Frugal Living: Aug 26, 2007

Sunday, August 26, 2007

25 new messages in 16 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: AT&T Modem Rebate
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/012562f812078897?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 3:02 am
From: "Jeremy Pleedle"

E Z Peaces wrote:
> Two months ago I signed up online for AT&T DSL. I saved the page of
> their terms conditions.
>
> It says: "Free DSL Modem with term agreement: Offer available to active
> subscribers of AT&T or BellSouth Dial service who purchase and receive
> FastAccess DSL. In exchange for a free DSL modem customers must maintain
> FastAccess DSL service for at least twelve (12) months from the date the
> modem was shipped or installed by BellSouth, and pay all applicable
> charges in connection with FastAccess service in a timely manner. If
> FastAccess service is terminated or in the event service is terminated
> for a violation of the BellSouth Internet Service Agreement, including
> but not limited to failure to pay the monthly FastAccess service charge,
> an early termination charge of $75.00 (representing the full price of
> the modem) if service is terminated between 0 and 6 months from the date
> the modem was shipped or installed by BellSouth or $37.50 (representing
> one half of the price of the modem) if service is terminated more than 6
> months but less than 12 months from the date the modem was shipped or
> installed by BellSouth will be incurred."
>
> The only charge besides the monthly fee was for the modem. When I
> signed up, their website informed me that I'd have to go to their
> rewards page and click for the rebate to cover the cost of the modem.
> I'd have to do it within 90 days. I'd be billed the $75 on my first
> bill, but I'd get it back.
>
> Their rewards page said I couldn't apply for the rebate until a month
> after I'd signed up. After a month, the AT&T site said they had nothing
> about a rebate and if it was about a modem I should check with
> Bellsouth. Bellsouth's site kept saying they had nothing on me.
>
> I kept checking. There was no modem charge on my first bill. I'd been
> a DSL customer nearly two months when the second bill came.
> FastAccess DSL Modem........... $75
> Credit for Installment Billing -$75
> Purchase - 1 of 1 Installments $75
> Total $75
>
> They seem to be saying, oh yes, the modem is free as promised except
> that they are charging me for it twice.
>
> That section of the bill gave me a number to call if I had any
> questions. I called and got a machine that gave me four choices, I
> think. Three were for ordering stuff and one was for technical support.
> There was no option for billing questions.
>
> Did AT&T make me a promise they never intended to keep? What should I
> do now?
http://help.bellsouth.net/bellsouth/asp/singlecolumncontentview.asp?UserType=DSL&source=2&sprt_cid=6153a66a-29a7-4ebc-b411-24b02e0569d5

does bellsouth not have internal support "usenet" type groups you could ask?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: MI5 Persecution: GLR: David Hepworth (21/Feb/1997) (1376)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3d02aee803bb24e8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 3:17 am
From: MI5Victim@mi5.gov.uk

GLR-David Hepworth (21/Feb/1997)

Certainty level: 80%

I was listening to BBC Greater London Radio (GLR) by stealth, ie. on my
walkman with headphones, with the sound turned right down, to prevent
anyone from hearing what I was listening to. Yet somehow "they" are still
able to tell what station I am listening to on the walkman. After half
an hour or so listening to GLR, DJ David Hepworth came out with this;

"I assume Brian, do we have an embarrassment of prizes in there, we do,
don't we, absolute obscene amounts of prizes, there will no doubt be a
riot at the back door, and that's A-level coming up after this"

The key phrases in what he said are, "EMBARRASSMENT of prizes", and what he
himself emphasised verbally, "ABSOLUTE OBSCENE amount of prizes". It is my
belief (based on content and tone of voice) that when he spoke these phrases he
knew I was listening, and that the phrases refer directly to my situation. The
"EMBARRASSMENT" is the embarrassment he and other media people would feel at
having their wrongdoing exposed; the "ABSOLUTE OBSCENE" (which he verbally
emphasised) described the disgusting sexual abuse which the harassers have been
throwing at me.

