Frugal Living: Jul 11, 2007

Wednesday, July 11, 2007

25 new messages in 15 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: dogfood?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/fad2c776405bec2d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 10 2007 11:08 pm
From: "Choise76Smu@EhOhEll.Net"

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-
bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2007/07/09/EDMEYER.DTL

http://news.google.com/news?ncl=1117981291

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A/C working properly? Cost -> lower temp?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6c37471a9403c0a2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 10 2007 11:26 pm
From: BobK207

On Jul 10, 5:18 am, <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote:
> "BobK207" <rkaza...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184048699.959557.25410@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Jul 9, 8:30 pm, <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote:
> > > "BobK207" <rkaza...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:1184023128.099280.148890@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > remember no references to actual post content.
>
> > > I can at least read the thread and know the difference between AM/PM. I
> also
> > > know it takes HOURS of run time to get a $320 electric bill.
>
> > > You don't!!!!!!!
>
> > Try a bit harder, you're not reading carefully enough....I merely
> > suggested she use noon & midnight instead of 12pm & 12am to avoid
> > confusion
>
> Yeah, like it's so confusing. <rolleyes>

Well, if its so universally clear why are several people arguing about
it?

Pretty hard to argue over the meaning of noon & midnight; my initial
point :)

btw no comment about your mis-reading of my posts?

I guess not, it must hard to admit you're wrong when you are so often.

please do try to read more carefully, it might make it easier for you
to reply with something that makes sense

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 10 2007 11:50 pm
From:

"BobK207" <rkazanjy@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184135206.664373.259730@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 10, 5:18 am, <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote:
> > "BobK207" <rkaza...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:1184048699.959557.25410@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Jul 9, 8:30 pm, <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote:
> > > > "BobK207" <rkaza...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >
> > > >news:1184023128.099280.148890@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > > > > remember no references to actual post content.
> >
> > > > I can at least read the thread and know the difference between
AM/PM. I
> > also
> > > > know it takes HOURS of run time to get a $320 electric bill.
> >
> > > > You don't!!!!!!!
> >
> > > Try a bit harder, you're not reading carefully enough....I merely
> > > suggested she use noon & midnight instead of 12pm & 12am to avoid
> > > confusion
> >
> > Yeah, like it's so confusing. <rolleyes>
>
> Well, if its so universally clear why are several people arguing about
> it?
>
> Pretty hard to argue over the meaning of noon & midnight; my initial
> point :)

Pretty hard to argue over a $320 electric bill.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 5:29 am
From: "Noon-Air"

<kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote in message
news:ed669$469471db$9440c41e$25325@STARBAND.NET...
>
> "Noon-Air" <Noon-Air@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:IaqdnaWlL72RzQnbnZ2dnUVZ_hmtnZ2d@comcast.com...
>>
>> <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote in message
>> news:adb90$46943c41$9440c41e$6469@STARBAND.NET...
>> >
>> > "Noon-Air" <Noon-Air@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> > news:KbWdnVuXg9d3Sg7bnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> >>
>> >> <kjpro @ usenet.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:ee22e$4693baa3$9440c41e$14424@STARBAND.NET...
>> >> >
>> >> > "Noon-Air" <Noon-Air@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> >> > news:OPKdnTJdqoxKLQ7bnZ2dnUVZ_sCinZ2d@comcast.com...
>> >> >
>> >> >> > #3 If you unit is freezing out side as some one posted?
>> >> >> > you have heat pump and it is working in reveres.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Guess again..... overcharge on a piston system will do the same
> thing.
>> >> >
>> >> > ???
>> >>
>> >> A piston system with a gross overcharge will freeze from the
>> >> compressor
>> > back
>> >> to the evap, whereas if its running real low on refrigerant, or there
> is
>> > no
>> >> airflow, it will freeze from the evap to the compressor. It doesn't
>> >> matter
>> >> if its A/C or a heat pump, it works the same.
>> >
>> >
>> > What??
>> >
>> > I have never come across this and have a hard time imagining it.
> Normally
>> > if
>> > they're grossly overcharged, they'll be slugging the compressor with
>> > liquid
>> > refrigerant. That normally happens after a (so-called) service tech
>> > charges
>> > the unit with too much refrigerant. Then the unit starts making a
>> > noise,
>> > so
>> > they condemn the system.
>> >
>> > You get the call and find that the unit is overcharged. Recover the
>> > refrigerant and fix the actually problem and then the system normally
>> > operates just fine.
>> >
>> > So the question is, how can a system be overcharged, yet it freezes??
>>
>> I have not seen this on a TXV system, only fixed oriface/piston systems
>> (10SEER)....
>> Remember what I told you about putting the temp clamp on the suction as a
>> "quick and dirty" method of indicating under/over charged systems??
>> Think about the ST with an undercharged system....superheat is very
> high(ST
>> 75 - 85 degrees), overcharged system will be very low ...........ST below
> 50
>> and the lower the temp, the greater the overcharge. If a system is
>> running
>> with a 30 degree ST, you can figure a minimum of 2 - 3 pounds of
> overcharge
>> on most resi systems.
>> Also remember that I told you that the gauges are the very last thing you
>> put to the system, after everything else is clean and right.
>
>
> Not so fast Scooby Doo...
>
> The overcharged system (if everything else is operating ok) is going to
> have
> a higher suction pressure (on an orifice metering system). On a normal
> system you're going to have a 70+ suction pressure (which is 41 degrees F
> with R-22). If the system is overcharged, the suction pressure goes up 70+
> (which is 41+ F with R-22). Since you can't have a negative superheat,
> your
> suction temp is going to be 41+ F.

