http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* Home heating oil price? - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/25ab6d7a439ac7f1?hl=en
* What minor frugal change did you make this year? - 7 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/2d2a9d8612f0c718?hl=en
* Digital vs Analog cordless Phone? Health Radiation is the same? - 4 messages,
4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/45689cba95ca38f8?hl=en
* Warning re Biodegradable Plastic Bags - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/ad8779c939ff4750?hl=en
* Balck and Decker Power Monitor frugal? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d61157f837e5fc08?hl=en
* Criminally insane or just a cancerous blood sucking leach? - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1f065e7bde756998?hl=en
* Onesuite Question - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/136859395009c10f?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Home heating oil price?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/25ab6d7a439ac7f1?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 3:25 pm
From: clams_casino
Ann wrote:
>
>
>FICA is not "income tax". It's your payment into a
>retirement/disability/etc fund, which you probably will get back in the
>future. And you'd pay that no matter what state you lived in.
>
>
Since when? Even the federal government refers to it as a payroll tax
where they publish "tax rate" tables. Hint - there is no "fund". It's
used to pay current retirees with the excess going to pay for deficit
federal spending where there is a promise there will be workers paying
similar taxes in the future to pay for his retirement. Call it was it
is (as the government does) - it's a payroll tax.
I believe the OP was pointing out he was having to pay about 15% of
wages in social security due to being self employed plus the federal and
state income on top of the high NY property taxes.
I do, however, doubt he is paying $6k state, federal and social security
taxes on $20k gross income. Social security should be about $3k, but
after even with a single standard deduction, he likely only pays about
$1300 federal and perhaps $400 in state. He should not be paying more
than about $4700 in payroll taxes, although that is still nearly 1/4 of
his gross income. Of course, this assumes a short form - probably
unlikely for someone who is self employed, especially with a reported
$4800 potential deductions just in property taxes, so the income taxes
should actually be lower.
If he really is paying $6k on $20k, he really needs to get some help
with his taxes.
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 4:52 pm
From: Ann
On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 18:25:26 -0500, clams_casino wrote:
> Ann wrote:
>
>
>>
>>FICA is not "income tax". It's your payment into a
>>retirement/disability/etc fund, which you probably will get back in the
>>future. And you'd pay that no matter what state you lived in.
>>
> Since when? Even the federal government refers to it as a payroll tax
> where they publish "tax rate" tables.
"Income tax" is what's reported on a 1040.
> Hint - there is no "fund"
No, it's not sitting somewhere in a big ole pile of cash, any more than
money one deposits in a bank is.
> It's
> used to pay current retirees with the excess going to pay for deficit
> federal spending where there is a promise there will be workers paying
> similar taxes in the future to pay for his retirement. Call it was it is
> (as the government does) - it's a payroll tax.
The government calls it what I did. FICA. "Payroll tax" is a category.
> I believe the OP was pointing out he was having to pay about 15% of
> wages in social security due to being self employed plus the federal and
> state income on top of the high NY property taxes.
Yes. But that's not relevant to his complaint about alleged high NY RE
taxes.
> I do, however, doubt he is paying $6k state, federal and social security
> taxes on $20k gross income. Social security should be about $3k, but
> after even with a single standard deduction, he likely only pays about
> $1300 federal and perhaps $400 in state. He should not be paying more
> than about $4700 in payroll taxes, although that is still nearly 1/4 of
> his gross income. Of course, this assumes a short form - probably
> unlikely for someone who is self employed, especially with a reported
> $4800 potential deductions just in property taxes, so the income taxes
> should actually be lower.
>
> If he really is paying $6k on $20k, he really needs to get some help
> with his taxes.
Yes, that number does need to be itemized. It is possible he's including
the sales tax he collected from his customers.
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 11:35 pm
From: Larry Caldwell
In article <F3W2l.49847$5P1.26231@newsfe13.iad>,
PeterGriffin@DrunkinClam.com (clams_casino) says...
> Ann wrote:
> >FICA is not "income tax". It's your payment into a
> >retirement/disability/etc fund, which you probably will get back in the
> >future. And you'd pay that no matter what state you lived in.
> Since when? Even the federal government refers to it as a payroll tax
> where they publish "tax rate" tables.
