Frugal Living: Jul 24, 2007

Tuesday, July 24, 2007

25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Woman is content living in 84-sq. ft. tiny dream home.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/911886124117ed11?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:12 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Tim Campbell <timcall@sbcglobal.net> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote

>> Yeah, saw that, but an RV or trailer makes a
>> lot more sense because its easier to move too.

> If ya don't mind all that plastic and the formaldahyde vapors...

Those are trivially avoidable if you're obsessed about those.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Breast-Feeding: Private Act or Public Right?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/d9ae679497789a49?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 11:58 am
From: Kelsey Bjarnason

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 12:07:50 -0700, firelock_ny wrote:

> On Jul 23, 1:45 pm, Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarna...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> [snips]
>>
>> On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 20:08:38 +0000, Terry Austin wrote:
>> >>> Indeed. For atheists, it is apparently a natural talent, not learned
>> >>> behavior.
>>
>> >> Please explain what the correlation is between atheism and lying or
>> >> bullshitting. If you cannot demonstrate such a correlation, then your
>> >> statement is, itself, a lie, which doesn't exactly give you the moral
>> >> high ground, now does it?
>>
>> > You're not exactly the sharpest tool in the shed, are you?
>>
>> That's nice. Still doesn't support the contention made. Shall we assume
>> you cannot, and therefore were, in fact, simply lying?
>
> Kelsey, you're talking to *Terry Austin*. He isn't
> here to show you whether or not he's lying.
>

Or much of anything else, apparently.

--
Hell hath no fury like the lawyer of a woman scorned.

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 11:58 am
From: Kelsey Bjarnason

[snips]

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 21:22:06 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:

>> That's nice. Still doesn't support the contention made. Shall
>> we assume you cannot, and therefore were, in fact, simply lying?
>>
> Or perhaps you just want to suck my dick again.

Again? Never did it once, so "again" wouldn't apply. 'Sides, being
straight and male, the notion doesn't interest me overmuch, but I wish you
the best of luck in finding a willing partner.

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:47 pm
From: No 33 Secretary

Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote in
news:q67in4-7ps.ln1@spanky.localhost.net:

> On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 20:35:24 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:
>
>> Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:3nuhn4-7t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net:
>>
>>> [snips]
>>>
>>> On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 21:22:06 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:
>>>
>>>>> That's nice. Still doesn't support the contention made.
>>>>> Shall we assume you cannot, and therefore were, in fact,
>>>>> simply lying?
>>>>>
>>>> Or perhaps you just want to suck my dick again.
>>>
>>> Again? Never did it once, so "again" wouldn't apply.
>>
>> Heh.
>>
>>> 'Sides,
>>> being straight and male, the notion doesn't interest me
>>> overmuch, but I wish you the best of luck in finding a willing
>>> partner.
>>>
>> Then you should stop begging in a public forum.
>
>
> Umm... it was you who brought up the bit about me sucking your
> dick, not I; if there's someone around here looking for such
> activities, logic would suggest it was you, not I.
>
> 'Course, that said, if the best you have to offer is aspersions
> of homosexuality, chances are you wouldn't be a very interesting
> partner even for someone of the appropriate gender and
> orientation.
>
I was only commenting on your actions. If you don't want people
commenting on your proclivities, don't do them in public.

--
"If he does that shit again I'm going to tie his ass hairs together
and kick him in the shin."

Terry Austin

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 11:41 am
From: Kelsey Bjarnason

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 09:10:32 -0500, bearclaw wrote:

> In article <hv9fn4-4t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>,
> Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I expect *you* as the *parent* to shut the kid up,
>> leave him at home, or get out.
>
> Personally, I don't have kids. But if I ever met someone with an
> attitude like yours in a public place, I would do everything I could
> think of to drive you smack out of your mind, including encouraging any
> nearby kids to scream, squall, run around and generally rain on your
> parade. I find upsetting people like you highly entertaining. It even
> becomes a game sometimes to see who leaves in a big huff first.

Figures. Someone else without brains enough to figure out that in doing
so, they're pissing off *everyone* around them, for no purpose other than
to be a prick.

I may be antisocial, but I'm at least *considerately* so; if I'm going to
make noises or whatever, I do it on *my* dime - I don't inflict my crap on
others who didn't ask for it and probably don't want it.

People like you should be banned from having kids; you're obviously not
mature enough for them.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:13 pm
From: William_Wingstedt@comcast.net (William Wingstedt)

On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 21:29:15 GMT, Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey>
wrote:

>On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 03:40:39 GMT, William_Wingstedt@comcast.net
>(William Wingstedt) wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 21:19:19 GMT, Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 20:27:34 GMT, William_Wingstedt@comcast.net
>>>(William Wingstedt) wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 14:58:08 -0400, "Lee K" <lee_keedick@hotmail.com>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"William Wingstedt" <William_Wingstedt@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>>>>news:469f90f5.147977640@Newsgroups.Comcast.net...
>>>>>> On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 15:23:34 GMT, "Lee K" <lee_keedick@hotmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:5g97ebF3f7j9hU1@mid.individual.net...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm a supporter of the right to choose - therefore, I am pro-choice.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Whose right to choose, and to choose what?
>>>>>>>I'd wager you don't support a male's participation in the choice that so
>>>>>>>intimately affects him.
>>>>>>>If he wants to choose life, and she chooses abortion, it's just too bad
>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>him.
>>>>>>>If she wants to choose life and he wants her to abort, it's just too bad
>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>him.
>>>>>>>Financially, if he wants to choose not to be involved, it's not a choice
>>>>>>>available to him. The argument that he should have been more careful so
>>>>>>>as
>>>>>>>to avoid impregnation is bogus. A brief instant in time that results in a
>>>>>>>pregnancy cannot be undone, as far as the male is concerned, but the
>>>>>>>female
>>>>>>>has months to make her decision after that brief instant, a decision which
>>>>>>>then impacts the male for the rest of his life.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Those are the terms of the deal. That's why males have to be careful.
>>>>>> Until the baby is born, it is part of the mother's body, so recognized
>>>>>> by her immune system, which rejects that which is not self. What
>>>>>> supposed right to you have over the sovereignty of someone else's body
>>>>>> and from where do you derive that power?
>>>>>
>>>>>And you don't view enslaving the male to a lifetime of financial burden as
>>>>>not exercising sovereignty over someone else's body?
>>>>
>>>>Financial responsibility for your ejaculatory acts are not a burden.
>>>>They are one of the joys of fatherhood.
>>>
>>>They are?
>>
>>Well, yeah, why else would you undertake such an endeavor?
>
>The inlaws, wanted a football team.
>
>
>>To endure
>>the burden of unhappiness? No thanks! :)
>>
>>>
>>>>Meeting those responsibilities will make you a better person
>>>
>>>And poorer.
>>
>>>>with the side benefit that as you provide for your progeny,
>>>>you will also enjoy a better standard of living.
>>>
>>>I don't remember that, either.
>>>
>>
>>Must be all the opulence has dulled your memory...it's a protective
>>mechanism. :)
>>
>
>That, or the poverty. (:-)

I hadn't even considered that...you're Dubh Ghall, dammit! I thought
that alone entitled you to some sort of fortune. I can't, nor do I
even want to, imagine a world where a Dubh Ghall lives in poverty.

>
>
>
>--
>
>The spelling like any opinion stated here
> is purely my own
>
> #162 BAAWA Knight.

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:19 pm
From: bearclaw@cruller.invalid

In article <inthn4-7t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>,
Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote:

> Figures. Someone else without brains enough to figure out that in
> doing so, they're pissing off *everyone* around them, for no purpose
> other than to be a prick.

Excellent. Enjoy life.

> I may be antisocial, but I'm at least *considerately* so

Whee! Once again proving the denial is NOT just a river in Egypt.

> if I'm going to make noises or whatever, I do it on *my* dime - I
> don't inflict my crap on others who didn't ask for it and probably
> don't want it.

Which is exactly what makes you such a perfect victim. Man, do I hope we
meet up someday. Don't worry, you will suffer on your dime, too. I will
be the one at the other table secretly enjoying your apoplexy. Tell me,
do you get migraines?

> People like you should be banned from having kids; you're obviously not
> mature enough for them.

Oh, no ban necessary. I enjoy kids as long as they belong to somebody
else-- especially if they are up to some delightfully innocent
provocation of those who walk around at the end of their rope. Surely
you know how "the little rotters" love to test "sensible" limits. Think
of my involvement as the spontaneous encouragement of frugal street
theater.

Surrender is really your only option because you are definitely your own
worst enemy, at least in this discussion.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal luxuries that you treat yourself to
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/47c53b3bb3c6299b?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:52 pm
From: George

Seerialmom wrote:
> On Jul 16, 3:22 pm, William Souden <sou...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> Two things for my self. The cost of the first is almost
>> infinitesimal. I use a fresh towel each day when I shower . If I go out
>> in the evening I use two towels that day.
>>
>> When I am having a bad week I go to the local butcher and treat myself
>> to a nice T-bone, always well under $10.
>
> Isn't "frugal luxury" an oxymoron?

No, Some people confuse frugal with cheapness but it isn't that at all.

