dg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:10:43 -0700, James <jl...@idirect.com> wrote:
> >On Oct 8, 8:42 pm, "OhioGuy" <n...@none.net> wrote:
> >> Anybody know of a great deal on SD cards? I need at least 2 of the 2GB
> >> variety to use in a couple of card readers I have laying around. Thanks!
>
> >Another frugal hint - make sure your device can read 2GB SD cards.
> >Many older card readers, digital cameras and PDAs can only read up to
> >1GB cards. I didn't know this until I read a sign at a local
> >retailler. I then went to check my Palm Tungsten T3, and it will only
> >take up to 1 GB.
>
> Also, depending on what you want to use it for, pay attention to the
> read/write speeds. Many of the cheap SD cards are pretty slow.
>
> Dennis (evil)
> --
> The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
> consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:44 am
From: turtlelover

Dennis wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:10:43 -0700, James <jlinn@idirect.com> wrote:
>
>
>>On Oct 8, 8:42 pm, "OhioGuy" <n...@none.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Anybody know of a great deal on SD cards? I need at least 2 of the 2GB
>>>variety to use in a couple of card readers I have laying around. Thanks!
>>
>>Another frugal hint - make sure your device can read 2GB SD cards.
>>Many older card readers, digital cameras and PDAs can only read up to
>>1GB cards. I didn't know this until I read a sign at a local
>>retailler. I then went to check my Palm Tungsten T3, and it will only
>>take up to 1 GB.
>
>
> Also, depending on what you want to use it for, pay attention to the
> read/write speeds. Many of the cheap SD cards are pretty slow.
>
> Dennis (evil)

I know what you mean about the older cameras. I have an Olympus 2020z that uses a _maximum_ 64MB card. The cards are nowhere to be found ... for a reasonable price, anyway. I wouldn't expect retail locations to use valuable shelf space for "obsolete" (in their eyes) media; however, I would also hope that someone who has one for sale wouldn't expect big bucks for them.

Cheers,
T

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:59 am
From: "Evelyn C. Leeper"

turtlelover wrote:
> Dennis wrote:
>> On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:10:43 -0700, James <jlinn@idirect.com> wrote:
>>> On Oct 8, 8:42 pm, "OhioGuy" <n...@none.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Anybody know of a great deal on SD cards? I need at least 2 of the
>>>> 2GB variety to use in a couple of card readers I have laying around.
>>>
>>> Another frugal hint - make sure your device can read 2GB SD cards.
>>> Many older card readers, digital cameras and PDAs can only read up to
>>> 1GB cards. I didn't know this until I read a sign at a local
>>> retailler. I then went to check my Palm Tungsten T3, and it will only
>>> take up to 1 GB.
>>
>> Also, depending on what you want to use it for, pay attention to the
>> read/write speeds. Many of the cheap SD cards are pretty slow.
>
> I know what you mean about the older cameras. I have an Olympus 2020z
> that uses a _maximum_ 64MB card. The cards are nowhere to be found ...
> for a reasonable price, anyway. I wouldn't expect retail locations to
> use valuable shelf space for "obsolete" (in their eyes) media; however,
> I would also hope that someone who has one for sale wouldn't expect big
> bucks for them.

You might try asking in your local Freecycle group--people may have them
lying around because they don't use anything that small anymore.

--
Evelyn C. Leeper
He who knows only his own side of the case
knows little of that. -John Stuart Mill

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Sample of Dove Cool Moisture Shampoo and Conditioner
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/62f81c3c3094a090?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:39 am
From: eHDMI

Free Sample of Dove Cool Moisture Shampoo and Conditioner
http://www.FreebiesPl.us/?p=148

==============================================================================
TOPIC: FREE Gas-X Thin Strips Sample Offer
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/20b3e029b04452c1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:41 am
From: eHDMI

FREE Gas-X Thin Strips Sample Offer
http://www.freebiespl.us/?p=152

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Prix Des Cigarettes
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7ded7175dcabee45?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 5:52 am
From: milis69@gmail.com

