http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
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Today's topics:
* Where are YOU cutting back? - 6 messages, 5 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a47415e5933d30b8?hl=en
* ot: Democrat: Obama's grandma confirms Kenyan birth - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8e80385d4cd9e3d1?hl=en
* Maximizing Welfare - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9949fc83cc11aec3?hl=en
* vacuum cleaner new - 5 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2e8cc394cc50a344?hl=en
* furnace keeps cycling every 6 to 8 minutes or so - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f4fd7fbe6fc6a698?hl=en
* Gas. - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/29c665c81bbb67da?hl=en
* What's the lowest cell phone cost? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/64ff8aa2b5f47ee2?hl=en
* Federal Reserve Cuts Interest Rates, but a 'Floor' Lets Companies Keep
Credit Card Interest High - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4f81570866a61e97?hl=en
* Estate sales aren't frugal - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6b2d8fe95a5dd9a7?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Where are YOU cutting back?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a47415e5933d30b8?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 1:55 pm
From: wfhabicher@hotmail.com
On Oct 25, 7:24 pm, "Buddy Matlosz" <amatl...@optonline.net> wrote:
> In your case, you can downsize to Just_Enough_Tools.
>
> B.
>
> "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:68bba63c-348a-4da5-a10c-26d31e952c5b@l64g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> > In tough times consumers tend to cut back...so where are you cutting
> > back, reprioritizing resources, whatever to make that dollar go
> > farther?
>
> > I am also posting this in the metal and wood working groups to hear
> > how those who pursue the hobby are allotting their resources.
>
> > Thanks
>
> > TMT
Well, last year we had a high efficiency natural gas furnace
installed; 94% vs 64% efficiency. Two years ago we increased the
insulation from 6" to 15 1/2" in 1200 sq. ft. attic. Had the front
thermopanes replaced... They'd begun to fog up in the evenings during
winter. The walls have 6" fibreglas plus 1" styrofoam and 4" bricks
already. The windows are still tight. Exterior doors were all
replaced with metal doors and urethane foam insulation including
magnetic door seals. Installed low energy "curly" bulbs in the
workshop. Sold all US investments 2 years ago.
My better half is very frugal by nature so no prob. there. We
traveled less this summer but not because of gas prices.
Apart from that we already own most conveniences, thus no changes
you'd notice. Shop projects are sporadic at best as is machinery
acquisition.. Material costs are minimal.
Wolfgang
== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 4:32 pm
From: Silfax
On Sat, 25 Oct 2008 13:53:54 -0700, William Souden regurgitated the
following
> canceled the local paper, the LA Times, and read it on line. I
> still get the NY times and the web version misses a lot of stories from
> the print edition.
I just pick up a discarded newspaper on the train on the homebound commute.
--
Silfax
== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 5:48 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)
In article <0445ccd6$0$4419$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>,
Lee Michaels <leemichaels*nadaspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>"Gary Heston" wrote
>> I'd say you're definantly a niche market, with that many displays
>> required.
>> Have you looked into clusters? That would allow lots of monitors to be
>> supported, provide lots of CPUs and memory, and improve reliability.
>OK, you are in an area that I have not heard of. What are clusters? The
>present solution is to configure various windows machines with either 4, 6.
>8 or 12 monitors. Then put them nex to each other.
Clusters are interconnected systems; they can be configured in various
ways, you'd probably want a load-balancing setup. Downside is that where
Windows is concerned, only server operating systems support clusters.
A search of www.microsoft.com will produce more and more detailed info.
>Another problem is drivers. Many of these systems do not allow monitors to
>be configured three high. So we configure two sets of whatever on the
>bottom two high. Then a third unit on top, spread across the top of the
>other units. They are then configured as a horizontal configuration. Then
>the whole thing is run from three mice and micro keyboards. We use the
>keyboards very little for these programs.
Sounds like an impresive setup. Most of what I take care of is in racks.
>If you have any other suggestions, like the clusters, etc, send them along.
>I am in research mode for the next systems to be installed in the next 3 - 6
>months.
You might contact your video adapter vendor to see if they'll do a custom
driver for you, or provide the source code to a developer working for you
to get it to handle your preferred monitor configuration.
Get an evaluation copy of Windows Server 2008 and try running your application
on it. While you don't need most of the services (just disable them), its'
superior memory management and less "user experience" crud should prove
to be much more stable. Anything running on XP should run on it with no
problems.
I gather your application isn't available on Linux/Unix/BSD; if it were
and was multithreaded, a Linux cluster would be an excellent choice.
Gary
--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
Why is it that these days, the words "What idiot" are so frequently
followed by the words "at Microsoft"?
== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 6:01 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)
In article <GeudnS_gF8IjhpjUnZ2dnUVZ_gednZ2d@earthlink.com>,
cavelamb himself <cavelamb@Xearthlink.net> wrote:
[ ... ]
>I've been toying with that idea as well.
>I hate digging through a bunch of small windows to looks something up
>while I'm drawing or whatever.
>A second (or third?) screen would be most useful.
Windows XP will support dual monitors, either using a dual-head
video adapter, or two of the same type. A good dual-head adapter
(like the GeForce 8800GT) is the better choice. (Why? Because while
a lot of motherboards have two PCI Express slots, they're usually
not the same speed--one is 16x, the other is 1x or 4x. One card in
the 16x slot gives better performace.)
Gary
--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
Why is it that these days, the words "What idiot" are so frequently
followed by the words "at Microsoft"?
== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 6:43 pm
From: cavelamb himself
The Real Bev wrote:
>>> Another big problem is tht nobody really addresses how their product
>>> will perform in these extreme applictions. It really boils down to
>>> the fact that there is a cycle involved as to how often you
>>> upgrade/replace hardware. You get the best you can get at the time
>>> with funds available.
>>
>>
>> I've been toying with that idea as well.
>>
>> I hate digging through a bunch of small windows to looks something up
>> while I'm drawing or whatever.
>>
>> A second (or third?) screen would be most useful.
>
>
> X/linux will allow you to have as many screens (desktops,not monitors)
> as you want -- I use 4 and can move from one to another by moving my
> mouse to the edge of the current screen. The Windows powertoys
> (tweakui) will also allow you 4 screens.
>
Thanks Real,
I'lve heard of TweakUI, but never played with it.
Guess it's time...
--
Richard
(remove the X to email)
== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 7:05 pm
From: The Real Bev
cavelamb himself wrote:
> The Real Bev wrote:
>
>>>> Another big problem is tht nobody really addresses how their product
>>>> will perform in these extreme applictions. It really boils down to
>>>> the fact that there is a cycle involved as to how often you
>>>> upgrade/replace hardware. You get the best you can get at the time
>>>> with funds available.
>>>
>>>
>>> I've been toying with that idea as well.
>>>
>>> I hate digging through a bunch of small windows to looks something up
>>> while I'm drawing or whatever.
>>>
>>> A second (or third?) screen would be most useful.
>>
>>
>> X/linux will allow you to have as many screens (desktops,not monitors)
>> as you want -- I use 4 and can move from one to another by moving my
>> mouse to the edge of the current screen. The Windows powertoys
>> (tweakui) will also allow you 4 screens.
You have to click on the 1/2/3/4 down at the bottom, but it works.
> Thanks Real,
>
> I'lve heard of TweakUI, but never played with it.
> Guess it's time...
M$ puts a BEWARE THERE BE DRAGONS HERE notice on it, but I've used one
or another of its functions since 1995 with no problems at all. It
contains stuff that SHOULD have been in the OS but, for some reason, isn't.
--
Cheers,
Bev
===========================================================
An organizer for the "Million Agoraphobics March" expressed
disappointment in the turnout for last weekend's event.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: ot: Democrat: Obama's grandma confirms Kenyan birth
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8e80385d4cd9e3d1?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:06 pm
From: "AllEmailDeletedImmediately"
"E Z Peaces" <cash@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:BK5Nk.55821$vX2.46613@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> Bob F wrote:
>> "E Z Peaces" <cash@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:QnqMk.50899$XT1.19860@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
>>> AllEmailDeletedImmediately wrote:
>>>> http://wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78931
>>> Right. When Obama was Hillary Clinton's opponent in the primaries,
>>> Clinton supporter Philip J. Berg filed suit for Obama to prove his
>>> citizenship. His only evidence to the contrary was a rumor that an
>>> unknown Obama relative who may no longer have been living had said he
>>> was born in Kenya. Obama filed to have the suit dismissed. Berg calls
>>> that an admission that he's not a U.S. citizen.
>>>
>>> To answer speculation, Obama posted a scan of his birth certificate.
>>> Some bloggers pointed to artifacts as proof it was a forgery. So
>>> factcheck.org scanned a genuine birth certificate and found that the
>>> scan had the same artifacts.
>>>
>>> Then factcheck.org found an announcement of Obama's birth in the August
>>> 13, 1961 edition of the /Honolulu Advertiser./
>>>
>>> http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
>>
>> His mother is an American. So he is an American citizen, no matter where
>> he was born anyway.
>>
>> I am constantly amazed about the lies the wackos make up.
>>
>>
>
> Those who doubt his citizenship say one parent has to have resided in the
> United States a certain number of years, including five years after
> turning fourteen. They say his mother didn't qualify because she hadn't
> turned 19.
>
> The proof that Obama was born in Hawaii makes it moot in this case, but
> I'm curious about the law. Suppose two college students who have been
> Americans all their lives get married. They are over the border in
> Canada, perhaps viewing Niagara Falls, when their baby is unexpectedly
> born. If neither parent has turned nineteen, is the baby not an American
> citizen?
there are those who contend that a "natural born citizen" is only one born
on u.s. soil, as in an actual u.s. state only. that would disqualify
mccain since he was born in panama or something like that. the there's me
who insists that the natural born part means a vaginal birth, not a
caesarian. :-o (haha)
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:10 pm
From: "AllEmailDeletedImmediately"
"NotMe" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:ge3jun$fv$2@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> "E Z Peaces"
> | >>> | >> Right. When Obama was Hillary Clinton's opponent in the
> primaries,
> | >>> Clinton
> | >>> | >> supporter Philip J. Berg filed suit for Obama to prove his
> | >>> citizenship. His
> | >>> | >> only evidence to the contrary was a rumor that an unknown Obama
> | >>> relative who
> | >>> | >> may no longer have been living had said he was born in Kenya.
> Obama
> | >>> filed to
> | >>> | >> have the suit dismissed. Berg calls that an admission that
> he's
> not
> | >>> a U.S.
> | >>> | >> citizen.
> | >>> | >>
> | >>> | >> To answer speculation, Obama posted a scan of his birth
> certificate.
> | >>> Some
> | >>> | >> bloggers pointed to artifacts as proof it was a forgery. So
> | >>> factcheck.org
> | >>> | >> scanned a genuine birth certificate and found that the scan had
> the
> | >>> same
> | >>> | >> artifacts.