A normal R22 system will have a "normal" suction pressure of 60 -
70psi.....most of the scroll systems are closer to 60psi. also remember that
when you have overcharge, and the temp drops on the suction line, the
pressure is going to drop also. What your talking about is only a slight
overcharge. With a gross overcharge, you have no superheat, and your ST is
going to be around 32 degrees or lower, and the entire compressor is going
to be sweating. I see a lot of that here.... "Billy-Joe-Jim-Bob" comes along
and says "Its no cooling, let me throw in a couple of pounds of that
freezone stuff"..... occasionally they will call him back 2 or 3 times, and
the only problem was the evap coil was dirty.

> In order for your suction temp to be under 32 degrees F, the suction
> pressure has to be 58 PSI or under. That's not going to happen with a
> system
> that is overcharged, unless it has other problems.

Try this... take a 10 SEER system, and dump in an extra 2 or 3 pounds of
refrigerant then take a set of readings, then get back to me.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Why don't the liberal whiners start a health insurance company?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/18cfba458dce8ce2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 10 2007 11:36 pm
From: muzician21@yahoo.com

On Jul 11, 12:50 am, Shawn Hirn <s...@comcast.net> wrote:

> Actually, even people in the United States who CAN afford the best
> treatment can end up waiting a while for medical care....I waited
> four hours to see a doctor, then another hour until I was actually
> treated.

I think you're going on a false premise if you're including yourself
in the group who can afford the best treatment.

Think Donald Trump, Rupert Murdoch, Bill Clinton etc. would have to
wait 4 hours for treatment or ever have to deal with some surly cow to
go through the whole "who's your insurance carrier" paperwork drill?
Or wait on a list like us peons for an organ if they needed a
transplant?

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 5:12 am
From: Shawn Hirn

In article <1184135811.020810.77490@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>,
muzician21@yahoo.com wrote:

> On Jul 11, 12:50 am, Shawn Hirn <s...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > Actually, even people in the United States who CAN afford the best
> > treatment can end up waiting a while for medical care....I waited
> > four hours to see a doctor, then another hour until I was actually
> > treated.
>
>
> I think you're going on a false premise if you're including yourself
> in the group who can afford the best treatment.
>
> Think Donald Trump, Rupert Murdoch, Bill Clinton etc. would have to
> wait 4 hours for treatment or ever have to deal with some surly cow to
> go through the whole "who's your insurance carrier" paperwork drill?
> Or wait on a list like us peons for an organ if they needed a
> transplant?

Probably not, but I am sure my medical plan would allow me to go to the
same hospital and see the same doctors they do for non-elective
specialized care, such as cardiac treatment. When I had to be
hospitalized four years ago, I received top flight care and all I had to
pay was a few dollars for the optional phone and TV in the hospital
room. One of the specialists I see now is widely regarded as being one
of the best in his field; and I pay nothing for his consultations, but
getting an appointment requires some advanced planning if its not an
emergency.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 6:27 am
From: ranck@vt.edu

In misc.consumers.frugal-living Shawn Hirn <srhi@comcast.net> wrote:

> But corporate America is downing under healthcare costs for current and
> retired employees. Freeing corporate American from the obligation to
> provide healthcare for its employees and retirees would increase
> profits, make more money available for hiring new employees, and it
> would American make companies more competitive with foreign companies
> who do not have to pay their employees' healthcare costs.