Of course, I can't prove that this is what he meant, although this has
happened enough times that it's hard not to recognise it when you see it.
I sent David Hepworth a copy of this explanation, with the results listed
in a subsequent item (David Hepworth 9/May/1997).

1376

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: You all are exactly what I need!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/06d0467d786e9594?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 3:35 am
From: "Bill"

The price of rent will go up, up, up over the years!

Whereas the mortgage payment on a house will pretty much stay the same.
(fixed rate of course)

So you can start out at the same date; one person renting, another person
buying a house.

At first the rent is say 1/2 of what the other persons mortgage payment
is...

Add 20 years in time...

Now the rent can be twice what the other person is still paying for their
mortgage payment!

You can of course sell your house and buy a less expensive house. Or buy a
house in an area with lower taxes.

If you work for a large company, you may be able to transfer to an area with
a lower cost of living, lower taxes, lower housing costs. For example on the
west coast there are plenty of rural areas which have houses for less than
$100,000.

"Claire" wrote in message
> Hi,
> At 36, I am a widow of two years. I am trying to sell my house.
> My older brothers differ in opinions.
> One believes I should remain in my house as income is good
> business.
> Yet the older one is concerned with the high taxes in
> Massachusetts and suggested I should sell and rent.
>
> Being frugal is exactly what I am looking for.
> Thank you.
> Claire
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: MI5 Persecution: GLR: David Hepworth (9/May/1997) (2599)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2d75507ec384af4d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 3:54 am
From: MI5Victim@mi5.gov.uk

GLR-David Hepworth (9/May/1997)

Certainty level: 100%

This time I deliberately listened to Hepworth with the sound turned up on
the radio, to try to get a reaction. Sure enough, he and his cronies
reacted;

David: "we have executive drivetime, and we have Brian in charge of the prize
cupboard. Brian it's not a bad prize cupboard this week is it?"

Brian: "no David in fact it's an absolute (EMPHASIS) embarrassment
(END-EMPHASIS) of prizes this evening" (laughter)

David: "what have we got?"

Brian: "well in my left hand alone we've got that .... Gary Clale, I don't
know if you remember him obviously still alive and kicking.... and that's
just in my left hand"

David: "So it's certainly worth competing. Rock and roll spelling test is
your first opportunity to take advantage of this embarrassment of prizes"

What I "read into" this item should again be quite obvious. Remember, I
sent off a letter of complaint to Hepworth after his spying activity
during the previous show. Here the emphasis on "absolute embarrassment"
of prizes shows he knows this is a "key" phrase.

It might be interesting to try to talk to DJs like Hepworth and ask them
what they get out of abusing their listeners. But if you challenge them
directly, they show their true colour (yellow) by either not answering
the challenge, or by denying that harassment has taken place.

2599

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Try these Juices,they really help
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/fb2a8b87a9b87b72?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 4:12 am
From: Stella

Try these Juices,they really help
http://foodone.blogspot.com/2007/08/try-out-these-juices-they-really-helps.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: MI5 Persecution: Capital Radio (11/April/1997) (3822)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c358c453a17d8375?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 4:27 am
From: MI5Victim@mi5.gov.uk

Capital Radio (11/April/1997)

Certainty level: 10%

A nice easy one here. The DJ is heard to say (around 8.30pm);

"Jacko in town, what a gig it's going to be, that guy is amazing, and
psychotic, but amazing on stage, 0171-420-0958, on stage he's a madman
but he's wonderful"

I was listening to Capital loud and clear, trying to get a reaction.
The above may have been a reaction. I'm not sure if it was, and I'm not
sure that it wasn't.

3822

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Which steak is better?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ac5b6687e1edb16e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 4:40 am
From: ppnerkDELETETHIS@yahoo.com (Phred)

In article <5j8on7F3t8ifgU1@mid.individual.net>, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
>Phred <ppnerkDELETETHIS@yahoo.com> wrote
[snip]
>> What are you doing here in rec.food.cooking?
>
>Its the result of the OP's original cross post.
>
>> Or are you just living frugally these days?
>
>Nope, just find the group interesting.
[snip]

Hmm... Maybe an old pov like me should drop in on
misc.consumers.frugal-living too. Especially given your
recommendation. ;-) Think I'll have a squiz at it tonight.

