Frugal Living: Jan 5, 2008

Saturday, January 5, 2008

25 new messages in 16 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Chinese Exports Safe
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/656ddf21b6fa6b07?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:27 am
From: Bernardo Gui

On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 15:10:52 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Chinese exports safe, good quality: US official
>12:06, January 05, 2008

PaPaPeng's continuing efforts to convince Americans that Chinese
products are safe are truly inspiring. No amount of facts to the
contrary have any effect on his steadfast confidence. No amount of
reality has any effect on his fantasy.

PaPaPeng is the George W. Bush of shoddy, lead-painted,
slave-manufactured products everywhere.

Bernardo

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 11:08 am
From: "Rod Speed"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Chinese exports safe, good quality: US official
> 12:06, January 05, 2008
> http://english.people.com.cn/90001/90777/90852/6332846.html

> Chinese exports to the United States are generally safe and of good
> quality, a senior US product safety official said in Beijing on Friday.

Pity about the stuff that isnt.

> "Among people who have knowledge of products from China, as a
> result of their profession, I think there is general acceptance that the
> overwhelming majority of the products are safe and of good quality
> and good value," Richard O'Brien, director of International Programs
> and Intergovernmental Affairs under the US Consumer Product Safety
> Commission (CPSC), told a press conference.

Pity about the stuff that isnt.

We've just seen a children's cosmetic toy that has the most obscene
chemical ingredients and has in fine print, 'keep out of the reach of children'

Talk about a complete and utter obscenity.

> On the massive recalls of Chinese toys last summer in the United States due
> to excessive quantities of lead paint, O'Brien said it was a natural result of an
> extensive inspection of Chinese toys after the first case was discovered.

> "Everybody started to check if the same problem existed around themselves
> you can understand one case led to another and led to another," he said,
> adding that he was "pretty optimistic" that the problems had been resolved
> and US consumers' confidence in Chinese goods was recovering.

They shouldnt have been using lead paint in the first place, fool.

> "We almost have no toy industry in the United States. If we stop
> importing toys from China, most toy shelves in US supermarkets
> will be empty," said O'Brien, who is on a two-week visit to China.

> The CPSC has been cooperating closely with China's General
> Administration of Quality Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine
> (AQSIQ), the country's top quality watchdog.

> The CPSC greatly appreciates the Chinese government's
> efforts on product safety improvement, said O'Brien.

> "We don't have foreign partners that are so involved in cooperation
> with us as AQSIQ," he said, adding that his agency is willing to share
> its experience and lessons on product safety inspection and the
> establishment of a nationwide recall system with its Chinese partner.

> As an independent federal regulatory agency, CPSC was set up in 1973
> to protect the public from risks associated with some 15,000 types of
> consumer products, covering almost all the products sold in the United
> States except food, drugs and pharmaceuticals, as well as
> transportation that requires government registration.

> The agency also handles recalls of unsafe products.

> Source: China Daily

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 1:29 pm
From: "Chloe"

"Bernardo Gui" <spr34y@mypacks.net> wrote in message
news:c28vn3lk9kbmtlfbuklgp4scgok1jj2890@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 15:10:52 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Chinese exports safe, good quality: US official
>>12:06, January 05, 2008
>
> PaPaPeng's continuing efforts to convince Americans that Chinese
> products are safe are truly inspiring. No amount of facts to the
> contrary have any effect on his steadfast confidence. No amount of
> reality has any effect on his fantasy.
>
> PaPaPeng is the George W. Bush of shoddy, lead-painted,
> slave-manufactured products everywhere.
>
> Bernardo

Yeah, but where he's really confused seems to be with the notion that US
consumers believe ANYTHING the federal government tells us. For the Consumer
Product Safety Commission to claim Chinese products are safe raises a bigger
red flag for me than just about anything else possibly could. PaPa, it might
be different in Canada, but in the US the government spins information to
the advantage of big corporate political contributors--in this case the
companies which profit from the import business--and that article is just a
prime example. "Set up to protect the public..." Puh-leeze.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 1:38 pm
From: clams_casino

Chloe wrote:

>"Bernardo Gui" <spr34y@mypacks.net> wrote in message
>news:c28vn3lk9kbmtlfbuklgp4scgok1jj2890@4ax.com...
>
>
>>On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 15:10:52 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Chinese exports safe, good quality: US official
>>>12:06, January 05, 2008
>>>
>>>
>>PaPaPeng's continuing efforts to convince Americans that Chinese
>>products are safe are truly inspiring. No amount of facts to the
>>contrary have any effect on his steadfast confidence. No amount of
>>reality has any effect on his fantasy.
>>
>>PaPaPeng is the George W. Bush of shoddy, lead-painted,
>>slave-manufactured products everywhere.
>>
>>Bernardo
>>
>>
>
>Yeah, but where he's really confused seems to be with the notion that US
>consumers believe ANYTHING the federal government tells us.
>
>

I believe whatever the federal government tells us. GW continues to
assure us that his war in Iraq continues to go well and that the US
economy is currently fully sound.

