Frugal Living: Dec 22, 2007

Saturday, December 22, 2007

25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Attractive American woman gang-raped by Halliburton thugs in 'safe'
Iraqi Green Zone testifies before Congress.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/227d8c83f28b86cb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:00 am
From: Joe

See it via

http://muvy.org/new.php?entity=kbr

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Yet another Best Buy consumer horror story -- woman tasered by cop.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8fc4714b1a22ea0e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:05 am
From: Joe

While my local Best Buy is wonderful, for some reason
others are not.

http://muvy.org/new.php?entity=bestbuy

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:45 am
From: "Rod Speed"

Joe <useful_infos@yahoo.com> wrote:

> While my local Best Buy is wonderful, for some reason others are not.

> http://muvy.org/new.php?entity=bestbuy

If you're actually stupid enough to behave like that, you can expect to get what you deserve.

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:15 pm
From: Larry Bud

On Dec 22, 2:45 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Joe <useful_in...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > While my local Best Buy is wonderful, for some reason others are not.
> >http://muvy.org/new.php?entity=bestbuy
>
> If you're actually stupid enough to behave like that, you can expect to get what you deserve.

If I was a cop, I'd taser every asshole that behaved like this. It's
probably the safest method of subduing someone.

http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/News/Headlines/frtHEAD01122007.htm

Note, this whole story has nothing to do with Best Buy, other than the
woman was going nuts inside a Best Buy store.

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 5:16 pm
From: JL

> If I was a cop, I'd taser every asshole that behaved like this. It's
> probably the safest method of subduing someone.
>
> http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/News/Headlines/frtHEAD01122007.htm
>
> Note, this whole story has nothing to do with Best Buy, other than the
> woman was going nuts inside a Best Buy store.

Yeah it's easy to second guess when a cop uses force against someone.
But in the moment, the officer has to protect himself and others. If
she would have cooperated nothing would have happened to her.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:54 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Larry Bud <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote
>> Joe <useful_in...@yahoo.com> wrote

>>> While my local Best Buy is wonderful, for some reason others are not.
>>> http://muvy.org/new.php?entity=bestbuy

>> If you're actually stupid enough to behave like that,
>> you can expect to get what you deserve.

> If I was a cop, I'd taser every asshole that behaved like this.

Me too, and thats essentially what I meant in my previous.

> It's probably the safest method of subduing someone.

And the best way to discourage others from behaving like that too.

> http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/News/Headlines/frtHEAD01122007.htm

> Note, this whole story has nothing to do with Best Buy,
> other than the woman was going nuts inside a Best Buy store.

Precisely.

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:56 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

JL <noone@nowheresville.biz> wrote

>> If I was a cop, I'd taser every asshole that behaved like this. It's probably the safest method of subduing someone.

>> http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/News/Headlines/frtHEAD01122007.htm

>> Note, this whole story has nothing to do with Best Buy, other than
>> the woman was going nuts inside a Best Buy store.

> Yeah it's easy to second guess when a cop uses force against someone.
> But in the moment, the officer has to protect himself and others.

And that is the best way to stop that stupid woman behaving like that.

> If she would have cooperated nothing would have happened to her.

And if she had behaved herself in the first place, it wouldnt have either.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Debit card article in Reader's Digest
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/30646f032f4ff9e6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:08 am
From: "Rod Speed"

val189 <gwehrenb@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> On Dec 19, 10:20 am, "rick++" <rick...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> The other safety technique I employ
>> is a special "gatewayaccount", i.e. one exposed to
>> the outside world, with very limited funding.
>> Its tied to checks, bill pay, and debit card.
>> In general it always has less than $1000,
>> except for the moment bills are paid.
>> The deposit and billpays are scheduled to
>> be simulataneous so no large amount exists
>> for long.

> Where do you park the rest of your funds?

Wherever that produces the best return currently. That tends to vary.

> In a related savings or MM account?

Usually the later, but not always, sometimes CDs etc produce a better return.

> Same bank?

Normally not, deliberately, so they cant choose to loot my
other accounts if someone manages to loot the 'gateway'
account, even if they legally arent allowed to do that.

Lot easier to make an obscene gesture in their general
direction if they decide that I was the one that looted the
'gateway' account deliberately in an attempt to scam them etc.

> Do you have another checking account with a different bank?

Yes, at least one other credit card too, just for convenience if the brown
stuff hits the fan with main 'gateway' account when I am out of town or
in hospital etc and it isnt convenient to fix the problem quickly etc.

> Mail checks from one to the other?

Nope, always do electronic transfers, try to avoid receiving any checks too,
just because they are less convenient to deal with than electronic transfers.
I even do that with stuff like the payments I make for others while they are out
of town for the winter etc, when they pay me for what I have paid for them etc.

> Just curious how the funds flow into your gateway chkg. acct.

Always electronically from the account with the money in it.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Frugal living in the Philadelphia region
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/bdb24219631c9f7a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:16 am
From: Joe

http://home.comcast.net/~plutarch/frugal-philly.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: More Selective reporting from Limbaugh
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/306db91f018962b9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 11:45 am
From: jl

jdoe wrote:
> On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 11:57:28 -0500, jl <jl@nowhereszville.biz> wrote:
>
>> Limbaugh is a total blithering idiot. He never analyzes an issue
>> completely. It's all just one sided.
> since you know that already why do you listen to his show? I know that
> the NY Times is a slanted leftist propaganda tool, I don't read it.

I don't listen to his show. But I have heard enough of it to realize
that most of the stuff that comes out of his mouth is bullshit. About
the only person on regular radio worth listening to is Phil Hendrie.
But I mostly listen to podcasts downloaded from iTunes.

Most of the talk show hosts are full of shit and are too far to the
right or to the left and none of them consider the whole picture. They
instead see things through their particular lens.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 1:27 pm
From: ""

On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 10:34:29 -0800, SMS ???* ? <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
wrote:

>jl wrote:
>> Limbaugh is a total blithering idiot. He never analyzes an issue
>> completely. It's all just one sided.
>
>Hey, he got very rich by conning enough right-wing wackos into actually
>believing anything he says. Remember, he's an entertainer, not a news
>person.

Think of Rush as;
"Your daily dose of Whine and Cheese"

r
<rj>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: RodSpeed, do you think major inflation is imminent globally?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/07987411c86cacd3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 12:00 pm
From: Quality_is_job_one

On Dec 21, 1:44 pm, "** Frank **" <noem...@xyz.net> wrote:
> CNBC has been talking about China, Russia and India - Brazil is doing pretty
> good too. But I feel more comfortable with US companies with foreign
> components.
>

BRIC?
Wasn't there a time when Japan was on top?
I agree, I feel more comfortable with US companies for conservative
growth as they will be transnational anyway as long as our government
can see to it.

Rodspeed, how is Australia? Is there a real estate bubble there or
inflation?

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 12:15 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Quality_is_job_one <kwokx2@hotmail.com> wrote
> ** Frank **" <noem...@xyz.net> wrote

>> CNBC has been talking about China, Russia and India - Brazil is doing pretty good too.
>> But I feel more comfortable with US companies with foreign components.

> BRIC?
> Wasn't there a time when Japan was on top?

Yep, and then the world moved on.

> I agree, I feel more comfortable with US companies for conservative growth
> as they will be transnational anyway as long as our government can see to it.

> Rodspeed, how is Australia?

Doing very well supplying China and Japan. We have had a positive
balance of trade in our favor for a long time with Japan and now with
China, something that the US, Canada and the EU has never managed.

> Is there a real estate bubble there

Nope, tho prices are getting high enough so that its hard for
first home buyers to get into the market in the capital citys.