Cheers, Phred.

--
ppnerkDELETE@THISyahoo.com.INVALID

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 5:17 am
From: ppnerkDELETETHIS@yahoo.com (Phred)

In article <5j9o8hF3sibstU2@mid.individual.net>, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
>Jimington <wvzubqtr@gfa.pp> wrote
>> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>>> Phred <ppnerkDELETETHIS@yahoo.com> wrote
[snip]
>>>> Pity the 713 mm received at Rainbow Beach in the past 24 hours (to
>>>> 9 a.m. 24 Aug 07) just ran back into the bloody sea instead of into
>>>> a dam somewhere! ]
>
>>> Yeah, looks like Noosa has been washed out to sea too.
>
>> Might bring them down to earth for a while,
>
>Or they might get washed out to sea |-)
>
>> they've been getting a bit uppity lately.
>
>True.
>
>> I must query the 713mm, i sense somebody's poured a jug of water
>> into the gauge. Nearby areas didn't get within coo-ee of that amount.

It does look a bit sus. Tewantin and Double Is Pt both got a bit over
300 mm, but that's a long way short of 713 -- maybe they measured in
points and forgot to divide by four. :-) However, it must be said
the met bureau guy seemed to be taking it seriously on the Country
Hour weather summary yesterday (24 Aug 2007).

That part of the world seems to have a history of unusual rainfall
events. I've always been suspicious of Inigo Jones's record from
Crohamhurst, for example. But then, maybe it takes a professional
weather forecaster to keep emptying the gauge before it overflows!

Quoting from the biog of Inigo Jones at:
<http://www.adb.online.anu.edu.au/biogs/A090511b.htm>

"In 1892 his parents bought a farm about sixty miles (97 km) north of
Brisbane and named it Crohamhurst after a property near Inigo's
birthplace. Inigo joined them there and on 2 February 1893 recorded an
Australian record for one day's rainfall of 37.714 inches (958 mm)."

{Did he *really* measure to thousandths of an inch?]

>Yeah, I auto update the national rainfall map at 2pm.
>
>>>> Returning to topic: Oz MSA standards seem to be pretty reliable now,
>>>> certainly possible to get some really good chewing steak these days
>>>> fairly consistently (at a price!) instead of the traditional roulette!
>
>>> Thats a significant improvement for you denizens of the north.
>>> Tropical beef has never been that flash.
>
>> It seems to have improved in the past years. In fact i'd almost forgotten
> about that.
>
>Presumably we send the worst of the tropical beef to the yanks now.
>
>They just grind it up and wouldnt even notice.

The "hamburger trade" was the saviour of the northern beef cattle
industry decades ago, and continues to be a major market for the
lesser quality beef. The yanks like the low-fat grass-fed product to
mix with their own stuff for healthier burgers. :-)

Cheers, Phred.

--
ppnerkDELETE@THISyahoo.com.INVALID

==============================================================================
TOPIC: MI5 Persecution: Neil Fox (March/1998) (5045)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/efd3c70621bc100e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 5:04 am
From: MI5Victim@mi5.gov.uk

Neil Fox's Juke Box on Capital Radio (week ending 15/March/1998)

Certainty level: 70%

Here is an excerpt from Neil Fox's show on Capital Radio 95.8FM, sometime
during the week ending Sunday 15/March/1998 (probably during the weekend,
but I don't remember).

First I will give the text of the conversation between Neil Fox and
telephone caller Martin, then I will state my interpretation.

