Frugal Living: Oct 29, 2008

Wednesday, October 29, 2008

25 new messages in 11 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Send free sms & save money.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/19ad67ede75060fb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 10:50 pm
From: madhurimaniknepal

Send free sms & save money.
Sending bulk free sms can be highly useful in your business and
earning. You can send free bulk sms using bulk sms gateways. You can
also use this facility in sending greetings to your friends.
http://free-bulk-sms-message-gateways.blogspot.com/

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Stagflation ...the next big thang...and a cure of sorts
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/619c01ee4664afb1?hl=en
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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 12:03 am
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)

In article <6mq47pFhut8iU1@mid.individual.net>, Rod Speed wrote:

>Some terminal fuckwit that hasnt ever been able to manage
>a better job than delivering pizzas by bicycle, claiming to be
>Don Klipstein <don@manx.misty.com> wrote just the usual
>puerile silly shit that's exactly what you'd expect from a
>terminal fuckwit that hasnt ever been able to manage
>a better job than delivering pizzas by bicycle.

With all the time you spend online, you are still unaware that what
I professionally deliver by bicycle and have professionally delivered
by bicycle since I started such work in January 1985 has included 2
pizzas, both of them more than 15 years ago.
Not that even 30% of the miles I have travelled by a vehicle that I was
driving in any of every year in my life that I drove a vehicle were done
via a vehicle with any sort of a motor! Is such ability to outright
travel by bicycle nowadays an asset more than a liability?

You better improve your research on your many deserved enemies or else
change your ways enough to make the FAQ on you untrue to extent much
greater than achieving close to 1 year of advancement of emotional
maturity towards age 12 from what the maybe-10-year-old FAQ on you
indicates.

I do have more than 1 job. You are doing better at being an irritant
sub-troll deserving a FAQ than knowing the enemies that you like to
accumulate.

And I do not mind this posting of mine being killfiled by old-heads on
basis of responding once or twice or thrice monthly to the sub-troll on
basis of liking to expose better to newbies how severely Usenet has a
sub-troll having a FAQ that is fairly-current even if something like 10
years old!

Will you attempt to "get in the last word" via your occaisional-MO
that uses "flushing of reams" (my paraphrasing) or will you repeat your
more-usual-one(s)-using-"fuckwit" and 100% snippage of what was said by
the whoever you respond to via such a tactic?

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 1:47 am
From: "Rod Speed"

Some terminal fuckwit that hasnt ever been able to manage
a better job than delivering pizzas by bicycle, claiming to be
Don Klipstein <don@manx.misty.com> wrote just the usual
puerile silly shit that's exactly what you'd expect from a
terminal fuckwit that hasnt ever been able to manage
a better job than delivering pizzas by bicycle.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 5:33 pm
From: Tony

Stagflation is something you won't see as the whole world with the
exception of a few countries is in recession. What you will see in America
is about 2 to 3 years of deflation followed by high inflation or the term
hyperinflation. You want to start buying gold, silver and platinum in a
few years' time. I know you've heard it before but i never get anything
wrong. What you say about these punks is correct. All of them are
imbeciles.

phil scott wrote:

> Educate yourself at the hands on level...become an entrepreneur, thats
> where baloney walks and skills talk...
>
> I am 67 years old and currently doing reasonably well only because my
> skill sets have recently come back in demand due to the decline of
> talent as most old farts are retiring.. and because of my ongoing
> agressive accumulation of new skills and abilities.
>
> ...the new breed of kiddies doesnt have much of a clue... and that
> includes many in the under age 45 bracket .. under at 35 its a
> complete disaster as best I can tell... I run into pipe wholesalers
> these days who will send me a box of pipe unions when i ordered
> valves... completely stunning levels of incompetence... on a recent
> test that included the branch manager... I gave him a spec and a
> sketch of a common fitting adapter... he came back with a whole box
> full of everything but and said take your pick.... no clue at
> all..not even the faintest.
>
> (there is hope, a new breed... teens to 20 somethings seem to have
> seen through much of this but are hampered by a grossly incompetent US
> educational system, lack of employer training in a majority of cases,
> and such low pay that they have no incentive to study up at home..)
>
> Stagflation:
> See my other posts on the underlying factors. these are not
> reversible in the US. We are in for it.
>
> accordingly the stock market will *rise in terms of dollars per share,
> as wages decline (in relation to living costs)... thats stagnation/
> inflation combination.... it will bankrupt a lot of people and
> companies. it will make the US a bad place to invest (see caveat
> below)... the US had been living on foreign capitol for decades...that
> has come to an end.
>
> ****
> However...
> I expect the stock market to double in terms of dollars per share over
> the next few years... as bread, gasoline, raw material increases at
> 15% more than that. tripleing, as the DOW doubles. (a net loss of
> value in the range of 50%..and thats also been the case with the DOW
> since 1993. its lost net value, as the dollar price rose.
>
> ***
>
> the ultra rich will get a lot richer by means of buying on margin..
> 5% . so that the gains as the other 95% of the stock doubles will
> amount to thousands of percentage points profit on the 5% they
> invested in buying the stock on margin.
>
> thats an insiders game... outsiders trying to tag along will be taken
> out by the pre-arranged dips in this overall market uptrend. The
> insiders (using untraceable) proxies know what 'good news', bad news
> or spin they will release and when and be ahead of that with their
> long or short selling.
>
> ***
> 99% of the general public will lose on that basis...but limitless
> wealth awaits those insiders... there is no cure in sight as this is
> not preventable.
>
> ***
>
> My advice; If you go long on margin, get the longest contracts
> possible, and ride them out.. be well informed, keep diversified in
> the major industrials....you might have a slim chance that way..very
> slim.... these largest firms have a harder time manipulating thier
> stock price than smaller companies with narrower vested interests.
>
> and invest in yourself, your own marketable skill sets, health and
> fitness, keeping costs well below income, with minimal taxation
> exposure., take care of your business relationships and income
> streams.
>
> as this mess tanks, and govt keeps on bloating it will become
> ruthlessly voracious... ruining many lives and eliminating whats left
> of the middle class.
>
> cutting ppty tax, and income tax exposure will be critical to
> survival.. there are many legal and ethical ways to accomplish that
> summed up in the categories of cooperation, joint venture, right
> relationship and full use of capitol equipment etc.
>
> Phil scott
>
> you can find my list of demographic and underlying factors posts on
> Misc.Invest.stocks and alt.computer.consultants

--
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG

Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city

Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know
proper manners

Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs,

Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!

El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar

Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions
beyond the realm of understandability

Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 5:40 pm
From: Tony

Stock markets will never have a run like from 1982 to 2007 in your
lifetime again. Maybe not for the next thousand years. Stock markets never
go up when everyone is in stocks they go up when no one is in stocks. I
can tell you right now you want to be in the precious metals in about 2 to
3 years' time. The stock market will probably be the worst place to put
your money and the market is still grossly overvalued. The foreign markets
are much more overvalued than the American market. Stay clear of the stock
market for the rest of your life unless you're buying precious metal
stocks in the future.

phil scott wrote:

--
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG

Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city

Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know
proper manners

Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs,

Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!

El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar

Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions
beyond the realm of understandability

Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How big is your entertainment budget?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3c6aa20660c0230b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 2:16 am
From: asiandollno1@gmail.com

I agree with what JonquilJan says it really depends on what
entertainment means to a person. Some people may spend more while some
people spend less.

Maybe its because we don't have kids we can spend more on
entertainment. We go out shopping almost every single day and most of
the time we eat out especially at the shopping mall. Whenever there is
a new blockbuster movies we will definitely go watch it. What about
holiday trips? We go on short trips a few months once.

In all we don't really have a budget for entertainment. Sometime we
can spend more than $100 per week Anyway why budget yourself it just
ruin the meaning of entertainment.

AsianDoll

Since its my school semester break I have been using my free time
playing games like <a href=http://www.gamestotal.com> http://www.gamestotal.com
</a> <a href=http://uc.gamestotal.com> http://uc.gamestotal.com </a>
<a href=http://gc.gamestotal.com> http://gc.gamestotal.com </a> <a
href=http://3700ad.gamestotal.com> http://3700ad.gamestotal.com </a>
<a href=http://manga.gamestotal.com> http://manga.gamestotal.com </a>

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:24 am
From: OhioGuy

I actually include the cost of my Internet connection in the
entertainment category - $3.50 a month for 150 hours of connectivity.
(since I play a lot of board games online for free on brettspielwelt)

>Anyway why budget yourself it just
> ruin the meaning of entertainment.