>
> But if you want to know about non-frugal treats that I partake in
> (after being frugally hypervigilant) in, here's my "go-to's":
>
> Turtles...not the aquatic kind but the chocolate/caramel/pecan
> convection featured on "Everybody Hates Chris". Usually able to snag
> these for a good price after a holiday (Christmas and Valentines day
> mostly).
>
> AYCE Chinese buffet for Sunday lunch while out and about.
>
> I have been known to buy the latest gadget just because it's too cool
> to pass up....but it's infrequent. Example: Go-Video VCR/DVR combo
> when it first came out. Loved the fact it took up the space of a
> VCR. Didn't love the fact that I never had a DVR before so though the
> skipping I had with it was due to "rental disks". Got it fixed one
> month before warranty was up. The other non-frugal but worth it buy
> was the Dyson when it first came out here.
>
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Repost: The Rod Speed work history
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/747e854fc8f838c0?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 12:13 pm
From: "Bob F"

"William Souden" <souden@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:xqdpi.29834$C96.22340@newssvr23.news.prodigy.net...

plonk!

Bob

==============================================================================
TOPIC: whither the ice house?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ece54484f7063e00?hl=en
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== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:20 pm
From: Ecnerwal

In article <46a66e94$0$505$815e3792@news.qwest.net>,
"Morris Dovey" <mrdovey@iedu.com> wrote:

> Steve Spence wrote:
> | When power is in short supply, and winter provides sufficient ice,
> | a ice house is an appropriate solution. We have built in-basement
> | ice houses, and collected ice from the pond in winter. The ice
> | stays with us through October. Outdoor temps rarely exceed 90F here
> | in upstate NY.
>
> I'm not questioning the technical possibility. I'd suggest discussing
> this issue with your wife/mother/grandmother before allowing yourself
> to become too enthusiastic about this particular choice.

I would not assume that a direct return to the technology of the
traditional (messy, warmish) ice-box is appropriate. If you can provide
a little bit of power to run a circulator pump, you can have the mess
and fuss contained outside or in the basement (and reduce the fuss quite
a bit), and pipe the cool (via insulated pipes) to a dedicated
refrigerator which might be built from an old upright freezer box - or
you might have a small walk-in fridge and freezer with the cooling for
the fridge section coming from ice-house as long as possible, and
compressor if/when that runs out. If there's more ice capacity, cool
(within specs, but given that they work with outside air through the
winter, this is a wider spec than typical house fridges) the condenser
for the freezer part as well.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 6:41 pm
From: "Steve Spence"

It wasn't an ice box. It was an ice house, in the basement. sort of a
walk-in cooler. Food was stored on shelves in the ice room.

--
Steve Spence
Director, Green-Trust
http://www.green-trust.org
http://www.green-trust.org/bookshop/

"Morris Dovey" <mrdovey@iedu.com> wrote in message
news:46a66e94$0$505$815e3792@news.qwest.net...
> Steve Spence wrote:
> | When power is in short supply, and winter provides sufficient ice,
> | a ice house is an appropriate solution. We have built in-basement
> | ice houses, and collected ice from the pond in winter. The ice
> | stays with us through October. Outdoor temps rarely exceed 90F here
> | in upstate NY.
>
> I'm not questioning the technical possibility. I'd suggest discussing
> this issue with your wife/mother/grandmother before allowing yourself
> to become too enthusiastic about this particular choice.
>
> I remember iceboxes (in small town Michigan) and would assure you that
> they weren't abandoned for reasons that had anything to do (directly)
> with the technology involved.
>
> I also remember that there weren't any frozen foods in the grocery
> store.
>
> --
> Morris Dovey
> DeSoto Solar
> DeSoto, Iowa USA
> http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/
>
>

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:02 pm
From: "Morris Dovey"

Steve Spence wrote:

| It wasn't an ice box. It was an ice house, in the basement. sort of
| a walk-in cooler. Food was stored on shelves in the ice room.

Ah! Thank you - I read "ice house" and thought "ice box". My mistake.

Still, that strikes me as a project needing a considerable mass of ice
and a substantial volume of insulation if it's to last from winter to
winter (or harvest to harvest).

Too much heavy lifting for me - I'll continue working on a solar
solution.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Inexpensive, Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1eb5a91cbd2518db?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:25 pm
From: Derald

"Don K" <dk@dont_bother_me.com> wrote:

>Ooh, an inexpensive process has been developed to use paint-on solar
>panels made from single wall carbon nanotubes.
Well, minus the commentary, the item made the A2 page of Monday's IBD;
that's something. From OP's citation, I read the nanotubes and buckyballs to be
constituents of the "paint", not of its support structure.
The "real" news is here (from OP's citation):
>"Developing organic solar cells from polymers, however, is a cheap and potentially simpler alternative,"
while the $64 qualifier is:
> "Someday, I hope to see...."

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Valley, Santa Clarita areas face problems with illness, poverty
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/123e617c98534333?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:26 pm
From: Millhaven

http://www.dailynews.com/ci_6447594

Valley, Santa Clarita areas face problems with illness, poverty
BY SUSAN ABRAM, Staff Writer
Article Last Updated: 07/23/2007 11:11:30 PM PDT

Residents in the San Fernando and Santa Clarita valleys are poorer,
mostly unhealthier and visiting emergency rooms for mental illness
more than they were three years ago, according to a report to be
released Wednesday.

While obesity and diabetes rates have grown steadily over the past
several years, mental health needs are surging, with more residents
being diagnosed with various forms of psychosis at area hospitals.

"The mental health diagnosis of (schizophrenia) is now among the top
five (inpatient diagnoses) among adults and children," said Ronald
Sorensen, director of the Providence Center for Community Health
Improvement.

"It raises a concern that there's not a lot of access to mental health
services. And mental health issues keep moving up on the list of
needs. If residents don't have access to a mental health provider,
what ends up happening is they go to the hospital."

The study by the Valley Care Community Consortium, a group of health
and mental health providers and schools, ties health to household
incomes, education, race and ethnicity, and neighborhood crime rates.

Among the findings, households that earn less than $25,000 a year have
increased from 17 percent to 23 percent
of the total in the San Fernando Valley and from 9 percent to 11
percent of Santa Clarita Valley households.
Diabetes accounted for 21 percent of deaths in 2004, up from 19
percent in 1999 in the San Fernando and Santa Clarita valleys.

Obesity rates in the two areas also rose to 21 percent in 2004 from 19
percent in 1999.

Funding for the study was provided by Kaiser Permanente, the
California Endowment and Northridge Hospital Medical Center.

The community consortium will meet Wednesday to release the study's
findings, identify causes for the general decline in health in the two
areas and find solutions.

Other key findings:

In one of the few positive improvements, asthma rates among children
age 17 and younger fell in the past three years, from 8.7 percent of
the total to 7.9 percent.

In Glendale, nearly 12 percent of the residents have heart disease.
The city also has the San Fernando Valley's highest rate of asthma and
diabetes.

While the number of uninsured adults decreased from 23.6 percent to 19
percent over three years, most adults still don't have a regular
medical physician.

The number of residents age 65 to 84 will increase by 35 percent in
the Santa Clarita Valley in the next five years.

"One of the main concerns is that the household income levels below
$25,000 are growing, so how can we make health care affordable if the
salaries are going down, and yet costs for health care continue to
rise?" asked Joni Novosel, program director for the Valley Care
Community Consortium.

Obesity also remains a top health crisis.

"That is a real concern because that brings in a lot of issues, such
as heart problems and diabetes," Novosel said.

Health experts and community leaders are expected to meet Wednesday to
discuss the progress made since 2004, as well as where more attention
is needed.

"This study is a picture of the San Fernando and Santa Clarita
valleys," Sorensen said. "We'll discuss what we have, and how to delve
deeper."

susan.abram@dailynews.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Can I Avoid Losing My Rollover Minutes When Changing Plans?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2ccfad333fda7ea2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:46 pm
From: Courtney

I'd like to drop from my AT&T 900 min plan to the 450 min plan but if
I do they say they will take my 3500 rollover minutes away from me.

Is there any way for me to avoid losing my rollover minutes?

Thanks

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:36 pm
From: Logan Shaw

Courtney wrote:
> I'd like to drop from my AT&T 900 min plan to the 450 min plan but if
> I do they say they will take my 3500 rollover minutes away from me.
>
> Is there any way for me to avoid losing my rollover minutes?

If those are the rules, I don't see how you can do much about it.

Of course, there is one way: use them all, then switch.

- Logan

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 6:33 pm
From: Ward Abbott

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 15:46:18 -0700, Courtney <ckinear@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Is there any way for me to avoid losing my rollover minutes?

Don't try to argue with us.....we have NO power.

Your beef is with AT&T.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 6:34 pm
From: Rick

Courtney wrote:
>
> I'd like to drop from my AT&T 900 min plan to the 450 min plan but if
> I do they say they will take my 3500 rollover minutes away from me.
>
> Is there any way for me to avoid losing my rollover minutes?
>
> Thanks

Why ask us? AT&T is the one telling you what the terms of changing the
contract will be. We don't know.

