Frugal Living: 25 new messages in 10 topics

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

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TOPIC: Surviving a bear attack
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6fc0d7e660741dbe?hl=en
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:02 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:13:54 GMT, "Ryan Robbins"
<redbird007@verizon.net> wrote:

>"Patriot Games" <Patriot@America.Com> wrote in message
>news:fsjqc49hve0nig0mhufgocetllf0ukepij@4ax.com...
>> Also, even though bears can sprint much faster than a person they
>> CANNOT run downhill.
>
>FALSE!

He thought you meant HIM. He's an old bear with arthritic knees (from
giving other bears so much sloppy head for so many years). I know who
he is, hangs out at a leather bar South of Market, gets on usenet
pretending to be a stupid hetero dickwad. His real name is Gary.

--
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http://www.gay-bible.org/steal

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:04 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 15:37:03 -0500, "John A. Weeks III"
<john@johnweeks.com> wrote:

>The evidence would suggest just the opposite. After all, wasn't
>it leading Republicans Larry Craig and Ted Haggard who were recently
>in the news for gay sex. In Craig's case, he was arrested from
>trying to pick up an undercover cop in a bathroom. That must
>be pretty high on your list of family values.

Well, he calls himself "patriot," so what else could we expect from
such a loser? He's a sad, lonely closet case. ALL men are who feel
they need to act super macho. Can you say "pathetic"?

--
Steal This Blog!
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: George Foreman Grill
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5150d26d00ad4bfc?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:07 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:56:32 -0700 (PDT), Al Bundy
<MSfortune@mcpmail.com> wrote:

> Hey, what the heck. A high school kid has to start somewhere.

I give him a "D".

--
Steal This Blog!
http://www.gay-bible.org/steal

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I am losing my butt
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2b88d0c3914417a6?hl=en
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== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:29 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 07:53:16 +1000, "Rod Speed"
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

>Only the dregs of the severely disabled end up entirely dependant on social security.

Nonsense. The majority of folks totally dependant on soc. sec. are not
dregs. They are decent people who suffer the misfortune of a
malicious, violent society.

>> You sound like Der Fuhrer.
>
>He gassed them, fool.

But first, he labelled all the handicapped "dregs" in order to justify
to himself and German citizens, the Final Solution. So yeah, you sound
very much like a Nazi...or at best, a "good German".

>Everyone dies sometime.

What kind of rationale is that? It certainly doesn't justify or excuse
slaughtering the diabled or any other innocent person scapegoated by
the ignorant masses.

>Corse it will, just like it did during the great depression and those world wars, you watch.

The United States is a terrorist nation, just like Germany had become.
And, just like Germany, needs to be stopped dead in its tracks and
divided. Amerika has started most of its wars, most unnecessary. The
Great Depression was a direct result of the barbarian ideology of hard
core capitalists, who run this gov't. War IS a racket.

>They werent put in place by FDR, they were put in place by Congress.

Under the watch of FDR. Duh.

>And we wouldnt have seen the bailout of Bear Stearns, Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac if your lie was true.

The gov't is bailing out big business, capitalist monsters...NOT the
people themselves. That's why we don't have universal health care,
living wage, etc., like civilized nations do.

>> It will be far more disastrous, and most likely unrecoverable.
>
>Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys, you watch.

Drug crazed? Pig ignorant? Is that your simplistic conclusion about
those who express compassion? News flash: "Patriotism is the last
refuge of a scoundrel."

>And we have invented the technology that allows us to yawn about that, nukes.

We are losing all the good things our technology has created. We've
dumbed down students by wrecking public education...we've been ripped
off and wrecked by our own leaders and corporations. You're an
absolute fool, to defend these antiAmerikan goons. We are going to
drown in our own greed, ignorance, and false patriotism. Our own
unbridled arrogance has finally dismantled and eradicated whatever
worthy accomplishments we've achieved. Amerika is now a totalitarian,
fascist society.

You're like an old Russian who stood up for the USSR even under
Stalin, despite all the evidence against.

>Cash under the bed isnt, fool.

And what if a fire burns away all your moolah? Or you're burglarized?
No matter, it's just ink on paper...soon to become totally worthless.
Do you REALLY keep cash under your bed? Invite me over for tea some
time...and I'll leave that much richer for the visit! :)

>Wrong, as always. You can keep it in FDIC guaranteed accounts if you want to, fool.

I admire your undaunting faith in such a corrupt gov't...as foolish as
that may be. I guess that old saying really IS true:

"Ignorance is bliss."