That helps me to sleep soundly at night.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 6:28 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 10:27:09 -0500, Bernardo Gui <spr34y@mypacks.net>
wrote:

>On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 15:10:52 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Chinese exports safe, good quality: US official
>>12:06, January 05, 2008
>
>PaPaPeng's continuing efforts to convince Americans that Chinese
>products are safe are truly inspiring. No amount of facts to the
>contrary have any effect on his steadfast confidence. No amount of
>reality has any effect on his fantasy.
>
>PaPaPeng is the George W. Bush of shoddy, lead-painted,
>slave-manufactured products everywhere.
>
>Bernardo

The product quality problem must go back many years before last year's
flap. Has anyone in the US made sick let alone died so far from China
imports ? The toothpaste incident was in Panama and that was from
Panama formulated toothpaste that used mislabelled glycol for glycine.
In the same period many have been made ill and even died from tainted
US origin spinach and hamburger beef among US grown products. In the
meantime the hoohah about tainted Chinese imports ran out of steam by
November 2007. There's not a peep out of the usual pressure and
advocacy groups since. Is it because you have a lot of real life
problems bearing upon you?

Anyway here's an update. If you still want to continue that
conspiracy theory do provide fresh evidence. It is apparent that the
US government and media doesn't think it a subject worth reporting on
anymore.

China to enhance int'l co-op on product quality improvement in 2008
+ - 07:57, January 04, 2008
http://english.people.com.cn/90001/90776/90884/6332080.html

China will strengthen cooperation with other countries on product
quality issues in a bid to promote sound development of foreign trade,
said Li Changjiang, director of the General Administration of Quality
Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine (AQSIQ), on Thursday.

Li made the remarks at a national quality supervision and inspection
work conference held in Beijing.

"China will enhance consultation with other countries regarding
quality supervision and inspections, establish and expand
inter-government cooperative mechanism on product quality and safety
control," Li said.

Li added that AQSIQ would assist Beijing Municipal Food Safety
Supervision and Coordination Office in food safety supervision and
sport equipment testing during the 2008 Olympic Games.

Chinese industries have been battered by a raft of reports detailing
substandard products ranging from drugs to toys.

The Chinese government responded the scandals by introducing a new
recall system last summer, launching a four-month-long nationwide
product quality campaign and offering intensive training courses to
domestic manufacturers.

AQSIQ has taken numerous measures to promote international cooperation
in the field, including signing 47 bilateral documents and
establishing 23 cooperative mechanisms. It also co-hosted the
High-Level International Food Safety Forum and International Consumer
Product Safety Conference in 2007.

Source: Xinhua

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Quick Tips on Saving Moola
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8b77e6ad8db2e6fe?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:29 am
From: Cheapo Groovo

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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:38 am
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: How do you cut your utility cost?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0f775dcaf5b9b909?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:41 am
From:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Nice to hear you've made a big boost to your comfort level just by
> switching. Kitchens and workrooms need to be well lit and it's great that
> you no longer have to withstand the heat and can stay in the kitchen!
>
> Jeff

Plus, when I accidentally touch one of the lightbulbs (cramped quarters in
the workspace) I don't get a second degree burn!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Which is more frugal - keep thermostat at 62 or bump up to 66 and let
fall
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/32bcb9a55cab5416?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:43 am
From:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

<bungalow_steve@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:216de6dc-d949-4648-8e65-4c41dcc19f5a@q39g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 4, 11:10 am, <h> wrote:
> "Joe" <joe5...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:b2a4263c-85fb-497e-918f-0d41416f6175@5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > back down to 62? It will work harder to get up to the higher temp but
> > then it will not cycle for 4 or 5 hours. If I keep it set at 62 it
> > will cycle every 30 min. Which uses less energy?
>
> Why set it so high? I leave mine at 58 all winter, all the time, and just
> wear a sweater.

at 58, a sweater is not enough to keep most skinny people comfortable

It is if you're moving. When we watch TV (rare), we have a quilt on the
couch.