It's a payroll tax, only assessed against earned income. All other
income is exempt. For example, you don't pay FICA on interest, dividends
or rental income. For now. The system is going broke, so they have the
choice of reducing benefits, raising the rate, or broadening the tax
base. I'm betting they broaden the tax base, and make all income
subject to FICA.
--
For email, replace firstnamelastinitial
with my first name and last initial.
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 11:44 pm
From: Larry Caldwell
In article <7878c47e-937e-4c19-99f6-
dcb2ca54085c@a12g2000pro.googlegroups.com>, tmclone@searchmachine.com
(tmclone@searchmachine.com) says...
> Umm, no, that's just state and fed. The property taxes are another
> $4800 on top of the $6000. Weird part is that my income taxes weren't
> much higher when I was making $45K a few years ago. It's being self-
> employed that's screwing me.
You really need to talk to a good accountant. The tax laws in the USA
are written to pamper small businesses. You should be paying hardly any
tax at all.
An accountant will probably get you incorporated. Once you are
incorporated, you can rent a room in your house to the corporation as an
office, for around $800 a month. You don't pay social security tax on
that $800, because it's not earned income. The tax code is full of
investment tax credits and accelerated depreciation schedules. A good
tax accountant will cost you about $400, and save you about $4000 of
that $6000 you are paying in state and federal tax.
--
For email, replace firstnamelastinitial
with my first name and last initial.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: What minor frugal change did you make this year?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/2d2a9d8612f0c718?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 3:50 pm
From: E Z Peaces
OhioGuy wrote:
> I thought it would be fun to share stories about things we have done
> this year to make a small but frugal difference in our budgets and such.
>
I spent $33 on closed-cell polyethylene and figure it saves me $60 a month.
== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 4:04 pm
From: Dave Garland
Evelyn Leeper wrote:
> Just try telling that to someone over sixty years old and see the look
> on their faces.
Hey, watch your step, you young whippersnapper.
Some of us old folks are too frugal to have cellphones. Or if we do,
they're the cheapie prepaid ones. (Frugal hint: Most of the
companies selling prepaid service expire the time eventually (usually
in 60 or 90 days), but if you add more before it expires the old
minutes roll over. If you don't use the phone much, the optimum is
the service with the smallest=cheapest refills. In the US, T-Mobil
sells $10 refills that have 90 day expiration, all the other companies
seem to have a $20 minimum.)
Dave
== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 5:44 pm
From: haranjoe@lycos.com
> So that's a couple of small changes we have made. How about you?
I got a bunch of CFL light bulbs to replace incandescents, and hooked
up a coil in my woodstove to heat hot water. Haven't used electricity
to make hot water since.
== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 6:56 pm
From: "Nicik Name"
"The Real Bev" <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:OVS2l.55295$v37.31453@newsfe01.iad...
> Evelyn Leeper wrote:
>
>> Rod Speed wrote:
>>>
>>> Did that with no upfront charge because my Nokia N95 cellphone
>>> has voip built in and I make the calls over wifi to my DSL.
>>
>> Just try telling that to someone over sixty years old and see the look on
>> their faces.
>
> Read my lips: Try not to be an asshole.
>
>> (Okay, not everyone in that age range.
>
> Gee thanks.
>
>> But when I picture my father trying to make sense of that sentence, my
>> mind boggles.)
>
> Did you set up a computer for him? Sometimes the "elderly" need to be
> forced. Our parents couldn't figure out why they needed a computer so we
> gave them one. Not having to deal out those damn cards for solitaire
> turns out to be a good enough reason, and it teaches mouse skills.
> Check todays date............
your parents know about computers
> --
> Cheers, Bev
> ============================================================
> Brian (Talking to crowd): You need to be independent minded.
> Crowd: We are! We are!
> Person in crowd: I'm not! -- Monty Python
== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 7:11 pm
From: The Real Bev
Seerialmom wrote:
> On Dec 19, 11:50 am, The Real Bev <bashley101+use...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Evelyn Leeper wrote:
>> > Rod Speed wrote:
>>
>> >> Did that with no upfront charge because my Nokia N95 cellphone
>> >> has voip built in and I make the calls over wifi to my DSL.