Assuming you have had the service for at least one year, and you have a
balance of 3500 rollover minutes, you are accumulating over 290 unused
minutes per month on your current plan. It doesn't sound like losing the
3500 minutes will be a problem for you, since you aren't using them
anyway and the oldest rollover minutes "roll off" and expire after 12
months anyway.

Then again, if you have had the plan for at least one year, under the
old plan 900 minute scenario you are accumulating an average of 290
rollover minutes a month. That means you are currently using an average
of 610 minutes a month. Are you sure dropping to 450 minutes per month
will be enough?

Rick

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:12 pm
From: Courtney

Thanks for the thoughts everybody...helped me think it through...

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Why I hate Washington Mutual (a rant)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/02d22dacefd6cc05?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:57 pm
From: The Real Bev

1. About 12 years ago I needed to withdraw $30K in cash. I had more than
that in the account, but they refused to give me the cash, instead offering
a cashier's check. I took it to Bank of America, where I had considerably
less than that in my checking account. BofA cheerfully cashed the check.

2. As a result, a few months later I went to the closest branch to close
one of the accounts. After half an hour they said they were having trouble
getting our signature card faxed over from the main local branch. An hour
later they got the signatures and closed our account.

3. A month or so after that I went to the main local branch, figuring that
they wouldn't have to fax anything anywhere. After half an hour they said
they had looked everywhere but couldn't find my signature card. I asked
what else they could do. They said I could show them my driver's license.
AARRGGHH.

4. I recently inherited a couple of WaMu accounts, for which I needed to
order checks. I spent an hour in the branch (they have guard-operated
double doors now, possibly with poison gas available Just In Case) watching
the bankdroid order checks and verify the new statement address. The checks
were supposed to arrive within 7-10 working days.

Here it is two months later. No checks. Statements still forwarded from
the old address. I went back into the branch where I ordered the checks.
They had no record of the order. Moreover, they didn't seem at all
concerned that A F*CKING BANK TRANSACTION HAD SIMPLY EVAPORATED. They
rush-ordered more checks, waived the fee ($20 for 150 checks is ridiculous)
and said they'd call me when they arrived at the bank (I figured that was a
more reliable address than mine).

At no time during any of these transactions did a single bank employee offer
an apology. Nobody wondered why I was closing out my accounts. When I
close these accounts I bet nobody will ask why. I'm going to tell them
anyway. Loudly.

--
Cheers,
Bev
===========================================================
"You should be glad that bridge fell down -- I was planning
to build thirteen more to the same design."
-- Attributed to I.K. Brunel, addressing the
Directors of the Great Western Railway

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:14 pm
From: Rick

The Real Bev wrote:
>
> 1. About 12 years ago I needed to withdraw $30K in cash. I had more than
> that in the account, but they refused to give me the cash, instead offering
> a cashier's check. I took it to Bank of America, where I had considerably
> less than that in my checking account. BofA cheerfully cashed the check.

In *cash*? Like dollar bills? If you had asked, you may have found out
that for any withdrawal in cash over a limit that the banks sets, they
need so many days advance notice to order extra money in from the
Federal Reserve bank to accommodate such a request. It is *highly*
unusual for a bank customer to request a pay out in cash dollars of
$30,000.00 - for what should be some very obvious reasons. And no, they
don't keep piles and piles of cash just sitting around in banks. They
order it in as needed, in as small amounts as reasonably possible for
normal day-to-day operations. And they get rid of any excess amounts as
quickly as possible as well. Different banks, and even branches within
the same banks, may have different maximum cash amounts they can or will
pay out without advance notice, depending on the customer traffic at
that bank or branch.

> 2. As a result, a few months later I went to the closest branch to close
> one of the accounts. After half an hour they said they were having trouble
> getting our signature card faxed over from the main local branch. An hour
> later they got the signatures and closed our account.
>
> 3. A month or so after that I went to the main local branch, figuring that
> they wouldn't have to fax anything anywhere. After half an hour they said
> they had looked everywhere but couldn't find my signature card. I asked
> what else they could do. They said I could show them my driver's license.
> AARRGGHH.

And providing proof of who you were... Somehow that was a problem?

> 4. I recently inherited a couple of WaMu accounts, for which I needed to
> order checks. I spent an hour in the branch (they have guard-operated
> double doors now, possibly with poison gas available Just In Case) watching
> the bankdroid order checks and verify the new statement address. The checks
> were supposed to arrive within 7-10 working days.
>
> Here it is two months later. No checks. Statements still forwarded from
> the old address. I went back into the branch where I ordered the checks.
> They had no record of the order. Moreover, they didn't seem at all
> concerned that A F*CKING BANK TRANSACTION HAD SIMPLY EVAPORATED. They
> rush-ordered more checks, waived the fee ($20 for 150 checks is ridiculous)
> and said they'd call me when they arrived at the bank (I figured that was a
> more reliable address than mine).

Look, it happens. They didn't lose a transaction. "They" - and "they"
could be a bank employee, a post office employee or the place that
prints the checks - lost a check order request. It wasn't a transaction.
You didn't lose any money.

> At no time during any of these transactions did a single bank employee offer
> an apology. Nobody wondered why I was closing out my accounts. When I
> close these accounts I bet nobody will ask why. I'm going to tell them
> anyway. Loudly.
>
>
> --
> Cheers,
> Bev

You seem to be over the top on this. You wanted to take out a very large
sum of cash, that the bank either didn't have on hand when you wanted it
or for some reason they felt very uncomfortable transferring that amount
of cash to you. They lost a check order - whoopee. And you don't even
know if it was actually the bank that lost the check order.

Rick

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal living in the Philadelphia region
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9c8ddd075cd535b7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:25 pm
From: "nemo"

"Sparrow" <funnybunnyfive@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1185200630.051628.143180@m3g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Some ideas for saving money:
>

http://home.comcast.net/~plutarch/frugal-philly.html
>

It says:

'Hey, turn on Javascript!'

Bleedin cheek!

I say: Coillons!! I care about the security of my PC.

(It's Middle English for b*ll*cks and therefore classical, and therefore not
rude! :o)

cheap Nemo!

(I *still* use the insides of kitchen towel rolls flattened and folded
double as over gloves!)

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:32 pm
From: "nemo"

"nemo" <nemo@naughtylass.wet> wrote in message
news:HLwpi.9009$%v3.7617@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
> "Sparrow" <funnybunnyfive@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1185200630.051628.143180@m3g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> > Some ideas for saving money:
> >

http://home.comcast.net/~plutarch/frugal-philly.html
> >
>
> It says:
>
> 'Hey, turn on Javascript!'
>
> Bleedin cheek!
>
> I say: Coillons!! I care about the security of my PC.
>
> (It's Middle English for b*ll*cks and therefore classical, and therefore
not
> rude! :o)
>
> cheap Nemo!
>
> (I *still* use the insides of kitchen towel rolls flattened and folded
> double as over gloves!)
>
That's OVEN gloves. Damned keyboatd!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Handbags and wallets
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c25bda08c395fefe?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:27 pm
From: "nemo"

MADE BY CHILDREN WORKING 20 HOURS A DAY IN SWEATSHOPS
NO DOUBT AND DYING IN THEIR TEENS THROUGH BREATHING THE FUMES FROM THE
POLYURETHANE ADHESIVE!!

BASTARDS!

"bestreplica99" <leeblanc999@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1185178790.495452.296550@e16g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
> We are a Chinese supplier of replica handbags located in GuangZhou.
>
> Our website carries MIRROR IMAGE 7 STARS quality replicas. They are
> 100% to the original, even the expert can't tell them.
>
> Packing : same as the original, come with dust bag/care booklet/
> authenic card.Embossed Serial Number/Date Code Inside.
>
> Workmanship : all pattern are perfect combined , make the bag looked
> like made by one pc of leather.
>
> Best regards
>
> welcome to www.bestreplica99.com
>
> MSN: bestreplica99@hotmail.com
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal deals
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/bcac699fb70f8bf8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:02 pm
From: monkeyboo

A couple of good websites for frugal deals:

http://www.socialbuys.com
http://www.dealcatcher.com
http://www.deals.plus

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!

==============================================================================

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Google Groups: http://groups.google.com?hl=en

25 new messages in 11 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Are you in good hands?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/dee8d846fdfe1fef?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:59 am
From: "AllEmailDeletedImmediately"

"donquijote1954" <nolionnoproblem@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1185292489.305972.80320@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>I don't think so. Let's see...
>
snip

> And the SUVs who put others at a much higher risk? They don't pay
> their share either.

the type of car you drive does factor in. as does your credit score
and some sort of an insurance score based upon claims.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:53 pm
From: Al Bundy

donquijote1954 wrote:
> I don't think so. Let's see...
>
> Accident Forgiveness
> After an accident, insurance rates can rise by up to 40%. But with
> this feature, your rates won't go up just because of an accident, even
> if it is your fault...
>
> Says Allstate. And who pays for it? The ones that have had no
> accidents at all. We all do. Insurance costs an arm and a leg because
> of the high rate of accidents and because the guilty parties don't pay
> for it.
>
> And the SUVs who put others at a much higher risk? They don't pay
> their share either.
>
> In Germany those factors result in higher rates. But not here. I don't
> think we are in good hands.
>
They don't make you buy their insurance, but then you were only
looking for a reason to post your link anyway.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Proper advantages of Fruits and Food Items
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4a3a774b4c2676d6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:02 am
From: Philospher

The Proper advantages of Fruits and Food Items
http://www.foodone.blogspot.com

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:09 am
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 22:22:51 GMT, William Souden <souden@nospam.com>
wrote:

> When I am having a bad week I go to the local butcher and treat myself
>to a nice T-bone, always well under $10.