I'm sorry, but I know for sure that companies in France have to
pay a big piece of their employees' health care costs. I worked
there and saw the break out of my salary and the taxes and fees
they had to pay on it. There is definitely a health care cost
being paid by the company. Of course, *all* companies have to
pay it for everyone, and everyone gets the same coverage, but
they are paying for it. I have to assume it works like that
in most of the countries with universal health care.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Get insured your vehicle
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/28059d2935ec4049?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 12:21 am
From: natasha

Just invest your fund in forex trading and earn as much you can.
Just visit the page below to know more details.

http://freewebs.com/sansi123

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Safety for your auto mobile
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/472ac6adaaa125db?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 12:29 am
From: natasha

You can save your car from any kind of losses. Just visit the site
below and learn more.

http://urbiz.blogspot.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Security for car
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/71afea70ef5fb2a0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 12:41 am
From: md.stha@gmail.com

You can save your car from any kind of losses. Just visit the site
below and learn more.

http://urbiz.blogspot.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Security of your auto mobile
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c49f79d7190667a3?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 12:42 am
From: md.stha@gmail.com

You can save your car from any kind of losses. Just visit the site
below and learn more.

http://urbiz.blogspot.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Something I've discovered about regular tipping . . .
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/d23163da3767e684?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 1:00 am
From: Jeff

"AllEmailDeletedImmediately" <derjda@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:fiQki.8984$ZO4.4111@trndny05:

>
> "<RJ>" <baranick@localnet.com> wrote in message
> news:t86n83lddpke8ldlq45f00lnfnpgob0b0g@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 4 Jul 2007 01:32:41 -0500, Mark Anderson
>> <mea@nospambrandylion.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>In article tock1@sbcglobal.net says...
>>>> That's what I've learned about tipping in my humble barber shop.
>>>
>>>Is there any reason why I should tip the cashier at the Starbucks or
>>>the local 7-11? What about the firefighter who put out my fire or
>>>the garbageman who picks up my garbage every week? Or the mailman or
>>>the guy who changed the oil in my car at Jiffy Lube? Where does the
>>>tipping end? Why can't vendors just charge what they think their
>>>service is worth and forget all this gratuity BS? Is it so hard to
>>>pay waiters and bartenders a decent wage and just charge more for the
>>>food like they do in Europe?
>>>
>>
>> BRAVO !!
>
> if they did that, most waitstaff and bartenders would take a paycut.
> back in 1982, i was averaging12.50/hr as a waitress in a chain
> restaurant. not even a really expensive place: chi-chis. base pay
> was 2.01/hr. so just how much of a price increase would be needed to
> cover that wage? because i sure as hell wouldn't have accepted
> 6.00/hr.
>
>

Assuming your customers were tipping 15%-20%, I would estimate the price
increase to cover that wage would be about 15%-20%.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Visa and MC: No Charge Is Too Small
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/09a236ad49955ac8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 2:05 am
From: SMS

Kent Wills wrote:

> It is. That there are those who chose not to have it enforced
> does not mean it can't be. No amount of your ignorance of this will
> change that.

That's the bottom line. Visa (and Mastercard) put a legally binding
clause in the merchant agreement, but they choose to not enforce it.
Consumer complaints about the minimum charge level are not investigated.

They managed to get laws passed preventing credit card surcharges on
purchases, which merchants worked around by offering cash discounts
instead. Lately I've noticed a lot of gasoline stations reinstituting
different prices for cash and credit, something that disappeared for a
long time. Gas station owners are especially hard hit by the higher
prices for gasoline, because the mark-up per gallon is on an absolute,
rather than a percentage basis. Selling a gallon at $1 earns them 10¢
profit, and they'd pay about 1.5-2¢ in credit card fees (not including
the transaction fee). Selling a gallon at $3 earns then 10¢ profit, and
they'd pay 4.5-6¢ in credit card fees. Plus, rewards cards process at a
higher rate.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 2:25 am
From: SMS

Mike Berger wrote:
> That's not entirely true. In Illinois, for example, you can
> offer discounts for cash payments. It amounts to the same thing
> as a surcharge on credit cards.

Same in California.