--
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== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:39 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 23:28:58 GMT, not@home.org (Barack's Bomber, Bill
Ayres) wrote:

>>>Fine? What about the incalculable suffering and deaths?
>
>Yeah, that seems to accompany wars.

Wars that are not necessary.

>Well, we could have been appeasement apostles and perhaps you'd be
>living under Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, or Islamic Sharia law.

WWII is just ONE war. Which COULD have been averted if we didn't have
so much business selling Nazis war material. But WWII was planned by
our own gov't, as a way for the elite to get even richer.

>Do you think you'd be able to run your mouth under them, as freely as
>you do now?

Well, since we helped to creat that war, I'd say our leaders already
WERE Nazis,,,,and our supposed freedoms were simply illusions all
along. Now, EVERYONE is going to discover this neat little factoid. We
do NOT have freedom of speech in Amerika...only a pale facsimile to
delude us.

>Let us do away with capitalism, comrade.

No, we can have a different FORM of capitalism, is all. One that
respects and HONORS democracy. What we have now is terrorist
capitalism, a form of fascism. If you think compassionate programs
like universal health care is socialism or communism, you are
brainwashed.

>Kill the corporations, along with the goods, services, and jobs they
>provide.

Nope. Just close all the tax loopholes, so we can easily afford living
wages, health care, housing for the poor, etc. Corporation profits are
on the backs of workers, who made them rich. You say we don't deserve
a healthy share of these profits? How unAmerikan of you!

>You grow the potatoes; I'll grow the cabbage, and we'll share.

That is soon where most of us will be, under the evil of our present
capitalists, who are raping our country. They are antiAmerikan, and
you are one of their brainwashed puppets.

>And being good little communists, we'll share with those who didn't
>grow anything.

Oh, good for you. Call true patriots communists. Aren't you the good
little Benedict Arnold!

--
Steal This Blog!
http://www.gay-bible.org/steal

== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:41 am
From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:00:52 -0400, "h" <tmclone@searchmachine.com>
wrote:

>Human population needs to drop down to a manageable 3-4 billion as soon as
>possible.

Right on! And the rest of what you said, so well wirt!

--
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== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 12:49 am
From: Carl Beattie

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 07:39:22 GMT, in alt.social-security-disability
chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian) wrote:

>
>WWII is just ONE war. Which COULD have been averted if we didn't have
>so much business selling Nazis war material. But WWII was planned by
>our own gov't, as a way for the elite to get even richer.
>

Just like the revolutionary war was planned by the rich to make the rich richer,
the common person gained nothing by breaking from England. And when they said
all "men" are created equal they really did mean men but they only meant
themselves as in the ones who drafted it. Only men who owned property could
vote and only white men could own property.

== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 1:18 am
From: "John Que Public"

"Chief Thracian" <chief_thracian@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:48d0b20e.17319123@amsterdam.newsgroups-download.com...
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 23:28:58 GMT, not@home.org (Barack's Bomber,
> Bill
> Ayres) wrote:
>
>>>>Fine? What about the incalculable suffering and deaths?
>>
>>Yeah, that seems to accompany wars.
>
> Wars that are not necessary.
>
>>Well, we could have been appeasement apostles and perhaps you'd be
>>living under Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, or Islamic Sharia law.
>
> WWII is just ONE war. Which COULD have been averted if we didn't
> have
> so much business selling Nazis war material. But WWII was planned by
> our own gov't, as a way for the elite to get even richer.
>
>>Do you think you'd be able to run your mouth under them, as freely
>>as
>>you do now?
>
> Well, since we helped to creat that war, I'd say our leaders already
> WERE Nazis,,,,and our supposed freedoms were simply illusions all
> along. Now, EVERYONE is going to discover this neat little factoid.
> We
> do NOT have freedom of speech in Amerika...only a pale facsimile to
> delude us.
>
>>Let us do away with capitalism, comrade.
>
> No, we can have a different FORM of capitalism, is all. One that
> respects and HONORS democracy. What we have now is terrorist
> capitalism, a form of fascism. If you think compassionate programs
> like universal health care is socialism or communism, you are
> brainwashed.
>
>>Kill the corporations, along with the goods, services, and jobs they
>>provide.
>
> Nope. Just close all the tax loopholes, so we can easily afford
> living
> wages, health care, housing for the poor, etc. Corporation profits
> are
> on the backs of workers, who made them rich. You say we don't
> deserve
> a healthy share of these profits? How unAmerikan of you!

Hell yes! Jack the taxes through the roof on those evil corporations.
Of course they will simply pass on the corporate taxes by raising the
prices of the products they manufacture or sell and the consumer will
pay the taxes.