> | >>> | >>
> | >>> | >> Then factcheck.org found an announcement of Obama's birth in
> the
> | >>> August 13,
> | >>> | >> 1961 edition of the /Honolulu Advertiser./
> | >>> | >>
> | >>> | >> http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
> | >>> | >
> | >>> | > His mother is an American. So he is an American citizen, no
> matter
> | >>> where he was
> | >>> | > born anyway.
> | >>> | >
> | >>> | > I am constantly amazed about the lies the wackos make up.
> | >>> | >
> | >>> | >
> | >>> |
> | >>> | Those who doubt his citizenship say one parent has to have resided
> in
> | >>> | the United States a certain number of years, including five years
> after
> | >>> | turning fourteen. They say his mother didn't qualify because she
> | >>> hadn't
> | >>> | turned 19.
> | >>> |
> | >>> | The proof that Obama was born in Hawaii makes it moot in this
> case,
> but
> | >>> | I'm curious about the law. Suppose two college students who have
> been
> | >>> | Americans all their lives get married. They are over the border
> in
> | >>> | Canada, perhaps viewing Niagara Falls, when their baby is
> unexpectedly
> | >>> | born. If neither parent has turned nineteen, is the baby not an
> | >>> | American citizen?
> | >>>
> | >>>
> | >>> The baby is an American citizen what the baby can't be is POTUS when
> he
> | >>> grows up.
> | >> Yeah, that's it. It seems like a strange distinction. I wonder if
> the
> | >> founding fathers wrote to it to exclude a particular politician.
> | >
> | > I wonder if was just intended to exclude naturalized American
> citizens.
> | > Surprising that a case hasn't made it's way to the courts to determine
> what
> | > the original "intent" of the language was.
> | >
> | >
> | Apparently John Jay and George Washington decided certain high offices
> | should be limited to natural citizens as a way of keeping power within
> | their group. (A lot of influential Americans in those days were not
> | natives.) However, the Constitution left it to Congress to define the
> | distinction between natural and naturalized citizens.
> |
> | John McCain's parents were citizens, but he was not a citizen according
> | to the law when he was born. George Romney's parents were citizens, but
> | he did not come to America until he was 32. I don't know what the law
> | said about his citizenship when he ran for Vice President in 1968.
>
> The Canal Zone is considered US property as is (I'm out on a limb here)
> any
> US base in the world for the purposed of being a natural born citizen of
> the
> USA wrt kids of service personal.
but has it ever been deemed so by the courts? there are those who would
insist that "natural born" means born within the borders of a u.s. state.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Oct 26 2008 6:20 pm
From: Jeff
NotMe wrote:
> "E Z Peaces" <cash@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:BK5Nk.55821$vX2.46613@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> | Bob F wrote:
> | > "E Z Peaces" <cash@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> | > news:QnqMk.50899$XT1.19860@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
> | >> AllEmailDeletedImmediately wrote:
> | >>> http://wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78931
> | >> Right. When Obama was Hillary Clinton's opponent in the primaries,
> Clinton
> | >> supporter Philip J. Berg filed suit for Obama to prove his citizenship.
> His
> | >> only evidence to the contrary was a rumor that an unknown Obama
> relative who
> | >> may no longer have been living had said he was born in Kenya. Obama
> filed to
> | >> have the suit dismissed. Berg calls that an admission that he's not a
> U.S.
> | >> citizen.
> | >>
> | >> To answer speculation, Obama posted a scan of his birth certificate.
> Some
> | >> bloggers pointed to artifacts as proof it was a forgery. So
> factcheck.org
> | >> scanned a genuine birth certificate and found that the scan had the
> same
> | >> artifacts.
> | >>
> | >> Then factcheck.org found an announcement of Obama's birth in the August
> 13,
> | >> 1961 edition of the /Honolulu Advertiser./
> | >>
> | >> http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
> | >
> | > His mother is an American. So he is an American citizen, no matter where
> he was
> | > born anyway.
> | >
> | > I am constantly amazed about the lies the wackos make up.
> | >
> | >
> |
> | Those who doubt his citizenship say one parent has to have resided in
> | the United States a certain number of years, including five years after
> | turning fourteen. They say his mother didn't qualify because she hadn't
> | turned 19.
> |
> | The proof that Obama was born in Hawaii makes it moot in this case, but
> | I'm curious about the law. Suppose two college students who have been
> | Americans all their lives get married. They are over the border in
> | Canada, perhaps viewing Niagara Falls, when their baby is unexpectedly
> | born. If neither parent has turned nineteen, is the baby not an
> | American citizen?
>
>
> The baby is an American citizen what the baby can't be is POTUS when he
> grows up.
Well, we know McCain was born in the Canal Zone. The rules are crazy,
not that I think that should have disqualified him.
Jeff
>
>
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Maximizing Welfare
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9949fc83cc11aec3?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:26 pm
From: lisajoe@privacy.net
On Mon, 27 Oct 2008 20:39:49 GMT, in misc.consumers.frugal-living "catalpa"
<catalpa@entertab.org> wrote:
>
>"Bruce C. Miller" <bm3719@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:bd7d4b8a-69eb-4970-b656-9b85c069727c@e2g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>> What US state can a single male with no kids collect the most welfare?
>> Food stamps and other perks are a plus as well. Another consideration
>> is any maximum limits on the amount of time you can receive payments
>> or any red tape they put you through to get it.
>>
>> Or, if anyone knows of a state-by-state comparison of welfare
>> benefits, I'd also be interested in that too.