The difference between a cash discount and a credit card surcharge is
that with a cash discount all prices are marked at the higher,
non-cash-discount level, though I've seen some on-line stores, and some
print ads, that simply state "All Prices Reflect 2% Cash Discount." Many
gas stations post two sets of prices.

Here's the text from the merchant agreement:

"The following requirements apply to all Card transactions: (a) you
cannot establish minimum or maximum amounts as a condition for accepting
a Card; (b) you cannot impose a surcharge or fee for accepting a Card;
(c) you cannot establish any special conditions for accepting a Card;
(d) you cannot establish procedures that discourage, favor or
discriminate against the use of any particular Card; however, you may
choose not to accept either U.S. issued Debit Cards or U.S. issued
credit Cards under the terms described in Section 1.3; (e) you cannot
require the Cardholder to supply any personal information (e.g., home or
business phone number; home or business address; or driver's license
number) unless instructed by us, except for a mail order/telephone order
or delivery required transaction, and ZIP code for a Card-present
key-entered transaction in order to obtain an Address Verification
(AVS); (f) Any tax required to be collected must be included in the
total transaction amount and not collected in cash; (g) you cannot
submit any transaction representing the refinance or transfer of an
existing Cardholder obligation deemed uncollectible; (h) you cannot
submit a transaction or sale that has been previously charged back; (i)
you must deliver at least one copy of the Sales Draft or credit draft to
the Cardholder; (j) you cannot submit a transaction or sale to cover a
dishonored check. Failure to comply with any of the Association Rules
may result in fines or penalties."

The merchant does break the contract if he establishes a minimum or
maximum amount, and the merchant bank could enforce the contract if they
wished to do so, but I doubt if they ever do, at least in terms of
minimum amounts.

I remember buying a car and after the deal was done they said I could
put the down payment on a credit card. I wanted to charge the entire car
on the credit card for the 2% reward, but they wouldn't let me do that,
so I paid the balance with a check.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 6:09 am
From: George

Mikko Peltoniemi wrote:
> George wrote:
>
>> The problem is that it costs money for the merchant to do this becuase
>> of the fees to the CC company. So then we all pay more so someone can
>> put a pack of cheese crackers on their credit card.
>
> Every CC transaction costs money to the merchant. So does every cash
> transaction. The merchant is free not to accept any cards, if he or she
> feels it's not worth the added business.

But the CC transaction costs more and it is likely a negative
transaction if people decide to do what the CC add advocates and using a
CC for pocket change purchases.

The banks are 900lb gorillas in this scenario. I applaud their efforts
to reject something that isn't good for them.

>
> Heating the store costs money. I know how to dress for winter, why
> should I have to pay because someone doesn't know how to dress warm?
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: US woman arrested over dry lawn
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b2cd0e567110d99c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 3:10 am
From: John Baker

On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 13:44:09 -0700, Al Bundy <MSfortune@mcpmail.com>
wrote:

>
>Wilson wrote:
>
>> "I can't believe this happened. Do you ever just wish you could start your
>> day over and it would all be different?"
>
>The woman got into a physical altercation with an officer who was
>about to give her a piece of paper at most. No wonder she'd like to
>start the day over. Given a fresh start, the officer might rather have
>just left the citation on the door and avoided the provocation. This
>rates right up there with the $54 Million pants lawsuit.

For me, the question is why, in this supposedly "free" country, do we
even tolerate ordinances that make it a criminal offense to have a few
weeds or a couple of brown spots on your lawn?

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 4:46 am
From: Greg Rozelle

On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 06:10:42 -0400, John Baker <nunya@bizniz.net>
wrote:

>On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 13:44:09 -0700, Al Bundy <MSfortune@mcpmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>Wilson wrote:
>>
>>> "I can't believe this happened. Do you ever just wish you could start your
>>> day over and it would all be different?"
>>
>>The woman got into a physical altercation with an officer who was
>>about to give her a piece of paper at most. No wonder she'd like to
>>start the day over. Given a fresh start, the officer might rather have
>>just left the citation on the door and avoided the provocation. This
>>rates right up there with the $54 Million pants lawsuit.
>
>
>For me, the question is why, in this supposedly "free" country, do we
>even tolerate ordinances that make it a criminal offense to have a few
>weeds or a couple of brown spots on your lawn?
>
>

What happens if the city has a drought and they is a water ban?