> or inflation?

Nope, its low and unemployment rates have returned to what we last saw 30+ years ago now.

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 1:02 pm
From: Quality_is_job_one

On Dec 22, 3:15 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Quality_is_job_one <kwo...@hotmail.com> wrote
>
> > ** Frank **" <noem...@xyz.net> wrote
> >> CNBC has been talking about China, Russia and India - Brazil is doing pretty good too.
> >> But I feel more comfortable with US companies with foreign components.
> > BRIC?
> > Wasn't there a time when Japan was on top?
>
> Yep, and then the world moved on.
>
> > I agree, I feel more comfortable with US companies for conservative growth
> > as they will be transnational anyway as long as our government can see to it.
> > Rodspeed, how is Australia?
>
> Doing very well supplying China and Japan. We have had a positive
> balance of trade in our favor for a long time with Japan and now with
> China, something that the US, Canada and the EU has never managed.
>
> > Is there a real estate bubble there
>
> Nope, tho prices are getting high enough so that its hard for
> first home buyers to get into the market in the capital citys.
>
> > or inflation?
>
> Nope, its low and unemployment rates have returned to what we last saw 30+ years ago now.

I am gonna keep an eye on Australia. I believe many who visit there
would want to live there. Bodes well for long run. So far I can invest
in them with the EWA exchange traded fund. I am interested in their
resources too. Copper a big thing in Australia?

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 1:22 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Quality_is_job_one <kwokx2@hotmail.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote
>> Quality_is_job_one <kwo...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>> ** Frank **" <noem...@xyz.net> wrote

>>>> CNBC has been talking about China, Russia and India - Brazil is
>>>> doing pretty good too. But I feel more comfortable with US
>>>> companies with foreign components.

>>> BRIC?
>>> Wasn't there a time when Japan was on top?

>> Yep, and then the world moved on.

>>> I agree, I feel more comfortable with US companies for conservative
>>> growth as they will be transnational anyway as long as our
>>> government can see to it. Rodspeed, how is Australia?

>> Doing very well supplying China and Japan. We have had a positive
>> balance of trade in our favor for a long time with Japan and now with
>> China, something that the US, Canada and the EU has never managed.

>>> Is there a real estate bubble there

>> Nope, tho prices are getting high enough so that its hard for
>> first home buyers to get into the market in the capital citys.

>>> or inflation?

>> Nope, its low and unemployment rates have
>> returned to what we last saw 30+ years ago now.

> I am gonna keep an eye on Australia. I believe many who
> visit there would want to live there. Bodes well for long run.

Sure.

> So far I can invest in them with the EWA exchange traded fund.

You can invest in most of the stocks directly too if you want.

> I am interested in their resources too. Copper a big thing in Australia?

Sure. But that varys over time.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:53 pm
From: Quality_is_job_one

On Dec 22, 4:22 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> You can invest in most of the stocks directly too if you want.

Individual stocks have greater volatility on a risk basis than an
exchange traded fund. That and I am mired in US stocks right now as
they have dividends that are approaching the same yield as bonds (~
5%).

> > I am interested in their resources too. Copper a big thing in Australia?
>
> Sure. But that varys over time.

I heard many rare-earth metals are in a bull market too. Heck, most
any resource has been driven up in price. Makes you wonder if China
and the other countries are a great long term investment scheme. Think
growing populations that want things made from resources. Other than
cheap labor and the lure of tourism, how can they jumpstart themselves
into the realm of a major economy? I am asking whether people will
stop trying to immigrate to the US and head to BRIC lands to make
their fortunes.

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 3:04 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Quality_is_job_one <kwokx2@hotmail.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote

>> You can invest in most of the stocks directly too if you want.

> Individual stocks have greater volatility on a risk basis than an
> exchange traded fund. That and I am mired in US stocks right now as
> they have dividends that are approaching the same yield as bonds (~ 5%).

>>> I am interested in their resources too. Copper a big thing in Australia?

>> Sure. But that varys over time.

> I heard many rare-earth metals are in a bull market too. Heck, most
> any resource has been driven up in price. Makes you wonder if China
> and the other countries are a great long term investment scheme.

The main problem with direct investments in those is that they dont
have anything like the investor protection that we have come to expect.

> Think growing populations that want things made from resources.
> Other than cheap labor and the lure of tourism, how can they
> jumpstart themselves into the realm of a major economy?

The way china has done it.

> I am asking whether people will stop trying to immigrate to the US

Nope.

> and head to BRIC lands to make their fortunes.

Quite a few chinese who left china in the past have chosen to return there now.

You dont see as much of that with India.

Bugger all with Russia and Brazil.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: buy cheap shoes (www.shoes-ec.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/804d231d5db5f4d5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 12:38 pm
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Medicine Assistance
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3397cfe18b32ccc6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 1:22 pm
From: rvz1fqp4

Here is another site that I came across by American Consultants Rx
that really helped me and my family deal with the high cost of
prescription drugs at http://www.rxassistanceforfree.com .

==============================================================================
TOPIC: We Want Illegal Aliens Out of NY Out of USA!!!!!!!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/96493c5f219e2cd7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:20 pm
From: Louie

Mira amigos! Hay noticias.

Despues de un dia Louie goes bak to Puerto Rico. My wife me echa de
menos so much & I miss to her allso. Now I am finish with visit to my
daughter in NY hasta que el ano que viene. I doesnt have computer en
mi casa y por eso no voy a escribir nada en los grupos por un rato por
lo menos. Quiza I make visit to San Juan I use to computer de nuevo
pero no se cuando voy alli.

Les prometo que despues de un ano mejore de escribir ingles much! I
hopes to every body think I make help for deport to illegals. I hopes
to here ICE make deport to Psycho Illegal Uliana Abramova they are
take to long. No body can be save mientras ella esta en USA!!!

I try allways for be useful man. I hope to make succeed of this.

Saludos hasta luego,
Louie
(I am Puerto Rican American Patriot & Family Man)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: So quiet in here. Everyone Chrismas shopping?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/14ff3a2698c21c95?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:21 pm
From: Jon v Leipzig

Mike M. wrote:
> Haven't been reading/posting to the group all that frequently in recent
> months. But even considering the time of year, it still seems awfully quiet
> in here.
>
> Hell, I didn't even notice any posts from happy-go-lucky Rod. Something is
> definitely wrong. Nothing to read aside from spam/cross-posted messages.
>
> I downloaded 1,000 headers from my Outlook reader, but almost no poster
> names looked familiar. Same thing when I clicked the next 1,000 - nothing
> but spam and rambling, nonsensical cross-posted messages (appear to be a LOT
> more whackos cross-posting than normally the case.)
>
> Anyway, to keep things on topic, I'm saving money on Christmas expenses this
> year - and contributing to the "Green" movement at the same time - by
> cutting back on two things: no outside Christmas lights (or inside for that
> matter) and no Christmas tree. Just my small part/sacrifice, in the name of
> saving our planet...
>

I got my Frugal tree last summer. A small plastic tree was leftover from
a moving sale.

Might as well shop till ya drop...this "trends researcher" thinks this
xmas shopping season might be our last hurrah.
This dude correctly predicted the crash of '87, the dotcom boom/bust,
and the housing bubble. Gets favorable reviews from WSJ, Bizzweek,
msnbc, and others.

http://tinyurl.com/2p7k5a

Forecast: U.S. dollar could plunge 90 pct

- A financial crisis will likely send the U.S. dollar into a free fall
of as much as 90 percent and gold soaring to $2,000 an ounce, a trends
researcher said.