Underdog, is that you?

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:09 am
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 08:09:38 -0700, Dennis <dgw80@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 16:30:50 -0700, Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG
><Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG> wrote:
>
>>In article <%cSmi.22234$RX.16779@newssvr11.news.prodigy.net>,
>>souden@nospam.com says...
>>> Two things for my self. The cost of the first is almost
>>> infinitesimal. I use a fresh towel each day when I shower . If I go out
>>> in the evening I use two towels that day.
>>
>>
>>I do that with pillow cases.
>
>Do they get you as dry as a towel?
>
>Dennis (evil)

I thought they were wearing them.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:38 am
From: Seerialmom

On Jul 16, 3:22 pm, William Souden <sou...@nospam.com> wrote:
> Two things for my self. The cost of the first is almost
> infinitesimal. I use a fresh towel each day when I shower . If I go out
> in the evening I use two towels that day.
>
> When I am having a bad week I go to the local butcher and treat myself
> to a nice T-bone, always well under $10.

Isn't "frugal luxury" an oxymoron?

But if you want to know about non-frugal treats that I partake in
(after being frugally hypervigilant) in, here's my "go-to's":

Turtles...not the aquatic kind but the chocolate/caramel/pecan
convection featured on "Everybody Hates Chris". Usually able to snag
these for a good price after a holiday (Christmas and Valentines day
mostly).

AYCE Chinese buffet for Sunday lunch while out and about.

I have been known to buy the latest gadget just because it's too cool
to pass up....but it's infrequent. Example: Go-Video VCR/DVR combo
when it first came out. Loved the fact it took up the space of a
VCR. Didn't love the fact that I never had a DVR before so though the
skipping I had with it was due to "rental disks". Got it fixed one
month before warranty was up. The other non-frugal but worth it buy
was the Dyson when it first came out here.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I am thinking of starting a business making custom t-shirts and ties
featuring my poetry
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ad8edf0142f367c8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:31 am
From: "Bill"

I don't recall seeing anyone wearing T-shirts with poetry around here.

Around here, those who buy T-shits which say something, are mostly young
males. They buy shirts which make them look more macho, are anti-authority,
are obscene/vulgar, or give them a particular "image".

Something like...

"Sworn to fun, loyal to none!"
"Stud"
"No Fear"
Etc.

<artworks4women@gmail.com> wrote in message
> Looking for advice, honest critique....I am a writer, essayist
> mostly,
> but really my blood is prose.
> But I am an apostle of sorts, and want to heard. Is poetry a vehicle
> anymore for ideas?
>
> I write haikus too and my friend is a painter. We have a cafe press
> store, a blog and lost of ideas.
>
> Do people want unique artworks, or is that extravagant. I am cheap
> myself, but do buy a piece of art a year as a rule, usually under
> $500. Is art a feasible way to make a living?
>
>
> ford free friday prose (this is the free day at the art museum)
>
>
> discovered some today
> resting nudes and
> lost Polish shepherds
> imprinted on my mind
> somewhere branching
> over dendrites
> and drying
> in between those spaces
> interstices
> Lonnie Holly
> called potentialities
> but he's on the outside
> looking in
> how will I use them for I went shopping today
> came here
> to reclaim
> returned to exchange
> you for me
> lies for truths
> tested my reactions
> to the litmus/rice paper
> in frames
> looked across the rooms
> let my eye
> catch watch
> in this see to sea
> wall to wall
> and land here
> on a cement pad
> patio
> reminiscent of Frieda Kahlo's
> home with a Midwestern sky
> and tourists belying the
> state
> writing like Jackson Pollack
> reeling from the scene
> today I went postmodern
> my words scream
>
>
> --
> ArtWorks4Women
> http://artworks4women.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Introducing a new blog/ new venture/a space for exploration and
> celebration.
> Narcissists are predators, psychophagic-meaning they eat your soul.
>
>
> This is a joint project to reclaim ourselves through our art.
>
>
> Our personal sites:
> Luba's art
> http://picasaweb.google.com/lubaborun/
> Laurel's words
> http://vox-vocis-viscus-verbiage.blogspot.com/
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal pre-paid funeral expenses?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ce3b2b4cec57072f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 9:35 am
From: Dennis

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:17:36 -0700, "the_verminator@comcast.net"
<the_verminator@comcast.net> wrote:

>The most frugal thing is to donate your body to science.

Much more frugal to sell it!

Here is a website that calculates how much your corpse might be worth:

http://mingle2.com/cadaver-calculator

(Note: I am not selling anything. The website in the link might be,
but it is easy enough to ignore. I am not affiliated with them in any
way, yada-yada-yada.)

Dennis (evil)
--
"There is a fine line between participation and mockery" - Wally

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:24 pm
From: Tisha

CHECK OUT (NO PUN INTENDED) THIS WEBSITE:

http://www.medcure.org/

THIS IS WHERE I'M REGISTERED. WHEN I DIE, THERE'S ONLY GOING TO BE
ONE PHONE CALL THAT MY FAMILY WILL HAVE TO MAKE. I OPTED FOR THE NO
RETURN OF ASHES, SO HERE TODAY, GONE TOMORROW!!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: NICEOFFERS.COM
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f7dd93de9e36e587?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 10:07 am
From: Duke

; We are an online database of special offers and deals. The offers
and deals are searchable and organized so they can be found quickly
and easily. We save consumers valuable time (no need to search through
magazines and newspapers). And, of course, NOC saves them money when
they use the coupons. Another benefit is that we will have many
exclusive deals available ONLY from NOC. http://www.moreinfo247.com/9374280/NOCM

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Watch Free Satellite TV on your PC or Laptop

http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c33e88b9fb059ec4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 10:16 am
From: Camron S

SATELLITE TV for PC - Amazing Software which Instantly Turns your
Computer into a Super TV!

Get over 3000 Stations.

Watch all your favorite shows on your Computer!

Save 1000's of $$$ over many years on cable and satellite bills.

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Know More About It: http://tvonpc.xt.cx

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Car batteries: Walmart any good?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a7caa1bfb7945071?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 10:37 am
From: E Z Peaces

Don Klipstein wrote:
> In article <y%cpi.40559$Um6.24338@newssvr12.news.prodigy.net>, Lee K wrote:
>> <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
>> news:09v9a39nhv0s48s6hn6vvcs5qjk137un4i@4ax.com...
>>> ranck@vt.edu wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Car batteries are like personal computers. They are
>>>> commondities and one is pretty much the same as another
>>>> if they have the same CCA and AmpHour specs. There are
>>>> really only 2 or 3 companies that actually make lead-acid
>>>> batteries and the technology is pretty much as mature
>>>> as it gets.
>>> Understood. It says the Exide made the Walmart battery
>>> I bought. Well Exide distributed it anyway
>>>
>>>> I know there will be a bunch of people in here claiming
>>>> this brand or that is far superior. I don't buy it. They
>>>> all last about 5 or 6 years, with some exceptions, and
>>>> the cheapest you can buy (assuming same specs) will work
>>>> the same and last as long as the most expensive.
>>> I cant seem to get any more than 3 years out of a
>>> battery now days!
>> I got a strange one. I bought my 97 Ranger new in June '97. The original
>> battery is still in use in the truck today, after 10 winters of use in
>> Central Connecticut. Had to replace the clamp on the Neg terminal a couple
>> of weeks ago, though. I should replace it, but at this point I just want to
>> see how long it will last.
>
> It is summer heat that ages batteries, and winter cold that reveals
> weakness of batteries by impairing them but doing the least actual damage.
>
> I expect that batteries last longer in places with cool summers and mild
> winters, such as Pacific Coast from SF to Juneau. Maybe they do better in
> Pacific Coast farther south such as Santa Cruz or San Diego where they
> stay warmer but avoid most outright hot conditions that do a lot of the
> aging trouble.
> They may age faster but avoid age-revealing winter conditions until they
> are really badly aged in Key West, where winters are warm but alltime
> summer high temp. is only 96 degrees F last time I heard.
>
> - Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

In Japan, battery failure is the most common complaint of new-car
owners. A German auto manufacturer checked 400 batteries returned under
warranty. Half were okay.

The problem is stratification of the electrolyte. The acid tends to
settle. Then it won't give good starting performance and charging will
be slow. Sulfation and corrosion happen faster when the electrolyte is
stratified.