>>
>> Thanks for any info.
>
>Why limit yourself to a single state? For years there have been people
>collecting welfare in both New York and New Jersey. Cheap ride on the PATH
>train to go back and forth.
>
>
why limit youself to welfare when there is federal money?
Insurance fraud nets 3 years for ex-dentist from Freehold
By ED JOHNSON
STAFF WRITER
A former dentist from Freehold has been sentenced to three years in state prison
after admitting to fraudulently obtaining more than $530,000 in disability
payments over a 13-year period.
Michael F. Monica, 65, of Freehold was given the prison term Friday by Superior
Court Judge Frederick P. DeVesa. Monica had pleaded guilty in June to a criminal
accusation that charged him with second-degree theft by deception. He could have
received as much as 10 years in prison, the state Attorney General's Office said
Monday.
Monica, formerly a licensed dentist in New Jersey, admitted that between Jan. 2,
1992, and Nov. 29, 2005, he fraudulently obtained disability insurance claims
money from several insurance companies and the Social Security Administration.
Monica admitted that he falsely told the insurance companies and the Social
Security Administration that he was disabled and not able to practice dentistry
when, in fact, he continued to operate a dental practice during the entire
13-year period in Freehold.
Prosecutors charged that he submitted false statements about his disability to
the Cigna Insurance Co., the Lincoln Financial Group and the Social Security
Administration, collecting $530,074 in disability benefits to which he was not
entitled.
State Attorney General Anne Milgram said Monica wrongfully collected $144,000
from Cigna, $81,500 from Lincoln Financial and $304,574 from the Social Security
Administration.
State investigators also seized assets they claim he acquired through the fraud.
Those assets include $97,875 in cash, three gold bars, 12 gold coins and three
parcels of real estate, including two condominium units in Atlantic City and a
single-family home in Howell, Milgram added.
The proceeds from the asset forfeiture action are to be be applied to pay both
restitution to the insurance companies and civil fraud fines, with the balance
being forfeited to the state, Brown said.
"Far too often this office receives allegations that persons who claim to be
disabled are actually working and collecting disability insurance," Brown said.
"This guilty plea demonstrates our resolve to prosecute persons who commit
disability insurance fraud."
Monica may also face civil insurance fraud fines, Brown said.
Maine woman sentenced for Social Security fraud
October 4, 2008
BANGOR, Maine --A 48-year-old Eddington woman has been sentenced for collecting
more than $45,000 in Social Security benefits intended for her disabled
daughter.
Felicia Brooks was sentenced Friday in federal court in Bangor to one month in
prison followed by five months of home confinement and three years of supervised
released. She was ordered to repay $45,551 to the government.
According to court documents, Brooks' developmentally disabled daughter began
receiving benefits in 1998, the same year that Brooks and her husband divorced.
The state removed Brooks' daughter from her custody in 2000, but Brooks
continued to receive and spend her daughter's disability checks for the next
seven years.
Brooks' attorney asked the judge to not impose any jail time because of her
mental health problems.
------
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 4:23 pm
From: Marsha
Bruce C. Miller wrote:
> What US state can a single male with no kids collect the most welfare?
> Food stamps and other perks are a plus as well. Another consideration
> is any maximum limits on the amount of time you can receive payments
> or any red tape they put you through to get it.
>
> Or, if anyone knows of a state-by-state comparison of welfare
> benefits, I'd also be interested in that too.
>
> Thanks for any info.
If you wait until Obama gets elected, anyone will be able to collect for
any reason in any state for an unlimited amount of time.
Marsha/Ohio
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 4:34 pm
From: William Souden
Finally, a topic Rod Speed can talk about.
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 7:23 pm
From: "Dave"
> If you wait until Obama gets elected, anyone will be able to collect for
> any reason in any state for an unlimited amount of time.
>
> Marsha/Ohio
>
Yeah, but who is going to pay for it, when we are all on welfare? Oh, I
guess we just borrow a few MORE trillion from China, eh? -Dave
==============================================================================
TOPIC: vacuum cleaner new
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2e8cc394cc50a344?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:46 pm
From: E Z Peaces
Archon wrote:
> E Z Peaces wrote:
>> Archon wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>> I think not, the principle was developed I believe from watching
>>> industrial silo dust removal. The filter does not work that hard, if
>>> as another poster stated, you use it for garage/plaster/woodwork
>>> sanding clean up with very fine dust, the dust does not get to the
>>> filter, it stays in the washable bin (another Dyson innovation).
>>
>> A given cyclone design will catch particles down to a certain size
>> because it's a particle's mass that causes it to stick to the side
>> instead of exiting with the air. That's why you need the paper
>> filter. Probably the cyclones in some vacuums won't catch particles
>> as small as other cyclone vacuums.
>>
>> I have a cheap vacuum cleaner that uses a filter I can knock clean
>> when I empty the bin, followed by a paper filter. I've never had to
>> replace the paper one.
>>>
>>> And Yes, American household appliances, from vacuums to kettles to
>>> power tools are dramatically underpowered.
>>
>> Some UK kettles have 3kW elements, while some US kettles have 1.75kW
>> elements. So it takes 45 seconds to boil a cup of water in the US
>> and 26 seconds in the UK.
>>
>> Standard US outlets are for 15 amps. Most homes use 20-amp wiring.
>> If enough Americans were impatient, there would be 20-amp kettles,
>> which could heat the water in 33 seconds.