FYI: All taxes are paid by the little guys so any tax increase to any
group falls on the backs of consumers.

The auto industry is a prime example of tax and government program
cost increase being passed on to the consumer. In 1974 a new ford 1/2
ton van cost around $4000.00 Thanks to government programs and taxes
the new smaller version cost over $35,000.00 the stripped down 1/2 ton
full sized version is now over $50,000.00. Who do you think is paying
for the higher taxes and government regulated features we have today?

When government involves itself in the taxation, production or
operation of any business the consumer is the one that pays the added
cost.

J.Q.P.

>
>>You grow the potatoes; I'll grow the cabbage, and we'll share.
>
> That is soon where most of us will be, under the evil of our present
> capitalists, who are raping our country. They are antiAmerikan, and
> you are one of their brainwashed puppets.
>
>>And being good little communists, we'll share with those who didn't
>>grow anything.
>
> Oh, good for you. Call true patriots communists. Aren't you the good
> little Benedict Arnold!
>
>
> --
> Steal This Blog!
> http://www.gay-bible.org/steal

== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 2:41 am
From: "Rod Speed"

Chief Thracian <chief_thracian@yahoo.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

>> Only the dregs of the severely disabled end up entirely dependant on social security.

> Nonsense.

Fact.

> The majority of folks totally dependant on soc. sec. are not dregs.

Corse they are.

> They are decent people who suffer the misfortune of a malicious, violent society.

They were too stupid to make their own provision for that rare situation.

>>> You sound like Der Fuhrer.

>> He gassed them, fool.

> But first, he labelled all the handicapped "dregs" in order
> to justify to himself and German citizens, the Final Solution.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

He had them gassed out of the view of the absolute vast bulk of the krauts.

>>> What about the incalculable suffering

>> Pure fantasy.

>>> and deaths?

>> Everyone dies sometime.

> What kind of rationale is that?

Just rubbing your stupid drug crazed ignorance in the basics, as always.

> It certainly doesn't justify or excuse slaughtering the diabled

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> or any other innocent person scapegoated by the ignorant masses.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

>>> Not to mention all the INNOCENT victims wiped out by our so-called righteous battles?

>> Nothing to do with the guarantees being discussed.

>>> Our nation has terrorized many other nations for many years now...

>> Nothing to do with the guarantees being discussed.

>> You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

>>> and gotten away with it, so far. This time around, it won't work.

>> Corse it will, just like it did during the great depression and those world wars, you watch.

> The United States is a terrorist nation,

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> just like Germany had become.

You wouldnt know what a real terrorist was if one bit you on your lard arse.

> And, just like Germany, needs to be stopped dead in its tracks and divided.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> Amerika has started most of its wars, most unnecessary.

Didnt start the ones that mattered, fuckwit.

> The Great Depression was a direct result of the barbarian
> ideology of hard core capitalists, who run this gov't.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> War IS a racket.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

>>> Capitalism has diligently wiped out all those safeguards put in place by FDR.

>> They werent put in place by FDR, they were put in place by Congress.

> Under the watch of FDR.

No such animal.

>> And we wouldnt have seen the bailout of Bear Stearns, Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac if your lie was true.

> The gov't is bailing out big business, capitalist monsters...

To avoid a full depression, fuckwit.

> NOT the people themselves.

Wrong, as always. Its those that benefit if there is no depression, fuckwit.

> That's why we don't have universal health care, living wage, etc., like civilized nations do.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

>>> It will be far more disastrous, and most likely unrecoverable.

>> Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys, you watch.

> Drug crazed? Pig ignorant?

Yep.

> Is that your simplistic conclusion about those who express compassion?

Nope, just about stupid drug crazed pig ignorant clowns like you.

> News flash: "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel."

You wouldnt know what real patriotism was if it bit you on your lard arse, child.

>>> 3 billion MORE people are in the capitalist game now ("Chindia"), grabbing
>>> as much and as fast as they can, limited resources of oil and gas.

>> And we have invented the technology that allows us to yawn about that, nukes.

> We are losing all the good things our technology has created.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> We've dumbed down students by wrecking public education...

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> we've been ripped off and wrecked by our own leaders and corporations.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> You're an absolute fool, to defend these antiAmerikan goons.

You're always welcome to set fire to yourself in 'protest' or sumfin.

> We are going to drown in our own greed, ignorance, and false patriotism.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> Our own unbridled arrogance has finally dismantled and
> eradicated whatever worthy accomplishments we've achieved.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> Amerika is now a totalitarian,fascist society.

