Frugal Living: 25 new messages in 8 topics

Tuesday, September 9, 2008

25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Are there good reasons to leave your computer on?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/687c8842ea058153?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 8:35 am
From: James

Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
cents per hour.

== 2 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 11:56 am
From: "h"

"James" <j0069bond@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8190553d-c364-4f39-a152-b741d9b145b7@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
> Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
> hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
> cents per hour.

I need my computer at least once an hour, 16-18 hours a day. Waiting for it
to boot would waste a helluva lot more than 16-18 cents of my time.

== 3 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 12:25 pm
From: johns

I build those things for a living. Leaving a pc turned
on lowers its useful lifetime to about 3 years. Then
it goes flakey, and I hear all the stupid reasons
from the users ... what "they" think is wrong.

Here's what is wrong:

Bad spots on the hard drive .. from heat and
friction. New hard drive ... $80.00
Reinstall by tech .. $80.00
Lost man-hours and data .. ?? .. $40,000.00

Bad power supply constantly rebooting during
operations ... $100.
Install by tech ... $60.

Scumbag Techs at Computer stores .. Lies and
overcharges .. $400.00 on average when replacing
your so-called "bad motherboard" and leaving
a flakey hard drive in the box so you'll come
back for the new computer you should have
bought.

Learn how to use "hibernate mode" and the thing
will reboot in about 30 seconds all the way
back to the application you left open.

johns

== 4 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:01 pm
From: "JonquilJan"

Don't know if this helps or not - but I not only turn the computer off in
the evenings when I am done - I unplug computer and monitor when I am
finished. Basic reason is because of sudden storms and power outages during
my sleeping/bed hours. Yes I do have a surge protector - but that doesn't
protect againist lightning - at least that's what I've been told.

JonquilJan - and open to practical information from informed others

Learn something new every day
As long as you are learning, you are living
When you stop learning, you start dying

== 5 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:08 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Sep 9, 11:56 am, "h" <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote:
> "James" <j0069b...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:8190553d-c364-4f39-a152-b741d9b145b7@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
> > hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
> > cents per hour.
>
> I need my computer at least once an hour, 16-18 hours a day. Waiting for it
> to boot would waste a helluva lot more than 16-18 cents of my time.

I agree with you on that; it's all dependent on how often you need to
access it. Right now I have an iMAC (Strawberry, 400 mhz) that I
leave in "sleep" mode and wake up by shaking the mouse. Sleep mode
does use power, but not as much as fully on/running. In the "olden
days" the reason for keeping the computer on was to avoid wearing out
the powersupply via multiple restarts. From what I understand this
isn't as much of an issue anymore; saving power expenses is.

== 6 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:11 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Sep 9, 1:01 pm, "JonquilJan" <war...@imcnet.net> wrote:
> Don't know if this helps or not - but I not only turn the computer off in
> the evenings when I am done - I unplug computer and monitor when I am
> finished. Basic reason is because of sudden storms and power outages during
> my sleeping/bed hours. Yes I do have a surge protector - but that doesn't
> protect againist lightning - at least that's what I've been told.
>
> JonquilJan - and open to practical information from informed others
>
> Learn something new every day
> As long as you are learning, you are living
> When you stop learning, you start dying

The other "good thing" that does by unplugging the computer/monitor at
night is you're killing a known energy vampire. Computers and newer
monitors (LCD's) still draw power when plugged in, even if they're off
(motherboard will show a light, monitor will show the orange light).

== 7 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:19 pm
From: Dennis

On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 14:56:45 -0400, "h" <tmclone@searchmachine.com>
wrote:

>
>"James" <j0069bond@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:8190553d-c364-4f39-a152-b741d9b145b7@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>> Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
>> hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
>> cents per hour.
>
>I need my computer at least once an hour, 16-18 hours a day. Waiting for it
>to boot would waste a helluva lot more than 16-18 cents of my time.
>

I have mine set to go to sleep (the lowest level of standby, HD off,
fans off) after a period of inactivity. Power use goes low (less than
4W, measured) and it only takes about 7-9 seconds to wake up.