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Apples
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/408e635a462df7fd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:10 am
From: "charleymccormick@gmail.com"

On Oct 2, 1:31 pm, PaPaPeng <PaPaP...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 12:56:50 -0000, "charleymccorm...@gmail.com"
>
> <charleymccorm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Bagging has been used in America and Japan for sometime. I really
> >think the bagging of fruit witnessed in the documentary might have
> >been one of the organic farms that cater to China's elite and
> >political leaders. With literally millions of individual farmers in
> >China growing apples, most of them small farmers, I find it hard to
> >believe that they have access to an "idle" work force to grow apples
> >in such a manner.
>
> You are so out of touch with what is going on in China that the only
> cure is for you to pay a visit there. You are free to travel anywhere
> within China (Tibet requires an easily obtainable permit) and no one
> gives a damn that you are there. That is you can see and ask anyone
> anything you like. The cost of everything there is at almost giveaway
> prices that a 1000 dollar budget will make you spend like a
> millionaire.
>
> Unemployment and underemployment is an endemic problem. Even a
> university graduate is lucky to get a job as a security guard at 800
> Yuan a month, the equivalent of just over USD 100. A mid management
> job pays just around 300 to 500 dollars a month. In the countryside
> the income is much less. That is why the peasants are streaming into
> the cities by the tens of millions to find work. This option is not
> available to most of the older peasants as they have to maintain their
> farms and families. These stay at homes number in the hundreds of
> millions since some 80 percent of China's 1.3 billions still live in
> the countryside.
>
> On thisapplethingy, do give your theory on how China managed to grow
> from nothing to its domination in so short a time. That's the OP's
> question I tried to answer. He and I am certainly very interested in
> another explanation.

I'm sorry you feel the need to be insulting....I will pass on the
opportunity to go to China for a "cure"....or is it still called re-
education? The theory that the bagging method of fruit is being used
on a mass commercial level like this is clearly absurd. I also feel
sorry that you keep insisting that China's rapid growth in this
industry is built on the backs of poor peasants, but that is only part
of the problem. The abuse of pesticides in this country is well
documented. With over three million farmers growing apples, I think
they will be hard pressed to bring them all up to speed on the
responsible use of pesticides, and to monitor that activity.
www.chineseapplejuice.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Play online Casino,Poker,Bingo with no Deposit required
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e72c24f2bc19cdc3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: What happened to surface mail shipping overseas?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e3751aa3d845f2e1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:17 am
From: "OhioGuy"

Last year, I mailed a number of comics across the ocean for a decent
price. Sure, it was slow, but the buyer didn't want to pay the $28 or so
for quick delivery. Cost was more important.

Today I was looking into shipping some comics to England, and I don't even
see the inexpensive surface mail.

It now appears that folks are being forced to use the much more expensive
airmail options to ship internationally.

Are there really no longer any options for shipping using an actual ship?

The cost is often 40 to 50% less, compared to air transport. Without the
cost savings, I guess I won't be able to consider selling internationally
any more. Nobody wants to pay $1.50 per comic for shipping.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:22 am
From: clams casino

OhioGuy wrote:

> Last year, I mailed a number of comics across the ocean for a decent
>price. Sure, it was slow, but the buyer didn't want to pay the $28 or so
>for quick delivery. Cost was more important.
>
> Today I was looking into shipping some comics to England, and I don't even
>see the inexpensive surface mail.
>
> It now appears that folks are being forced to use the much more expensive
>airmail options to ship internationally.
>
> Are there really no longer any options for shipping using an actual ship?
>
> The cost is often 40 to 50% less, compared to air transport. Without the
>cost savings, I guess I won't be able to consider selling internationally
>any more. Nobody wants to pay $1.50 per comic for shipping.
>
>
>
>
Those heavily subsidized / money losing methods of mailing were
eliminated at the last postage increase.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ron Paul...
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/eb674cb08f954f60?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 6:54 am
From: George Grapman

gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Oct 2007 04:38:04 GMT, George Grapman
> <sfgeorge@paccbell.net> wrote:
>
>> gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 20:58:41 -0700, George Grapman
>>> <sfgeorge@paccbell.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Free breakfast and lunch, Curriculums that are packed with politically
>>>>> correct subjects instead of basic education, busing and generally
>>>>> trying to make all schools everything for everybody. School boards
>>>>> have no flexibility to tune a particular school to the needs of the
>>>>> community it serves.
>>>> None of which are forced on states if they refuse federal funding.
>>>
>>> That is just wrong. The state of Utah is currently in court over "no
>>> child left behind" lets see how that goes.
>> They are suing over a provision that requires students under
>> performing schools to be bused to better schools.
>> The law allows a state to opt out if it refuses federal funding.
>>
>>
>> http://www.nhpr.org/node/5820
>>
>>
>> Two of the Legislature's top Democrats are launching a new effort to get
>> New Hampshire to withdraw from the national No Child Left Behind program.
>>
>> They say Washington is making demands that it doesn't pay for. They
>> complain about losing local control.
>>
>> But this year New Hampshire is not alone.
>>
>> New Hampshire Public Radio's political correspondent, John Milne, reports:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Some academics suggest it will be a significant issue in this fall's
>> election.
>>
>> But that debate begins sooner in New Hampshire.
>>
>> Towns throughout the state are debating school budgets now and for the
>> next few weeks.
>>
>> And Democrats are telling voters to blame President Bush and the
>> Republicans if No Child regulations demand more school spending and
>> higher taxes.
>>
>> Senate Democratic Leader Lou D'Allesandro of Manchester connects the
>> political and fiscal dots:
>> (nochild1)
>> It's time to revisit this issue. We need to tell Washington that our
>> property taxpayers are not going to pay the bills. The bill without
>> money is not acceptable. Show me the money!
>>
>> School administrators say tests mandated by the law are far more costly
>> than the funds Washington provides. That's 66 million dollars for all
>> schools in the state.
>>
>> Steve Spratt is on the Mascenic Regional school board in New Ipswich. He
>> complains that the federal money comes with too many restrictions:
>> (nochild 2)
>> NCLB is punitive. It's all stick. There are very few carrots in the
>> bill. If you don't make the grade, you're forced to lower the standards.
>> There are 40 measurements in the bill, and if you miss any one of them,
>> you're classified as need improving.
>>
>> The New Hampshire House passed a bill last year to refuse No Child
>> money. The state Senate tabled the bill. There's been no action this year.
>>
>> Mike Sentance is the regional representative of the U-S Department of
>> Education. He says the No Child program is fully funded. It would have
>> no effect on local spending, and therefore no increase in property taxes.
>>
>> (nochild4)
>> In fact, I would be arguing that you're getting more bang for your buck
>> out of your property tax. I mean, if you know that now the people have
>> the appropriate level of qualifications to be in the classroom, your
>> school should be more effective. I mean, one of the things that always
>> confuses me about the conversation in New Hampshire is why people defend
>> having thoroughly unqualified people in classrooms as being a good
>> investment of local tax dollars.
>>
>> Sentance blames politics for why 14 states other than New Hampshire are
>> protesting the No Child law.
>>
>> In Utah, for example, the Republican-led House voted 64 to 8 to scrap
>> the No Child mandates. Utah's Senate hasn't acted.
>>
>> In Virginia, the House of Delegates passed a resolution criticizing the
>> law. Patricia Wright is superintendent for instruction of the Virginia
>> Board of Education:
>>
>> There are some technicalities in the No Child Left Behind law that would
>> be counterproductive to our own reform. And it expressed some concern
>> with the federal intrusion into state's rights.
>>
>> So far no state has rejected the program.
>>
>> One reason is that a state that rejects the federal law would also have
>> to turn down millions of dollars in federal aid.
>> From a political perspective, the debate reverses traditional partisan
>> positions in the state.
>>
>> The Democrats say No Child Left Behind will increase taxes and destroy
>> local control.
>>
>> The Republicans say the federal program calls for improvements in
>> reading, math and science that all parents would want.
>>
>> But the "little democracies" of New Hampshire towns are famous for their
>> independence. Their votes may offer a nonpartisan analysis of No Child
>> Left Behind
>
>
> I suppose you are too young to remember Brown V BOE
>
>
Actually I remember it very well. Like the Voting Rights Act it
simply implemented the 14th Amendment.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Money, no joke
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/accc21168a7fd473?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 7:02 am
From: captaind