(conversation) (F=Dr Fox, M=Martin the caller)

F: coming up on the jukebox, the hotline's 0171-4848-958, just a quick shout
here and so who's this going to be then Mr Producer?
(staff, shouting) MARTIN!
F: Couldn't quite hear you, it's going to be?
(staff, normal voice) Martin.
F: Thank you. Martin, hello.
M: Hello, Foxy.
F: How are you Martin.
M: Er, knackered.
F: Why?
M: Didn't get much sleep last night. Party down the road.
F: What time did you go to bed?
M: Four o'clock this morning.
F: Well that sounds quite a reasonable Saturday night if you ask me.
M: I was up at eight.
F: You were up at eight this morning?
M: Yeah.
F: That's sick. Why? What on earth made you get out of bed at eight this
morning?
M: My father.
F: Well that's no good. Why is he being sicko, is he being a sadist?
M: No, he out there, sort of clearing room.
F: Listen, is your dad there?
M: No, he's downstairs.
F: Oh mate, can you get him?
M: No.
F: Does he not let you on the phone? The only reason is that I wouldn't mind
having a chat with someone who makes anyone get up at eight o'clock on a
Sunday morning. I'm sorry, that's ill isn't it, that's out of order.
M: It's sick.
F: I'm just going to ask around here. What do you think then, eight o'clock
Sunday morning? That's out of order isn't it, for any father?
(staff) Yeah, definitely.
F: Is he like victimising you or something, is there any reason why he wanted
you up at eight o'clock? To clean your room?
M: Well as I say I got up at eight this morning to clean my room and it looks
worse that it did yesterday.
F: Well I should have just left it and stayed in there until eleven o'clock
if I was you.
M: Well I was up, I didn't get out of bed.
F: What, you didn't get out of bed at eight o'clock? No, he woke you up at
eight o'clock. Did you do any cleaning at all?
M: I haven't touched my bedroom.
F: Top man. Boy you're going to get your arse kicked later aren't you. Now
a song for you, what can we play?
M: Guns and Roses, "Sweet Child of Mine".
F: And we're going to dedicate this to your father?
M: No we're not, we'll dedicate this to my good mate Jamie, who's sitting
on the bed now.
F: Right, hello Jamie. And anyone else? Any top totty in your life at the
moment?
M: Unfortunately no.
F: The totty factor is quite low at the moment is it?
M: It's dead.
F: It's dead? What, nothing?
M: Nothing.
F: What, zero? Well, that's pathetic. No wonder you're down. You stay out
til four o'clock and nothing. We'd better have words when we're off the
radio I think. We need to give you a team talk. You have a good night tonight.
M: And you.
F: Take care.
(song starts)
F: Actually something was going through my mind. I think I'll leave it.

I'm not really sure whether this is in any way about me. It probably isn't.
Probably it's just my nasty suspicious mind finding links where none exist.
However, here is an explanation of why it might, possibly, be about me.

Throughout this interview, I was throwing abuse at the radio, and to my mind,
Neil Fox was hearing the abuse, and responding interactively. This explains
why he sounds so stressed when talking to telephone caller Martin, and the
general violence of his words including "Boy you're going to get your arse
kicked later aren't you".

The piece starts of with the producer shouting the name of the caller, which
might be related to my loud vocalisations at the radio. The trouble starts
off with Fox saying "That's sick". "Sick" might be taken as a reference to my
condition. Then Fox says, "Why is he being sicko, is he being a sadist?",
again sick = my illness, "sadist" = attitude of my oppressors towards me.
"that's ill isn't it" = further comment on my illness. "Is he like
victimising you or something" = again what my enemies are doing to me.

Fox sounds quite happy when he gets Martin to say "It's sick"; as you would
expect him to, if the comment were directed at me. It is a constant feature
of my enemies' harassment of me that they get intermediaries to verbalise the
abuse. Immediately after saying "victimising you" Fox gives a little laugh,
to show he thinks the victimisation (of me, not Martin) is funny.

Fox gets increasingly nasty as the piece progresses. "Boy you're going to get
your arse kicked later aren't you" is not really what you would expect him to
say if he were just talking to Martin. Fox is on the same side as Martin, so
why would he be so verbally aggressive to him? On the other hand, if the
piece is about me, then his strong words start to make sense.

Fox's jubilation at finding that Martin's "totty factor" is "dead" again
doesn't make much sense unless you think that he might not be considering
Martin's totty factor, but mine, since it's a fairly well known fact that my
"totty factor" is not significantly above zero.