Works for me.

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

== 8 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:46 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Seerialmom <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 9, 11:56 am, "h" <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote:
>> "James" <j0069b...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:8190553d-c364-4f39-a152-b741d9b145b7@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
>>> hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
>>> cents per hour.
>>
>> I need my computer at least once an hour, 16-18 hours a day. Waiting
>> for it to boot would waste a helluva lot more than 16-18 cents of my
>> time.
>
> I agree with you on that; it's all dependent on how often you need to
> access it. Right now I have an iMAC (Strawberry, 400 mhz) that I
> leave in "sleep" mode and wake up by shaking the mouse. Sleep mode
> does use power, but not as much as fully on/running.

And hibernation speeds up the boot dramatically too.

> In the "olden days" the reason for keeping the computer on
> was to avoid wearing out the powersupply via multiple restarts.

Nope, that is not correct.

> From what I understand this isn't as much of an issue anymore;

It never was.

> saving power expenses is.

Not really. And like you say, its trivial to fix that if you want to.

== 9 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:49 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

johns <johns321@moscow.com> wrote:

> I build those things for a living.

But dont have a clue about the basics.

> Leaving a pc turned on lowers its useful lifetime to about 3 years.

Like hell it does.

> Then it goes flakey,

Nope.

> and I hear all the stupid reasons from the users ... what "they" think is wrong.

> Here's what is wrong:

We'll see...

> Bad spots on the hard drive .. from heat and friction.

Mindlessly silly. There is no 'friction', the heads fly above the platters.

> New hard drive ... $80.00
> Reinstall by tech .. $80.00
> Lost man-hours and data .. ?? .. $40,000.00

Not when you have enough of a clue to have what matters backed up.

> Bad power supply constantly rebooting during operations ... $100.
> Install by tech ... $60.

> Scumbag Techs at Computer stores .. Lies and
> overcharges .. $400.00 on average when replacing
> your so-called "bad motherboard" and leaving
> a flakey hard drive in the box so you'll come
> back for the new computer you should have bought.

> Learn how to use "hibernate mode" and the thing
> will reboot in about 30 seconds all the way
> back to the application you left open.

And sleep brings it back much faster than that.

== 10 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:53 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

JonquilJan <ward39@imcnet.net> wrote:

> Don't know if this helps or not

Not really unless there is a very close lightning strike.

> - but I not only turn the computer off in the evenings when I
> am done - I unplug computer and monitor when I am finished.

Too much farting around for me for the microscopic reduction in risk.

> Basic reason is because of sudden storms and power outages during
> my sleeping/bed hours. Yes I do have a surge protector - but that
> doesn't protect againist lightning - at least that's what I've been told.

What you have been told is just plain wrong. It does
help with lightning that isnt very close to your house.

I dont even bother to unplug the systems when there is real lightning around
and that has worked fine for the 40+ years I have been using computers too.

> JonquilJan - and open to practical information from informed others

> Learn something new every day
> As long as you are learning, you are living
> When you stop learning, you start dying

== 11 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:53 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Seerialmom <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 9, 1:01 pm, "JonquilJan" <war...@imcnet.net> wrote:
>> Don't know if this helps or not - but I not only turn the computer
>> off in the evenings when I am done - I unplug computer and monitor
>> when I am finished. Basic reason is because of sudden storms and
>> power outages during my sleeping/bed hours. Yes I do have a surge
>> protector - but that doesn't protect againist lightning - at least
>> that's what I've been told.
>>
>> JonquilJan - and open to practical information from informed others
>>
>> Learn something new every day
>> As long as you are learning, you are living
>> When you stop learning, you start dying
>
> The other "good thing" that does by unplugging the computer/monitor at
> night is you're killing a known energy vampire. Computers and newer
> monitors (LCD's) still draw power when plugged in, even if they're off
> (motherboard will show a light, monitor will show the orange light).

That power use is microscopic tho.