>>
>> > Just try telling that to someone over sixty years old and see the look
>> > on their faces.
>>
>> Read my lips: Try not to be an asshole.
>>
>> > (Okay, not everyone in that age range.
>>
>> Gee thanks.
>>
>> > But when I picture my father
>> > trying to make sense of that sentence, my mind boggles.)
>>
>> Did you set up a computer for him? Sometimes the "elderly" need to be
>> forced. Our parents couldn't figure out why they needed a computer so
>> we gave them one. Not having to deal out those damn cards for solitaire
>> turns out to be a good enough reason, and it teaches mouse skills.
>
> Bev I think you were under the impression that Rod S. made the comment
> about telling that to someone over 60 years old and watch their face.
> All he did was said how he used his cellphone and VOIP; it was Evelyn
> who made the comment about the 60 year old.
Yes, I knew that. She's normally a sensible person, but not this time.
I was perhaps more pissed off than I should have been, but I'm not
fully certain of that.
> personally I thought it was a pretty funny statement because I've seen
> many a blank face as I try to explain what's wrong with someone's
> computer.
Yeah, and age is largely irrelevant. My grandchildren, including a
15-YO, are not all that clueful.
--
Cheers, Bev
**********************************************
"I've had a Lucas pacemaker for years and have
never experienced any prob
== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 7:16 pm
From: The Real Bev
Dave Garland wrote:
> Evelyn Leeper wrote:
>
>> Just try telling that to someone over sixty years old and see the look
>> on their faces.
>
> Hey, watch your step, you young whippersnapper.
>
> Some of us old folks are too frugal to have cellphones. Or if we do,
> they're the cheapie prepaid ones. (Frugal hint: Most of the
> companies selling prepaid service expire the time eventually (usually
> in 60 or 90 days), but if you add more before it expires the old
> minutes roll over. If you don't use the phone much, the optimum is
> the service with the smallest=cheapest refills. In the US, T-Mobil
> sells $10 refills that have 90 day expiration,
Once you've bought $100 worth of time, it doesn't expire for a year.
Minimum cost from then on is $10/year. Not all that bad.
Personally, I did my Xmas shopping the easy way at Costco.com this year.
Everybody gets one of these:
http://tinyurl.com/4uru4x
(yes, it's safe for work)
--
Cheers, Bev
**********************************************
"I've had a Lucas pacemaker for years and have
never experienced any prob
== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 7:49 pm
From: Jeff
haranjoe@lycos.com wrote:
>> So that's a couple of small changes we have made. How about you?
>
> I got a bunch of CFL light bulbs to replace incandescents, and hooked
> up a coil in my woodstove to heat hot water. Haven't used electricity
> to make hot water since.
Gee, where do you live that you run a woodstove all year? Saving
money on hot water is a great idea as it can be 1/3 of your energy budget.
I'm going to try to get my solar hot water going this winter, just
painted the collectors with selective paint. My main idea is for winter
heat, but I'll have plenty for hot water the rest of the year which will
probably save as much or more money. I'd like to get my total energy
bill under $50/month. Not that it's a lot of money saved, I just hate
paying them!
Jeff
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Digital vs Analog cordless Phone? Health Radiation is the same?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/45689cba95ca38f8?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 3:56 pm
From: Dave Garland
lbbss wrote:
> I noticed that you can buy a 5.8Mhz phone in both analog or digital.
> I realize most people thing cordless phones are fairly safe, but is
> an still curious if one gives off more radiation then the other before
> I buy a my next phone.
By "radiation" you presumably mean "radio waves".
A digital spread spectrum (DSS) phone is allowed to have up to 1 watt
power, although many (most?) have less, and (to improve battery life)
the handset may use lower power than the base station. You're
unlikely to find specifications that tell you what any particular
phone does, though.
An analog phone looks like it is allowed to have 1 mW (0.001 watt) power.
In general, I'd expect *lower* frequency phones to use lower power,
because the lower frequencies are less affected by obstructions, etc.
If you're really worried about it, get a unit that you can use with a
headset (then the radio transmitter doesn't need to be against the
side of your head).