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== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: Free Pancakes at IHOP on February 12
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/28d22bdde3a76c33?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 8:09 am
From: "FreebiesPl.us"

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== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: buy cheap shoes (www.shoes-ec.com)
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== 1 of 1 ==
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: FREE APPROVED STUDENT LOANS WWW.LOANSURF.INFO
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/250f93bc7374f25c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 10:28 am
From: proxynoob

WWW.LOANSURF.INFO

==============================================================================
TOPIC: filtering out british spy nutbag posts
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4fa2a57ab20d02a0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 10:34 am
From: max

m.i.5.p

Use the above string as a regexp match and it'll nuke mister /\/\ |
phive.

Regexps are "Regular Expressions", gobbledygook expressions that can be
used to match patterns within text.

I tested this on 666 chi.eats articles and 5555 chi.general articles
with no false positves and no misses.

Guarenteed to work as advertised for MT-Newswatcher running on MacOS
10.5.1, other platforms mmv. (UNcheck "match case" in filter expression
window)

On MTNW you invoke regexps by looking under the "contains" dropdown menu
of the filters window e.g. "Kill" if "Message" "Contains"

This will keep "him" busy for a while.

hth.max

--
The part of betatron @ earthlink . net was played by a garden gnome

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 5:07 pm
From: imascot

max <betatron@earthlink.net> wrote in news:betatron-FBD2F1.12344105012008@news.ftupet.com:

> m.i.5.p
>
> Use the above string as a regexp match and it'll nuke mister /\/\ |
> phive.
>
> Regexps are "Regular Expressions", gobbledygook expressions that can be
> used to match patterns within text.
>
> I tested this on 666 chi.eats articles and 5555 chi.general articles
> with no false positves and no misses.
>
> Guarenteed to work as advertised for MT-Newswatcher running on MacOS
> 10.5.1, other platforms mmv. (UNcheck "match case" in filter expression
> window)
>
> On MTNW you invoke regexps by looking under the "contains" dropdown menu
> of the filters window e.g. "Kill" if "Message" "Contains"
>
> This will keep "him" busy for a while.
>
> hth.max
>

His news server filtered him out permanently.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 5:57 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

imascot <imnot@mycomputer.now> wrote:
> max <betatron@earthlink.net> wrote in
> news:betatron-FBD2F1.12344105012008@news.ftupet.com:
>
>> m.i.5.p
>>
>> Use the above string as a regexp match and it'll nuke mister /\/\ |
>> phive.
>>
>> Regexps are "Regular Expressions", gobbledygook expressions that can
>> be used to match patterns within text.
>>
>> I tested this on 666 chi.eats articles and 5555 chi.general articles
>> with no false positves and no misses.
>>
>> Guarenteed to work as advertised for MT-Newswatcher running on MacOS
>> 10.5.1, other platforms mmv. (UNcheck "match case" in filter
>> expression window)
>>
>> On MTNW you invoke regexps by looking under the "contains" dropdown
>> menu of the filters window e.g. "Kill" if "Message" "Contains"
>>
>> This will keep "him" busy for a while.
>>
>> hth.max
>>
>
> His news server filtered him out permanently.

Bet it wont be permanent for long.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: do inter business online ,buy popular product
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a7bc77027243b157?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 10:56 am
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Basically, it's Free Telephone Service
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9147fe7dc2a73336?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 11:41 am
From: igotskillz

Basically it's not

you have to pay for the device, then you pay an annual fee.
How is that basically free ?

On Jan 5, 6:51 am, RICLAND <ricland...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey, pals, get a load of this...
>
> It's called "magicjack" and what it is, is a thing that looks like a
> flash drive. You plug it into your usb port, plug your phone wire in
> the back, and you've got unlimited local and long distance --and your
> own telephone number in your area code.
>
> I've had mine a week and the calls are flawless.
>
> Here's a forum where people are talking about it:
>
> www.magicjacknews.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Real Cost of US Support for Israel: $3 MILLION-MILLION
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6ddf22a68bcc41b5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 12:00 pm
From: "P. Maffia"

Of course, neither you nor Mr. Boyle took note of the fact that Egypt
receives almost as much each year from the US as does Israel.