To round off the 135 second interchange, just as the next track is starting,
Fox says, "Actually something was going through my mind. I think I'll leave
it". Given that I was chucking abuse at Fox throughout, it is only natural
for him have thought up a reply that he would have wished to have made,
except that such a reply would (a) probably not be suitable for a family
show, and (b) have given the game away completely.

So there you are. You the jury, what say you in the case of plaintiff vs.
Neil Fox's Juke Box, guilty or not guilty?

5045

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: gobindexpeller.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ac1fc30e48cb74a1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 5:12 am
From: goel

gobindexpeller.com

for oil expellers

for oil mill machinery

courtsy:domainandspace.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: MI5 Persecution: Neil Fox (Nov/1998) (6268)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5b62edda3e65e82d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 5:37 am
From: MI5Victim@mi5.gov.uk

Foxy's Showtime on Capital FM 25/11/98 7.35pm

Certainty level: 100%

This one, I can say with absolute certainty, is about me. It was recorded
on my Sony Recording Walkman on the evening of Wednesday 25 November 1998.
It doesn't mention me by name, so the objective observer might have trouble
understanding why I'm so sure it's about me. I'm sure, because the
harassment had restarted over the period when this piece was broadcast, and
what Capital transmitted would have been in context with events at the time.
(Sorry if that explanation is somewhat opaque, but I don't really want to
embarrass myself by giving an explanation in detail, and an intelligent
reader should be able to work it out for him/her self.)

This isn't the first time Capital have "got at" me; they were doing so
right at the very beginning in summer 1990, when they said, "if he listens
to Capital then he can't be all bad"; and Tarrant made remarks about me
in his breakfast show in spring 1994, when he said, "you know this bloke?
he says we're trying to kill him. We should be done for attempted
manslaughter."

Unfortunately I didn't record those previous, much more conclusive
instances of harassment by Capital DJs, and Capital Radio tells me they
only keep recordings for three months. But lately I've been recording
everything, and here is one product of that recording.

Neil Fox was introducing some petite Swedish songstress, sounded like
Amelia, when he said something about her petite-ness ;

"she's a big big girl, actually she's really about tiny, she's this big,
would you say what less than....."

then one of his studio staff shouted, "six inches"

then Fox laughed and said, "less than a meter tall, definitely"

What I think the "six inches" referred to should be obvious. I think it's
sexual abuse directed at me.

Also there were a lot of words like "crazy", "mad" etc on this programme,
which reinforced my belief that this was on purpose directed at myself.

I think Fox may be something of an unwilling participant in this abuse, he
doesn't want to be an abuser but the persecutors are using his show and
his staff to get at me. This is not the first time this sort of thing has
happened from his show; and my guess is that it won't be the last

6268

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Water Sprinkler on hot roof
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/cd33b11ba1e1b1ff?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Aug 23 2007 12:19 pm
From: Wayne Sallee

Don K wrote on 8/18/2007 1:19 AM:
> "Seerialmom" <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1187397242.726059.319310@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>> I like the idea of the elevated solar panels; do any of the companies
>> actually install them that way? I've invented (in my mind of course)
>> similar contraptions for the roof like "shades" you could raise to
>> allow the air flow and shade.
>
> Spacing a flat panel off the roof, could turn it into an airfoil.
>
> For example, you can get 1120 pounds of lift for a 20x20 foot flat rectangle
> in a 100mph airflow at an angle of 1 degree.
>
> Here's a neat applet from NASA that shows the lift you can get from
> flat rectangular plate (and other shapes).
>
> http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/aerosim/applet/vj402.html
>
> select input to "shape/angle"
> change airfoil shape to Plate
> change angle-deg to 1
> change camber-% to 0
>
> select input to "size"
> change chord-ft to ~20
> change span-ft to ~20
>
> select input to "flight test"
> change speed-mph to 100
>
> set view to show geometry 2D or 3D geometry and streamlines
>
> set output, plot selection to lift vs. speed (or anything)
> Then vary the input parameters to see how it behaves.
>
> Don
>
>

That's a cool web ap. And they have it downloadable too.