[ .........]

A result will be a drop in holiday spending a year from now, followed by
a permanent end of the "retail holiday frenzy" that has driven the U.S.
economy since the 1940s, he said.

----------

Those who take their predictions seriously ... consider the Trends
Research Institute. -- The Wall Street Journal

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 3:45 pm
From: clams_casino

Marsha wrote:

>>
>> --
>
>
> I'll admit my thinking processes are not normal, but if more people
> want live trees than what are planted, won't the demand eventually
> exceed supply? For example, if you have a tree farm with 100 trees
> and 50 people take trees, you re-plant 50 trees. The next year, you
> only have 50 trees to offer because it's going to take years for your
> newly-planted trees to develop, but 50 or more people want your trees,
> well you eventually won't have any trees ready. I'm really trying to
> understand this processs, honestly.
>
> Marsha/Ohio
>
OK - Some Facts per This Week (Dec28-Jan11)

Two out of three homes in US will have a real tree (29M in 2007 / $1.2B)
which will be cut in a five week season

15k commercial tree growers plant 73M trees/yr on 450k acres across
every state

It takes 6-10 years for a tree to reach a saleable condition (about
2k/acre) - where many die along the way

Most popular - Scotch pine (40%), Douglas Fir (35%) with noble fir,
white pine, balsam fir & white spruce at about 15% each

2007 - 9.3M artificial trees sold averaging $68 mostly imported from
China (up from 2M just five years ago) vs. $40 for a cut tree

Artificial trees are made from polyvinyl chloride which lasts for
centuries when discarded into landfills

Researchers estimate it takes five times more energy to make and ship a
fake vs. cut tree

Downside to cut trees is that each requires about 0.5 oz of pesticides

Each acre of a typical tree farm produces enough O2 to sustain 18 people
which also absorbs the CO2 produced by two cars for one year (26K miles)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: bought stocks in 2007?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b830423e6d61b3ab?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:34 pm
From: Quality_is_job_one

For 2007, the maximum long-term capital gains rate is 15 percent for
taxpayers in the 25 percent or higher tax bracket. The tax will be
only 5 percent if you are in a lower bracket. In 2008, taxpayers in
the 15 percent federal bracket or below will pay no capital gains
taxes.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 2:57 pm
From: Quality_is_job_one

A better explanation of capital gain tax levies for 2007 and onward:

http://www.americanfunds.com/resources/tax/tax-cuts.htm

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Did hot air popcorn machines go extinct?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1cd18f9995361a81?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 4:10 pm
From: clams_casino

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:

>>splitpea34On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 22:45:43 -0400, Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>But shocked I am to find out that
>>popcorn machines - especially hot air poppers - seemed to have vanished.
>>
>>
>
>
>Why? They proved themselves to be the idiotic idea that they were.
>Hot air poppers produce popcorn that is worthy of use in the national
>sawdust eating competiton as an extra points category.
>

I prefer styrofoam peanuts. They taste just like air-popped with the
added advantage of reduced calories.

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25 new messages in 17 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
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Today's topics:

www.globwholesale.com - 1 messages, 1 author
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: new movie wallpapers,tollywood news,gossips,functions,reviews,travel
information.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9208c1eea96a8bd4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 12:54 am
From: "andhralo@gmail.com"

new movie wallpapers,tollywood news,gossips,functions,reviews,travel
information.

for more click here
http://andhralo.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Futuretrieval
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a61f50d4b4b57db2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 3:02 am
From: Klaudio Zic

FUTURETRIEVER was first published by Klaudio Zic Publications, 2007,
www.lulu.com/astrology. Copyright (c) 2007 By Klaudio Zic. All Rights
Reserved. No part of this material may be reproduced or transmitted in
any form or by any means, electronic or otherwise, for commercial
purposes or otherwise, without the written permission of the author,
except when permitted by law.

YOUR FUTURE RETRIEVED

Did you ever fancy a world where wishes come true as future
misfortunes are easily predicted as well as annihilated by the
positive forces of human mind? Would that not be magick? What a
wonderful world it could be!

Would you agree on human beings being influenced by the celestial
bodies much as everything is in mutual influence as enmeshed in
eternal creation?

Mysterious forces at work frame human fate as unfathomed by
astrology. The future is molded in advance by the use of magick1.

We use the organized sky for our precise predictions, the better to
counter fate.

Why do we use the real celestial objects and constellations instead
of irrational means that flatter the superstitious? It is in our
belief that the noble arts of astronomy and astrology were once the
same art, both scientific and divine.

Superstition settles in only upon the fall of some great
civilisation. The profanation of celestial mathematics results in
false zodiacs and mangled astrological imagery. It is a well-known
fact that astronomy parted from pseudo-astrology as soon as the
alleged astrologers ceased to upgrade their calculations to precession
and sound scientific thought. Nowadays astrology is but superstition,
the so-called astrological signs having nothing to do with their
alleged heavenly counterparts. To state but one blatant example, the
sun is still in Libra on November 23rd, albeit the astrologist might
not be informed accordingly2.

Futuretrieving succeeds in atuning one's preferred future to one's
karma. One would otherwise suffer calamity, whether predicted or not,
often on account of bad astrology. Over the past 3000 years much evil
was done by influencing people with fase astrology3.

Pseudo-astrologists have brought much harm to humanity and continue
toi do so. To mention but a most obvious error, the astrologist's
victim is e.g. Told he's a "Scorpio" albeit his natal sun is clearly
in Virgo. It is easy to imagine a terrible series of errors that can
issue from living a life as based on a false identity.

Besides being mathematically off the mark, the false zodiacal
presumptions form a trojan psychological barrier to optimal an life.
The academic zodiac and RTRRT help setting one's futurity in a proper
perspective by determining one's true natal sky, as well as dissolving
the bad transits coming from the future while installing a positive
set of events into the future ahead instead of bad expectancy.

The academic zodiac hosts 22 IAU constellations while the present
ascendant set distributes 16 constellations over your true eastern
horizon. The Night & Day house system matches the 22/16 duo with
perfection. This may be the first time that the principles behind your
own real natal horoscope are available in comprehensive form. Whether
your interest lies in future-changing, astronomy or astrology, the
astronomic zodiac and precessed ascendant set will open a new future
for you. And don't forget that you can always change your future with
the help of the handy RTRRT, your daily magick kit!

It is our fair offer. Nothing less but your real natal sky. It is easy
to agree on that.

Klaudio Zic

klaudio_zic@yahoo.com

Redistribution of this file in any form is violation of the Copyright
Law.

This copyrighted material has been previously published as available
from http://www.lulu.com/astrology

Transmitted in any form or by any means, electronic or otherwise, for
commercial purposes or otherwise,

without the written permission of the author, except when permitted by
law.

1Future changing is achieved by inspiration, meditation and the RTRRT.
The real time reality rendering tools help molding one's future,
whether immediate or distant, into any form, implying freedom of
choice.

2Our calculations are based on the NASA ephemerides. Other sources may
have been meant for the doubtful entertainment of the superstitious,
but are of course not at all authoritative according to the current
IAU standards.

3Marriages were broken on account of an e.g. "Neptune in the 7th
house: which was in fact in the 6th house of the horoscope. People
were told they are "Scorpio" when their natal sun was clearly in
Virgo. A woman suffered her "Capricorn" ascendant only to discover it
was Pisces rising over her eastern horizon at birth.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wholesale world famous handbag-CHANEL/CHLOE/LV/GUCCI/Feidi and so on
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7865ec5e405c9dd2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 3:03 am
From: swukong26@gmail.com

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Natural gas space heaters
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/620118e627721656?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 3:55 am
From: nicksanspam@ece.villanova.edu

sylvan butler <ZsdbUse1+noZs_0712@Zbigfoot.Zcom.invalid> wrote:

>clare at snyder.on.ca <clare> wrote:

>> Vent free heaters produce COPIOUS amounts of water vapour - a much more
>> serious issue in most cases thanoxygen depletement or CO concentration.