"Hobo" <dfgsdgt546456rtg@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:aafd50ed-94aa-489c-abf4-f7ed1c19ea00@1g2000hsl.googlegroups.com...
> By Christopher Bollyn
>
> While it is commonly reported that Israel officially receives some $3
> billion every year in the form of economic aid from the U.S.
> government, this figure is just the tip of the iceberg. There are many
> billions of dollars more in hidden costs and economic losses lurking
> beneath the surface. A recently published economic analysis has
> concluded that U.S. support for the state of Israel has cost American
> taxpayers nearly $3 trillion ($3 million millions) in 2002 dollars.
>
> "The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict:
> $3 Trillion" is a summary of economic research done by Thomas R.
> Stauffer. Stauffer's summary of the research was published in the June
> 2003 issue of The Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.
>
> Stauffer is a Washington, D.C.-based engineer and economist who writes
> and teaches about the economics of energy and the Middle East.
> Stauffer has taught at Harvard University and Georgetown University's
> School of Foreign Service. Stauffer's findings were first presented at
> an October 2002 conference sponsored by the U.S. Army College and the
> University of Maine.
>
> Stauffer's analysis is "an estimate of the total cost to the U.S.
> alone of instability and conflict in the region - which emanates from
> the core Israeli-Palestinian conflict."
>
> "Total identifiable costs come to almost $3 trillion," Stauffer says.
> "About 60 percent, well over half, of those costs - about $1.7
> trillion - arose from the U.S. defense of Israel, where most of that
> amount has been incurred since 1973."
>
> "Support for Israel comes to $1.8 trillion, including special trade
> advantages, preferential contracts, or aid buried in other accounts.
> In addition to the financial outlay, U.S. aid to Israel costs some
> 275,000 American jobs each year." The trade-aid imbalance alone with
> Israel of between $6-10 billion costs about 125,000 American jobs
> every year, Stauffer says.
>
> The largest single element in the costs has been the series of oil-
> supply crises that have accompanied the Israeli-Arab wars and the
> construction of the Strategic Petroleum Reserve. "To date these have
> cost the U.S. $1.5 trillion (2002 dollars), excluding the additional
> costs incurred since 2001," Stauffer wrote.
>
> The cost of supporting Israel increased drastically after the 1973
> Israeli-Arab war. U.S. support for Israel during that war resulted in
> additional costs for the American taxpayer of between $750 billion and
> $1 trillion, Stauffer says.
>
> When Israel was losing the war, President Richard Nixon stepped in to
> supply the Jewish state with U.S. weapons. Nixon's intervention
> triggered the Arab oil embargo which Stauffer estimates cost the U.S.
> as much as $600 billion in lost GDP and another $450 in higher oil
> import costs.
>
> "The 1973 oil crisis, all in all, cost the U.S. economy no less than
> $900 billion, and probably as much as $1,200 billion," he says.
>
> As a result of the oil embargo the United States created the Strategic
> Petroleum Reserve (SPR) to "insulate Israel and the U.S. against the
> wielding of a future Arab 'oil weapon.'" The billion-barrel SPR has
> cost U.S. taxpayers $134 billion to date. According to an Oil Supply
> Guarantee, which former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger provided
> Israel in 1975, Israel gets "first call" on any oil available to the
> U.S. if Israel's oil supply is stopped.
>
> Stauffer's $3 trillion figure is conservative as it does not include
> the increased costs incurred during the year-long buildup to the
> recent war against Iraq in which Israel played a significant, albeit
> covert, role. The higher oil prices that occurred as a result of the
> Anglo-American campaign against Iraq were absorbed by the consumers.
> The increase in oil prices provided a huge bonus for the leading oil
> companies such as British Petroleum and Shell, who are major oil
> producers as well as retailers. The major international oil companies
> recorded record profits for the first quarter of 2003.
>
> The Washington Report seeks to "provide the American public with
> balanced and accurate information concerning U.S. relations with
> Middle Eastern states." The monthly journal is known for keeping close
> tabs on the amount of U.S. taxpayer money that goes to Israel and how
> much pro-Israel money flows back to Members of Congress in the form of
> campaign aid.
>
> The journal's website, www.wrmea.com, has an up-to-date counter at the
> top that indicates how much official aid flows to Israel. While the
> counter currently stands at $88.2 billion, it only reflects the
> minimum, as it does not include the many hidden costs.
>
> "The distinction is important, because the indirect or consequential
> losses suffered by the U.S. as a result of its blind support for
> Israel exceed by many times the substantial amount of direct aid to
> Israel," Shirl McArthur wrote in the May 2003 issue of Washington
> Report.
>
> McArthur's article, "A Conservative Tally of Total Direct U.S. Aid to
> Israel: $97.5 Billion - and Counting" tallies the hidden costs, such
> as interest lost due to the early disbursement of aid to Israel and
> funds hidden in other accounts. For example, Israel received $5.45
> billion in Defense Department funding of Israeli weapons projects
> through 2002, McArthur says.
>
> Loans made to Israel by the U.S. government, like the recently awarded
> $9 billion, invariably wind up being paid by the American taxpayer. A
> recent Congressional Research Service report indicates that Israel has
> received $42 billion in waived loans. "Therefore, it is reasonable to
> consider all government loans to Israel the same as grants," McArthur
> says.
>
> Support for Israel has cost America dearly - well over than $10,000
> per American - however the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been
> extremely costly for the entire world. According to Stauffer, the
> total bill for supporting Israel is two to four times higher than that
> for the U.S. alone - costing the global community an estimated $6 to
> $12 trillion.
>
> Finis
> Courtesy Rumor Mill News Agents Forum
>
> http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=831

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 3:42 pm
From: "MasterChief" <1@nowhere.com>

No more our taxes should go to any nation,but our own.