Get real a 70 year resting arrest. Most people that old can not
hardly move. A lot of people when they reach that age are senile.
Some cops need to be more patients with older people. Some older
people just don't understand things.

If you want to your landscape die, so be it.

Greg Rozelle

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 5:05 am
From: "pbamvv@worldonline.nl"

On 10 jul, 06:23, "Wilson" <wil...@universal.com> wrote:
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6282348.stm
>
> US woman arrested over dry lawn
>
> A 70-year-old US woman has been left bruised and bloody after an unexpected
> clash with police who came to caution her for not watering her lawn.
> Trouble flared when Utah pensioner Betty Perry, 70, refused to give her name
> after being upbraided because her garden breached local regulations.
>
> She says the officer hit her with handcuffs, cutting her nose, although
> police insist she slipped and fell.
>
> Ms Perry said she was "distraught" after the incident.
>
> She denied accusations she was resisting arrest, maintaining that she only
> turned to go inside to call her son to fix the confusing dispute.
>
> "I tried to sit down and get away from him [the police officer]," she told
> Utah newspaper the Daily Herald.
>
> "I don't know what he's doing. I said: 'What are you doing?' And he hit me
> with those handcuffs in my face," she said.
>
> "He's just trying to cover his tracks, as far as I'm concerned."
>
> The officer had judged that Ms Perry's "sadly neglected and dying landscape"
> breached an Orem city guideline and was attempting to issue a formal caution
> when the 70-year-old was injured.
>
> She was treated in a local hospital for the cut to her nose and for other
> bruises before being taken to jail.
>
> But she was let go when police realised there were "other ways" of finding
> out her identity without jailing her, a police spokesman said
>
> The arresting officer has not been named but has been placed on
> administrative leave, he added.
>
> Ms Perry, who says she has never had a run-in with police in the past, has
> been offered help by local church leaders to clean up her garden.
>
> "I'm very distraught over all this," she said.
>
> "I can't believe this happened. Do you ever just wish you could start your
> day over and it would all be different?"
>
> Story from BBC NEWS:http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/6282348.stm
>
> --
> " Never give a sucker an even break"
> - W.C. Fields

This is really silly
In some countries in some summers watering you lawn would be against
the law!:)

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 5:20 am
From: parsifal50@gmail.com

On 11 juil, 13:46, Greg Rozelle <inva...@invaild.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 06:10:42 -0400, John Baker <n...@bizniz.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 13:44:09 -0700, Al Bundy <MSfort...@mcpmail.com>
> >wrote:
>
> >>Wilson wrote:
>
> >>> "I can't believe this happened. Do you ever just wish you could start your
> >>> day over and it would all be different?"
>
> >>The woman got into a physical altercation with an officer who was
> >>about to give her a piece of paper at most. No wonder she'd like to
> >>start the day over. Given a fresh start, the officer might rather have
> >>just left the citation on the door and avoided the provocation. This
> >>rates right up there with the $54 Million pants lawsuit.
>
> >For me, the question is why, in this supposedly "free" country, do we
> >even tolerate ordinances that make it a criminal offense to have a few
> >weeds or a couple of brown spots on your lawn?
>
> What happens if the city has a drought and they is a water ban?
>
> Get real a 70 year resting arrest. Most people that old can not
> hardly move. A lot of people when they reach that age are senile.

"A lot"?

> Some cops need to be more patients with older people. Some older
> people just don't understand things.

It's not a question of age and you know it very well...

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Republican senator KNOWS he was forgiven by God?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a2d8816068be388b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 5:13 am
From: Shawn Hirn

In article <5-2dnRhZMeLD9QnbnZ2dnUVZ_sGqnZ2d@comcast.com>,
"Bob F" <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:

> "Shawn Hirn" <srhi@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:srhi-2944E9.01102811072007@newsgroups.comcast.net...
> > In article <1184120115.423068.210080@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
> > "editor@netpath.net" <editor@netpath.net> wrote:
> >
> >> On Jul 10, 5:31 pm, Too_Many_Tools <too_many_to...@yahoo.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > You know if you think about it....if God forgave this Republican,
> >> > then
> >> > He must also have forgiven former President Clinton.
> >>
> >> Bullshit. Forgiveness doesn't apply to every sin or every
> >> sinner -
> >> at least not in the Jewish concept of forgiveness. If Vitter was
> >> willing to apologize to his wife and she forgave him, that counts
> >> for
> >> a lot - BUT the fact that Bill Klinton lied to Hillary until the
> >> end
> >> about sweet Monica says the reverse.
> >
> > How do you know Hilly did not forgive Bill? For that matter, why is
> > it
> > any of your business? What about that old saying in the Bible about
> > not
> > judging other people, or are you exempt from that rule?
>
> Repubs are exempt.