We do it out of necessity. Rather than ruining it, I feel that it
makes us more creative when it comes to entertainment. Out of habit, I
usually want to go to the cheap theater with the family. However, that
really adds up fast unless we can go on Tuesdays. ($8 on Tuesdays, vs
$14 other days for 4) My wife has been getting me more interested in
doing crafts and other less expensive things.

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 7:59 am
From: "rick++"

I consider entertainement and travel an affordable luxury.
So it is 10% of my budget and 3% of my income.
Probably first to be cut in a crisis.
I could do a lot with cheap hikes in the nearby mountains
and $1 threater movies, if pressed.

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:25 am
From: George Grapman

My best recurring expense in Netflix, three movies at a time
,unlimited. With store rentals I have to drive to the store,park ,hope
they have what I want and repeat the process.

When a movie is due at a store and I have not watched it my choices
are stay up late,pay a late fee or return the unwatched movie. With
Netflix I simply turn it off and continue at my convenience.

One of the last things I would give up is the baseball tv package.
It comes out to less than a dollar a day.

I eat out as much as before but I often oder plain water with my
meal instead of soft drinks or beer.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:59 am
From: "h"

"George Grapman" <sfgeorge.@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:9g%Nk.5477$yr3.1080@nlpi068.nbdc.sbc.com...
> My best recurring expense in Netflix, three movies at a time
> ,unlimited. With store rentals I have to drive to the store,park ,hope
> they have what I want and repeat the process.
>
> When a movie is due at a store and I have not watched it my choices are
> stay up late,pay a late fee or return the unwatched movie. With Netflix I
> simply turn it off and continue at my convenience.
>
> One of the last things I would give up is the baseball tv package. It
> comes out to less than a dollar a day.
>
> I eat out as much as before but I often oder plain water with my meal
> instead of soft drinks or beer.

We have cable tv with the cheapest premium channel package bundled in with
roadrunner and phone, both of which are necessary for business use
(self-employed, work at home). Other than that, we don't have any
"entertainment". We only eat out if we're traveling, and we don't rent
movies or go to the theatre. Just too expensive. Also, now that I'm old and
crotchety, I find the behavior of most people in theatres appalling. I'd
rather watch it on my tv where there are no people talking or children
screaming.

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 3:08 pm
From: clams_casino

OhioGuy wrote:

> I'm just curious how much others set aside for this category. We
> have two adults and 2 children in our family, and we set aside $40
> every two weeks for all entertainment purposes.
>
> This means eating out, movies, music, books, tickets to anything, etc.
> We have to have the $ in there, or we do an alternative low cost or
> free activity. (board games, DVD from the library, etc.)
>
> How much do you set aside in your budget for these things?
>
> Thanks

Over 28 years, we have averaged 10% of our income going for
entertainment (motels, movies, eating out, plays, travel costs other
than driving, etc.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Car Loans Banned in 7 Countries
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/04e9c0439e50d114?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 2:16 am
From: blixs9@gmail.com

GMAC Financial Services said Tuesday that it no longer will make auto
loans in seven European countries, citing troubles in the lending
industry that have forced it to adjust its operations.

The financing arm of Detroit-based General Motors Corp. said as of
Nov. 1, it no longer will originate retail loans in the Czech
Republic, Finland, Greece, Norway, Portugal, Slovakia and Spain.

GMAC said it will assess the implications of the tough credit markets
in those countries and in its markets in Hungary and Denmark.

Gina Proia, a spokeswoman for GMAC, said the company's moves in Europe
are a result of a shortage of capital

http://quickloans.aokhost.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hits2u Free Website & Blog Advertising. Be on Google when people come
looking!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5a5ae320bf434e18?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:11 am
From: River

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: www.cicigogo.cn air max 90, air max ltd, nike shox R4, NZ, Jordan 23,
Jordan 5 fusion, air force one, dunk sb
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/31ccdb78a17d1c9a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:24 am
From: cicitrade01@yahoo.cn

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: The rain is winning
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/387ab70dc2616cff?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:33 am
From: "OG"