"P. Maffia" <pmaffia@centurytel.net> wrote in message
news:T_6dnbPHp7xffOLanZ2dnUVZ_q2hnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> Of course, neither you nor Mr. Boyle took note of the fact that Egypt
> receives almost as much each year from the US as does Israel.
>
>
> "Hobo" <dfgsdgt546456rtg@googlemail.com> wrote in message
> news:aafd50ed-94aa-489c-abf4-f7ed1c19ea00@1g2000hsl.googlegroups.com...
>> By Christopher Bollyn
>>
>> While it is commonly reported that Israel officially receives some $3
>> billion every year in the form of economic aid from the U.S.
>> government, this figure is just the tip of the iceberg. There are many
>> billions of dollars more in hidden costs and economic losses lurking
>> beneath the surface. A recently published economic analysis has
>> concluded that U.S. support for the state of Israel has cost American
>> taxpayers nearly $3 trillion ($3 million millions) in 2002 dollars.
>>
>> "The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict:
>> $3 Trillion" is a summary of economic research done by Thomas R.
>> Stauffer. Stauffer's summary of the research was published in the June
>> 2003 issue of The Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.
>>
>> Stauffer is a Washington, D.C.-based engineer and economist who writes
>> and teaches about the economics of energy and the Middle East.
>> Stauffer has taught at Harvard University and Georgetown University's
>> School of Foreign Service. Stauffer's findings were first presented at
>> an October 2002 conference sponsored by the U.S. Army College and the
>> University of Maine.
>>
>> Stauffer's analysis is "an estimate of the total cost to the U.S.
>> alone of instability and conflict in the region - which emanates from
>> the core Israeli-Palestinian conflict."
>>
>> "Total identifiable costs come to almost $3 trillion," Stauffer says.
>> "About 60 percent, well over half, of those costs - about $1.7
>> trillion - arose from the U.S. defense of Israel, where most of that
>> amount has been incurred since 1973."
>>
>> "Support for Israel comes to $1.8 trillion, including special trade
>> advantages, preferential contracts, or aid buried in other accounts.
>> In addition to the financial outlay, U.S. aid to Israel costs some
>> 275,000 American jobs each year." The trade-aid imbalance alone with
>> Israel of between $6-10 billion costs about 125,000 American jobs
>> every year, Stauffer says.
>>
>> The largest single element in the costs has been the series of oil-
>> supply crises that have accompanied the Israeli-Arab wars and the
>> construction of the Strategic Petroleum Reserve. "To date these have
>> cost the U.S. $1.5 trillion (2002 dollars), excluding the additional
>> costs incurred since 2001," Stauffer wrote.
>>
>> The cost of supporting Israel increased drastically after the 1973
>> Israeli-Arab war. U.S. support for Israel during that war resulted in
>> additional costs for the American taxpayer of between $750 billion and
>> $1 trillion, Stauffer says.
>>
>> When Israel was losing the war, President Richard Nixon stepped in to
>> supply the Jewish state with U.S. weapons. Nixon's intervention
>> triggered the Arab oil embargo which Stauffer estimates cost the U.S.
>> as much as $600 billion in lost GDP and another $450 in higher oil
>> import costs.
>>
>> "The 1973 oil crisis, all in all, cost the U.S. economy no less than
>> $900 billion, and probably as much as $1,200 billion," he says.
>>
>> As a result of the oil embargo the United States created the Strategic
>> Petroleum Reserve (SPR) to "insulate Israel and the U.S. against the
>> wielding of a future Arab 'oil weapon.'" The billion-barrel SPR has
>> cost U.S. taxpayers $134 billion to date. According to an Oil Supply
>> Guarantee, which former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger provided
>> Israel in 1975, Israel gets "first call" on any oil available to the
>> U.S. if Israel's oil supply is stopped.
>>
>> Stauffer's $3 trillion figure is conservative as it does not include
>> the increased costs incurred during the year-long buildup to the
>> recent war against Iraq in which Israel played a significant, albeit
>> covert, role. The higher oil prices that occurred as a result of the
>> Anglo-American campaign against Iraq were absorbed by the consumers.
>> The increase in oil prices provided a huge bonus for the leading oil
>> companies such as British Petroleum and Shell, who are major oil
>> producers as well as retailers. The major international oil companies
>> recorded record profits for the first quarter of 2003.
>>
>> The Washington Report seeks to "provide the American public with
>> balanced and accurate information concerning U.S. relations with
>> Middle Eastern states." The monthly journal is known for keeping close
>> tabs on the amount of U.S. taxpayer money that goes to Israel and how
>> much pro-Israel money flows back to Members of Congress in the form of
>> campaign aid.
>>
>> The journal's website, www.wrmea.com, has an up-to-date counter at the
>> top that indicates how much official aid flows to Israel. While the
>> counter currently stands at $88.2 billion, it only reflects the
>> minimum, as it does not include the many hidden costs.
>>
>> "The distinction is important, because the indirect or consequential
>> losses suffered by the U.S. as a result of its blind support for
>> Israel exceed by many times the substantial amount of direct aid to
>> Israel," Shirl McArthur wrote in the May 2003 issue of Washington
>> Report.
>>
>> McArthur's article, "A Conservative Tally of Total Direct U.S. Aid to
>> Israel: $97.5 Billion - and Counting" tallies the hidden costs, such
>> as interest lost due to the early disbursement of aid to Israel and
>> funds hidden in other accounts. For example, Israel received $5.45
>> billion in Defense Department funding of Israeli weapons projects
>> through 2002, McArthur says.
>>
>> Loans made to Israel by the U.S. government, like the recently awarded
>> $9 billion, invariably wind up being paid by the American taxpayer. A
>> recent Congressional Research Service report indicates that Israel has
>> received $42 billion in waived loans. "Therefore, it is reasonable to
>> consider all government loans to Israel the same as grants," McArthur
>> says.
>>
>> Support for Israel has cost America dearly - well over than $10,000
>> per American - however the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been
>> extremely costly for the entire world. According to Stauffer, the
>> total bill for supporting Israel is two to four times higher than that
>> for the U.S. alone - costing the global community an estimated $6 to
>> $12 trillion.
>>
>> Finis
>> Courtesy Rumor Mill News Agents Forum
>>
>> http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=831
>