You wouldnt know what real totalitarianism or fascism was if it bit you on your lard arse, child.

> You're like an old Russian who stood up for the USSR even under Stalin, despite all the evidence against.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

>>>>> All that said, yeah, the markets are way too volatile for people in or very near retirement.

>>>> Wrong again. All those close to retirement have to do is avoid the most volatile markets.

>>> EVERY market is highly volatile, dufus

>> Cash under the bed isnt, fool.

> And what if a fire burns away all your moolah?

Anyone with a clue puts it in a fire proof safe, fuckwit.

> Or you're burglarized?

Anyone with a clue puts it where it cant be, fuckwit.

> No matter, it's just ink on paper...soon to become totally worthless.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> Do you REALLY keep cash under your bed?

Nope. Just rubbing your stupid pig ignorant drug crazed nose in the FACT that it aint VOLATILE, fuckwit.

> Invite me over for tea some time...

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

> and I'll leave that much richer for the visit! :)

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

>>> There is NO safe haven when it comes to gambling...er, I mean investing.

>> Wrong, as always. You can keep it in FDIC guaranteed accounts if you want to, fool.

> I admire your undaunting faith in such a corrupt gov't...

Its undaunted, fuckwit.

> as foolish as that may be. I guess that old saying really IS true:

> "Ignorance is bliss."

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed pig ignorant fantasys.

== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 5:53 am
From: not@home.org (Barack's Bomber, Bill Ayres)

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 07:39:22 GMT, chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief
Thracian) wrote:

>On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 23:28:58 GMT, not@home.org (Barack's Bomber, Bill
>Ayres) wrote:
>
>>>>Fine? What about the incalculable suffering and deaths?
>>
>>Yeah, that seems to accompany wars.
>
>Wars that are not necessary.

Historians tell us that since the inception of homo sapiens, the world
has been at peace for something like 16 minutes.

Regarding the present, tell your whine to Akmed and those who are on a
global mission to convert, enslave, or kill all infidels.

>>Well, we could have been appeasement apostles and perhaps you'd be
>>living under Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, or Islamic Sharia law.
>
>WWII is just ONE war. Which COULD have been averted if we didn't have
>so much business selling Nazis war material. But WWII was planned by
>our own gov't, as a way for the elite to get even richer.

Are you Neville Chamberlain's great grandson?

>>Do you think you'd be able to run your mouth under them, as freely as
>>you do now?
>
>Well, since we helped to creat that war, I'd say our leaders already
>WERE Nazis,,,,and our supposed freedoms were simply illusions all
>along. Now, EVERYONE is going to discover this neat little factoid. We
>do NOT have freedom of speech in Amerika...only a pale facsimile to
>delude us.

You're running your mouth pretty good.

Perhaps you'd find life more enjoyable in a utopia like Cuba, North
Korea, or Vietnam.

Perhaps you'd savor life in one of the 57 Muslim countries. If you're
a female, I'm sure you'd enjoy practicing the quaint traditions of
Sharia law.

Or if you'd prefer a simple lifestyle, sub-Saharan Africa beckons.
The folks are real down-to-earth there.

>>Let us do away with capitalism, comrade.
>
>No, we can have a different FORM of capitalism, is all. One that
>respects and HONORS democracy. What we have now is terrorist
>capitalism, a form of fascism. If you think compassionate programs
>like universal health care is socialism or communism, you are
>brainwashed.

I've heard of the wonders of national health from my friends in UK.
They get to pull their own teeth, wait a mere 6 months to get MRIs, 2
years to see a psychiatrist .... rejection of obese patients ...
delaying necessary treatment for cancer patients .... It seems that
they are starting to travel to the US for treatment. And in
Canuckistan, ladies are crossing the border to have their babies
delivered. So if universal health care is in our future, I hope that
it is well thought out. All aspects of it.

>>Kill the corporations, along with the goods, services, and jobs they
>>provide.
>
>Nope. Just close all the tax loopholes, so we can easily afford living
>wages, health care, housing for the poor, etc. Corporation profits are
>on the backs of workers, who made them rich. You say we don't deserve
>a healthy share of these profits? How unAmerikan of you!

Lovely platitudes.

Straight off the teleprompter.

Now, fill us in on the nuts-and-bolts details to accomplish what you
say.

And when you have formulated your socioeconomic and tax strategies, be
sure to pass a copy to Barry Obama.

>>You grow the potatoes; I'll grow the cabbage, and we'll share.
>
>That is soon where most of us will be, under the evil of our present
>capitalists, who are raping our country. They are antiAmerikan, and
>you are one of their brainwashed puppets.