>Except my humidifier (on a humidistat) runs nearly all winter long anyway.
>So added humidity from unvented gas heater would not likely be an issue.

It would a help...

>I'm thinking in climates where heating is needed (not just to take
>the chill off, e.g. southern C.A.) lack of humidity is frequently
>more of a problem than too much humidity.

An average 2400 ft^2 US house leaks naturally leaks 0.7 ACH, ie 224 cfm,
much more than ASHRAE's standard of 15 cfm per full-time occupant (which
used to be 5 cfm.) This makes house air very dry in wintertime and makes
the system efficiency of a vent-free heater higher than any vented heater.

A good (IDEAS) Canadian house only leaks 2.5 cfm. With people and green
plants evaporating water inside, it needs DEhumidification (eg mechanical
ventilation) in wintertime.

Nick

==============================================================================
TOPIC: CVS weekly deals 12/23-29 CVS printable coupons
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/400235c8a164274c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 4:21 am
From: Tree

http://budgetdial.blogspot.com/2007/12/cvs-weekly-extra-care-bucks-deals-1223.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: HDTV software
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/cc95cc03b4e8e5f5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 5:04 am
From: Jeff

Jeff wrote:
> This is an update to an earlier post I wrote about watching HDTV on the
> PC. It's working fairly well... Blows away my TV, and I can work while I
> have the TV in the background.
>
> There was some software mentioned. I'd like to try something other
> than the software that came with my Volar, it's pretty, but a little
> annoying to use.
>
> Thanks for the help, can you repost the software info?

Ah, I just remembered, it's Beyond TV.

I'm toying with the free list first:

<URL: http://www.hdtvtunerinfo.com/freesoftware.html />

Jeff
>
> Jeff

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 9:56 am
From: Dennis

On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 08:04:41 -0500, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:

>Jeff wrote:
>> This is an update to an earlier post I wrote about watching HDTV on the
>> PC. It's working fairly well... Blows away my TV, and I can work while I
>> have the TV in the background.
>>
>> There was some software mentioned. I'd like to try something other
>> than the software that came with my Volar, it's pretty, but a little
>> annoying to use.
>>
>> Thanks for the help, can you repost the software info?
>
> Ah, I just remembered, it's Beyond TV.
>
> I'm toying with the free list first:
>
><URL: http://www.hdtvtunerinfo.com/freesoftware.html />
>

One of the free packages that I saw mentioned a lot when I was
researching it was GBPVR. It works with Windows, while a lot of the
others are Linux based. I haven't personally tried it, though.

I use BeyondTV because I like the interface and features. There is a
free trial that you can download and install. If you like it, you
just buy an activation code (no re-install necessary). Similar deal
with Sage, but they have a shorter trial period.

Dennis (evil)
--
I'm a hands-on, footloose, knee-jerk head case. -George Carlin

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 10:30 am
From: Dennis

On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:56:52 -0800, Dennis <dgw80@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I use BeyondTV because I like the interface and features. There is a
>free trial that you can download and install. If you like it, you
>just buy an activation code (no re-install necessary). Similar deal
>with Sage, but they have a shorter trial period.

Also -- one trick that I learned when sorting out my HDTV PVR PC:
make a Ghost image (or equivalent) backup of your Windows system
partition before installing any of the trial software. Then if you
need to, you can restore the clean Windows image and reinstall the
trial SW for more testing before you lay down your cash. I found out
the hard way that the trial SW (and the SW support people) are not
forgiving if you have a problem that you can't sort out within the
trial period. In my case I had problems with my video card which
entailed installing, tweaking, reinstalling, then finally order and
delivery of a new card. By the time I had the hardware working with
HD, the SW trial period was expired. The only way to restart the
trial period is to re-install Windows. Having a backup image handy
makes an easy shortcut.

Dennis (evil)
--
I'm behind the eight ball, ahead of the curve, riding the wave,
dodging the bullet and pushing the envelope. -George Carlin

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Will an oil-filled radiator save me money?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f6eb6f9a24be546e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 5:42 am
From: Jeff

Rick wrote:
> Joe wrote:
>> On Dec 21, 10:30 am, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I live in a house built in 1920 with additions in 70's. Even in the
>>> 70's wall insulation was not used. I remember standing *over* my gas
>>> floor heater and shivering. Now that I've insulated the walls and
>>> insulated the windows I heat that same room with a electric radiator and
>>> it is much more comfortable. One fifth the heat, five times the comfort
>>> level.
>>>
>> How can I tell by touch that my walls need more insulation? I thought
>> last year that my walls suffered from inadequate insulation but then I
>> felt the walls of my front hallway which are definitely not insulated
>> and they were freezing. My inside walls were just cold. But I've felt
>> the walls of newer houses and they were cold too, not as cold as mine
>> but still cold to the touch. I did some cursory research on blown in
>> insulation last year and I remember reading that it is only
>> recommended for use in uninsulated walls. Is that true?
>
> You said in an earlier post that you just bought this house last year.
> Wasn't any of this - insulation or the lack of it - discovered in the
> inspection? (Please tell me you didn't buy the house without getting an
> inspection...)

You would be surprised what isn't covered in an inspection. I have
friend that bought a house that had 4 inspections before closing. Those
inspections never revealed that the heating/AC didn't work, that the
plumbing was disconnected in numerous places. And some other glaring
faults that I noticed in 5 minutes.

Now, a lot of people are keyed into attic insulation, because heat
rises. But heat will escape through any surface where it is colder on
the other side. It is very easy to add attic insulation but is of little
help if your walls/floor are heat porous.

Lets take a 30' x 40' house, That's 1200 SF of floor and attic space
and roughly 1200 SF of wall space.

Lets insulate the attic to R15, at 40 F colder outside than in that's
2400 BTU/hr. That's a bit less that half a single electric space heater.
Double that insulation and you get a quarter of an electric space
heater. Diminishing returns.

Now lets assume the walls are uninsulated with single pane windows.
That's about R2, that's 24,000 BTUs each hour fleeing. Or almost 5 space
heaters running full blast. Insulate those walls and you'll take away 4
space heaters, instead of a fourth of a space heater.

Note that even if you insulate everything you will still have loss
through infiltration. Sealing air leaks should be job one. An average
insulated house will lose one third it's heat through air leaks.

My math may be a bit off, it's early...

Jeff

If it was inspected the person *must* have looked in an
> attic or crawl space and could have given an assessment regarding
> insulation in a matter of minutes - heck seconds - just by looking in
> the attic.
>
> Rick

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 10:25 am
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)

In article <566833c7-3dc2-4d8d-8584-e179d4615977@p1g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
Joe <joe5345@gmail.com> wrote:
[ ... ]
>It's a 50 year old home that I bought last year. the Windows are 50
>years old and although there are no real breezes coming through I
>thinnk their full insulative properties went bye bye long ago.

Go to a home center and get a batch of the shrink-film window cover
kits (one per window and a few spares--they're cheap, especially in
the multiple window kits). Wal-Mart also has them. Install one on
each window; also pick up some tubes of latex caulk and caulk around
the window casings. This will greatly reduce heat loss.