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 5:31 pm
From: clams_casino

MasterChief wrote:

>No more our taxes should go to any nation,but our own.
>
>
>
Tell that to GW - the biggest tax spender in US history.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 7:54 pm
From: "P. Maffia"

Isolationism is a good way for any Country to end up in the dust bin of
history quickly.
"MasterChief" <1@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:vcOdnZNRVLy_iB3anZ2dnUVZ_h-vnZ2d@comcast.com...
> No more our taxes should go to any nation,but our own.
>
> "P. Maffia" <pmaffia@centurytel.net> wrote in message
> news:T_6dnbPHp7xffOLanZ2dnUVZ_q2hnZ2d@centurytel.net...
>> Of course, neither you nor Mr. Boyle took note of the fact that Egypt
>> receives almost as much each year from the US as does Israel.
>>
>>
>> "Hobo" <dfgsdgt546456rtg@googlemail.com> wrote in message
>> news:aafd50ed-94aa-489c-abf4-f7ed1c19ea00@1g2000hsl.googlegroups.com...
>>> By Christopher Bollyn
>>>
>>> While it is commonly reported that Israel officially receives some $3
>>> billion every year in the form of economic aid from the U.S.
>>> government, this figure is just the tip of the iceberg. There are many
>>> billions of dollars more in hidden costs and economic losses lurking
>>> beneath the surface. A recently published economic analysis has
>>> concluded that U.S. support for the state of Israel has cost American
>>> taxpayers nearly $3 trillion ($3 million millions) in 2002 dollars.
>>>
>>> "The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict:
>>> $3 Trillion" is a summary of economic research done by Thomas R.
>>> Stauffer. Stauffer's summary of the research was published in the June
>>> 2003 issue of The Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.
>>>
>>> Stauffer is a Washington, D.C.-based engineer and economist who writes
>>> and teaches about the economics of energy and the Middle East.
>>> Stauffer has taught at Harvard University and Georgetown University's
>>> School of Foreign Service. Stauffer's findings were first presented at
>>> an October 2002 conference sponsored by the U.S. Army College and the
>>> University of Maine.
>>>
>>> Stauffer's analysis is "an estimate of the total cost to the U.S.
>>> alone of instability and conflict in the region - which emanates from
>>> the core Israeli-Palestinian conflict."
>>>
>>> "Total identifiable costs come to almost $3 trillion," Stauffer says.
>>> "About 60 percent, well over half, of those costs - about $1.7
>>> trillion - arose from the U.S. defense of Israel, where most of that
>>> amount has been incurred since 1973."
>>>
>>> "Support for Israel comes to $1.8 trillion, including special trade
>>> advantages, preferential contracts, or aid buried in other accounts.
>>> In addition to the financial outlay, U.S. aid to Israel costs some
>>> 275,000 American jobs each year." The trade-aid imbalance alone with
>>> Israel of between $6-10 billion costs about 125,000 American jobs
>>> every year, Stauffer says.
>>>
>>> The largest single element in the costs has been the series of oil-
>>> supply crises that have accompanied the Israeli-Arab wars and the
>>> construction of the Strategic Petroleum Reserve. "To date these have
>>> cost the U.S. $1.5 trillion (2002 dollars), excluding the additional
>>> costs incurred since 2001," Stauffer wrote.
>>>
>>> The cost of supporting Israel increased drastically after the 1973
>>> Israeli-Arab war. U.S. support for Israel during that war resulted in
>>> additional costs for the American taxpayer of between $750 billion and
>>> $1 trillion, Stauffer says.
>>>
>>> When Israel was losing the war, President Richard Nixon stepped in to
>>> supply the Jewish state with U.S. weapons. Nixon's intervention
>>> triggered the Arab oil embargo which Stauffer estimates cost the U.S.