Senor Fidel welcomes you with open arms, comrade.

Now don't let the door hit ya in the ass on the way out.

>>And being good little communists, we'll share with those who didn't
>>grow anything.
>
>Oh, good for you. Call true patriots communists. Aren't you the good
>little Benedict Arnold!

Hey, if it talks like a commie, and smells like a commie ......

==============================================================================
TOPIC: All bankers are criminals and should be treated as such.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/929a49de1380dfd5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 2:17 am
From: St Georges Day April 23rd

The people in charge of these banks which did this should be killed
and their property confiscated to pay off any debt.

This is the only true way to handle these on-going bank frauds and
stock market swindles.

But the bankers work in extended crime families. It is necessary to
arrest all of the bankers, CEOs and Board members as well as their
entire extended families and business associates.

Put them on trial for grand larceny and treason, and confiscate
everything that they have swindled. This would erase the National Debt
and give every American and Englishman their own home free and clear
of debt.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 5:47 am
From: "Paul Thomas, CPA"

"St Georges Day April 23rd" <bbbbbdfgdfgdgddfg@googlemail.com> wrote
> The people in charge of these banks which did this should be killed
> and their property confiscated to pay off any debt.

Now slow down sparkey. These lenders didn't go out, waylay some poor scmuck
on the street and force them to take out a loan they couldn't support.

It took at least two to create the problem. Lender and borrower. Greedy
lenders. Greedy borrowers.

> This is the only true way to handle these on-going bank frauds and
> stock market swindles.

And the folks who said they had income sufficient to repay the debt? I
doubt that there is just one no-doc loan that contains a tad of expectations
and puffery on the application filled out by the borrower. Nope, not just
one for sure. In fact, I'd be surprised if there were one that didn't
contain some erroneous claim by the borrower about their income or assets.

Seems there is sufficient fraud on both sides to go around.

You have to remember that home equity loans are a relatively new idea.
Brought out by lenders to meet the demand of borrowers. Greedy borrowers
took to them like a teen to a text message. Borrowers took out home equity
loans to do stupid things like go on vacation. They used their house like
an ATM, borrowing any and all equity they could, refinancing and rolling up
the HELOC, and second mortgages into one big first mortgage with a cash out
and starting all over again.

So who caused the mess you're in? If not you - the borrower - then who?
And why is it someone elses fault that they let you - the borrower - be
greedy?

Is it the cops fault that they let you speed? It's the fault of the road
department for making the roads so smooth that you can go twice the speed
limit? So now what, you shouldn't have to pay the speeding ticket?

--
"For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For
those who do not, none will suffice." - Joseph Dunniger

Paul A. Thomas, CPA
Athens, Georgia

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:25 am
From: Jeff

Paul Thomas, CPA wrote:
> "St Georges Day April 23rd" <bbbbbdfgdfgdgddfg@googlemail.com> wrote
>> The people in charge of these banks which did this should be killed
>> and their property confiscated to pay off any debt.
>
>
> Now slow down sparkey. These lenders didn't go out, waylay some poor scmuck
> on the street and force them to take out a loan they couldn't support.

I don't really disagree with you, but...

There's some evidence that as much as one quarter of all subprime loans
could have been financed otherwise. In that respect at least some of
these smucks were waylaid. There was also the implication that they
could refinance after their property had appreciated.
>
> It took at least two to create the problem. Lender and borrower. Greedy
> lenders. Greedy borrowers.

Oh it goes beyond that. When you make CDOs of that debt it became
easy for the bond rating agencies to never really look into that complex
mess and just do what those who hired them wanted. All everyone wanted
was to drive this foolish easy money/ easy profit market.

The real failure, IMHO, is that the regulators did exactly what the
sharks wanted. Not what was good for them or the country but what they
wanted. That permissiveness is a hallmark of this era.