>>
>> It appears that the most common size of Dyson vacuum in the UK is 1400
>> W. Some US vacuums use roughly that much. If US vacuums really
>> aren't as good, the problem must be something else.
> HSN were advertising some lousy vacuum based on its 1400W or wattever
> (pun) power, the power it consumes probably totally unrelated to the
> work done.
When you say American appliances are dramatically underpowered, is that
totally unrelated to the work done?
== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 4:08 pm
From: Archon
E Z Peaces wrote:
> Archon wrote:
>> E Z Peaces wrote:
>>> Archon wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I think not, the principle was developed I believe from watching
>>>> industrial silo dust removal. The filter does not work that hard, if
>>>> as another poster stated, you use it for garage/plaster/woodwork
>>>> sanding clean up with very fine dust, the dust does not get to the
>>>> filter, it stays in the washable bin (another Dyson innovation).
>>>
>>> A given cyclone design will catch particles down to a certain size
>>> because it's a particle's mass that causes it to stick to the side
>>> instead of exiting with the air. That's why you need the paper
>>> filter. Probably the cyclones in some vacuums won't catch particles
>>> as small as other cyclone vacuums.
>>>
>>> I have a cheap vacuum cleaner that uses a filter I can knock clean
>>> when I empty the bin, followed by a paper filter. I've never had to
>>> replace the paper one.
>>>>
>>>> And Yes, American household appliances, from vacuums to kettles to
>>>> power tools are dramatically underpowered.
>>>
>>> Some UK kettles have 3kW elements, while some US kettles have 1.75kW
>>> elements. So it takes 45 seconds to boil a cup of water in the US
>>> and 26 seconds in the UK.
>>>
>>> Standard US outlets are for 15 amps. Most homes use 20-amp wiring.
>>> If enough Americans were impatient, there would be 20-amp kettles,
>>> which could heat the water in 33 seconds.
>>>
>>> It appears that the most common size of Dyson vacuum in the UK is
>>> 1400 W. Some US vacuums use roughly that much. If US vacuums really
>>> aren't as good, the problem must be something else.
>> HSN were advertising some lousy vacuum based on its 1400W or wattever
>> (pun) power, the power it consumes probably totally unrelated to the
>> work done.
>
> When you say American appliances are dramatically underpowered, is that
> totally unrelated to the work done?
IMHO 120Vac sucks, (This was a thread about vacuums...sorry)
== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 5:01 pm
From: Bored Borg
On Mon, 27 Oct 2008 17:52:03 +0000, Archon wrote
(in article <6dnNk.177673$KY3.158041@fe02.news.easynews.com>):
> E Z Peaces wrote:
<ausgesnipt>
>> Some UK kettles have 3kW elements, while some US kettles have 1.75kW
>> elements. So it takes 45 seconds to boil a cup of water in the US and
>> 26 seconds in the UK.
>>
>> Standard US outlets are for 15 amps. Most homes use 20-amp wiring. If
>> enough Americans were impatient, there would be 20-amp kettles, which
>> could heat the water in 33 seconds.
>>
>> It appears that the most common size of Dyson vacuum in the UK is 1400
>> W. Some US vacuums use roughly that much. If US vacuums really aren't
>> as good, the problem must be something else.
> HSN were advertising some lousy vacuum based on its 1400W or wattever
> (pun) power, the power it consumes probably totally unrelated to the
> work done.
A friend o'mine bought a super-dooper HD Whirlpool washing machine to handle
the load from her incontinent, disabled kid. A long time researching and
taking sales advice.
The machine was HUGE, seemed built like a tank. It was heavy and gawdawful
expensive and could take a king-size heavy-tog quilt with room to add,
probably, a sofa and the family dog. It had great, industrial type styling
and we had a celebration party 'cos we were all so impressed. (yes, really.
loads of people watching a washing machine with glasses of bubbly... sad but
true.) Everyone thought it was a 20yr investment.
The trouble was that NOTHING came out clean. The KS quilt, clothes,
underwear, ordinary shirts... everything. Had an engineer out to check it. It
was up to spec. No faults anywhere - except in the design for performance.
She tried every recommended combination of detergent, heat, agitation, voodoo
incantations, payload size... No matter what, everything was dirty and
covered with felt-ish fluff. The manual even referred to this as a known
"feature" of this type of machine and called it something like "nubbing" or
"bobbling" or whatever, saying it may be an initial problem with some fabrics
and could be cut down by using their speciall no-nubbiing, anti-bobbling
zero-beading chaff-stopping detergent. Very expensive special detergent, that
is. The very expensive special detergent was duly bought, and used. No
improvement in the bobble-chaffing nub beading at all, and the clothes were
still stained, dirty.. and covered in all this raised pile stuff.
The machine was great at accelerating wear in its payload but lousy at
cleaning.
She got her money back as the machine was argued not to be of merchantable
quality - i.e. it didn't (couldn't) perform its intended task of being a
washing machine.
This, apparently was America's Finest - at least as far as those of us in the
export slipstream are aware.
This begs all sorts of questions..
er.. Do you guys in the USA who have carpet cleaners that don't clean, and
washing machines that don't either... er, <ahem>... well. what I mean is....
I hope that showers work O.K. at least.. :-)
Maybe the domestic machines are different.