>>> as much as $600 billion in lost GDP and another $450 in higher oil
>>> import costs.
>>>
>>> "The 1973 oil crisis, all in all, cost the U.S. economy no less than
>>> $900 billion, and probably as much as $1,200 billion," he says.
>>>
>>> As a result of the oil embargo the United States created the Strategic
>>> Petroleum Reserve (SPR) to "insulate Israel and the U.S. against the
>>> wielding of a future Arab 'oil weapon.'" The billion-barrel SPR has
>>> cost U.S. taxpayers $134 billion to date. According to an Oil Supply
>>> Guarantee, which former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger provided
>>> Israel in 1975, Israel gets "first call" on any oil available to the
>>> U.S. if Israel's oil supply is stopped.
>>>
>>> Stauffer's $3 trillion figure is conservative as it does not include
>>> the increased costs incurred during the year-long buildup to the
>>> recent war against Iraq in which Israel played a significant, albeit
>>> covert, role. The higher oil prices that occurred as a result of the
>>> Anglo-American campaign against Iraq were absorbed by the consumers.
>>> The increase in oil prices provided a huge bonus for the leading oil
>>> companies such as British Petroleum and Shell, who are major oil
>>> producers as well as retailers. The major international oil companies
>>> recorded record profits for the first quarter of 2003.
>>>
>>> The Washington Report seeks to "provide the American public with
>>> balanced and accurate information concerning U.S. relations with
>>> Middle Eastern states." The monthly journal is known for keeping close
>>> tabs on the amount of U.S. taxpayer money that goes to Israel and how
>>> much pro-Israel money flows back to Members of Congress in the form of
>>> campaign aid.
>>>
>>> The journal's website, www.wrmea.com, has an up-to-date counter at the
>>> top that indicates how much official aid flows to Israel. While the
>>> counter currently stands at $88.2 billion, it only reflects the
>>> minimum, as it does not include the many hidden costs.
>>>
>>> "The distinction is important, because the indirect or consequential
>>> losses suffered by the U.S. as a result of its blind support for
>>> Israel exceed by many times the substantial amount of direct aid to
>>> Israel," Shirl McArthur wrote in the May 2003 issue of Washington
>>> Report.
>>>
>>> McArthur's article, "A Conservative Tally of Total Direct U.S. Aid to
>>> Israel: $97.5 Billion - and Counting" tallies the hidden costs, such
>>> as interest lost due to the early disbursement of aid to Israel and
>>> funds hidden in other accounts. For example, Israel received $5.45
>>> billion in Defense Department funding of Israeli weapons projects
>>> through 2002, McArthur says.
>>>
>>> Loans made to Israel by the U.S. government, like the recently awarded
>>> $9 billion, invariably wind up being paid by the American taxpayer. A
>>> recent Congressional Research Service report indicates that Israel has
>>> received $42 billion in waived loans. "Therefore, it is reasonable to
>>> consider all government loans to Israel the same as grants," McArthur
>>> says.
>>>
>>> Support for Israel has cost America dearly - well over than $10,000
>>> per American - however the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been
>>> extremely costly for the entire world. According to Stauffer, the
>>> total bill for supporting Israel is two to four times higher than that
>>> for the U.S. alone - costing the global community an estimated $6 to
>>> $12 trillion.
>>>
>>> Finis
>>> Courtesy Rumor Mill News Agents Forum
>>>
>>> http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=831
>>
>
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Stuff at 90 percent off
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7d9c72b1acf0d6e9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jan 5 2008 4:27 pm
From: Dawn