"Cwatters" <colin.wattersNOSPAM@TurnersOakNOSPAM.plus.com> wrote in message
news:ssqdnSjdj7qp5prUnZ2dnUVZ8sXinZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>
> "john d hamilton" <bluestar@mail.invalid> wrote in message
> news:gdncvd$p0c$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>I recently installed a yardmaster metal shed in the garden. After a good
>> shower of rain the inside has huge wet patches on the concrete floor.
>>
>> The sheds on a cement base with the top three or four inches being a mix
>> of
>> one cement to four sharp sand and under that top layer, it's a mix of one
>> cement to three sharp sand and three Wickes ballast (gravel).
>>
>> I have put a bead of *clear* silicone around the metal frame base of the
>> shed, but its obviouslly not enough to stop the problem.
>
> I think you need to check with a hose to see where it's getting in.
>
> On the first picture it looks like a bit is missing. On the right of the
> picture there appears to be a triangular bead but on the left there
> appears to be none or even a U shape channel.

If it's anything like the one we bought, the side panels fit into shallow
channels and water running down the panels will run off both inside and
outside the shed.
See my earlier post for one way of tackling the problem (2x layers pond
liner and 1 of OSB). The experts' recommendation would be to use 18mm OSB
raised on 4x4 treated joists with a dpm between the joists and the OSB. I
didn't follow their advice because of the limited headroom.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 12:25 pm
From: "Cwatters"

"OG" <owen@gwynnefamily.org.uk> wrote in message
news:6mre5jFi8lvrU1@mid.individual.net...
> If it's anything like the one we bought, the side panels fit into shallow
> channels and water running down the panels will run off both inside and
> outside the shed.

Yes that's what the OP's photo looks like, although this one from the
yardmaster web site appears to show it the other way up (eg n rather than u)
? Perhaps that's the problem?

http://www.yardmaster.co.uk/images/Anchor.GIF

> See my earlier post for one way of tackling the problem (2x layers pond
> liner and 1 of OSB). The experts' recommendation would be to use 18mm OSB
> raised on 4x4 treated joists with a dpm between the joists and the OSB. I
> didn't follow their advice because of the limited headroom.

I think that would work (in that the floor would be dry) but I'd be nervous
about how long the joists would last as there will be water underneath the
floor. At least it would be easy to replace.

I'm just starting an oak boarded shed. The timber walls will be built off a
1 brick high plinth/wall sitting on the concrete slab. The external boarding
will be taken down over the outside of the brick plinth so no chance of
water getting in. At the doorway (where there won't be a brick plinth) the
weather bar on the door will extend over the edge of the concrete slab
although I'm thinking of installing a linear drain.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 3:09 pm
From: "OG"

"Cwatters" <colin.wattersNOSPAM@TurnersOakNOSPAM.plus.com> wrote in message
news:FoednWPX4vgBJZXUnZ2dnUVZ8uydnZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>
> "OG" <owen@gwynnefamily.org.uk> wrote in message
> news:6mre5jFi8lvrU1@mid.individual.net...
> > If it's anything like the one we bought, the side panels fit into
> > shallow
>> channels and water running down the panels will run off both inside and
>> outside the shed.
>
> Yes that's what the OP's photo looks like, although this one from the
> yardmaster web site appears to show it the other way up (eg n rather than
> u) ? Perhaps that's the problem?
>
> http://www.yardmaster.co.uk/images/Anchor.GIF
>
>> See my earlier post for one way of tackling the problem (2x layers pond
>> liner and 1 of OSB). The experts' recommendation would be to use 18mm OSB
>> raised on 4x4 treated joists with a dpm between the joists and the OSB. I
>> didn't follow their advice because of the limited headroom.
>
> I think that would work (in that the floor would be dry) but I'd be
> nervous about how long the joists would last as there will be water
> underneath the floor. At least it would be easy to replace.

I'd assume you'd use tannalised timbers, and although they will sit in water
when it rains, that shouldn't be a problem as they will get a chance to dry
out a bit betweentimes

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Fiber Art Blog
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a89645eee3b333ee?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:52 am
From: Rick

Hello group,

Our Fiber Arts & Animals Festival website has started a blog
( www.FiberArtFest.com/faafBlog ) to talk about our thoughts and
concerns setting up our festival in Marshall, Michigan and to share
the story behind the event. As I become more proficient with writing
in the blog, I will post pictures of our festival and the critters
that attend.

We will continue to respond to inquires about fiber art on the
different groups we belong to as well.