Personally, I love USA engineering. I prefer over-robust materials - cast
iron, milled alluminum (!) bolted together with proper fasteners - to the
oriental approach, which is to work to incredibly fine tolerances but to
specify very thin cheese as the construction material. I love the apparent
non-obsolescence of the USA paradigm which implies that in a post apocalyptic
world we can all get by, fixing stuff with a hammer and baling wire, making
spares as needed with the help of the local blacksnith. It's just got a
better feeling that knowing you'll need a dedicated computer with constanly
updated firmware to make the most basic adjustments to your hedgetrimmer,
toaster, motorcycle, router and yes indeed, _washing machine_... It's the
sort of thing that drives us to working with wood, isn't it?
The rub comes when the tank-like build quality is not matched by _functional_
quality, either through crap design (Whirlpool washing machines, so it
seems), lousy tolerances in manufacturing (AMC Harley Davidson) or
anally-retentive tolerance specifications (M16 carbines ??)
When USA conservative engineering is combined with marketing honesty, you
guys turn out gear that rocks. It doesn't happen all the time, however, and
that needs a little consumer honesty to point out. Just 'cos something is
marked "Made in the USA" doesn't mean it's going to trump the competition,
regardless. Often it does, but there's no sense in getting all fierce and
patriotic to try and flog a dead horse - at any price.When it works, it
works. SnapOn tools, etc.. The process is not automatic, though. Badging a
thing "American" does not confer quality. Neither does "Made in Japan." It
can often be an indicator that something has a high probability of being
superior, but it's only a probability marker. The quality comes from
something else, but hey, it feels good to support the home team, and there's
nothing wrong with that - just let's not get confused about the issues.
== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 6:50 pm
From: tnom@mucks.net
>
>Hear Hear !!!
>
>As the man from Hoover told me, "All Vacuum Cleaners Suck".
He was wrong. Vacuum cleaners don't suck. They can only
reduce the atmospheric pressure.
== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 6:55 pm
From: Archon
Bored Borg wrote:
> On Mon, 27 Oct 2008 17:52:03 +0000, Archon wrote
> (in article <6dnNk.177673$KY3.158041@fe02.news.easynews.com>):
>
>> E Z Peaces wrote:
>
> <ausgesnipt>
>>> Some UK kettles have 3kW elements, while some US kettles have 1.75kW
>>> elements. So it takes 45 seconds to boil a cup of water in the US and
>>> 26 seconds in the UK.
>>>
>>> Standard US outlets are for 15 amps. Most homes use 20-amp wiring. If
>>> enough Americans were impatient, there would be 20-amp kettles, which
>>> could heat the water in 33 seconds.
>>>
>>> It appears that the most common size of Dyson vacuum in the UK is 1400
>>> W. Some US vacuums use roughly that much. If US vacuums really aren't
>>> as good, the problem must be something else.
>> HSN were advertising some lousy vacuum based on its 1400W or wattever
>> (pun) power, the power it consumes probably totally unrelated to the
>> work done.
>
> A friend o'mine bought a super-dooper HD Whirlpool washing machine to handle
> the load from her incontinent, disabled kid. A long time researching and
> taking sales advice.
> The machine was HUGE, seemed built like a tank. It was heavy and gawdawful
> expensive and could take a king-size heavy-tog quilt with room to add,
> probably, a sofa and the family dog. It had great, industrial type styling
> and we had a celebration party 'cos we were all so impressed. (yes, really.
> loads of people watching a washing machine with glasses of bubbly... sad but
> true.) Everyone thought it was a 20yr investment.
>
> The trouble was that NOTHING came out clean. The KS quilt, clothes,
> underwear, ordinary shirts... everything. Had an engineer out to check it. It
> was up to spec. No faults anywhere - except in the design for performance.
> She tried every recommended combination of detergent, heat, agitation, voodoo
> incantations, payload size... No matter what, everything was dirty and
> covered with felt-ish fluff. The manual even referred to this as a known
> "feature" of this type of machine and called it something like "nubbing" or
> "bobbling" or whatever, saying it may be an initial problem with some fabrics
> and could be cut down by using their speciall no-nubbiing, anti-bobbling
> zero-beading chaff-stopping detergent. Very expensive special detergent, that
> is. The very expensive special detergent was duly bought, and used. No
> improvement in the bobble-chaffing nub beading at all, and the clothes were
> still stained, dirty.. and covered in all this raised pile stuff.
>
> The machine was great at accelerating wear in its payload but lousy at
> cleaning.
>
> She got her money back as the machine was argued not to be of merchantable
> quality - i.e. it didn't (couldn't) perform its intended task of being a
> washing machine.
> This, apparently was America's Finest - at least as far as those of us in the
> export slipstream are aware.
>
> This begs all sorts of questions..
>
> er.. Do you guys in the USA who have carpet cleaners that don't clean, and
> washing machines that don't either... er, <ahem>... well. what I mean is....
> I hope that showers work O.K. at least.. :-)
>
> Maybe the domestic machines are different.
>
> Personally, I love USA engineering. I prefer over-robust materials - cast
> iron, milled alluminum (!) bolted together with proper fasteners - to the
> oriental approach, which is to work to incredibly fine tolerances but to
> specify very thin cheese as the construction material. I love the apparent
> non-obsolescence of the USA paradigm which implies that in a post apocalyptic
> world we can all get by, fixing stuff with a hammer and baling wire, making
> spares as needed with the help of the local blacksnith. It's just got a
> better feeling that knowing you'll need a dedicated computer with constanly
> updated firmware to make the most basic adjustments to your hedgetrimmer,
> toaster, motorcycle, router and yes indeed, _washing machine_... It's the
> sort of thing that drives us to working with wood, isn't it?