If the battery in Connecticut has lasted ten years, it was probably kept
fully charged, which reduces stratification. Maybe roads were bumpy
enough to slosh the electrolyte.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 10:45 am
From: Anthony Matonak

E Z Peaces wrote:
...
> In Japan, battery failure is the most common complaint of new-car
> owners. A German auto manufacturer checked 400 batteries returned under
> warranty. Half were okay.
>
> The problem is stratification of the electrolyte. The acid tends to
> settle. Then it won't give good starting performance and charging will
> be slow. Sulfation and corrosion happen faster when the electrolyte is
> stratified.
>
> If the battery in Connecticut has lasted ten years, it was probably kept
> fully charged, which reduces stratification. Maybe roads were bumpy
> enough to slosh the electrolyte.

This difference may have been simply how often the vehicles were used
and the distances driven. Japan has major traffic congestion problems
so driving a car might be an occasional luxury and then only for short
distances.

Anthony

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:17 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Jul 23, 11:18 am, ra...@vt.edu wrote:
> m...@privacy.net wrote:
> > Anyway..... I bought a replacement battery from
> > Walmart cause it was an emergency (no time to shop
> > around).
> > Are their batteries any good?
> > What brand/model car battery IS good?
>
> Car batteries are like personal computers. They are
> commondities and one is pretty much the same as another
> if they have the same CCA and AmpHour specs. There are
> really only 2 or 3 companies that actually make lead-acid
> batteries and the technology is pretty much as mature
> as it gets.
>
> I know there will be a bunch of people in here claiming
> this brand or that is far superior. I don't buy it. They
> all last about 5 or 6 years, with some exceptions, and
> the cheapest you can buy (assuming same specs) will work
> the same and last as long as the most expensive.
>
> Just my opinion, of course.
>
> Bill Ranck
> Blacksburg, Va.

I tend to agree with your opinion as well. I also suspect that many
of the batteries that are store branded are all from the same
manufacturer. When the security guy on my job killed my car battery
(and fried the fuse, too) by jumping it backwards I walked to the
local Kragen and bought the cheapest one that fit the car...no name
brand. It was still working fine when I traded the car in 4 years
later.

But...the warranty for a Sears Diehard vs a generic may be
considerably different.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:28 pm
From: E Z Peaces

Anthony Matonak wrote:
> E Z Peaces wrote:
> ...
>> In Japan, battery failure is the most common complaint of new-car
>> owners. A German auto manufacturer checked 400 batteries returned
>> under warranty. Half were okay.
>>
>> The problem is stratification of the electrolyte. The acid tends to
>> settle. Then it won't give good starting performance and charging
>> will be slow. Sulfation and corrosion happen faster when the
>> electrolyte is stratified.
>>
>> If the battery in Connecticut has lasted ten years, it was probably
>> kept fully charged, which reduces stratification. Maybe roads were
>> bumpy enough to slosh the electrolyte.
>
> This difference may have been simply how often the vehicles were used
> and the distances driven. Japan has major traffic congestion problems
> so driving a car might be an occasional luxury and then only for short
> distances.
>
> Anthony

It is worse in vehicles that aren't driven much. The average is about
60 miles a week (100 km) in Japan. The Japanese and Germans are big on
quality control. That's why they have figures pointing to
stratification. If it can be severe enough to cause some fairly new
cars not to start, I think it may speed sulfation and corrosion that
shorten battery life in many other cars.

It also seems to happen more in luxury cars. It's possible that luxury
brands are just more aware of the problem, but if it is indeed worse, it
may be because luxury cars have less vibration and bumping to stir the
electrolyte.

Ever since the lead-acid battery was invented, it has been good
maintenance to leave it on a charger 24 hours or more once a month. It
takes a long charge to convert all the lead sulfate to lead or lead
oxide. If it's not converted it eventually hardens, reducing the useful
plate area. It tends to flake off when you start the car, accumulating
at the bottom of the cell. If the crud rises to the bottom of the
plates, I think it can cause the cell to discharge.

By doing this, I get years more than a battery's advertised life. If a
vehicle has been sitting several days, it may charge faster after an
hour than when I first turn on the charger. That may be evidence that a
long charge can stir up the electrolyte. Apparently stirring the
electrolyte slows the corrosion that wrecks batteries in hot climates.

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 11:17 am
From: bob@earthlink.net (bob)

Decentralized power such as this, could be a threat to the fear-based
boys who run the show.

http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php
"NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive,
Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
NEWARK, July 18, 2007
Researchers at New Jersey Institute of Technology (NJIT) have
developed an inexpensive solar cell that can be painted or printed on
flexible plastic sheets. The process is simple, said lead researcher
and author Somenath Mitra, PhD, professor and acting chair of NJIT's
Department of Chemistry and Environmental Sciences. Someday homeowners
will even be able to print sheets of these solar cells with
inexpensive home-based inkjet printers. Consumers can then slap the
finished product on a wall, roof or billboard to create their own
power stations." ...

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 12:42 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

bob <bob@earthlink.net> wrote

> Decentralized power such as this, could be a
> threat to the fear-based boys who run the show.

Not a chance, you watch.

And there are no 'fear-based boys who run the show' either.

> http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php
> "NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive,
> Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
> NEWARK, July 18, 2007

Just another in a VERY long line of claims like this, not one of which has
EVER turned out to be anything like as important as they claim they are.

> Researchers at New Jersey Institute of Technology (NJIT) have
> developed an inexpensive solar cell that can be painted or printed on
> flexible plastic sheets. The process is simple, said lead researcher
> and author Somenath Mitra, PhD, professor and acting chair of NJIT's
> Department of Chemistry and Environmental Sciences.

Corse that's a stunningly impeccible source, eh ?

> Someday homeowners will even be able to print sheets of
> these solar cells with inexpensive home-based inkjet printers.

Nope.

> Consumers can then slap the finished product on a wall,
> roof or billboard to create their own power stations." ...

Nope. Just another stupid pig ignorant claim.

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:11 pm
From: "Don K"

"bob" <bob@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:46a63952.823484@news.east.earthlink.net...
> Decentralized power such as this, could be a threat to the fear-based
> boys who run the show.

Nice job of turning a scientific anouncement into a political statement.

> http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php
> "NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive,
> Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels

Ooh, an inexpensive process has been developed to use paint-on solar
panels made from single wall carbon nanotubes. One day homeowners
will be able to use an inexpensive inkjet printer to print their own
solar cells.

Great!
Let's check the price of these inexpensive carbon nanotubes...
Here's some at Cheap Tubes Inc:
Short Single Walled Carbon Nanotubes 90wt% -- $250 per gram
http://www.cheaptubesinc.com/pricelist. htm?gclid=CJnqsKv6wI0CFSQsFQod1yayMA

It's always something. They develop a process using an inexpensive printer,
but they screw you with the cost of the ink!

Don

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:14 pm
From: Boston Blackie (PA Robert Black, or is it the other way 'round?)

On 2007-07-24 14:42:45 -0500, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> said:

> bob <bob@earthlink.net> wrote
>
>> Decentralized power such as this, could be a
>> threat to the fear-based boys who run the show.
>
> Not a chance, you watch.
>
> And there are no 'fear-based boys who run the show' either.
>
>> http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php
>> "NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive,
>> Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
>> NEWARK, July 18, 2007
>
> Just another in a VERY long line of claims like this, not one of which has
> EVER turned out to be anything like as important as they claim they are.
>
>> Researchers at New Jersey Institute of Technology (NJIT) have
>> developed an inexpensive solar cell that can be painted or printed on
>> flexible plastic sheets. The process is simple, said lead researcher
>> and author Somenath Mitra, PhD, professor and acting chair of NJIT's
>> Department of Chemistry and Environmental Sciences.
>
> Corse that's a stunningly impeccible source, eh ?
>
>> Someday homeowners will even be able to print sheets of
>> these solar cells with inexpensive home-based inkjet printers.
>
> Nope.
>
>> Consumers can then slap the finished product on a wall,
>> roof or billboard to create their own power stations." ...
>
> Nope. Just another stupid pig ignorant claim.

What, exactly, are your technical qualifications, Rod Speed? Are you a
Certified Aircraft Repair Technician?

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:19 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Boston Blackie (PA Robert Black, or is it the other way 'round?) <bblackie@mail.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>> bob <bob@earthlink.net> wrote

>>> Decentralized power such as this, could be a
>>> threat to the fear-based boys who run the show.

>> Not a chance, you watch.

>> And there are no 'fear-based boys who run the show' either.

>>> http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php
>>> "NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive,
>>> Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
>>> NEWARK, July 18, 2007

>> Just another in a VERY long line of claims like this, not one of which has
>>> EVER turned out to be anything like as important as they claim they are.

>>> Researchers at New Jersey Institute of Technology (NJIT) have
>>> developed an inexpensive solar cell that can be painted or printed
>>> on flexible plastic sheets. The process is simple, said lead
>>> researcher and author Somenath Mitra, PhD, professor and acting
>>> chair of NJIT's Department of Chemistry and Environmental Sciences.

>> Corse that's a stunningly impeccible source, eh ?

>>> Someday homeowners will even be able to print sheets of
>>> these solar cells with inexpensive home-based inkjet printers.

>> Nope.

>>> Consumers can then slap the finished product on a wall,
>>> roof or billboard to create their own power stations." ...

>> Nope. Just another stupid pig ignorant claim.