Jeff
>
>
>
>
>> This is the only true way to handle these on-going bank frauds and
>> stock market swindles.
>
>
>
> And the folks who said they had income sufficient to repay the debt? I
> doubt that there is just one no-doc loan that contains a tad of expectations
> and puffery on the application filled out by the borrower. Nope, not just
> one for sure. In fact, I'd be surprised if there were one that didn't
> contain some erroneous claim by the borrower about their income or assets.
>
> Seems there is sufficient fraud on both sides to go around.
>
>
>
>
>
> You have to remember that home equity loans are a relatively new idea.
> Brought out by lenders to meet the demand of borrowers. Greedy borrowers
> took to them like a teen to a text message. Borrowers took out home equity
> loans to do stupid things like go on vacation. They used their house like
> an ATM, borrowing any and all equity they could, refinancing and rolling up
> the HELOC, and second mortgages into one big first mortgage with a cash out
> and starting all over again.
>
> So who caused the mess you're in? If not you - the borrower - then who?
> And why is it someone elses fault that they let you - the borrower - be
> greedy?
>
> Is it the cops fault that they let you speed? It's the fault of the road
> department for making the roads so smooth that you can go twice the speed
> limit? So now what, you shouldn't have to pay the speeding ticket?
>
>
>
>
>
>

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:26 am
From: Jeff

I don't really disagree with you, but...

The real failure, IMHO, is that the regulators did exactly what the
sharks wanted. Not what was good for them or the country but what they
wanted. That permissiveness is a hallmark of this era.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: AIG borrows $85 billion (USD) from the U.S. government today just to
stay afloat
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f165c292fdf5921a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 2:28 am
From: Taylor

dad:"Buddy, we're with A.I.G."
son: "Oh."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VvGW98D3XA

______________________
mccaw@rogers.com
www.nocirc.org

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 5:25 am
From: "John A. Weeks III"

In article
<46864c41-b00c-41c5-a7d1-94f9191158cc@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
Taylor <lukebenward@gmail.com> wrote:

> dad:"Buddy, we're with A.I.G."
> son: "Oh."

Note that the AIG life insurance company was not part of
the bail-out loan. The life insurance group is solvent,
is in good financial health, and is doing business as
normal. That line of business is much more heavily
regulated by the states and did not get in the same
trouble as some other companies that carry an AIG name.

-john-

--
======================================================================
John A. Weeks III 612-720-2854 john@johnweeks.com
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
======================================================================

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Reusing Water
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/fd655be017f95057?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 3:51 am
From: Lou

>
> Should be okay for lawn areas, but keep the organic matter up, aka do not
> crop and dispose of the grass clippings but mulch them back into the lawn.

You got my curiosity up, why?
Lou

==============================================================================
TOPIC: AUDIO: "There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever the nature of the crash
is such that it cannot be repaired. It is like dropping a mirror."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e93d816ff7c3e927?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 4:18 am
From: "."

http://www.iamthewitness.com/audio/Muhammad.Rafeeq/CII.2008.08.08.Fri.Rafeeq.mp3

Daryl Bradford Smith's French Connection
http://www.iamthewitness.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What's an average wait time for large checks deposited?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ca72020d3b4132af?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 4:38 am
From: "OhioGuy"

I just sold some stocks so that we could finally pay off our mortgage
completely. I got the checks from scottrade in the mail yesterday, and went
to deposit them. I was told there would be a delay before the funds would
be available. I figured it would be maybe 3 days. They told me it would be
5, so I figured max of 1 week including the weekend.

When I got home, I noticed that the receipt said the funds would be
available OCTOBER 1, not the 5 days I had been told. So now I have to wait
a full two weeks before paying off the mortgage, which seems excessive.
It's a whole half month they get to keep my $ and I can't do anything with
it.

Now I'm remembering that we had to wait a whole week when we deposited our
tax refund, and that was directly from the US Treasury. The US Treasury and
Scottrade are well known, trusted entities, so why in the world are they
making us wait so long for funds to be available? What is the purpose? I
thought they usually just scanned the checks and transferred the funds in a
day, like a wire transfer.

Are these normal wait times at banks for "large" deposits of around $11k?
I'm wondering why the cashier told me 5 days, but it turns out to be 15.

LONGER DELAYS MAY APPLY

In some cases, we will not make all of the funds that you deposit by check
available to you on the same business day as the day of your deposit.
Depending on the type of check that you deposit, funds may not be available
until the fifth business day after the day of your deposit. However, the
first $100.00 of your deposit will be available no later than the first
business day after the day of your deposit.

If we are not going to make all of the funds from your deposit available on
the same business day as the day of your deposit, we will notify you at the
time you make your deposit. We will also tell you when the funds will be
available. If your deposit is not made directly to one of our employees, or
if we decide to take this action after you have left the premises, we will
mail you the notice by the business day after the business day we receive
your deposit.

If you will need the funds from a deposit right away, you should ask us when
the funds will be available.
In addition, funds you deposit by check may be delayed for a longer period
under the following circumstances:
We believe a check you deposited will not be paid.

You deposit checks totaling more than $5,000.00 on any one day.

You redeposit a check that has been returned unpaid.