>
> The rub comes when the tank-like build quality is not matched by _functional_
> quality, either through crap design (Whirlpool washing machines, so it
> seems), lousy tolerances in manufacturing (AMC Harley Davidson) or
> anally-retentive tolerance specifications (M16 carbines ??)
>
> When USA conservative engineering is combined with marketing honesty, you
> guys turn out gear that rocks. It doesn't happen all the time, however, and
> that needs a little consumer honesty to point out. Just 'cos something is
> marked "Made in the USA" doesn't mean it's going to trump the competition,
> regardless. Often it does, but there's no sense in getting all fierce and
> patriotic to try and flog a dead horse - at any price.When it works, it
> works. SnapOn tools, etc.. The process is not automatic, though. Badging a
> thing "American" does not confer quality. Neither does "Made in Japan." It
> can often be an indicator that something has a high probability of being
> superior, but it's only a probability marker. The quality comes from
> something else, but hey, it feels good to support the home team, and there's
> nothing wrong with that - just let's not get confused about the issues.
>
>
Back to the 120Vac problem here, American washing machines run off
120Vac so there's not enough juice to put a heater in, they run off
domestic hot water which of course is not always hot because the
dishwasher empties out the hot tank each time. We have the fabulously
expensive Maytag Neptune, 12 months of use and it stank like a septic
tank, as did the clothes. This is due to the fact it fills with luke
warm water to wash, no boil cycle here or even over 60C to kill the goop
living in the drum. Of course top loaders are king here because they
don't have that problem. The Neptune is a front loader, I really can't
stand 1950's top loader technology (do they have mangles still?).
Solution was to not close the door when not in use, bit inconvenient but
simple enough. Showers rock over here, or at least they did until the
enviroidiots put a flow regulator in them, they are usually mains
pressure hot tank fed, no chance of a piddling UK electric shower, the
8Kw heater would black out our local town.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: furnace keeps cycling every 6 to 8 minutes or so
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f4fd7fbe6fc6a698?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:47 pm
From: Cheapo Groovo
In article <gdihos$pj6$1@aioe.org>, none@none.net says...
> Our gas furnace seems to be turning on and off rather often - like
> every 6-8 minutes. It is doing a fine job of heating the place, but
> that's just the problem - it seems like it is too "fine" tuned. It
> isn't letting the temperature vary more than a tenth of a degree, or at
> least that is what it seems like.
>
>
> Before assuming it is something about the furnace itself, I realized
> that our thermostat is about 12 years old. Since thermostats are
> usually 80 bucks or less, I should probably consider replacing that as a
> first step, to see if it makes any difference.
>
> I want a thermostat where I can adjust the delay a bit, and
> especially where I can set it so that it isn't trying to keep the temp
> at as narrow a range. Currently, when our furnace comes on, the temp
> doesn't even go up a single degree before it turns back off. I would
> much prefer that it went up 3 degrees or something before turning off,
> and then the furnace not come on and off so much. It would be fantastic
> if I could set a temp to trigger the furnace on, and a different temp to
> kick it off.
>
> Can anyone suggest a thermostat that has features like this? Thanks!
>
http://cheapogroovo.vox.com/library/posts/tags/heat/
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Gas.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/29c665c81bbb67da?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:49 pm
From: Cheapo Groovo
In article <5b701c66-5548-4676-8dd4-a801946a9529
@a29g2000pra.googlegroups.com>, j0069bond@hotmail.com says...
> Filled up today. $1 a gallon cheaper than my last fill up. 16 cents
> cheaper per gallow than yesterday at a different Exxon station 15
> miles away.
>
Enjoy while you can.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: What's the lowest cell phone cost?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/64ff8aa2b5f47ee2?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 2:51 pm
From: Cheapo Groovo
In article <c5d0dcf7-e8d7-43e2-8652-ee2cb5f98011
@v15g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, j0069bond@hotmail.com says...
> I pay $28 a month for land line for unlimited local calls. Is it
> worth it for me to look into replacing it with a cell phone?
>
http://cheapogroovo.vox.com/library/posts/tags/phone+calls/
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Federal Reserve Cuts Interest Rates, but a 'Floor' Lets Companies Keep
Credit Card Interest High
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4f81570866a61e97?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 5:29 pm
From: "Lou"
"JonquilJan" <ward39@imcnet.net> wrote in message
news:4905e877$0$7498$38cefb40@news.westelcom.com...
(snipped)
> Thanks Ron. Yes that is the information I also received on the printout
> from the financial advisor. I just don't understand why my CC company
uses
> that instead of Prime Rate. Well maybe I do - LIBOR is usually higher -
and
> more volitle - Prime Rate went down - and LIBOR (supposedly) went up.
Whatever's been happening recently is highly unusual, and I'd suggest both
not jumping to conclusions and putting the cyncism aside unless there's a
sound reason for it. For instance in January of this year the prime rate
was 6.50%, while the LIBOR 12-month rate was 3.445%. In March, the numbers
were 5.25% and 2.5133% and again, the prime was the higher of the two.
This isn't all that unusal - the prime tends to be 2.5% to 3.5% above the
LIBOR. Of the two, the prime tends to be more volatile - the prime lags
decreases in bank cost of capital but immediately reflects increases.
Historically, the spread between the two has been increasing, so over the
long term a loan based on the LIBOR will be less expensive than one based on
the prime (if the margin - the premium over the index - is the same).
(Source: - http://www.finaid.org/loans/prime_libor.phtml )
As to why a bank would base it's credit card rates on the LIBOR, my guess is
that the LIBOR reflects the market price for money, while the prime reflects
the Federal Reserve's Federal Funds Target Rate.