On Oct 10, 2:01 am, woehrl...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Are you looking for a way to be at home and make ends meet or better?
> Do you dream of spending more time with your family and friends? Are
> you tired of work deadlines and the stress that comes with you job? If
> you are like me, then you may have found an answer to those very same
> questions. I had been searching the web for ways to earn income at
> home. I ran across this posting and decided to give it a trial run.
> What could I lose for few dollars and a few postage stamps . This is
> not a scam. When I studied the article I concluded that the purchase
> of the service offered, in this letter, is legal and a valid
> transaction.
>
> This method really does work and is a very easy way to make fast
> money. The article that I had found said that I could make thousands
> of dollars easily in a matter of weeks with only an initial small
> payment of $6.00. I thought, "Yeah, right, this must be a scam like
> most of the rest", but like most of us, I was curious, so I kept
> reading. Anyway, it said that if I sent $1.00 to each of the 6 names
> and addresses listed at the bottom of the article that I would make
> great money but only if I followed the following steps. After sending
> the $1.00 to each person you were then instructed to rewrite the list
> by taking the 1st person off of the list then moving the 2nd person to
> the 1st spot, and the 3rd person to the 2nd spot, etc, etc. Finally
> you should be left with the number 6 spot empty and this is where you
> place your name and address. After reconfiguring the list you then
> must post it on about 200 newsgroups (doesn't matter but the more
> places you post the more money you make!). There are thousands and
> thousands of newsgroups from around the world so this task is easy and
> that was it when I was done! no catch. So after thinking it over, and
> talking to a few people that were on the list, I thought about trying
> it. I figured what have I got to lose except 6 stamps and $6.00,
> right? Like most of us I was a little skeptical because it seemed so
> easy and a I was a little worried about the legal aspects of it all.
> So I checked it out with the U.S. Post Office (1-800-725-2161) they
> confirmed that it is indeed legal! After reviewing the pro's and con's
> of the investment I decided to carry out with it. I invested the
> measly $6.00 and guess what??... Within 7days, I started getting money
> in the mail!! I was very shocked! I figured it would end soon, but the
> money just kept coming in. In my first week, I made about $25.00. By
> the end of the second week I had made a total of over $1,000.00! In
> the third week Ihad over $10,000.00 and it's still growing. This is
> now my fourth week and I have made a total of just over $42,000.00 and
> it's still coming in rapidly. It's certainly worth $6.00, and 6
> stamps.... Now let me explain to you how this works and most importantly
> why it works. Also, make sure you print a copy of this article NOW, so
> you can get the information off of it as you need it.
>
> STEP 1
> · Get 6 separate pieces of paper and write the following on each piece
> of paper "PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST."
> · Now get 6 US $1.00 bills and place ONE inside EACH of the 6 pieces
> of paper so the bill will not be seen through the envelope to prevent
> thievery.
> · Next, place one paper in each of the 6 envelopes and seal them. You
> should now have 6 sealed envelopes, each with a piece of paper stating
> the above phrase (PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST), your name and
> address, and a $1.00 bill. What you are doing with this letter is
> creating a service. THIS IS ABSOLUTELY LEGAL!
> · Now mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses
>
> 1. Michael Mitchell, 88 Mutual Street, Toronto, Ontario M5B 2N3
> 2. Joseph Brown, 14 Mount Pleasant Street, Winchester, MA 01890
> 3. Charles Baguley, 4260 Crazyhorse rd. Cameron Park, CA 95682
> 4. Gulam Rasul, 864-42nd Street Apt# 7 Brooklyn, NY-11232, U.S.A
> 5. Tony Washington 303 saint Patrick st. apt#1 rapid city, SD 57701
> 6. Jessie Woehrle 127, South Harmony Lane, Apt.206, Whitewater, WI
> 53190, U.S.A
>
> STEP 2
> · After you have mailed out your letters creating a service and making
> this legal, take the #1 name off the list that you see above, move the