You have overdrawn your account repeatedly in the last six months.

There is an emergency, such as failure of communications or computer
equipment.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 5:27 am
From: Al Bundy

On Sep 17, 7:38 am, "OhioGuy" <n...@none.net> wrote:
> I just sold some stocks so that we could finally pay off our mortgage
> completely. I got the checks from scottrade in the mail yesterday, and went
> to deposit them. I was told there would be a delay before the funds would
> be available. I figured it would be maybe 3 days. They told me it would be
> 5, so I figured max of 1 week including the weekend.
>
> When I got home, I noticed that the receipt said the funds would be
> available OCTOBER 1, not the 5 days I had been told. So now I have to wait
> a full two weeks before paying off the mortgage, which seems excessive.
> It's a whole half month they get to keep my $ and I can't do anything with
> it.
>
> Now I'm remembering that we had to wait a whole week when we deposited our
> tax refund, and that was directly from the US Treasury. The US Treasury and
> Scottrade are well known, trusted entities, so why in the world are they
> making us wait so long for funds to be available? What is the purpose? I
> thought they usually just scanned the checks and transferred the funds in a
> day, like a wire transfer.
>
> Are these normal wait times at banks for "large" deposits of around $11k?
> I'm wondering why the cashier told me 5 days, but it turns out to be 15.
>
> LONGER DELAYS MAY APPLY
>
> In some cases, we will not make all of the funds that you deposit by check
> available to you on the same business day as the day of your deposit.
> Depending on the type of check that you deposit, funds may not be available
> until the fifth business day after the day of your deposit. However, the
> first $100.00 of your deposit will be available no later than the first
> business day after the day of your deposit.
>
> If we are not going to make all of the funds from your deposit available on
> the same business day as the day of your deposit, we will notify you at the
> time you make your deposit. We will also tell you when the funds will be
> available. If your deposit is not made directly to one of our employees, or
> if we decide to take this action after you have left the premises, we will
> mail you the notice by the business day after the business day we receive
> your deposit.
>
> If you will need the funds from a deposit right away, you should ask us when
> the funds will be available.
> In addition, funds you deposit by check may be delayed for a longer period
> under the following circumstances:
> We believe a check you deposited will not be paid.
>
> You deposit checks totaling more than $5,000.00 on any one day.
>
> You redeposit a check that has been returned unpaid.
>
> You have overdrawn your account repeatedly in the last six months.
>
> There is an emergency, such as failure of communications or computer
> equipment.

I think you are getting hosed by your institution. I just deposited
$41K in three checks and they cleared overnight. If they were foreign
checks it could take over four days, but it doesn't sound like it is
in your case.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:56 am
From: James

On Sep 17, 8:27 am, Al Bundy <MSfort...@mcpmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 17, 7:38 am, "OhioGuy" <n...@none.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > I just sold some stocks so that we could finally pay off our mortgage
> > completely. I got the checks from scottrade in the mail yesterday, and went
> > to deposit them. I was told there would be a delay before the funds would
> > be available. I figured it would be maybe 3 days. They told me it would be
> > 5, so I figured max of 1 week including the weekend.
>
> > When I got home, I noticed that the receipt said the funds would be
> > available OCTOBER 1, not the 5 days I had been told. So now I have to wait
> > a full two weeks before paying off the mortgage, which seems excessive.
> > It's a whole half month they get to keep my $ and I can't do anything with
> > it.
>
> > Now I'm remembering that we had to wait a whole week when we deposited our
> > tax refund, and that was directly from the US Treasury. The US Treasury and
> > Scottrade are well known, trusted entities, so why in the world are they
> > making us wait so long for funds to be available? What is the purpose? I
> > thought they usually just scanned the checks and transferred the funds in a
> > day, like a wire transfer.
>
> > Are these normal wait times at banks for "large" deposits of around $11k?
> > I'm wondering why the cashier told me 5 days, but it turns out to be 15.
>
> > LONGER DELAYS MAY APPLY
>
> > In some cases, we will not make all of the funds that you deposit by check
> > available to you on the same business day as the day of your deposit.
> > Depending on the type of check that you deposit, funds may not be available
> > until the fifth business day after the day of your deposit. However, the
> > first $100.00 of your deposit will be available no later than the first
> > business day after the day of your deposit.
>
> > If we are not going to make all of the funds from your deposit available on
> > the same business day as the day of your deposit, we will notify you at the
> > time you make your deposit. We will also tell you when the funds will be
> > available. If your deposit is not made directly to one of our employees, or
> > if we decide to take this action after you have left the premises, we will
> > mail you the notice by the business day after the business day we receive
> > your deposit.
>
> > If you will need the funds from a deposit right away, you should ask us when
> > the funds will be available.
> > In addition, funds you deposit by check may be delayed for a longer period
> > under the following circumstances:
> > We believe a check you deposited will not be paid.
>
> > You deposit checks totaling more than $5,000.00 on any one day.
>
> > You redeposit a check that has been returned unpaid.
>
> > You have overdrawn your account repeatedly in the last six months.
>
> > There is an emergency, such as failure of communications or computer
> > equipment.
>
> I think you are getting hosed by your institution. I just deposited
> $41K in three checks and they cleared overnight. If they were foreign
> checks it could take over four days, but it doesn't sound like it is
> in your case.- Hide quoted text -