Dave
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 4:42 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)
In article <a5c025e6-66c0-456a-ab2d-7ec4cd604f6b@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>,
lbbss <labicff@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I noticed that you can buy a 5.8Mhz phone in both analog or digital.
>I realize most people thing cordless phones are fairly safe, but is
>an still curious if one gives off more radiation then the other before
>I buy a my next phone. thanks
The actual broadcast signal is analog for both, just different encoding.
Check the radiated power (usually marked in milliwatts, abreviated as mw)
to find out which is putting out more.
Gary
--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
"Behind every successful woman there is an astonished man"
General of the Army (four stars) Ann Dunwoody
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 5:56 pm
From: lbbss
more power equals more radiation? is that correct?
I read some info on the web suggesting that the new Dect technology is
worst for you, because of the lower frequencies (1.9Ghz) affects your
cells in a negative way.
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 6:06 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
lbbss wrote:
> more power equals more radiation? is that correct?
Yep.
> I read some info on the web suggesting that the new Dect technology is worst for
> you, because of the lower frequencies (1.9Ghz) affects your cells in a negative way.
Its complete bullshit. In fact the higher freqs can give you cataracts at power levels
that are massively higher than any cordless phone can ever generate and we havent
seen an increase in the number of cataracts as DECT phone use has increased.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Warning re Biodegradable Plastic Bags
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/ad8779c939ff4750?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 4:37 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)
In article <25d24844-f571-4267-bae4-b8274adf5bf1@g1g2000pra.googlegroups.com>,
Mark Leeper <mleeper@optonline.net> wrote:
[ ... ]
>Actually the story was more bizarre than that. I was the someone.
>There were no keys. I was keeping in a pocket a spare 9-volt battery
>and as it happens a Jolly Rancher candy. Somehow both leads of the 9-
>volt ended up touching the candy, which is a lowgrade conductor. I
>guess the current started melting the candy making a better
>connection. All I know is that I had a hot spot in my pocket and
>found the 9-volt and the melted candy.
Back in the days when police carried revolvers, it was a common practice
to carry spare ammo loose in a pocket. That in itself is fairly safe.
Then, these newfangled portable radios were issued, but they had a problem
with battery life being short, so they carried spare battery packs. After
a few incidents of rounds discharging when they got across the terminals
of a battery, causing relatively minor injuries, officers were provided
with belt pouches to keep batteries where they wouldn't short against
anything.
Older lithium batteries are particularly hazardous; I worked with some
that were about the size of a 1/2 long AA cell--they would dump 75 amps
into a dead short, until they exploded.
Carry batteries safely; medical emergencies aren't frugal.
Gary
--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
"Behind every successful woman there is an astonished man"
General of the Army (four stars) Ann Dunwoody
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Balck and Decker Power Monitor frugal?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d61157f837e5fc08?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 6:12 pm
From: me@privacy.net
Would this device be frugal?
It allows one to monitor power use in real time
http://www.blackanddecker.com/Energy/products.aspx?WT.mc_id=BD00039
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 8:04 pm
From: Jeff
me@privacy.net wrote:
> Would this device be frugal?
>
> It allows one to monitor power use in real time
>
> http://www.blackanddecker.com/Energy/products.aspx?WT.mc_id=BD00039
Well, it is $100. Nice toy though.
With that said, I often read my meter to check on overall daily useage.
I have a infrared thermometer to look for heat leaks. Now, that's a
neat tool you can get for under $50.
Also, the kill a watt devices are ~$25.00 and would give you much
better stats on single appliances.
Jeff
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Criminally insane or just a cancerous blood sucking leach?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1f065e7bde756998?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 7:09 pm
From: phil scott
The Blood Sucking Parasite? Or is it a malignant cancer…. Or.. a
malignant blood sucking leach?
Relative to the US govt and to a large extent its complicit no bid
quasi govt corporations, brazenly corrupt, Fanny Mae, Haliburtion, etc
etc.. and what President Eisenhower warned about 'the military
industrial complex" .. all of that can be characterized as a
malignant blood sucking leach in my view.