Wayne Sallee
Webmaster@LeesburgNazarene.org

--
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Paper towels in rest-rooms?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0311d5c09a0dfa57?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Aug 24 2007 6:51 am
From: Wayne Sallee

A Veteran wrote on 8/23/2007 11:44 PM:
> not everyone washes their hands in the
> public toilets

LOL That reminds me of a story about a school that
set out to put a stop to the girls putting kiss
marks on the bathroom mirrors. They brought all the
students into the bathroom, and the janitor show
them how difficult it was to clean the kiss marks
off of the mirror. :-)

Wayne Sallee
Webmaster@LeesburgNazarene.org

--
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== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 7:17 am
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

On Fri, 24 Aug 2007 17:36:10 -0500, Mark Anderson
<mea@nospambrandylion.com> wrote:

>The sinks and the faucet handles in these restrooms harbor the most
>germs because every Tom, Dick, and Harry touched those and you don't
>know what kind of germs they harbor on their penii.

Dunno about Tom or Dick, but I resemble that remark. Bowel movements
excepted, your post is right. Trivia - did you know that the pen the
cashier hands you to use to sign off on your credit slip has more
germs than most public toilets?

The moving hand writes, and having writ, moves on...

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 9:34 am
From: "Don K"

<hchickpea@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:29e0d3pvbqln8fihhntd36bbrnpueoe1fk@4ax.com...
>
> Dunno about Tom or Dick, but I resemble that remark. Bowel movements
> excepted, your post is right. Trivia - did you know that the pen the
> cashier hands you to use to sign off on your credit slip has more
> germs than most public toilets?

Trivia should probably avoid that cashier or use her own pen from now on.
Also she might consider getting a restraining order to prevent stalkers.

Don

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How many treadwear miles do we REALLY get for every 100 UTQG points?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6a0106987541f236?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:04 am
From: _Pnina Gersten_

On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 10:36:13 GMT, Androcles wrote:
>: So, my question is how many miles do we/you REALLY get
>: for every 100 points in a UTQG rating? In real life. Really.

> It's on the page you quoted.
> "The grading fixes 30,000 miles (48,279kms) as 100%

Hi Androcles,
Maybe I wasn't clear.

I was asking how many miles we REALLY get - not what some rating says.

I don't know ANYONE who gets 150,000 miles out of a 500 tire. Do you?

I'm gonna take a wild-eyed guess and say we need to subtract more than 66%
from the government numbers, so, that would make a 500 tire not 150,000
miles but 50 thousand miles in actual use on actual roads with actual
passengers and loads and actual driving in actual weather and traffic but
not abuse.

Do other agree that you only get about 1/3 of the government numbers?

Another way to put it is you only get about 10,000 miles for every 100
index in the UTQG tire rating.

With so many millions of USA drivers ... can't anyone else come up with a
number that they've found to be true for them?

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:21 am
From: _Pnina Gersten_

On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 09:16:07 -0400, Nate Nagel wrote:
>> So, my question is how many miles do we/you REALLY get for every 100 points
>> in a UTQG rating? In real life. Really.
>
> I'd put more stock in the treadwear warranty of the tire than in the
> UTQG rating.

Hi Nate Nagel,

Being scientifically inclined, I prefer measurements to marketing.

IMHO, the tire manufacturer's "warranty" is a blatant marketing gimmick.
I'm always amazed at some of my friends who would rather quote a warranty
rather than a test result. IMHO, the "warranty" gibberish has absolutely no
bearing on anything other than pure marketing needs. Sure, you'll say they
don't warrant what they can't justify and I'll respond with sure, they need
to make money, but, how many times have YOU actually redeemed a
battery/brakepad/tire warranty in real life? I never do because
a) The warranty is prorated
b) You have to buy THEIR tire again from THEIR distributor and stock
c) You have to pay THEIR (inflated) price at that time
d) The warranty is prorated but you often end up paying MORE for the second
tire (due to conditions above) than the first tire! Ha. Warranty.

It's not you per se that makes me write this as I've taught many a friend
about testing standards - but anyone who quotes a marketing tool as science
has to get this lecture from me.