Regards,

Rick Boesen
www.FiberArtFest.com
www.QuesoCabezaFarm.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bicycles at yard sales, flea markets, etc.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e1924195b32556d4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:56 am
From: OldRoads

On Sep 23, 10:14 am, ra...@vt.edu wrote:
> Vandy Terre <va...@tanglewood-destiny.com> wrote:
> > This sounds good for folks hunting information onbicycles. Any one with
> > sources on values for horse drawn equipment? Or maybe sources for construction
> > plans for horse drawn equipment and harness? I have several horses and am
> > starting to train them for riding but would like to cross train for hauling.
>
> Unfortunately for you the people with the most knowledge and experience
> on the value of horse drawn equipment are Amish. They are unlikely to
> have a web site of any kind. There may be books, though. I'd check
> Amazon for those.
>
> Bill Ranck
> Blacksburg, Va.

More info about the bikes you might find at a yard sale, flea market,
etc:
About a year ago we were contacted by ExpertVillage.com and asked to
do a series of videos about vintage bicycles.
Filming was done in March and they finished editing the videos in
June.

There are 16 videos in each series. All are on-line and free.
There are over 100 clips. It was a lot of work getting the
information together and then presenting it without notes. I ain't a
professional video dude as you will see, but there may be some useful
info in there.

The topics are:

Intro To Vintage Bicycles
Vintage Bicycle Styles
Vintage Balloon Tire Bicycles
Vintage Middleweight Bicycles
Vintage English 3-Speed Bicycles
Vintage Muscle Bicycles
Vintage Bicycle Appraisal Tips
Collecting Vintage Bicycles Accessories

You can get to the videos from here:

http://oldroads.com/whats_new.asp

Vin - Menotomy Vintage Bicycles
http://OldRoads.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cork hard to come by on wine bottles?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2b0408d66c4c1ad4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 3:35 pm
From: Boothbay

What's with the wine industry...replacing cork tops with metal caps
and white ( ? )..I don't even know what the last one is made of. The
last one is so difficult to open and forget about putting it back onto
the bottle...its almost impossible. I even had to use a sharp razor to
try and taper one end so it could be inserted and it was hard to
carve. Finally, after thinking I succeeded, a few minutes later I
heard a 'pop' and sure enough the pressure in the bottle, popped the
stopper. Why can't they leave it as it was with the cork stopper? Its
even harder to see when purchased if it has such a stopper, cause its
covered with wax paper, that u can only take off after buying it.

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 3:36 pm
From: Boothbay

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 4:08 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Boothbay <harri85274@aol.com> wrote:

> What's with the wine industry...replacing cork tops with metal caps
> and white ( ? )..I don't even know what the last one is made of.

Plastic.

They do that because cork is much more variable.

> The last one is so difficult to open and forget about putting it back
> onto the bottle...its almost impossible. I even had to use a sharp
> razor to try and taper one end so it could be inserted and it was
> hard to carve. Finally, after thinking I succeeded, a few minutes later
> I heard a 'pop' and sure enough the pressure in the bottle, popped
> the stopper. Why can't they leave it as it was with the cork stopper?
> Its even harder to see when purchased if it has such a stopper, cause
> its covered with wax paper, that u can only take off after buying it.

The world's moved on, just like it always does.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 4:47 pm
From: Dennis

On Wed, 29 Oct 2008 15:35:38 -0700 (PDT), Boothbay
<harri85274@aol.com> wrote:

>What's with the wine industry...replacing cork tops with metal caps
>and white ( ? )..I don't even know what the last one is made of. The
>last one is so difficult to open and forget about putting it back onto
>the bottle...its almost impossible. I even had to use a sharp razor to
>try and taper one end so it could be inserted and it was hard to
>carve. Finally, after thinking I succeeded, a few minutes later I
>heard a 'pop' and sure enough the pressure in the bottle, popped the
>stopper. Why can't they leave it as it was with the cork stopper? Its
>even harder to see when purchased if it has such a stopper, cause its
>covered with wax paper, that u can only take off after buying it.

Why not just save a cork next time you find one and use it to reseal
the next bottle with a plastic stopper?