If you have any attic access doors or hatches, cover those as well. I
have an access hatch in each house, and decided to put the shrink film
over them a few years ago; as I was installing it, the film was getting
sucked up against the hatch! With the hatch covered, the house became
far more comfortable and the heater runs much less.

> I've
>somewhat eliminated all the breezes coming from outlets and doors but
>the outside walls are still too cold to the touch for warm air to
>stick around too long. That combined with the cold windows seem to cut
>down on the residual heat circulation.
[ ... ]

The cold walls mean they're not insulated; your floors probably are not
insulated either. There's probably a little insulation in your attic,
but not likely enough by current standards. Start working on upgrades
over the next few years, they'll pay off.

You can use incense sticks to locate air leaks; they're cheap and safe,
since they don't have an open flame.

Gary

--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net

http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/

Yoko Onos' former driver tried to extort $2M from her, threating to
"release embarassing recordings...". What, he has a copy of her album?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: how much are you all paying for cell phone service and are you happy
with your plan?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9013263c432ebe2f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 6:07 am
From: George

JL wrote:
> I'd like to do a survey of how you all like your plans. I just signed
> up with Sprint. $59/month for the "550 anytime minutes plan" for 2
> phones (family plan--wife and I have to share the 550 minutes) plus
> $15/month for the Access Pack (unlimited web browsing on the phone).
> That's a total of $74/month for 2 phones with 550 anytime minutes. Plus
> we received 2 brand new phones -- the LG LX-160 which are nice and that
> have great screens.
>
> There's a TV pack for $20/month that includes the web browsing in the
> Access Pack plus allows you to watch shows from over 20 different
> networks on your phone -- like ABC, CBS, Comedy Central, etc.. I'm not
> sure if watching TV on the phone eats up your anytime minutes. If not,
> I'll probably delete the Access Pack and upgrade to the TV Pack.
>
> A friend of mine has Revol but he says the coverage area is spotty.

I don't think the walmart low prices everyday thing works for cellphones
(or other things for that matter). There is more to cell phone service
than the cost of the plan. You also need a carrier that has good
coverage where you will use the phone. For example tmobile and Sprint
are not good choices here. Guess which ones have the lowest prices?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 8:50 am
From: jl

> Wow, that's expensive. I got 3 (free) phones and 1000 minutes,
> unlimited minutes nights and weekends, and unlimited minutes when
> calling each-other for only $100 (after taxes, that's my final bill.)
>

Sprint has a 700 anytime family plan for $69.99 and a 1400 anytime
minute family plan for $89.99 (for 2 phones). Plus add an extra
9.99/month for having a 3rd phone. That also includes unlimited calling
each other and nights/weekend. Also, the phones are free.

What service are you using?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: FREE Sample of Kenneth Cole Reaction
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/260bd500fdf5e409?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 6:28 am
From: "FreebiesPl.us"

FREE Sample of Kenneth Cole Reaction
http://www.freebiespl.us/?p=353

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Dine with Your Canine Pet Food Sample
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3e17fcc8496d81d6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 6:36 am
From: "FreebiesPl.us"

Free Dine with Your Canine Pet Food Sample
http://www.freebiespl.us/?p=351

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 9:24 am
From: "Ian"

"FreebiesPl.us" <sales@boostviews.com> wrote in message
news:bfaf3176-3520-42cb-abd1-249724d264ce@i12g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> Free Dine with Your Canine Pet Food Sample
>

The correct URL is -

http://www.dinewithyourcanine.com/samples.shtml

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 7:28 am
From: barbie gee

On Fri, 21 Dec 2007, Marsha wrote:

> barbie gee wrote:
>>> "Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message
>>>> I'll admit my thinking processes are not normal, but if more people want
>>>> live trees than what are planted, won't the demand eventually exceed
>>>> supply?
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, and if fewer people want live trees than what are planted, the supply
>>> will exceed the demand. I recall more than once driving by tree farms here
>>> in the Midwest where there are fields and fields full of trees that have
>>> obviously matured past the point of being practical to harvest. I think
>>> it's
>>> a good bet they were not harvested in order to avoid glutting the market
>>> and
>>> driving the price down.
>>
>>
>> and, I've yet to see a tree lot "sell out", and I live in a major
>> metropolis, not a podunk with a limited market. Maybe those last trees are
>> rejects, but they remain unsold, whatever the reason.
>>
>> Marsha's thinking is painfully linear. There are the different varieties
>> of trees, trees of different sizes (meaning ages) and so forth. There is
>> NOT simple cut one-replace one system going on here.
>
> Painfully linear? That hurts :-) It was just a simple "I don't quite
> understand business" statement. Obviously I don't belong to Mensa in that
> department.

C'mon girlfriend, let your fingers do the Googling;

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_tree_cultivation>
<http://www.salary.com/careers/layouthtmls/crel_display_Cat10_Ser132_Par232.html>
and so on.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Make Money With GOOGLE- Free To Join
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/047bbb9db4b766f4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 7:41 am
From: nagi54

Best Business Opportunity with Google from Home/Cafe
and make big money by the end of every day!

Details at:- http://www.freewebs.com/hsnagi/jobs.htm

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Do Not buy from Circuit City
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3fb963f1666140e8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 8:04 am
From: SMS 斯蒂文* 夏

Gerald Newton wrote:

> Now the bummer. The original order was paid for by debit card and the
> money was given to Circuit City as shown in my online bank record. It
> now has been 7 days and they still have my money for the canceled
> order. I called yesterday and again got some guy in Manila who said
> the money for the canceled order would not go back into my bank
> account for 2 to 5 business days and that they still have until
> tomorrow, Friday to put the money back in. Funny how they can
> immediately take the money, but have to wait a week to put the money
> back. Do Not Buy From Circuit City! I making this post all over the
> Internet to teach these bums a lesson.

The bigger lesson you should have learned is to _never_ use a debit card
for big ticket items. You lose all the consumer protection that the Fair
Credit Billing Act extends to credit card purchases. _You_ have to fight
to get your money back in your account, rather than have the store fight
to get the money from the credit card issuer.

Always use a credit card for big ticket items. You gain important
consumer protections, plus if you return or cancel the order within the
same billing period, you're not out any money at all.

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 8:05 am
From: SMS 斯蒂文* 夏

imascot wrote:
> George Grapman <sfgeorge@paccbell.net> wrote in news:0lWaj.704$se5.697
> @nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com:
>
>> M.L. wrote:
>>>>> I'd love to know any reason that someone would use a MC/Visa logo
>>>>> debit card rather than an actual credit card, because I can't think
>>>>> of any good reasons.
>>>
>>> No possible risk to their credit status due to spending beyond one's
>>> means.
>>>
>> Also useful to people with bad credit who can not get a regular card.
>
> Coincidentally, there is a real life problem with a debit card just down the
> article list here under "Do Not Buy From Circuit City"

I saw that thread.

The bigger lesson the original poster on that thread should have learned
is to _never_ use a debit card for big ticket items. You lose all the
consumer protection that the Fair Credit Billing Act extends to credit
card purchases. _You_ have to fight to get your money back in your
account, rather than have the store fight to get the money from the
credit card issuer.

Always use a credit card for big ticket items. You gain important
consumer protections, plus if you return or cancel the order within the
same billing period, you're not out any money at all.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 10:31 am
From: val189

On Dec 19, 10:20 am, "rick++" <rick...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> The other safety technique I employ
> is a special "gatewayaccount", i.e. one exposed to
> the outside world, with very limited funding.
> Its tied to checks, bill pay, and debit card.
> In general it always has less than $1000,
> except for the moment bills are paid.
> The deposit and billpays are scheduled to
> be simulataneous so no large amount exists
> for long.