Having said that, does anyone of the millions of drivers out there actually
compare their mileage received with the government UTQG test results?

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:40 am
From: "Androcles"

"_Pnina Gersten_" <pd53@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:2yXzi.55$ZA5.44@nlpi068.nbdc.sbc.com...
: On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 10:36:13 GMT, Androcles wrote:
: >: So, my question is how many miles do we/you REALLY get
: >: for every 100 points in a UTQG rating? In real life. Really.
:
: > It's on the page you quoted.
: > "The grading fixes 30,000 miles (48,279kms) as 100%
:
: Hi Androcles,
: Maybe I wasn't clear.
:
: I was asking how many miles we REALLY get - not what some rating says.

You really get 30,000 miles. Really really, yes really. Maybe I wasn't
clear.
You really get 30,000 miles. Really really, yes really.
:
: I don't know ANYONE who gets 150,000 miles out of a 500 tire. Do you?

Yes. Trucks and buses ... not roller skates, though. The bigger the tyre,
the greater the miles.

: I'm gonna take a wild-eyed guess and say we need to subtract more than 66%
: from the government numbers, so, that would make a 500 tire not 150,000
: miles but 50 thousand miles in actual use on actual roads with actual
: passengers and loads and actual driving in actual weather and traffic but
: not abuse.
:
Are you? Well, that's a nice wild-eyed guess, but the gov said you get
30,000 miles and the tyre is worn out, nobody is going to pay the
slightest attention to a wild-eyed bigot too stupid to listen, and neither
am I. Now get out of sci.physics and take your idiotic rants with you.
*plonk*

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:45 am
From: _Pnina Gersten_

On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 15:40:00 GMT, Androcles wrote:
> You really get 30,000 miles. Really really, yes really.
>: I don't know ANYONE who gets 150,000 miles out of a 500 tire. Do you?
> Yes. The bigger the tyre, the greater the miles.

I'm shocked that everyone gets the 150,000 miles a 500 UTQG treadwear
rating says you'll get based on an extrapolation of the first 7,200 miles
in ideal constant-speed conditions.

Thank you for your insight.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT Looking For A New Job
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/12de660682716035?hl=en
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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:22 am
From: Millhaven

On Aug 22, 6:02 pm, Shawn Hirn <s...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In article <1187814866.019146.107...@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Millhaven<millha...@intergate.com> wrote:
> > I want a job where I can listen to music while working. Any ideas?
>
> One of my colleagues sits at his desk with head phones on and works
> while listening to music. He's an computer systems manager.

I can't wear headphones anymore.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 8:22 am
From: Millhaven

On Aug 22, 6:18 pm, Logan Shaw <lshaw-use...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> Millhavenwrote:
> > I want a job where I can listen to music while working. Any ideas?
>
> Easy: become a Grammy-Award-winning record producer.
>
> - Logan

Most Grammy-Award-winning music sucks.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 9:05 am
From: Logan Shaw

Millhaven wrote:
> On Aug 22, 6:18 pm, Logan Shaw <lshaw-use...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>> Millhavenwrote:

>>> I want a job where I can listen to music while working. Any ideas?

>> Easy: become a Grammy-Award-winning record producer.

> Most Grammy-Award-winning music sucks.

Agreed. But you didn't say you wanted to listen to *good* music while
working.

- Logan

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 9:30 am
From: Millhaven

On Aug 25, 9:05 am, Logan Shaw <lshaw-use...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> Millhaven wrote:
> > On Aug 22, 6:18 pm, Logan Shaw <lshaw-use...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> >> Millhavenwrote:
> >>> I want a job where I can listen to music while working. Any ideas?
> >> Easy: become a Grammy-Award-winning record producer.
> > Most Grammy-Award-winning music sucks.
>
> Agreed. But you didn't say you wanted to listen to *good* music while
> working.
>
> - Logan

I want to listen to whatever music I want to listen to.

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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Aug 25 2007 9:24 am
From: ghyti

George Hotz, 17, has written an application hack to unlock the iPhone
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