== 12 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 2:44 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Sep 9, 1:53 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Seerialmom <seerial...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > On Sep 9, 1:01 pm, "JonquilJan" <war...@imcnet.net> wrote:
> >> Don't know if this helps or not - but I not only turn the computer
> >> off in the evenings when I am done - I unplug computer and monitor
> >> when I am finished. Basic reason is because of sudden storms and
> >> power outages during my sleeping/bed hours. Yes I do have a surge
> >> protector - but that doesn't protect againist lightning - at least
> >> that's what I've been told.
>
> >> JonquilJan - and open to practical information from informed others
>
> >> Learn something new every day
> >> As long as you are learning, you are living
> >> When you stop learning, you start dying
>
> > The other "good thing" that does by unplugging the computer/monitor at
> > night is you're killing a known energy vampire. Computers and newer
> > monitors (LCD's) still draw power when plugged in, even if they're off
> > (motherboard will show a light, monitor will show the orange light).
>
> That power use is microscopic tho.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Ok, it's a baby vampire then :p

== 13 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 2:47 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Sep 9, 1:46 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Seerialmom <seerial...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > On Sep 9, 11:56 am, "h" <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote:
> >> "James" <j0069b...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:8190553d-c364-4f39-a152-b741d9b145b7@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>
> >>> Considering 24X365 hours in a year, if electricity costs 1 cent per
> >>> hour for your computer, it would cost $87 a year or over $170 if 2
> >>> cents per hour.
>
> >> I need my computer at least once an hour, 16-18 hours a day. Waiting
> >> for it to boot would waste a helluva lot more than 16-18 cents of my
> >> time.
>
> > I agree with you on that; it's all dependent on how often you need to
> > access it. Right now I have an iMAC (Strawberry, 400 mhz) that I
> > leave in "sleep" mode and wake up by shaking the mouse. Sleep mode
> > does use power, but not as much as fully on/running.
>
> And hibernation speeds up the boot dramatically too.
>
> > In the "olden days" the reason for keeping the computer on
> > was to avoid wearing out the powersupply via multiple restarts.
>
> Nope, that is not correct.
>
> > From what I understand this isn't as much of an issue anymore;
>
> It never was.
>
> > saving power expenses is.
>
> Not really. And like you say, its trivial to fix that if you want to.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes it is correct. That was the thinking about 10 years ago; maybe
not in your neighborhood but here around Silicon valley it was. It
was common thinking that multiple cycles would shorten the life of the
powersupply. Kinda like flicking a light switch off/on can kill a
light bulb faster than leaving it on.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Anything wrong with canned tomatoes?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7fb7868def5d6f0e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 9:40 am
From: Derald

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:

> This area has a nice frosty winter to slow some of the pests down a little.
Well, I'm a few mile further north than you were -- just a little
south of Spring Hill in NW Pasco County -- and, while we may have a
couple of frosts and one or two nights of freezing temps, it isn't
winter as you (will come to) know it in 'Bama and has little effect on
the insect population. The trick with many veggies, summer squash for
example, is to get the seeds in as early as possible, even if you have
to use cold frames, so as to make a crop before the pests are most
active.
>
> I discovered that the "puddling" behavior of butterflies, moths, and
>some wasps seems to be more about picking up soil minerals for some
>sexual development than being thirsty. Perhaps this is their version
>of going to the local bar?
I've noticed that behavior but did not understand its significance.
Each of our beds has at least one approx. quart-sized stainless steel
bowl of water and a fair-sized rock perch. When the water level is low
enough for the bowl to provide a windbreak, the wasps actually land on
or walk out onto the water's surface. Of course, the watering stations
also are visited by native bees as well as the occasional European
honeybee. I don't like the honeybees but don't actively discourage them
unless they discover the wildflowers in the surrounding area. The
butterflies seem most taken with the basil blossoms.
>
>I got okra seeds mixed up with bean seeds, and so a second crop of
>okra is just now flowering on top of the bean plants. Seems to work
>well, I might do it on purpose next year.
I do something similar as a matter of course. I always plant an
understorey, usually peanuts or marigolds, even though it may not
receive enough sunlight to flourish. Of course, tomatoes are always
interplanted with chives, basil, etc. As the upper storey develops, I
often replace the understorey with something that will be more
productive foodwise. For example, okra (and almost everything else, for
that matter) had peanuts under it which, after the okra got on up about
shoulder high, were replaced with the last planting of blackeyed peas. I
have boiled _fresh_ peanuts in the freezer and the okra and peas are
likely to end their productivity at about the same time.
I'm among the "microclimate" true believers: A living mulch, a
closely-spaced upperstorey, and "soaker" hose irrigation helps to reduce
evaporative water loss and provides a more cophesthetic habit for
beneficial insects, frogs, toads and anole. I know that the latter three
eat some percentage of the first but I didn't design the system....
>
>I did one green
>crop of wheat and have added grass clippings in a few areas, but the
>organic matter in the soil is way low. At least when I add it the
>stuff doesn't evaporate in a day like in Florida.
Tell me about it. DW did not put bottoms in the beds and we began
with native soil. Although, I kept the beds mulched during the fallow
years, the sand still percolates to the top and seems to eat organic
matter overnight. All of the tomatoes, peppers, eggplant, sweet potatoes
and some of the basil are in containers. Containers may represent my
gardening future.
If you have the time to wait, you might be able to use deep-rooted
native plant species such as spiny amaranth in your planting area to
help loosen the clay. I allow deep-rooted native "weeds", especially
amaranth, to remain in my garden because when pulled and composted
they've reclaimed some of the nutrients that leach down beyond the reach
of shallow-rooted food crops; every little bit helps.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 12:29 pm
From: "JonquilJan"

Just a small hint that could help with the insect problem for summer squash
(works in my part of the country - northern New York - but may not be
applicable elsewhere).

Mix a small amount of turpentine with sawdust and sprinkle it in a circle
around transplants (such as broccoli, cabbage) and around small seedlings
(such as zucchini, yellow squash). Must be renewed after a few rains. Odor
keeps the egg laying butterflies/moths away - as well as cutworms. But I
use toothpicks around the stems of transplants for cutworms.

JonquilJan

Learn something new every day
As long as you are learning, you are living
When you stop learning, you start dying

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:09 pm
From: Dennis

On Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:40:53 -0500, Derald <derald@invalid.net> wrote:

> All of the tomatoes, peppers, eggplant, sweet potatoes
>and some of the basil are in containers. Containers may represent my
>gardening future.

I have sitting in my barnyard one of those rotating metal wire racks
that are used for displaying videos and books (DW runs the community
library and this was deemed excess and brought home to add to our "to
the dump/recycling" staging area). It stands about 5 feet tall and
has four sides of wire shelves that look like they should handlily
accomodate some 4-6" pots. I keep thinking that I should put it to
use as a vertical container garden for strawberries or some such.
Seems like it would be fairly low/easy maintenance. Hmmm...

I just picked, dried and vacuum-sealed almost 2 lbs of hops from my 3
hop vines. Woo hoo! That should help keep my newly-fabricated
kegerator in business for another year, with some left over to share
with my homebrew homies! I can now laugh at the nation-wide hop
shortage and resulting high market prices.

Dennis (evil)
--
I'm behind the eight ball, ahead of the curve, riding the wave,
dodging the bullet and pushing the envelope. -George Carlin

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 2:42 pm
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 20:09:37 +0000 (UTC), Dennis <dgw80@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> I can now laugh at the nation-wide hop
>shortage and resulting high market prices.

Oh lordy, now we'll have to listen to hip music.

You could plant the rotating rack with little evergreens and have a
rotating Christmas tree in a few months...