Where do you park the rest of your funds? In a related savings or MM
account? Same bank? Do you have another checking account with a
different bank? Mail checks from one to the other? Just curious how
the funds flow into your gateway chkg. acct.
Thanks.

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 8:16 am
From: Warren Block

hchickpea@hotmail.com <hchickpea@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>splitpea34On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 22:45:43 -0400, Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:
>
>>But shocked I am to find out that
>>popcorn machines - especially hot air poppers - seemed to have vanished.
>
> Why? They proved themselves to be the idiotic idea that they were.
> Hot air poppers produce popcorn that is worthy of use in the national
> sawdust eating competiton as an extra points category. Popping corn
> without oil or flavoring such as are used in kettle corn is like
> cooking your porterhouse steak in the microwave. It tastes like crap,
> it wastes your time, and is a waste of money.

Air-popped popcorn tastes like popcorn, not oil. While most people are
used to lots of oil to enhance the taste of terrible food, it's possible
to get past that.

Which is not to say you can't add flavoring. A spray bottle with water
will allow any kind of flavoring to stick: salt, spices, parmesan, any
of a hundred specially-made popcorn flavorings that range from terrible
to very good.

--
Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota * USA

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 8:57 am
From: jl

Limbaugh is a total blithering idiot. He never analyzes an issue
completely. It's all just one sided.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 10:00 am
From: jdoe

On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 11:57:28 -0500, jl <jl@nowhereszville.biz> wrote:

>Limbaugh is a total blithering idiot. He never analyzes an issue
>completely. It's all just one sided.
since you know that already why do you listen to his show? I know that
the NY Times is a slanted leftist propaganda tool, I don't read it.
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Dec 22 2007 10:34 am
From: SMS 斯蒂文* 夏

jl wrote:
> Limbaugh is a total blithering idiot. He never analyzes an issue
> completely. It's all just one sided.

Hey, he got very rich by conning enough right-wing wackos into actually
believing anything he says. Remember, he's an entertainer, not a news
person.

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20 new messages in 10 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Do Not buy from Circuit City - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3fb963f1666140e8?hl=en
* Natural gas space heaters - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/620118e627721656?hl=en
* Will an oil-filled radiator save me money? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f6eb6f9a24be546e?hl=en
* how much are you all paying for cell phone service and are you happy with
your plan? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9013263c432ebe2f?hl=en
* So quiet in here. Everyone Chrismas shopping? - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/14ff3a2698c21c95?hl=en
* HDTV software - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/cc95cc03b4e8e5f5?hl=en
* Did hot air popcorn machines go extinct? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1cd18f9995361a81?hl=en
* HYUNDAI WARRANTY - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ef493d1b2fffa985?hl=en
* ((((((jenitha)))))) I really hope you get this job. I wish you the best - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e903f2166467c777?hl=en
* Cheap Fashion Shoes & Clothing & Mobile Phones & Handbags Wholesale on www.
fashion-sky.com - 5 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/526b0c6f8869b070?hl=en

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 8:39 pm
From: JL

>> Especially considering you then cancelled the order when you
>> found that you couldn't arrange to have anyone pick it up after all.
>>
>> The scenario doesn't reflect badly at all on Circuit City, but on
>> you as an unreasonable customer.
>>
>> Don

My wife works at a Buick dealership and sees a lot of demanding
customers everyday. Some people expect to buy the car for $50-$100 over
dealer cost and to have their asses kissed thoroughly and completely the
entire transaction.

As far as Circuit City, I haven't shopped there in years. I think the
last item I bought there was a video card for my friend's PC (was an
emergency situation). It was overpriced but had the advantage of being
readily available. I usually order my PC parts from newegg.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 6:35 pm
From: Marsha

JL wrote:
> My wife works at a Buick dealership and sees a lot of demanding
> customers everyday. Some people expect to buy the car for $50-$100 over
> dealer cost and to have their asses kissed thoroughly and completely the
> entire transaction.

What does your wife consider a fair offer for a new car?

Marsha/Ohio

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 5:41 pm
From: sylvan butler

On Tue, 18 Dec 2007 22:06:57 -0500, clare at snyder.on.ca <clare> wrote:
> Vent free heaters produce COPIOUS amounts of water vapour - a much
> more serious issue in most cases thanoxygen depletement or CO
> concentration.

Except my humidifier (on a humidistat) runs nearly all winter long
anyway. So added humidity from unvented gas heater would not likely be
an issue. I'm thinking in climates where heating is needed (not just to
take the chill off, e.g. southern C.A.) lack of humidity is frequently
more of a problem than too much humidity.

sdb
--
What's seen on your screen?

http://PcScreenWatch.com
sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 5:56 pm
From: "Gini"

"Joe" wrote
...................
>
> Yeah well, I have a couple of children that have a penchant for
> knocking their covers off in the middle of the night so I have to keep
> the heat in the low sixties in case.
====
That's what pajama sleepers are for. You can even layer them.
That worked quite well when we lived in an uninsulated 19th century
farmhouse with nothing more than
a wood stove for heat. Mornings were a little nippy--frost on the windows
and such.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 9:09 pm
From: Rick

Joe wrote:
>
> On Dec 21, 10:30 am, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:
>
> > I live in a house built in 1920 with additions in 70's. Even in the
> > 70's wall insulation was not used. I remember standing *over* my gas
> > floor heater and shivering. Now that I've insulated the walls and
> > insulated the windows I heat that same room with a electric radiator and
> > it is much more comfortable. One fifth the heat, five times the comfort
> > level.
> >
>
> How can I tell by touch that my walls need more insulation? I thought
> last year that my walls suffered from inadequate insulation but then I
> felt the walls of my front hallway which are definitely not insulated
> and they were freezing. My inside walls were just cold. But I've felt
> the walls of newer houses and they were cold too, not as cold as mine
> but still cold to the touch. I did some cursory research on blown in
> insulation last year and I remember reading that it is only
> recommended for use in uninsulated walls. Is that true?

You said in an earlier post that you just bought this house last year.
Wasn't any of this - insulation or the lack of it - discovered in the
inspection? (Please tell me you didn't buy the house without getting an
inspection...) If it was inspected the person *must* have looked in an
attic or crawl space and could have given an assessment regarding
insulation in a matter of minutes - heck seconds - just by looking in
the attic.

Rick

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 8:54 pm
From: JL

I'd like to do a survey of how you all like your plans. I just signed
up with Sprint. $59/month for the "550 anytime minutes plan" for 2
phones (family plan--wife and I have to share the 550 minutes) plus
$15/month for the Access Pack (unlimited web browsing on the phone).
That's a total of $74/month for 2 phones with 550 anytime minutes. Plus
we received 2 brand new phones -- the LG LX-160 which are nice and that
have great screens.

There's a TV pack for $20/month that includes the web browsing in the
Access Pack plus allows you to watch shows from over 20 different
networks on your phone -- like ABC, CBS, Comedy Central, etc.. I'm not
sure if watching TV on the phone eats up your anytime minutes. If not,
I'll probably delete the Access Pack and upgrade to the TV Pack.

A friend of mine has Revol but he says the coverage area is spotty.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 8:46 pm
From: "Daniel T."

On Dec 21, 11:54 pm, JL <no...@nowheresville.biz> wrote:

> I'd like to do a survey of how you all like your plans. I just signed
> up with Sprint. $59/month for the "550 anytime minutes plan" for 2
> phones (family plan--wife and I have to share the 550 minutes) plus
> $15/month for the Access Pack (unlimited web browsing on the phone).
> That's a total of $74/month for 2 phones with 550 anytime minutes. Plus
> we received 2 brand new phones -- the LG LX-160 which are nice and that
> have great screens.