> What, exactly, are your technical qualifications, Rod Speed?

What are yours, gutless ?

> Are you a Certified Aircraft Repair Technician?

Irrelevant.

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:35 pm
From: No 33 Secretary

Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote in
news:3nuhn4-7t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net:

> [snips]
>
> On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 21:22:06 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:
>
>>> That's nice. Still doesn't support the contention made.
>>> Shall we assume you cannot, and therefore were, in fact,
>>> simply lying?
>>>
>> Or perhaps you just want to suck my dick again.
>
> Again? Never did it once, so "again" wouldn't apply.

Heh.

> 'Sides,
> being straight and male, the notion doesn't interest me
> overmuch, but I wish you the best of luck in finding a willing
> partner.
>
Then you should stop begging in a public forum.

--
"If he does that shit again I'm going to tie his ass hairs together
and kick him in the shin."

Terry Austin

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:23 pm
From: Kelsey Bjarnason

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 20:35:24 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:

> Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:3nuhn4-7t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net:
>
>> [snips]
>>
>> On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 21:22:06 +0000, No 33 Secretary wrote:
>>
>>>> That's nice. Still doesn't support the contention made.
>>>> Shall we assume you cannot, and therefore were, in fact,
>>>> simply lying?
>>>>
>>> Or perhaps you just want to suck my dick again.
>>
>> Again? Never did it once, so "again" wouldn't apply.
>
> Heh.
>
>> 'Sides,
>> being straight and male, the notion doesn't interest me
>> overmuch, but I wish you the best of luck in finding a willing
>> partner.
>>
> Then you should stop begging in a public forum.

Umm... it was you who brought up the bit about me sucking your dick, not
I; if there's someone around here looking for such activities, logic would
suggest it was you, not I.

'Course, that said, if the best you have to offer is aspersions of
homosexuality, chances are you wouldn't be a very interesting partner even
for someone of the appropriate gender and orientation.

--
"Hardly, since, as far as I know Dr. Duane T. Gish, has not
'disavowed' those Paluxy Man tracks! It is evolutionists who have been
desperately trying to disavow them!" -- Liar Appleton

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:09 pm
From: "Steve Spence"

When power is in short supply, and winter provides sufficient ice, a ice
house is an appropriate solution. We have built in-basement ice houses, and
collected ice from the pond in winter. The ice stays with us through
October. Outdoor temps rarely exceed 90F here in upstate NY.

--
Steve Spence
Director, Green-Trust
http://www.green-trust.org
http://www.green-trust.org/bookshop/

"Morris Dovey" <mrdovey@iedu.com> wrote in message
news:46a65c74$0$495$815e3792@news.qwest.net...
> dances_with_barkadas@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> | how expensive would electricity have to become, before entrepreneurs
> | would devote time to becoming skilled at doing turn-key
> | installations of well-thought-out, conveniently-useable ice houses
> | in private homes, the way that there's a category of specialists
> | who do solar-hot-water installs?
>
> Judging by the speed with which already paid-for iceboxes were
> replaced with expensive compressor refrigerators, I think it'd need to
> get pretty expensive.
>
> There are other solutions available beside those you mentioned,
> including some solar refrigeration possibilities using solar-stirling
> lash-ups. I'm (slowly) working toward one such implementation -
> described at the link below...
>
> --
> Morris Dovey
> DeSoto Solar
> DeSoto, Iowa USA
> http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Stirling/
>
>

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:23 pm
From: "Morris Dovey"

Steve Spence wrote:
| When power is in short supply, and winter provides sufficient ice,
| a ice house is an appropriate solution. We have built in-basement
| ice houses, and collected ice from the pond in winter. The ice
| stays with us through October. Outdoor temps rarely exceed 90F here
| in upstate NY.

I'm not questioning the technical possibility. I'd suggest discussing
this issue with your wife/mother/grandmother before allowing yourself
to become too enthusiastic about this particular choice.

I remember iceboxes (in small town Michigan) and would assure you that
they weren't abandoned for reasons that had anything to do (directly)
with the technology involved.

I also remember that there weren't any frozen foods in the grocery
store.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:06 pm
From: "Morris Dovey"

dances_with_barkadas@yahoo.com wrote:

| how expensive would electricity have to become, before entrepreneurs
| would devote time to becoming skilled at doing turn-key
| installations of well-thought-out, conveniently-useable ice houses
| in private homes, the way that there's a category of specialists
| who do solar-hot-water installs?

Judging by the speed with which already paid-for iceboxes were
replaced with expensive compressor refrigerators, I think it'd need to
get pretty expensive.

There are other solutions available beside those you mentioned,
including some solar refrigeration possibilities using solar-stirling
lash-ups. I'm (slowly) working toward one such implementation -
described at the link below...

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Stirling/

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25 new messages in 18 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Anybody using t-mobile's hotspot at home service?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/42ba5c276f6eb553?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 23 2007 9:28 pm
From: Logan Shaw

Preacher wrote:
> I'm wondering how well this works -- anyone got a perosnal experience?

I just got it Saturday. It seems to work pretty well so far. Sound
quality seems pretty good, not as good as a landline, but better than
a cell phone by a lot. It's hard to be 100% sure because I've only
used it for maybe 2 hours so far and all the calls I've made have been
to cell phones. I've heard a few drop-outs but couldn't tell if those
were because of the other person's cell or what.

I did try one hand-off from wi-fi to GSM, and it worked fine. In fact,
I think I know when it did the hand off (there was a very slight
interruption in service) but I'm not really positive that I do know.

With wi-fi networks, I've noticed that if it has consistently 2 bars of
signal (out of 4) or less, it will often fall back to the GSM mode.
The wi-fi router they gave me covers my apartment well enough that so
far it never needs to fall back to GSM within my apartment, even though
the wi-fi access point is at the far corner of the apartment.

An unexpected side benefit is that the phone fills the role of one of
those devices you carry around to scan for wi-fi networks. I basically
always have my phone with me, so wherever I am, I can check network
availability for future reference (should I ever splurge and buy a
laptop).

I was already a T-Mobile customer but my contract had ended several
months ago. For starting up a new 2-year contract, this is what I
got:

(1) Nokia 6086 phone for $50 after discounts.
(2) Linksys WRT54G-TM wi-fi router for free after rebate.
(3) Unlimited wi-fi calling time for $10/month.
(4) 1000 any-time minutes per month for $40/month.

I am going to wait for a week or so, and if I see no obvious problems,
I'm going to proceed with my plan and cancel my land line. I've never
not had a land line before, but $50/month for unlimited calling at home
*and* 1000 minutes peak time (plus unlimited nights and weekend) when
not at home seems like it should cover my needs pretty well.

I may post an update in a week or two if I have any further insights
or interesting experiences. :-)

- Logan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: GET FREE Satellite TV on your PC - Download Now!

http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/91f895116d7968b0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 23 2007 9:35 pm
From: lewis

SATELLITE TV for PC - Amazing Software which Instantly Turns your
Computer into a Super TV!

Get over 3000 Stations.

Watch all your favorite shows on your Computer!

Save 1000's of $$$ over many years on cable and satellite bills.

INSTANT DOWNLOAD

Know More About It: http://tvonpc.xt.cx

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 23 2007 9:35 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)

In article <y%cpi.40559$Um6.24338@newssvr12.news.prodigy.net>, Lee K wrote:
>
><me@privacy.net> wrote in message
>news:09v9a39nhv0s48s6hn6vvcs5qjk137un4i@4ax.com...
>> ranck@vt.edu wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Car batteries are like personal computers. They are
>>>commondities and one is pretty much the same as another
>>>if they have the same CCA and AmpHour specs. There are
>>>really only 2 or 3 companies that actually make lead-acid
>>>batteries and the technology is pretty much as mature
>>>as it gets.
>>
>> Understood. It says the Exide made the Walmart battery
>> I bought. Well Exide distributed it anyway
>>
>>>I know there will be a bunch of people in here claiming
>>>this brand or that is far superior. I don't buy it. They
>>>all last about 5 or 6 years, with some exceptions, and
>>>the cheapest you can buy (assuming same specs) will work
>>>the same and last as long as the most expensive.
>>
>> I cant seem to get any more than 3 years out of a
>> battery now days!
>
>I got a strange one. I bought my 97 Ranger new in June '97. The original
>battery is still in use in the truck today, after 10 winters of use in
>Central Connecticut. Had to replace the clamp on the Neg terminal a couple
>of weeks ago, though. I should replace it, but at this point I just want to
>see how long it will last.

It is summer heat that ages batteries, and winter cold that reveals
weakness of batteries by impairing them but doing the least actual damage.

I expect that batteries last longer in places with cool summers and mild
winters, such as Pacific Coast from SF to Juneau. Maybe they do better in
Pacific Coast farther south such as Santa Cruz or San Diego where they
stay warmer but avoid most outright hot conditions that do a lot of the
aging trouble.
They may age faster but avoid age-revealing winter conditions until they
are really badly aged in Key West, where winters are warm but alltime
summer high temp. is only 96 degrees F last time I heard.

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:14 am
From: me@privacy.net

Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG
<Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG> wrote:

>I suggest getting it tested any time you have to replace the
>battery.