Ymmv
Any organism, bacteria, bunny rabbits, bears in the woods, leaches, or
humanity on the face of the earth tends to grow to the limit of its
food supply,
…..including in many cases eating its host alive. The parasite seeks
to survive and grow a the expense of its host. a benign tumor at
first, it becomes cancerous and destroys its host.
** that's my basic observation and premise **
With that thought alone, and no other, and noticing the behavior of
your host government, you should be able to complete the analogy, and
notice the inevitable, and historic and biological repercussions… and
end stage cure.
It's not rocket science.
***
I urge you *not to read on. It is my wish that you examine these
mechanisms in common for yourself, only in that way will you come to
appreciate what's happened, and why it's happened, and why it has
been repeating in history….. and finally a way to save yourself from
some of such ravages.
(Hint: same strategy works against vampires)
**
this is my long winded elaboration.
If you are tempted to read the following it is for one reason only…
you had not read the above remarks relating to the nature of all
tumors, cancers, parasites and leaches. And you missed the allusion
to the wooden stake solution entirely
*****
Any government. Corporation or conglomerate of such entities, say the
ocean fisheries corporations for instance… or the IRS, or just state
or local government has the same exact set of motivations… that is to
grow and be successful in what it does… and at first generally
supported for whatever benefit it brings.…
These also tend to over graze so to speak, ruin its habitat, or
ruin the habitat *then become outright cancerous… that's the class A
variety we have just witnessed ruining America. Class A no doubt
about it. Simply beyond all human comprehension.
GBW, the Neocons, and their utterly criminal and now totally failed
PNAC doctrine (search it on google)
Humanity one would think is smarter than that, but apparently not…
Human governments, being a collage of such…. apparently take such
insanity to its ballistic limits… in all cases.
So please, now do not mistake my intent…
I am not just targeting government here in my remarks… But I am
including government, a necessary parasite…which in the end, no
exceptions yet in world history.. goes criminally insane. It turns
cancerous… most end by killing everything in sight. (takes about 250
years to rach such and end stage)
Depressions are simply mid stage steps in the longer process, We
have currently run our course on depressions, our leach has become
terminally and incurably cancerous, the dead tissue has caused sepsis.
The patient will die shortly,… a few straglers will survive
This memo is to alert those to whatever thin degree it might be
useful.
***
A current example in the US:
We have given upwards of 8 trillion dollars to the banks and
criminally insane bankers that have brought us this end stage total
300 trillion dollar financial melt down, as we are paying IRS
thugs to go after mom and pop businesses simply trying to employ
themselves and a few others …
And who became in the end unable to eat and produce enough blood to
satisfy the giant leach… so thugs have been dispatched to finish them
off,… even as that ruins whats left of the same tax base that pays the
thugs,
That's insanity… the self destructive end game.
So we can give the very last bits of our blood, crop seed, and money
to criminals running our financial institutions into the ground…..in
order to pay these billions of dollars in bonuses for doing so.
You wanted a marker for comlete and terminal criminal insanity? Well
that's just one.
The other and more important marker is the US citizenry as it watches
its nation collapse at the hands of these criminals… and has not
stormed their capitols.
that same criminality is taking everything our working class had that
it needed to survive….its industrial infrastructure, and its jobs ….…
no blood left… no tax base…. The blood sucking leach is dying,,, even
as it spends the last bit of its rescourses paying IRS thugs to go
after the last remaining viable business and already broken
retirees, broken by governments own corruption of the currency so
that it wont buy sufficient bread any longer…. We send the IRS thugs
out at great expense demanding these half starved prove they paid it
all…every dime,
(these self same IRS thugs, and police btw retiring in a range
between $100,000 and $200,000 per year (half of that TAX FREE … with
100% health care, at age 51 in the case of civil 'service' lifers)
This is also completely and utterly self destructive nationally… there
is no money, except In the near future worthless hyper inflated
currency to pay for one single dime of that….
In the end the cancerous leach goes insane and destroys itself,….
You, the gentle reader have a front row seat.
Differentiating the cancerous from the non cancerous tumors and
parasites:
The more begnign of such parasites abates voluntarily as it sees its
host suffering… for instance a parent who is depending on his childs
labor in a third world nation will not work the child to death as a
rule. There is common human interest in viability for all
involved. These will not go out and poison their drinking water
wells carelessly. In this category, of common human interests there
is a modicum of viable behavior. Not always, but generally. The
American Indians ceased hunting any thinning herd or fishery,,, they
let it recover.