Wow, that's expensive. I got 3 (free) phones and 1000 minutes,
unlimited minutes nights and weekends, and unlimited minutes when
calling each-other for only $100 (after taxes, that's my final bill.)

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 6:15 pm
From: Marsha

Lou wrote:
> "Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message news:fkhm3f$qd9$1@news.datemas.de...
>
>>Derald wrote:
>>
>>>Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I don't mean to offend anyone, but to
>>>>cut down a live tree and then discard it when you're done just does not
>>>>make sense to me, even if it is from a "tree farm".
>>>
>>>Funny, that's exactly how some folks feel about commercially grown
>>>flowers.
>>
>>Flowers that die and get thrown away are not a practical gift, IMO. It
>>makes more sense to get something that can be re-planted, so you can
>>enjoy it for years.
>
>
> Cut flowers aren't meant to be practical. They're meant to be pretty.
> Sometimes they're meant to show that the giver is well enough off that every
> decision doesn't have to be ruled by strict practicality. Even when the
> whatever could be replanted, that doesn't necessarily mean that you could
> enjoy flowers in the middle of winter, a time when some people might
> appreciate them the most. And oh yeah, a good many flowers are annuals, and
> even if replanted, wouldn't last beyond one season anyway.
>

Obviously cut flowers aren't meant to be practical and obviously some
are only annuals. That's why I don't like them. I don't enjoy looking
at flowers for a few days, watching them die, and then throwing them
away. When I mentioned re-planting, I meant something suitable to plant
outdoors for the giftee's climate or something that could be grown in
indoors.

Marsha/Ohio

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 6:25 pm
From: Dennis

On Fri, 21 Dec 2007 19:15:00 -0500, Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:

>Okay, I get it now. This was just one of those things that needed an
>explanation or example different than what I was thinking. Enjoy your tree!

Thank you -- Happy Holidays to you too!

I'm not sure how what seemed (to me) like an innocent question about
Christmas trees engendered so many nasty replies. Kind of ironic,
given the original subject of the thread. Maybe all the spam has put
folks in flame-first-ask-questions-later mode.

Dennis (evil)
--
I'm behind the eight ball, ahead of the curve, riding the wave,
dodging the bullet and pushing the envelope. -George Carlin

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 8:25 pm
From: "Mike M."

"Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message news:fkhrvk$1bc$1@news.datemas.de...
> Lou wrote:
>> "Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message
>> news:fkhm3f$qd9$1@news.datemas.de...
>>
>>>Derald wrote:
>>>
>>>>Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I don't mean to offend anyone, but to
>>>>>cut down a live tree and then discard it when you're done just does not
>>>>>make sense to me, even if it is from a "tree farm".
>>>>
>>>>Funny, that's exactly how some folks feel about commercially grown
>>>>flowers.
>>>
>>>Flowers that die and get thrown away are not a practical gift, IMO. It
>>>makes more sense to get something that can be re-planted, so you can
>>>enjoy it for years.
>>
>>
>> Cut flowers aren't meant to be practical. They're meant to be pretty.
>> Sometimes they're meant to show that the giver is well enough off that
>> every
>> decision doesn't have to be ruled by strict practicality. Even when the
>> whatever could be replanted, that doesn't necessarily mean that you could
>> enjoy flowers in the middle of winter, a time when some people might
>> appreciate them the most. And oh yeah, a good many flowers are annuals,
>> and
>> even if replanted, wouldn't last beyond one season anyway.
>>
>
> Obviously cut flowers aren't meant to be practical and obviously some are
> only annuals. That's why I don't like them. I don't enjoy looking at
> flowers for a few days, watching them die, and then throwing them away.
> When I mentioned re-planting, I meant something suitable to plant outdoors
> for the giftee's climate or something that could be grown in indoors.
>
> Marsha/Ohio

Or, as it relates to dead Christmas trees, their post-life usefulness
(mainly in the form of mulch - our city gathers and chips the trees, then
gives away the mulch to area residents and/or distributes the waste product
at various local parks/median strips) continues on long after they have
served their main purpose.

"Green", brown... I guess it's all the same. Their death is not totally in
vain (more free mulch for me!)

Mike
--treeless, in accordance with my own personal beliefs, though I respect
(and defend) others' right to choose

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 6:58 pm
From: Jeff

This is an update to an earlier post I wrote about watching HDTV on
the PC. It's working fairly well... Blows away my TV, and I can work
while I have the TV in the background.

There was some software mentioned. I'd like to try something other
than the software that came with my Volar, it's pretty, but a little
annoying to use.

Thanks for the help, can you repost the software info?

Jeff

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 8:22 pm
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

>splitpea34On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 22:45:43 -0400, Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:

>But shocked I am to find out that
>popcorn machines - especially hot air poppers - seemed to have vanished.

Why? They proved themselves to be the idiotic idea that they were.
Hot air poppers produce popcorn that is worthy of use in the national
sawdust eating competiton as an extra points category. Popping corn
without oil or flavoring such as are used in kettle corn is like
cooking your porterhouse steak in the microwave. It tastes like crap,
it wastes your time, and is a waste of money.

Movie theatres promoted oil-free popcorn back in the 1980s. The
public responded with a resounding "YUCK!!" Your "I am shocked!" is
as cardboard as the one in "Casablanca."

Buy a real popcorn machine. Cretors still makes good ones, and if you
can find a Manley that still works and use coconut oil, you'll have
people wanting you to package it for them to take home.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 9:20 pm
From: Rick

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> >splitpea34On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 22:45:43 -0400, Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:
>
> >But shocked I am to find out that
> >popcorn machines - especially hot air poppers - seemed to have vanished.
>
> Why? They proved themselves to be the idiotic idea that they were.
> Hot air poppers produce popcorn that is worthy of use in the national
> sawdust eating competiton as an extra points category. Popping corn
> without oil or flavoring such as are used in kettle corn is like
> cooking your porterhouse steak in the microwave. It tastes like crap,
> it wastes your time, and is a waste of money.
>
> Movie theatres promoted oil-free popcorn back in the 1980s. The
> public responded with a resounding "YUCK!!" Your "I am shocked!" is
> as cardboard as the one in "Casablanca."
>
> Buy a real popcorn machine. Cretors still makes good ones, and if you
> can find a Manley that still works and use coconut oil, you'll have
> people wanting you to package it for them to take home.

Not for me - thanks. Some of us can live with - and like - food that
isn't drenched in fats and sugars. If I wanted to make it with oil I
wouldn't be asking about hot air poppers. I'd just make it on the stove
like my parents did - in any old 5 quart pan with a cup of "popcorn oil"
for every batch. To each his own "Yuck!"

Rick

==============================================================================
TOPIC: HYUNDAI WARRANTY
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ef493d1b2fffa985?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 10:17 pm
From: Bill

"ROBERTMARKMAN@SBCGLOBAL.NET" wrote:
>
> We bought a 2002 Elantra GT, largely because of its generous warranty.

I have a 2001 Elantra GT and recently (after passing the 5
year/60k bumper-to-bumper warranty limit, I had the check engine
light come on. I had this happen once under warranty and it was
a sensor, and that turned out to be what it was this time as
well. My local mechanic diagnosed it and I told him not to fix
it if it was power train related because the Hyundai had the 10
year/100k mile power train coverage. So I brought it to the
dealer. I had to agree to pay their $95 diagnosis charge, which
would be waived if it was covered by warranty; since I assumed
it would be, I told them fine. They told me it was a sensor, and
because it was EXTERNAL to the transmission, it was NOT covered
by the power train warranty. At that point I had to pay another
$95 (hourly labor charge) and $200 or so for the sensor. What
really pissed me off was that the labor for each piece was
probably much less than an hour, but they charged it separately.
And they were completely unsympathetic about it being power
train that should be covered under warranty.