Agreed. In Canada, when I've deposited checks in person, if they are
major institutions like Insurance companies, gov't etc, they would
clear them immediately. Everything that goes through the ATM takes a
week.

James

==============================================================================
TOPIC: In-house visit by a "Rainbow vacuum" salesperson
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8cbbcbc71d84da35?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:25 am
From: Lew Hartswick

Michael A. Terrell wrote:
>
> BTW Rex-Aire built a higher suction version, but it was recalled after
> a few people succeeded in pulling their carpet loose from the tack
> strips.

That sounds like just what is needed to suck the oily chips out
of the T slots of a mill. :-)
...lew...

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:37 am
From: "Stormin Mormon"

Thanks, got a good smile from this thought.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:UKidnTjmQKcSzk3VnZ2dnUVZ_hWdnZ2d@earthlink.com...

BTW Rex-Aire built a higher suction version, but it was recalled after
a few people succeeded in pulling their carpet loose from the tack
strips.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: CVS Pharmacist calls customer a "Fucking AIDS freak"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5f6c5d62367cf192?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:32 am
From: Patriot Games

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 06:40:58 GMT, chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief
Thracian) wrote:
>On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:36:09 -0400, Patriot Games
><Patriot@America.Com> wrote:
>>You weren't paying attention, FAG.
>How intelligent, you're remark, My, you must belong to MENSA.

From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)
Path: sp6iad.superfeed.net!
in1.nntp.be!
eweka.nl!
hq-usenetpeers.eweka.nl!
eweka.nl = Amsterdam, Noord-Holland, Netherlands

>>1 conservative heterosexual wife, 5 conservative heterosexual
>>children, 12 conservative heterosexual grandchildren.
>All cursed with your ignorant, vile presence.
>>That means we have YOU outnumbered, FAG.
>Quantity over quality, of course.
>>>Gaymerica: love it or leave it!
>>There's NO SUCH THING.
>Then why get so upset?
>>At best maybe 4% of the population is FAGGOTS.
>Nope...10%, statistics have proven time and again.

Yet you FAILED to CITE any...

>The only way one
>can claim a much smaller amount, is to count only those gays brave
>enough to be out of the closet. The remaining majority percentage
>continue to live in fear of hetero bully terrorists, and thus hide
>their sexuality.

I see. They hide yet you magically know they exist?

Bwahahahahhahaha!!!

>One day, though, there will be a reckoning, and we will rise up and
>bash back. That day is soon.

Can't wait.

>White folks once thought that blacks were
>spineless pushovers, they'd NEVER rebel. Well, look what happened,
>eh?

Yes, they NEVER rebelled. They marched.

>So most heteros believe the same about homos. You're in for a rude
>awakening, old breeder fart!

Can't wait.

I stomped and boot-beat a few fags but I've never shot one. I bet
that'll be fun!

Ok... So... I'm waiting for that "rude awakening..."

<crickets...>

Where is that "rude awakening...?"

<crickets...>

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Sep 17 2008 6:34 am
From: Patriot Games

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 06:41:08 GMT, chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief
Thracian) wrote:
>On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:36:09 -0400, Patriot Games
><Patriot@America.Com> wrote:
>>>Gaymerica: love it or leave it!
>>There's NO SUCH THING.
>OH TREMBLE AMERIKA
>© 2000 by Ezekiel J. Krahlin
>(Jehovah's Queer Witness)

Another shit-eating foreigner EXPOSED:

From: chief_thracian@yahoo.com (Chief Thracian)
Path: sp6iad.superfeed.net!
in1.nntp.be!
eweka.nl!
hq-usenetpeers.eweka.nl!
eweka.nl = Amsterdam, Noord-Holland, Netherlands

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Wednesday, September 17, 2008

25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

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