On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 20:37:56 -0500, "Chloe" <justsayno@spam.com> wrote:

>A couple months ago I switched two prescription refills to a chain pharmacy
>that was having a promotion, and got a $25 gift card for each one. I still
>had about $10 left on one of the cards. When I stopped back in today, they
>had the last odds and ends of their Christmas merchandise for 90 percent
>off. I treated myself to a bag of nice chocolate truffles (69 cents) and
>stocked up on gift wrap supplies in neutral colors that can be used any time
>of the year. A tightwad home run, for sure.
>
That sure beats my 20 cents a roll of paper at Walmart the other day.
Dawn, who only restocked five rolls.

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4 new messages in 4 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Bathroom Design and Remodeling, Designer Steam Rooms, Whirlpool Bathtubs - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ed65d10124932d79?hl=en
* Frugal house heating: better to keep the thermostat static night? - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/674ef4c9a7457ae9?hl=en
* golden supplier best service,lowest price (http://www.silkonroad.com) - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/76beb0183c5e326e?hl=en
* How do you cut your utility cost? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0f775dcaf5b9b909?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bathroom Design and Remodeling, Designer Steam Rooms, Whirlpool
Bathtubs
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ed65d10124932d79?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jan 4 2008 10:06 pm
From: windowsyyy

Bathroom Design and Remodeling, Designer Steam Rooms, Whirlpool
Bathtubs
http://cqlr.cn/a

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal house heating: better to keep the thermostat static night?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/674ef4c9a7457ae9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jan 4 2008 10:09 pm
From: max

In article
<95a09070-9b83-4f4d-a58c-938605e7147b@e4g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
Joe <joe5345@gmail.com> wrote:

> At night I put my thermostat down to 62 degrees and my boiler (hot
> water heat) basically doesn't cycle at all from 10pm to 7:30am when I
> have it scheduled to heat the house back up to 66 degrees. Between
> 7:30am and 9am the boiler cycles about 5-6 times in order to heat the
> house back up to 66 degrees. My question: Is it better to just keep
> the thermostat at 66 degrees all night? Normally it would cycle once
> every 2 hours to maintain the temp - that would mean it would cycle a
> minimum of 4 times during the night instead of 5 or 6 in the morning.
> Anyone done any experimenting with this?

66 degrees will take more energy. I've made a picture to help illustrate
<http://www.flickr.com/photos/14094663@N04/2167437743/>

The "area under the curve" is the power, or gas used. In the picture
the 66 degree scheme is orange PLUS green. With 62 degrees, it's just
green.

Hopefully this will answer this question for all time. :-)

hth.

.max

--
The part of betatron @ earthlink . net was played by a garden gnome

==============================================================================
TOPIC: golden supplier best service,lowest price (http://www.silkonroad.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/76beb0183c5e326e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jan 4 2008 10:48 pm
From: xiaobb01@gmail.com

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jan 4 2008 10:58 pm
From: Coffee's For Closers

In article <2bgrn3lbtk7a944supei4jv4jgdasovh7l@4ax.com>,
PaPaPeng@yahoo.com says...
> On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 14:32:57 GMT, "AllEmailDeletedImmediately"
> <derjda@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >you're probably just saving water, but not money. most water companies
> >charge per 1000 gallons or any part thereof. so, if you usually use 2000 a
> >month and cut back to 1001 gallons, you're still gonna pay for 2000. to
> >really see water use drop in this country, there should be a requirement
> >that you only pay for what you use, but that would probably entail changing
> >out all the water meters since i think they only compute in 1000 gal
> >increments.
>
>
> I always wondered about that. I try to save water by (4 gal) flushing
> it every third pee and it didn't make any diffrerence as when I
> flushed more often. I suppose the billing will even out over each
> billing cycle as the meter clocks up the next 1000 gallons. The same
> method would be used for electricty as I way away for 6 weeks and
> there was no difference in the bills.

The electric bills may alternate between a physical reading and
an estimate.

For example, my electric provider takes a physical meter reading
every two months, and sends a bill up to that exact amount. The
other, non-read months, are based on my average monthly usage
over time (at least a year, and maybe weighted to season.)
Theoretically, I could use zero power during that period, and
still be billed according to my real usage, say, last January.

A discrepancy like that would be compensated with the next
physical meter reading.

So, your bill that covered the absent period, might be an
estimated amount. I seem to recall reading of situations where
the bill was estimated each month for a long time, sometimes
getting further and further away from actual usage.

--
Get Credit Where Credit Is Due
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