I had the same thing happen several months later. This time I
called Hyundai hoping I could convince them to cover it under
warranty. They actually called the dealer and told me I had to
bring it to the dealer, who of course would have to diagnose it,
and of course would not cover it if it was external (which it
was). I let me mechanic do it instead.

I currently have the air bag light coming on. My mechanic said
it needs a new air bag but I am fairly sure it's another sensor
(he doesn't see a lot of Hyundais so he isn't familiar with
their problems). Apparently Hyundais are becoming notorious for
this sort of this once they get out of warranty. I really like
the Elantra GT, but I don't think I'd buy another Hyundai
because of this warranty BS.

Bill

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ((((((jenitha)))))) I really hope you get this job. I wish you the best
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e903f2166467c777?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 11:25 pm
From: "sexy.adult3@gmail.com"

((((((jenitha)))))) I really hope you get this job. I wish you the
best
of luck.

jenitha
search this site must click me
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cheap Fashion Shoes & Clothing & Mobile Phones & Handbags Wholesale on

www.fashion-sky.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/526b0c6f8869b070?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Fri, Dec 21 2007 11:47 pm
From: fashion-sky.001@hotmail.com

Dear my friend
It is our pleasure to meet you here.
we are wholesaler sport shoes,clothing,electrons in Fujian of China.
our website: http://www.fashion-sky.com
We are professional and honest wholesaler of all kinds of brand
sneaks and apparel.the products
our company supply are as follows:
1).Nike Jordans
Jordan 1 jordan 1.5 jordan 2 jordan 3 jordan 3.5 jordan 4 jordan 5
jordan 5.5 jordan 6 jordan 6.5 jordan 7 jordan 8 jordan 9 jordan 9.5
jordan 10 jordan 11 jordan 12 jordan 13 jordan 13.5 jordan 14 jordan
15 jordan 16 jordan 17 jordan 18 jordan 18.5 jordan 19 jordan 20
jordan 21 jordan 21.5 jordan 22 jordan King jordan Dub Zero Jordan 23
Jordan 7.5
2).Air Force One Air Force one (low) Air Force one (High) Air Force
one (Mid) Air Force one (clear) Air Force One 25 year
3).SHOX Shox R3 Shox R4 Shox R5 Shox TL1 Shox TL2 Shox TL3 Shox NZ
Shox OZ Shox Turbo Show GO Shox CL Shox Coqnescenti Shox Energia Shox
Explodine Shox Monster Shox Rhythmic Shox Warrior
4).Bape Shoes Bape Bape (transparent)
5).Air max AirMax 90 AirMax 95 AirMax 97 AirMax 2003 AirMax 2004
AirMax 2005 Air Max 2006 AirMax 180 AirMax LTD AirMax TN AirMax solas
AirMax 87 AirMax Rift
6).Puma Puma Rpt2 Puma SK6 Puma Jayfi Puma Cir Puma Speed Puma Repli
Puma Future Cat Puma Mostro Puma Lifestyle
7).Dunk SB Dunk High Dunk Low
8).Timberland Timberland High Timberland Low
9).Adidas Adidas 35 Adicolor Country city sense Adidas NBA
11).Prada & Gucci Prada Gucci
12).Footballer Shoes Footballer
13).Locaste
14).converse & Reebok converse Reebok
15).D&G shoes
16).Dsquared2 shoes
17).James shoes
18).Nike King
9).Children shoes Jordan Shox
20).Women shoes Women Jordans Women Shox R3 Women Shox R4 Women AirMax
95&97 Women AirMax 03&06 Women Dunk Women Shox NZ Women AF1
21).sandal & baboosh Nike Puma Gucci Prada
CLOTHES 1).Bape 2).ED Hardy 3).BBC 4).CLH 5).LRG 6).Artful Dodger
Hoodies 7).GINO GREEN GLOBAL 8).10 Deep 9).A&F Coat 11).Jersey NBA
Jersey Football Jersey 12).Juicy Bikini 13).Adidas Coat 14).F1 Coat
15).D&G Coat 16).Superman Coat 17).NBA Coat
JEAN 1).E&D Jeans 2).BBC Jeans 3).BAPE Jeans 4).D&G Jeans 5).EVSIU
Jeans 6).Red monkey 7).COOGI Jeans
T-shirt 1).POLO 2007 polo(women) 2007 POLO IIII(Men) POLO (stripe)
polo (small )
2).Lacoste Lacoste (LONG) Lacoste (SHORT) 3).Name Brand shirt D&G
Shirt Giorgio Armani TN Shirt 4).BBC T-shirt 5).LRG & gina green
glalal 6).Triumvir 7).ED handy 8).Evsiu 9).R.M.B 10).CLOT
Burse & Handbag 1).LV Bag 2).Gucci Bag 3).Dior Bag 4).Chanel Bag
5).Fendi Bag 6).Coach Bag 7).Burberrys Bag 8).Prada Bag 9).Man Leisure
Bag 11).D&G bag 12).nike bag 13).Wallet 14).Suitcase
Electronics 1).Vertu Mobile 2).New iphone Mobile(apple iphones,apple
iphones,apple iphones,apple iphones) 3).Nokia Mobile(Nokia N95,Nokia
N95 Nokia N95 Nokia N95 Nokia N93,Nokia N70,Nokia N92,Nokia 8800)
4).moto Mobile 5).PSP Game & memory card 6).Sony Mobile 7).Samsung
Mobile 8).Ipod nano 9).Sony PS3 10).Laptops IBM laptops DELL laptops
Sony laptops ASUS laptops
CAP 1).ED Hardy Cap 2).New Bape & NY Cap 3).RMC Cap 4).New era NBA
5).F1 6).Chanel 7).D&G 8).gucci 9).LV 10).Prada 11).PUMA 12).wool
WATCH 1).Rolex 2).Omega 3).Cartier 4).Chanel 5).Piaget 6).Breitling
7).Bvlgari 8).Corum
Sunglasses 1).Gucci Sunglasses 2).D&G Sunglasses 3).Dior Sunglasses
4).LV Sunglasses 5).Chanel Sunglasses 6).Prada Sunglasses 7).Versace
Sunglasses 8).Giorgio Armani
Strap 1).Bape Strap 2).D&G Strap 3).Gucci Strap 4).LV Strap 5).Scarf
Other 1).Lighter

size chart
Men Size:
US: 7 8 8.5 9 9.5 10 10.5 11 11.5 12 13 14 15
UK: 6 7 7.5 8 8.5 9 9.5 10 10.5 11 12 13 14
EUR: 40 41 42 42.5 43 44 44.5 45 45.5 46 47.5 48 49
Women Size:
US: 5 5.5 6 6.5 7 7.5 8 8.5
UK: 2.5 3 3.5 4 4.5 5 5.5 6
EUR: 35.5 36 36.5 37.5 38 38.5 39 40

Kid's
US: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 7.5 8 8.5 9 9.5 10 10.5 11 11.5 12 12.5 13 13.5
UK: 13 1 2 3 4 5 6 6.5 7 7.5 8 8.5 9 9.5 10 10.5 11 11.5 12 12.5
EUR:17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 24.5 25 25.5 26 26.5 27 27.5 28 29 30 30.5
31