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Do you believe that giving opens the door to receiving?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c5fec406d6e0ea4d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 9:40 am
From: Derald

Coffee's For Closers <Usenet2008@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG> wrote:

>No, I believe that giving people "free" money (or physical items,
>or services) opens their hands, grabbing for more. Without any
>sense of limits. And absolutely zero gratitude. That is what
>happened every time I was ever generous to anyone.
>
>Giving money to pyramid-scamming spammers doesn't sound like
>much fun, either.
I don't believe that gratitude or the expectation thereof is a
reasonable motivation for giving, although, that's not what you were
saying. Otherwise: Ditto. No cash without a repayment plan and a note,
thanks. However, I'm those guys who plops a Big Mac into the
work-for-food guys' hands at the highway interchange because I remember
being on the street myself and waking up under (yes, under) a Miami
sidewalk. Some few seem appreciative while others seem to be put off; I
reckon the latter group to be on liquid diets....

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Update to Prepaid Cellular Site
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0b9c64361ec1224e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 9:28 am
From: SMS

I have updated my web site on prepaid cellular service at:
"http://prepaiduswireless.com/"

This is a non-commercial site that I put together because I was
constantly e-mailing people information regarding which prepaid wireless
plans were the best deals.

There are presently four ways to get prepaid cellular for under $2.50
per month:

T-Mobile: As low as 74¢/month, as low as 8.8¢/minute (T-Moble network)

PagePlus: As low as $2.35/month, as low as 5.4¢/minute (Verizon network)

7-11: SpeakOut $2.08/month, 15¢/minute (AT&T network)

ARN: As low as 21¢ per month, as low as 25¢/minute (CDMA and AMPS networks))

If you know of any better deals than these, let me know.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 3:12 pm
From: imascot

SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote in
news:xuxxk.20404$jI5.10460@flpi148.ffdc.sbc.com:

> I have updated my web site on prepaid cellular service at:
> "http://prepaiduswireless.com/"
>
> This is a non-commercial site that I put together because I was
> constantly e-mailing people information regarding which prepaid
> wireless plans were the best deals.
>
> There are presently four ways to get prepaid cellular for under $2.50
> per month:
>
> T-Mobile: As low as 74¢/month, as low as 8.8¢/minute (T-Moble network)
>
> PagePlus: As low as $2.35/month, as low as 5.4¢/minute (Verizon
> network)
>
> 7-11: SpeakOut $2.08/month, 15¢/minute (AT&T network)
>
> ARN: As low as 21¢ per month, as low as 25¢/minute (CDMA and AMPS
> networks))
>
> If you know of any better deals than these, let me know.
>

Great site, very informative. However, my Page Plus phone roamed just fine in Vancouver, and it
also roamed in the U.S. Virgin Islands.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Electricity Rates - wasRe: Home heating oil price?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/25ab6d7a439ac7f1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 9:58 am
From: "Matthew Beasley"

"Larry Caldwell" <firstnamelastinitial@peaksky.com> wrote in message
> Here in Oregon we have cheap electricity, thanks to a bunch of 70 year
> old hydro projects - the original renewable energy. We also have a
> tiered rate system.
>
> The first 525 kwh is $0.0345400/kwh
> The second 525 kwh is $0.0410600/kwh
> The third 525 kwh is $0.0508200/kwh
>
> Basic charge is $7.50
> Delivery charge is $0.0359600/kwh
> State Tax is $0.0019900/kwh

You only have that nonsense since you're serviced by an investor owned
utility. I'm on a co-op and we have the reverse. Use more power and the
price kWh drops.

Energy mizers are being subsidized HEAVILY by the other users of
electricity. My biggest beef with the tiered rate is that it does not
differentiate between energy source. A wasteful user of natural gas, oil or
propane will of course use less electricity than a heat pump user. But the
owner of the heat pump is more "environmentally frendly" than the others,
and that is the alleged goal of the tiered system.

> The company is Pacific Power. They didn't get the rate increases they
> asked for in Utah, so the word is that they are going to cut grid
> maintenance and not pay overtime if there is a storm outage. They got
> bought by Warren Buffet, who wants his 10% ROI. I suspect my cheap
> electricity will be coming to an end pretty soon.

Dump them and form a co-op..... I'm a free market guy, but a utility isn't
a free market. I figure that being a member of a co-op has more access to a
free market than any customer of an investor owned utility. Me and the
other members have a person who's job is to find the cheapest power he can.
And he's got a big block of purchasing to wield behind him. It puts us on a
much stronger negotiating position than any individual customer has.