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 5:05 pm
From: "Bob F"

"Boothbay" <harri85274@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1c96fb2e-1259-4d23-9e37-eb90bc5bbcf0@p39g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> What's with the wine industry...replacing cork tops with metal caps
> and white ( ? )..I don't even know what the last one is made of. The
> last one is so difficult to open and forget about putting it back onto
> the bottle...its almost impossible. I even had to use a sharp razor to
> try and taper one end so it could be inserted and it was hard to
> carve. Finally, after thinking I succeeded, a few minutes later I
> heard a 'pop' and sure enough the pressure in the bottle, popped the
> stopper. Why can't they leave it as it was with the cork stopper? Its
> even harder to see when purchased if it has such a stopper, cause its
> covered with wax paper, that u can only take off after buying it.

http://www.baycrossings.com/archives/2003/08_September/cork_no_more.htm

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to make money easily through online.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f2535e65ea9c733f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Oct 29 2008 8:49 pm
From: "eforce.ws"

On Oct 28, 1:15 pm, shilpa <kangar...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Put in a Free Advertisement.
> 2. Get others to put in Free Advertisements.
> 3. Get paid!!
>
> ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
>
> ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

If anyone is looking for F*R*E*E site to get started making money
online, This is the best site available online. NO SCAMS here.
Trusted admin and a great resource. Join me. I am already profiting
by using the programs on this site

http://www.marketingpond.com/p.cgi/36227/

Marketing Pond

http://www.marketingpond.com/?36227

==============================================================================

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Google Groups: http://groups.google.com/?hl=en

17 new messages in 10 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:02 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

phil scott <phil@philscott.net> wrote

> Educate yourself at the hands on level...become an
> entrepreneur, thats where baloney walks and skills talk...

> I am 67 years old and currently doing reasonably well

No you havent. You dont even have a house to live in.

> only because my skill sets have recently come back in demand due
> to the decline of talent as most old farts are retiring.. and because
> of my ongoing agressive accumulation of new skills and abilities.

And when you end up with a serious medical problem the shit will really hit the fan.

> ...the new breed of kiddies doesnt have much of a clue...
> and that includes many in the under age 45 bracket ..
> under at 35 its a complete disaster as best I can tell...

The ancient greeks used to sit around in their togas or
whatever they wore and rave on precisely the same way.

> I run into pipe wholesalers these days who will send me a box of pipe
> unions when i ordered valves... completely stunning levels of incompetence...

Corse nothing like that ever happened in the past, eh ?

> on a recent test that included the branch manager...
> I gave him a spec and a sketch of a common fitting adapter...
> he came back with a whole box full of everything but and
> said take your pick.... no clue at all..not even the faintest.

Corse nothing like that ever happened in the past, eh ?

> (there is hope, a new breed... teens to 20 somethings seem to have
> seen through much of this but are hampered by a grossly incompetent
> US educational system, lack of employer training in a majority of cases,
> and such low pay that they have no incentive to study up at home..)

Anyone with a clue doesnt need an education system.

> Stagflation:
> See my other posts on the underlying factors.

No thanks, that was all completely mindless silly shit.

> these are not reversible in the US. We are in for it.

Have fun explaining how come we managed to survive the great depression fine.

> accordingly the stock market will *rise in terms of dollars per share, as wages
> decline (in relation to living costs)... thats stagnation/ inflation combination....

No it isnt.

> it will bankrupt a lot of people and companies. it will make the US a bad place to invest (see
> caveat below)... the US had been living on foreign capitol for decades...that has come to an end.

No it hasnt. And its capital, not capitol. A capitol is a building, stupid.

> ****
> However...
> I expect the stock market to double in terms of dollars per share
> over the next few years... as bread, gasoline, raw material
> increases at 15% more than that. tripleing, as the DOW doubles.

More fool you. The price of commoditys is dropping thru the floor, stupid.

Have a look at the price of wheat sometime.

> (a net loss of value in the range of 50%..and thats also been the case
> with the DOW since 1993. its lost net value, as the dollar price rose.

That wasnt due to the dollar price rising.

> ***

> the ultra rich will get a lot richer by means of buying on margin.. 5%

No one will let them buy on margin with the DOW dropping like a stone, stupid.

> so that the gains as the other 95% of the stock doubles
> will amount to thousands of percentage points profit on
> the 5% they invested in buying the stock on margin.

No one will let them buy on margin with the DOW dropping like a stone, stupid.

And they'll be losing money when the stock drops like a stone anyway.

> thats an insiders game... outsiders trying to tag along will be
> taken out by the pre-arranged dips in this overall market uptrend.