Did that before I went and bought the battery

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:15 am
From: me@privacy.net

don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein) wrote:

> It is summer heat that ages batteries, and winter cold that reveals
>weakness of batteries by impairing them but doing the least actual damage.

Interesting

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 23 2007 10:05 pm
From: Tim Campbell

On Jul 15, 10:09 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Yeah, saw that, but an RV or trailer makes a lot more sense because its easier to move too.- Hide quoted text -
>
If ya don't mind all that plastic and the formaldahyde vapors...

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 23 2007 10:10 pm
From: Tim Campbell

I wonder how often she has to move it to avoid property taxes...

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 2:04 am
From: Myal

Tim Campbell wrote:
> On Jul 15, 10:09 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Yeah, saw that, but an RV or trailer makes a lot more sense because its easier to move too.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>
> If ya don't mind all that plastic and the formaldahyde vapors...
>
>
Get a few years old one that dont have the smells anymore ... if not
avoiding the problem it certainly lessens it

==============================================================================
TOPIC: old bmw
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4a026509c40d50dd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 12:00 am
From: mastonogtg@gmail.com

Dear All,

I would like posting tips to mantaint old bmw at http://www.ourcar-online.com,
if you have any time to help me please send your traditional recipe to
this email.
I would like to thank for all of you before.

Best regard,

Tono

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Seduction Guide for Men only!

http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1f9ca3e0fa2531fa?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 12:21 am
From: "yanarai20@gmail.com"

I Seduced 3 Beautiful Women This Week!

DID YOU ???

Learn All You Need To Know On How To PICK UP and SEDUCE any Women!

Know More About it at http://superdate.xt.cx

==============================================================================
TOPIC: !!!!$!$!$!$!$!$!FREE MONEY NO CATCH!$!$!$!$!$!$!$!!!!!!!!!!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/60bf091f5329cdbc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 1:17 am
From: basketballjerms07@yahoo.com

The other day, I recieved this email. Now, I am a college
student,
and
I am not at all weathly. So, I decided to give this a whirl... Good
luck to you:)

"A little while back, I was reading my junk E-Mail just like you are
no,
and came across an E-Mail similar to this that said you could make
thousands of dollars within weeks with only an initial investment of
$5.00! So, I thought, 'Yeah, right, this must be a scam!, like most
of
us, but I was curious, like most of us, so I kept reading. Anyway,
it
said that you send $1.00 to each of the 5 names listed in the
article.
You then place your own name and addresses in the bottom of the list
at
#5 and send an E-Mail to at least 200 news groups. (There are
thousands). No catch, that was it. So, after thinking about it, and
talking to a few people first, I thought about trying it. I figured
what have I got to lose except 5 stamps and $5.00, right? Like most
of
us, I was a little skeptical and a little worried about the legal
aspects of it all. So, I checked it out with the U.S. Post Office
(1-800-725-2161) and they confirmed that it is indeed legal! Then, I
invested the measly $5.00... Well, GUESS WHAT! With in 7 days, I
started getting money in the mail. I was shocked! I still figured
it
would end soon, and didn't give it another thought. But, the money
just
continued coming in. In my first week, I made about $20-$30. By the
end of the second week, I had made a total of over $1,000! In the
third
week, I had over $10,000 and it's still growing! This is now my
fourth
week, and I have made a total of just over $42,000!!!! And it's
still
coming in!!! It's certainly worth $5.00 and 5 stamps. I spent more
that that on the lottery! Let me tell you how this works and most
importantly, WHY IT WORKS. Also, make sure you print a copy of this
article now, so you can get the info you need off of it as you need
it.
The process is very simple and consists of 3 easy steps:

STEP 1: Get 5 separate pieces of paper and write the following on
each
piece of paper: "PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST" Now get 5
$1.00
bills and place ONE inside of EACH of the 5 pieces of paper so the
bill
will not be seen through the envelope to prevent thievery. Next,
place
one paper in each of the 5 envelopes and seal them. You should now
have
5 sealed envelopes, each with a piece of paper stating the above
phrase
and a $1.00 bill. What you are doing is creating a service by this.
THIS IS PERFECTLY LEGAL! Mail the 5 envelopes to the following
addresses:

1. Donald Foulk
216 N. Myers
Bryan, OH 43506

2. Scott Hilterbran
222 W. Pleasant St.
Hillsboro, OH 45133

3. Paul Mewes
5550 Fillmore St.
Merrillville, IN 46410

4. Scott Brkovich
2251 Sandhurst Dr.
Castle Rock, CO 80104

5. Jeremy Johnson
1907 Holloman Dr.
Port Lavaca, TX 77979

Continue to STEP 2.

STEP 2: Now take the number 1 name off of the list that you see
above,
move the other names up (5 becomes 4, 4 becomes 3, etc...), and add
YOUR
name and address as number 5 on the list.

STEP 3: Change anything you need to, but try to keep this article as
close to original as possible. Now, post your amended article to at
least 200 newssgroups. (I think there are close to 18,000) All you
need is 200, but remember, the more you post, the more money you
make!
Don't know HOW to post in the news groups? Well, do exactly the
following:

FOR NETSCAPE USERS:

1) Click on any news group, like normal. Then click on 'To News',
which is in the top left corner of the news group page. This will
bring
up a message box.

2) Fill in the SUBJECT with a flashy title, like the one I used,
something to catch the eye!

3) Now go to the message part of the box and retype this letter
exactly
as it is here, with the exception of your few changes. (Remember to
add
your name to number 5 and move the rest up)

4) When you're done typing in the WHOLE letter, click on 'FILE'
above
the send button. Then 'SAVE AS' DO NOT SEND YOUR ARTICLE UNTIL YOU
SAVE
IT!!!!!!!!! (So you don't have to retype this 200+ times!!:)

5) Now that you have saved the letter, go ahead and send your first
cope! (Click the 'SEND' button in the top left corner)

6) This is where you post all 200! Ok, go to ANY news group article
and click the 'TO NEWS' button again. Type in your flashy subject in
the 'SUBJECT BOX', then go to the message and place your cursor here.
Now, click on 'ATTACHMENT' which is right below the 'SUBJECT BOX'.
Click on attach file, then find your letter wherever you saved it.
Click once on your file the click 'OPEN' then click 'OK'. If you did
this right, you should see your filename in the 'ATTACHMENT BOX' and
it
will be shaded. NOW POST AWAY!!!!!

IF YOU ARE USING INTERNET EXPLORER:

It's just as easy, holding down the left mouse button, highlight this
entire article, then press the 'CTRL' key and 'C' key at the same
time
to copy this article. Then, print the article for your records to
have
the names of those you will be sending $1.00 to.

NEXT: Go to the news groups and press 'POST AN ARTICLE', type in
your
flashy subject and click the large window below. Press 'CTRL' and
'V',
and the article will appear in the message window.

BE SURE TO MAKE YOUR ADDRESS CHANGES TO THE 5 NAMES!!! Now,
re-highlight the article and re-copy it so you have the changes....
Then, all you have to do for each news group is 'CTRL' and 'V' and
press
'POST'. It's that easy! THAT'S IT! All you have to do is jump to
different news groups and post away. After you get the hang of it,
it
will take about 30 seconds for each news group! REMEMBER, THE MORE
NEWS
GROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY YOU WILL MAKE! BUT YOU HAVE TO
POST
A MINIMUM OF 200!!!!!!!!!!!

That's it! You will begin receiving money from around the world
within
days! You may eventually want to rent a P.O. Box due to the large
amount of mail you receive. If you wish to stay anonymous, you can
invent a name to us, as long as the postman will deliver it.

**JUST MAKE SURE ALL OF THE ADDRESSES ARE CORRECT!!!!!!!!!**

Now the WHY part: Out of 200 postings, say I receive only 5 replies
(a
very low example). So, then I made $5.00 with my name at #5 on the
letter. Now, each of the 5 persons who just sent me $1.00 make the
MINIMUM 200 postings, each with my name at #4, and only 5 people
respond
to each of the orginal 5. That is another $25.00 for me, now those
25
each make 200 minimum posts with my name at #3, and only 5 replies
each,
I will bring in an additional $626!! Ok, now here is the fun part.
Each of those 625 people post a MINIMUM 200 letters with my name at
#1,
and they each only receive 5 replies, that just make me $3,125!!!
With
an original investment of only $5.00!!! AMAZING!! And as I said, 5
responses is actually VERY LOW! Average is probable 20-30 letters!
So,
let's put those figures at just 15 respones per person. Here is what
you will make: At #5: $15, at #4: $225, at #3: $3,375, at #2:
$50,625, at #1: $759,375!!!!!!
When your name is no longer on the list, you just take the
latest
posting in the news groups, and send out another $5.00 to names on
the
list, putting you at #5. And start posting! The thing to remember
is,
do you realize that thousands of people over the world are joining
the
internet and reading these articles everyday, JUST LIKE YOU ARE NOW!
So
can you afford $5.00 and see if it really works? I think so...
People
have said, 'What if the plan is played out and happening when there
are
tons of new honest users and new honest people who are joining the
internet and news groups everyday and are willing to give it a try?'
Estimates are at 20,000-50,000 new users every day, with thousands of
those joining the actual internet. Remember, play FAIRLY AND
HONESTLY
and this will work. You just have to be honest. Make sure you print
this article out RIGHT NOW also. Try to keep a list of everyone that
sends you money, and always keep an eye on the news groups to make
sure
everyone is playing fairly. Remember, HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY!!!
You don't need to cheat the basic idea to make the money! GOOD LUCK
to
all and please play fairly and reap the huge rewards from this, which
is
tons of EXTRA CASH.
**BY THE WAY: If you try to deceive people by posting the
messages
with your name in the list and not sending the money to the rest of
the
people already on the list, you will NOT get as much. Someone I
talked
to knew someone who did that, and he only made about $150 and that's
after 7 or 8 weeks! Then he sent the 5 $1.00 bills, people added
them
to their lists, and in 4-5 weeks, he had over $10k. This is the
fairest
and most honest way I have ever seen to share the wealth of the world
without costing anything but our time! You also may want to buy
mailing
and e-mail lists for future dollars. PLEASE REMEMBER TO DECLARE YOUR
EXTRA INCOME!!!!!!**"