The other nice part is that the co-ops, MUD's and PUD's are exempt from the
political shenanigans that the PUC tries to force upon us. We are our own
PUC, and when we vote, we vote for cheap reliable power as our first
consideration.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 11:49 am
From: SMS

Larry Caldwell wrote:
> In article <48badca3$0$7480$38cefb40@news.westelcom.com>, ward39
> @imcnet.net (JonquilJan) says...
>
>> Here (northern New York) my electric is .13028/kWh - but - delivery services
>> are ,030799/kWh plus a 2.04082% surcharge on the delivery service plus
>> basic delivery service (other than useage) of $16.21. The delivery services
>> are over half my bill.
>
>> What is the situation on electric in other parts of the country? Company is
>> National Grid - and I opt in for wind energy (which adds just a bit - trying
>> to do 'my part').
>
> Here in Oregon we have cheap electricity, thanks to a bunch of 70 year
> old hydro projects - the original renewable energy. We also have a
> tiered rate system.
>
> The first 525 kwh is $0.0345400/kwh
> The second 525 kwh is $0.0410600/kwh
> The third 525 kwh is $0.0508200/kwh

Yeah, most utilities have this sort of tiered rate system for
residential use.

Also, TOU (time of use) can make a big difference here. In California,
solar systems make economic sense to the homeowner because you generate
the most electricity during the peak usage time, when the utility is
paying you the most for what you generate (a time of use meter is
required). Yet you can often modify your usage patterns to use more
electricity during off-peak.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Spam
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7ad12922df7b5f75?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 12:54 pm
From: clams_casino

cyber wrote:

>Index the websites and search engines
>

But you are posting from Taiwan. Got any information on houses in India?

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TOPIC: There's something deeply satisfying...
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/79d8bd252fa6c6e0?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 1:35 pm
From: Al Bundy

The Real Bev wrote:
> ...about cutting a grasshopper in half -- the one you just noticed had
> consumed half the leaves on the baby Queensland flame trees whose seeds
> you stole from the Huntington Library -- with the nice $40 (or $80, I
> can't remember) Cutco kitchen scissors that you got at a yard sale for
> half a buck.
>
> The Cutco rep at the LA County Fair said that all Cutco products had a
> lifetime guarantee and that if they ever needed sharpening they would
> send one of their Associates (all good-looking young guys, at least the
> ones that were manning the booth) out to the owner's home to sharpen
> them. I wonder if that includes replacement, and I wonder if using the
> scissors for something really disgusting (like cutting a grasshopper in
> half) would count...
>
> --
> Cheers, Bev
-----------------
Other than the slime on your scissors, they won't be dulled or
damaged by cutting bugs.
On the other hand, your karma will be quite damaged.

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TOPIC: Unplug your cable. Get TV over the internet
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ac4fe22465227d21?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Sep 9 2008 2:44 pm
From: Gordon

Back in March I posted a message where I told everyone here
that I was pulling the plug on Comca$t and I was going to
get all my TV viewing off the internet. Well, the results
are in and the results are mixed. I thought that the rest
of the group might be intrested. So I created a web page
at www.gordonreeder.com/content/TVoIP.html. I'm not selling
anything, there are no ads, and no click throughs. Just
trying to share some knowledge.

Good news is that I found enough video to watch.
Bad news is that it's just not the same as cable.
current episodes are not broadcast on the internet
so you have to go to a web site to catch the show
the next day.
Good news is i found a lot of great stuff
out there that the cable co's don't carry.
(No, not _that_ stuff).

Good news is I'm not paying $50/month to Comcast
Bad news is that I'm paying $10.00 more to Verizon
for a faster internet connection.

Bad news is I had to listen to the wife and kids
bitch about missing their TV shows.
Good news is that they are getting used to it and
finding their shows on the internet.
More good news is that they are spending less time
sitting on their asses in front of the boob tube.
that includes the internet version of the boob tube
as well.

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Frugal Living

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Tuesday, September 9, 2008

25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

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