The corrupt govt and its host corporations has no such motive…. It
simply wants it all, as soon as possible.,. that variety becomes the
most aggressive of the cancers…. And the strongest, and mostly
untreatable.
***
As face to face human concerns connections drop away… then such
government moves from being a useful begnign parasite, to a blood
sucking leach that ruins its host.
This is common across all life forms… in the human body we have first
a few stray cells forming a begnign tumor, then these turn cancerous,
unnoticed, tolerated… become larger and then kill the host… it is a
pattern that repeats in the microcosm…. and the macrocosm of nations,
all through recorded history,
It begins to eat away the muscle and sinues of the person, with govt,
and in the case of the US Internal Revenue Service, it has sucked so
much blood from its hosts that there is not enough blood left for the
host to function…it becomes unable to eat and give blood at the same
time.
It is at this stage that the blood sucking leach sucks harder,,
finally sucking all the blood from its host, imploding its own brain …
that's the current condition, by factual observation
The leach them moves to its next victim early in the process, but in
the end runs out of victims…in the case of the state of California
(and the US govt despite spin to the contrary) it can no longer sell
bonds to its own public or internationally…. By the way, two weeks
ago our treasurer here in Calif said we would not be selling bonds
because he wanted to do the right thing, not go into further debt, but
cut govt to a budget. Well today we find out, the real story,
calif bonds are fast becoming junk rated, he can sell then at any
discount.
The US federal govt is in the sane boat
No more blood is to be had. The entire turnip has been sucked
dry,
The Leach then, as leaches do, keeps on sucking until it impodes its
own head. That has been the pattern of every single government in
every single nation, known thoughout the history of the earth.
**
My advice, study up on how the survivors survived.. and the failure
modes, next actions, and desperations of such governments… then make
sure you have stepped to the side across all aspects of your existence
(not just economically).
***
Note for Homeland security
Despite what some of you have been told it is freedom of speech that
affords the lasting strength and viabiliy of any nation, It is the
challenges and stressors caused to govt especially, from dissidents
that preclude collapse these are not the cause of collapse as
governments gone corrupt assume... and as the worst president in US
history GWB had assumed as he pushed his destructive agenda warning
not to ' speak against the national interest US corporate interest
under penalty of treason'
the man is criminally insane,
These imprison their dissendents or murder them outright,. always
that has been a mistake, in the end such govts become so weak and
their economies and peoples so decimated that they cannot defend
themselves nor cope with the storm of dissention from within....and
the massive assaults from without, These collapse economically
first, then in all other respects, we are deeply in the process
here in the US
Further I recommend the now classic film with Natalie Portman, V
for Victory/? or maybe that was V for Veracity?
Perhaps V for Verbosely Verbose, or possibly the V was for
Vendetta,
accordingly you might review as I am sure you are ... the phenomena
of 'anonymous', faceless, nameless, no location, no shape, no single
goal ,,, except to speak freely,
go search Youtube for 'anonymous; and one of its original social
agenda anouncements in the months of Jan and Feb 2008.... do this as
you reward the most massively criminal acts ever seen on earth. and
send thugs after those who mention it.
I am not impressed,
Phil scott
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Onesuite Question
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/136859395009c10f?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 19 2008 11:17 pm
From: "NotMe"
"NancyR" <nancyr@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:gif0fb$s0q$1@news.motzarella.org...
: "Zee" <zzaldy@gmail.com> wrote in message news:a9cb322d-b920-47e0-95fd->
:
: "Hi Nancy, are you dialing the 1-800-3159339? I had the same problem a
: while back on pinless dialing using that 800 number. Try the other 800
: number 1-800-3165123. If you are using a local access number then try
: another Onesuite local access number. Hope this helps."
:
: Zee,
: Thanks so much for responding. The second number works fine. It's too
bad
: that Onesuite couldn't suggest this.
:
Onesuit support is off shore and aside from having comprehension problems is
not technically trained much less qualified. Hint they read from a scrip
and if it 'ain't scripted" they can't tell you.
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