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Make money while reading, eating or doing whatever you want!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/60d534d824f02aad?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 3:56 am
From: Josh Cipans

I've found this great way to make money. You just sign up here and
click on ads. You can do it while you're reading or doing anything.
You have to open each ad for 30 seconds so you just leave it open
while you read, then open the next one straight after and keep doing
what you are doing. But make sure you sign up for a premium membership
because then you get a much wider choice of ads. The free version
isn't really worth it. I know it costs $10 but it's well worth it.
Plus if you have a premium membership you can refer people for $5
each! So get 2 of your friends to join up and you've made the money
back. How easy was that? If you can't wait to make stacks of money
then click below.

<a href=http://www.clixsense.com/?2171272> Click Here </a>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to get Low Priced Prawns for your home
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4ca68ae388752f72?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 4:23 am
From: Stella

How to get Low Priced Prawns for your home
http://www.prawnpark.blogspot.com

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TOPIC: start making money online i canshow you my income proof
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a6b0fbae3387773a?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 4:54 am
From: SFI

start making money online i canshow you my income proof after
registration just get register http://www.moreinfo247.com/9179906/free
and start making money online

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TOPIC: Close look at the LG Prada mobile phone
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b40ca5e30eac1f92?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:05 am
From: kaash

Close look at the LG Prada mobile phone
http://mobilephone-guide.blogspot.com/2007/07/shiny-media-close-look-at-lg-prada.html

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TOPIC: Close look at the Sexy LG Prada mobile phone
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6120e707b3a8b3a9?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:10 am
From: kaash

Close look at the LG Prada mobile phone
http://mobilephone-guide.blogspot.com/2007/07/shiny-media-close-look-at-lg-prada.html

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:39 am
From: "Don K"

<artworks4women@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1185219694.265222.194910@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Looking for advice, honest critique....I am a writer, essayist
> mostly,
> but really my blood is prose.
> But I am an apostle of sorts, and want to heard. Is poetry a vehicle
> anymore for ideas?

Don't even think about it until people start making unsolicited offers
to actually buy your stuff.

Don

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 6:11 am
From: George Grapman

Don K wrote:
> <artworks4women@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1185219694.265222.194910@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>> Looking for advice, honest critique....I am a writer, essayist
>> mostly,
>> but really my blood is prose.
>> But I am an apostle of sorts, and want to heard. Is poetry a vehicle
>> anymore for ideas?
>
>
> Don't even think about it until people start making unsolicited offers
> to actually buy your stuff.
>
> Don
>
>
"....and want to heard"? He must be a great essayist.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 6:20 am
From: Just A User

artworks4women@gmail.com wrote:
> Looking for advice, honest critique

Most small businesses fail.

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TOPIC: Ooma Offers Free Long Distance Forever
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/74e83ed1a5238d99?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 5:48 am
From: George

Ablang wrote:
> Ooma Offers Free Long Distance Forever
> The free service also comes with a network-based message box that can
> deliver voicemail via e-mail attachments and that can be checked via
> the Web.
> Tim Greene, Network World
> Monday, July 23, 2007 8:00 AM PDT
>
> http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,134942/article.html?tk=nl_dnxnws
>
> VOIP startup Ooma offers free domestic long-distance phone service
> forever if you buy an Ooma appliance for $399.
>

So the question would be how much faith do you have to prepay the $399
given the usual result for such startups? (Especially since others in
the VoIP space that looked more promising than this such as Voicestick
have failed)

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 7:10 am
From: bearclaw@cruller.invalid

In article <hv9fn4-4t5.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>,
Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote:

> I expect *you* as the *parent* to shut the kid up,
> leave him at home, or get out.

Personally, I don't have kids. But if I ever met someone with an
attitude like yours in a public place, I would do everything I could
think of to drive you smack out of your mind, including encouraging any
nearby kids to scream, squall, run around and generally rain on your
parade. I find upsetting people like you highly entertaining. It even
becomes a game sometimes to see who leaves in a big huff first.

Heh. And some in here think YOU are anti-social.

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TOPIC: Vitamin C useless in combatting colds
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/498d68c0ba1d2e0f?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:00 am
From: "Mark K. Bilbo"

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 09:58:01 +1000, wwrrtt wrote:

> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote:
>> On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 04:25:47 +1000, 345 wrote:
>>
>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>> Rod Speed wrote
>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>> Rod Speed wrote
>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>>>> Rod Speed wrote
>>>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>>>>>> Rod Speed wrote
>>>>>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>> Rod Speed wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Michael Gray wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo <gmail@com.mkbilbo> wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Geoff wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark K. Bilbo wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Michael Gray wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wilson <wilson@universal.com> wrote
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news/2007/07/18/nvit118.xml
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vitamin C useless in combatting colds
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a.. Taking vitamin C supplements to prevent a cold is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a waste of time and money, say researchers. A review
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of 30 studies involving more than 11,000 people found
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that taking the tablets had no effect on the average
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> person.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But Echinacia seems to be beneficial...
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Actually, that one was debunked some time ago...
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What about those zinc tabs like Cold-Eze?
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's all marketing fluff.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Are you going to tell the publishers of "The Lancet"??
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Zinc may have some effectiveness but I haven't seen a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> medical expert yet that hasn't pointed out that obtaining
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> vitamens via vegetables is immensely better than any pill.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Further, much of what's on the market is dreck. At least in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the US, the suppliment market is totally unregulated and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you can put pretty much anything into a bottle and call it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything you want.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The bottom line being your mother was right, eat your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> veggies...
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pity that doing that hasnt been shown to PREVENT colds.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vegetarians still get colds.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, other than being irrelevant,
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Nope, prevention of colds is clearly what was being discussed.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yeah that explains that Subject line up there huh?
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Irrelevant to what the cited article was clearly about.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dingleberry, the topic is whatever the people in the thread are
>>>>>>>> talking about.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Wrong, as always.
>>>>>
>>>>>> This from the guy who is screaming about vitamen C not preventing
>>>>>> colds when we were talking about zinc.
>>>>>
>>>>> You're lying, as always.
>>>>>
>>>>>> And whether supplimentation is an effective way to otbain vitamens
>>>>>> to begin with.
>>>>>
>>>>> You're lying, as always.
>>>>>
>>>>>> But, well, don't let *that* stop you...
>>>>>
>>>>> None of your shit ever does.
>>>
>>>> Okay, fruit cup, the killfile is that way...
>>>
>>> Fat lot of good that will do you, fuckwit.
>>
>> yawn.
>>
>> <plonk>
>
> Fat lot of good that will do you, fuckwit.

Oh great, a nym shitter.

--
Mark K. Bilbo a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
------------------------------------------------------------
"Warned you we tried! Listen you did not! Now screwed
we will all be!"

http://www.sequentialpictures.com/moviestarwarsepisode3.html

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:09 am
From: Dennis

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 16:30:50 -0700, Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG
<Usenet2007@THE-DOMAIN-IN.SIG> wrote:

>In article <%cSmi.22234$RX.16779@newssvr11.news.prodigy.net>,
>souden@nospam.com says...
>> Two things for my self. The cost of the first is almost
>> infinitesimal. I use a fresh towel each day when I shower . If I go out
>> in the evening I use two towels that day.
>
>
>I do that with pillow cases.

Do they get you as dry as a towel?

Dennis (evil)
--
"There is a fine line between participation and mockery" - Wally

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jul 24 2007 8:54 am
From: donquijote1954

I don't think so. Let's see...

Accident Forgiveness
After an accident, insurance rates can rise by up to 40%. But with
this feature, your rates won't go up just because of an accident, even
if it is your fault...

Says Allstate. And who pays for it? The ones that have had no
accidents at all. We all do. Insurance costs an arm and a leg because
of the high rate of accidents and because the guilty parties don't pay
for it.

And the SUVs who put others at a much higher risk? They don't pay
their share either.

In Germany those factors result in higher rates. But not here. I don't
think we are in good hands.

WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE
(consumer beware of the hungry lion)
http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote

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