> other names up (6 becomes 5, 5 becomes 4, etc...) and add YOUR Name as
> number 6 on the list.
> STEP 3
> · Change anything you need to in this article, but try to keep this
> article as close to original as possible. Now, post your amended
> article to at least 200 newsgroups. (I believe there are close to
> 24,000 groups in USA alone). All you need is 200, but remember, the
> more you post the more money you make!
>
> DIRECTIONS ---HOW TO POST TO NEWSGROUPS
> Step 1 You do not need to re-type this entire letter to do your own
> posting. Simply put your cursor at the beginning of this letter and
> drag your cursor to the bottom of this document, and select 'copy'
> from the edit menu. This will copy the entire letter into the
> computers memory.
>
> Step 2 Open a blank "notepad" file under accessories in windows and
> place your cursor at the top of the blank page. From the 'edit' menu
> select 'paste'. This will paste a copy of the letter into notepad so
> that you can add your name to the list.
>
> Step 3 Save your new notepad file as a .txt file. If you want to do
> your postings in different sittings, you'll always have this file to
> go back to.
>
> Step 4 Use Netscape or Internet explorer and try searching for various
> newsgroups (on-line forums, message boards, chat sites, discussions.)
>
> Step 5 Visit these message boards and post this article as a new
> message by highlighting the text of this letter and selecting paste
> from the edit menu. Fill in the Subject, this will be the header that
> everyone sees as they scroll through the list of postings in a
> particular group, click the post message button.
>
> After you have completed these steps you are done with your first
> posting Congratulations you are that more closer to easy
> money!...THAT'S IT! All you have to do is jump to different newsgroups
> and post away, after you get the hang of it, it will take about 30
> seconds for each newsgroup! That's it! You will begin receiving money
> from around the world within days! You may eventually want to rent a
> P.O.Box due to the large amount of mail you will receive. If you wish
> to stay anonymous, you can invent a name to use, as long as the
> postman will deliver it. **JUST MAKE SURE ALL THE ADDRESSES ARE
> CORRECT AND REMEMBER, THE MORE NEWSGROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY
> YOU WILL MAKE!! BUT YOU HAVE TO POST A MINIMUM OF 200**
>
> Now WHY and HOW it works : Out of 200 postings, say I receive only 5
> replies (a very low example). So then I made $5.00 with my name at #6
> on the letter. Now, each of the 5 persons who just sent me $1.00 make
> the MINIMUM 200 postings, each with my name at #5 and only 5 persons
> respond to each of the original 5, that is another $25.00 for me, now
> those 25 each make 200 MINIMUM posts with my name at #4 and only 5
> replies each, I will bring in an additional $125.00! Now, those 125
> persons turn around and post the MINIMUM 200 with my name at #3 and
> only receive 5 replies each, I will make an additional $626.00! OK,
> now here is the fun part, each of those 625 persons post a MINIMUM 200
> letters with my name at #2 and they each only receive 5 replies, that
> just made me $3,125.00!!! Those 3,125 persons will all deliver this
> message to 200 newsgroups with my name at #1 and if still 5 persons
> per 200 newsgroups react I will receive $15,625,00! With an original
> investment of only $6.00! AMAZING! When your name is no longer on the
> list, you just take the latest posting in the newsgroups, and send out
> another $6.00 to names on the list, putting your name at number 6
> again. And start posting again. The thing to remember is, do you
> realize that thousands of people all over the world are joining the
> internet and reading these articles everyday, JUST LIKE YOU ARE
> SEARCHING NOW!! So it's up to you to START GETTING SOME SERIOUS MONEY.

There is nothing legal about this, it is a pyramid scheme and if you
are involved with this you will now be happy with the results and the
outcome.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Hypoallergenic Pillowcase
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/678dd13afacc7663?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 10 2007 7:08 am
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Wednesday, October 10, 2007

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