Concerning volatility, the federal funds target rate is usually reviewed
every six weeks, while the LIBOR is published daily. But small jiggles in
the daily rate don't fall into the definition of volatility in my book - the
price of every commodity fluctuates daily, even hourly, depending on a host
of factors.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 8:10 pm
From: "JonquilJan"
Lou <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:ge5mfm$gm7$1@aioe.org...
>
> "JonquilJan" <ward39@imcnet.net> wrote in message
> news:4905e877$0$7498$38cefb40@news.westelcom.com...
> (snipped)
> > Thanks Ron. Yes that is the information I also received on the printout
> > from the financial advisor. I just don't understand why my CC company
> uses
> > that instead of Prime Rate. Well maybe I do - LIBOR is usually higher -
> and
> > more volitle - Prime Rate went down - and LIBOR (supposedly) went up.
>
> Whatever's been happening recently is highly unusual, and I'd suggest both
> not jumping to conclusions and putting the cyncism aside unless there's a
> sound reason for it. For instance in January of this year the prime rate
> was 6.50%, while the LIBOR 12-month rate was 3.445%. In March, the
numbers
> were 5.25% and 2.5133% and again, the prime was the higher of the two.
>
> This isn't all that unusal - the prime tends to be 2.5% to 3.5% above the
> LIBOR. Of the two, the prime tends to be more volatile - the prime lags
> decreases in bank cost of capital but immediately reflects increases.
> Historically, the spread between the two has been increasing, so over the
> long term a loan based on the LIBOR will be less expensive than one based
on
> the prime (if the margin - the premium over the index - is the same).
> (Source: - http://www.finaid.org/loans/prime_libor.phtml )
>
> As to why a bank would base it's credit card rates on the LIBOR, my guess
is
> that the LIBOR reflects the market price for money, while the prime
reflects
> the Federal Reserve's Federal Funds Target Rate.
>
> Concerning volatility, the federal funds target rate is usually reviewed
> every six weeks, while the LIBOR is published daily. But small jiggles in
> the daily rate don't fall into the definition of volatility in my book -
the
> price of every commodity fluctuates daily, even hourly, depending on a
host
> of factors.
>
>
Well I'm totally confused now. The question came up for me when I got my
last CC statement. I keep track of the APR rates charged and notice that it
had gone up from the last statement - not much but up. And I knew Prime
Rate had dropped. I called the CC company and was then told that APR was
based on LIBOR and not Prime Rate. From there on I have just been trying to
gather information, And am about to throw up my hands about the whole
thing.
JonquilJan
Learn something new every day
As long as you are learning, you are living
When you stop learning, you start dying
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Estate sales aren't frugal
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6b2d8fe95a5dd9a7?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 5:49 pm
From: Seerialmom
>
> Seerialmom wrote:
> > Unless they're run by the family themselves and just want to get rid
> > of everything. I'm amazed at the ridiculous prices charged by these
> > professional "Estate" sales people. $20 for a basic Pyrex nesting
> > bowl I can buy at a thrift store for $3 or a normal yard sale for 50
> > cents? I went to a couple of these estate sales over the weekend and
> > the prices are apalling. If I wasn't on the hunt for an old school
> > console stereo (which I plan to repurpose as a TV stand/entertainment
> > center, I don't want some cheap particle board set up from Ikea), I
> > wouldn't have even bothered stopping.
>
On Oct 26, 5:37 am, Tony <T...@TheDeli.Sandwich> wrote:
> You're shopping in the wrong neighborhoods. Poor people tend to overprice
> things at garage sales whereas rich people tend to underprice them.
> --
> The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG
>
> Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city
>
> Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know
> proper manners
>
> Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs,
>
> Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!
>
> El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar
>
> Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions
> beyond the realm of understandability
>
> Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday
Not talking about "yard sales". I'm talking about professional
"estate sales" where the grieving family hires a 3rd party to
liquidate the assets of the recently deceased. These "estate agents"
also seem to bring along leftovers they've acquired from other sales
and the prices are outrageous. Of course there's those "professional"
sellers who hunt down deals at other garage sales, buy cheap and then
run their own sale, marking up the price considerably. They might
also be annoying enough to title it an "estate sale" even though no
one died. So in terms of pricing hierachy it seems to be from least
to most: yard sales, flea markets, thrift stores, estate sales. But I
do agree with you that the best "yard sales" are in neighborhoods
where the people just want to clear out the garage and aren't that
worried about what they paid for the strawberry iMac they bought 5
years ago.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 27 2008 7:26 pm
From: FrouClou
Seerialmom <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote in
> Not talking about "yard sales". I'm talking about
> professional "estate sales" where the grieving family hires a
> 3rd party to liquidate the assets of the recently deceased.
> These "estate agents" also seem to bring along leftovers
> they've acquired from other sales and the prices are
> outrageous. Of course there's those "professional" sellers
> who hunt down deals at other garage sales, buy cheap and then
> run their own sale, marking up the price considerably. They
> might also be annoying enough to title it an "estate sale"
> even though no one died. So in terms of pricing hierachy it
> seems to be from least to most: yard sales, flea markets,
> thrift stores, estate sales. But I do agree with you that the
> best "yard sales" are in neighborhoods where the people just
> want to clear out the garage and aren't that worried about
> what they paid for the strawberry iMac they bought 5 years
> ago.
You don't have to be dead to have an estate sale.
You just need an estate to have a sale. :-)
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