Ah, but that's for their god to decide, not any of us.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 7:09 am
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Jul 11, 12:07 am, Shawn Hirn <s...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In article <q9SdnbjtpbJDKg7bnZ2dnUVZ_v6tn...@giganews.com>,
>
> vir...@mary.heaven (V.M.) wrote:
> >http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070710/pl_nm/usa_madam_dc_2
>
> > Republican Senator David Vitter, a church lector, who used the famous
> > D.C. prostitute service that is being investigated for some reason,
> > says that he "received forgiveness from God". (literally).
>
> > I want to know how this "church lector" Vitter knows for sure that God
> > forgave him. Did he get a fax from God, or what?
>
> I suppose the forgiveness came to Vitter in his dreams.

Latest news is that it came in his latest issue of Hustler.

Apparently Republicans get Hustler for its articles.

TMT

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wal-Mart lost a sale today
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/69666051fcf4a7d3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 6:41 am
From: "Bill"

I would suggest writing a letter to the local manager of that store and cc
the regional manager and president of the company.

This does two things.

1. Sometimes stores have a policy to allow groups which fit a certain
criteria to set up tables at the entrance. And they tell them they can and
can't do certain things. If they get complaints about certain groups, then
they can do something. They can tell them to go away. Managers do not have
as much power as some people think. Sometimes they need documentation to
back themselves up before they can do anything. (For legal reasons many
times).

2. When the manager sees the regional manager's name cc'ed on your letter,
it will motivate him to take action. And same thing with the president's
name cc'ed on your letter and the regional manager.

"No Soliciting" wrote in message
> I'm tired of being panhandled and solicited to at the entrance of
> Wal-Mart.
> The link is to a picture of what was going on earlier in the day at the
> entrance to the store on Monterey Highway, San Jose. Every person who
> enters or exists the store is aggressively approached, all under the guise
> of being friendly. Usually there are 3 people at the desk but they
> scattered when they saw the camera. The real purpose is to solicit funds
> for "Child Protection Education of America." The BBB gives this
> organization a negative rating, saying "does not meet Standards for
> Charity
> Accountability." Basically the organization spends 51% of what it
> collects
> towards its stated goal, where the standard is at least 65%.
>
> Notice that to the upper left of the table is a sign in the window that
> says "No Soliciting." But enforcement is zero. This is a free-standing
> store, the table is setup on Wal-Mart property. And yet this is tolerated
> by management who prefer to look the other way and do nothing while their
> customers are subjected to a shake-down at the entrance. Well they lost
> a
> sale today, I spent my money at a different store. Wal-Mart lost a sale
> because of the soliciting. And if anybody in Wal-Mart management doesn't
> think this is a big deal, they should get out of retail, because it's
> ALWAYS ABOUT THE SALE! WAL-MART LOST BUSINESS TODAY!
>
> http://i18.tinypic.com/6b386k6.jpg

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Kissing Explained
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a9d2f33ca58a0a9f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 6:58 am
From: Priyanka

A first kiss should always be done while the two of you are alone.
http://kisstips143.blogspot.com/2007/07/kissing-explained.html
This will help to avoid any unnecessary nervousness and embarrassing
situations.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Chinese Company Denies Defect in Recalled Tires
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4bc1e6e088b5c0b8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 6:58 am
From: "*"

hls <hls@nospam.nix> wrote in article
<DYLki.9558$Rw1.2486@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net>...
>
> Zheng being executed is a strong statement for quality control.
>
> Maybe that alternative should be written into ISO norms.
>

ISO certification only means that you are consistent about producing the
same product.

If it is a POS, you are certified to produce that POS to the same, exacting
standards - day in and day out.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: With Regard to Frivolous Tipping....
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0bdb5ac54c9cc9c6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jul 11 2007 7:01 am
From: Chief_Billy@hotmail.com

..or, why should I leave a tip at the drive-thru window ?

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/SavingandDebt/ConsumerActionGuide/WhatsUpWithAllThoseTipJars.aspx

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Wednesday, July 11, 2007

25 new messages in 15 topics - digest