There is no overall market uptrend, just sucker rallys.

> The insiders (using untraceable) proxies know what 'good
> news', bad news or spin they will release and when and
> be ahead of that with their long or short selling.

How odd that so many hedge funds are sinking beneath the waves.

> ***
> 99% of the general public will lose on that basis...but limitless wealth
> awaits those insiders... there is no cure in sight as this is not preventable.

How odd that so many hedge funds are sinking beneath the waves.

> ***

> My advice;

After your mindless silly shit above, no one is going to take your 'advice' on anything at all, ever.

> If you go long on margin, get the longest contracts possible,
> and ride them out.. be well informed, keep diversified in the
> major industrials....you might have a slim chance that way..very
> slim.... these largest firms have a harder time manipulating thier
> stock price than smaller companies with narrower vested interests.

> and invest in yourself, your own marketable skill sets, health and fitness,
> keeping costs well below income, with minimal taxation exposure., take
> care of your business relationships and income streams.

Makes a lot more sense to have owned the house you live in before the real estate bubble.

You couldnt even manage that.

> as this mess tanks, and govt keeps on bloating it will become ruthlessly
> voracious... ruining many lives and eliminating whats left of the middle class.

You aint anything even remotely resembling anything like middle class.

Just another bum.

> cutting ppty tax, and income tax exposure will be critical to survival..

Having your house paid off is actually if the shit does hit the fan.

> there are many legal and ethical ways to accomplish that
> summed up in the categories of cooperation, joint venture,
> right relationship and full use of capitol equipment etc.

They wont let bums like you use the capitol, they keep that for the politicians.

> you can find my list of demographic and underlying factors
> posts on Misc.Invest.stocks and alt.computer.consultants

That shit should be flushed where it belongs since it clearly
didnt even manage to allow you to own a decent house.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 6:40 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)

In <6mp9fkFi2edrU1@mid.individual.net>, infamous Rod Speed wrote in part:

>Corse nothing like that ever happened in the past, eh ?

>No it hasnt. And its capital, not capitol. A capitol is a building, stupid.

>More fool you. The price of commoditys is dropping thru the floor, stupid.

The sub-troll that likes to irritate everyone, especially those who work
for a living apparently because they get more income than someone who is
apparently on disability for an apparent mental condition, is now trying
among other things a spelling flame.
Meanwhile, the sub-troll continues with his favored misspelings that he
defends with "like it or lump it" when he gets called on them.

The sub-troll even has a FAQ about him. That FAQ may have not been
updated in close to a decade, but still it has good validity since the
sub-troll has appeared to me to have emotional maturity advancing by about
1 year to about that of age 12 or so in the past decade. Any decent
search engine should be able to find you a few copies of that FAQ that
say plenty well.

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 8:39 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:10 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

OhioGuy <none@none.net> wrote:

> I'm just curious how much others set aside for this category.

Zero, nada, ziltch. I just watch free to air digital TV and occasionally download stuff I miss.

> We have two adults and 2 children in our family, and we set aside $40 every two weeks for all entertainment purposes.

> This means eating out, movies, music, books, tickets to anything, etc.

I do spend quite a bit on books, but nothing of any of the rest. And I dont bother
to budget with the books, just buy what interest me or what shows up etc.

> We have to have the $ in there, or we do an alternative low cost or free activity. (board games, DVD from the library,
> etc.)

> How much do you set aside in your budget for these things?

Zero, nada, ziltch.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:34 pm
From: William Souden

Rod Speed wrote:
> OhioGuy <none@none.net> wrote:
>
>> I'm just curious how much others set aside for this category.
>
> Zero, nada, ziltch. I just watch free to air digital TV and occasionally download stuff I miss.
>
Hard to pay for cable when you are on welfare.

>> We have two adults and 2 children in our family, and we set aside $40 every two weeks for all entertainment purposes.
>
>> This means eating out, movies, music, books, tickets to anything, etc.
>
> I do spend quite a bit on books, but nothing of any of the rest. And I dont bother
> to budget with the books, just buy what interest me or what shows up etc.

You mean you dumpster dive for old books.
>
>> We have to have the $ in there, or we do an alternative low cost or free activity. (board games, DVD from the library,
>> etc.)
>
>> How much do you set aside in your budget for these things?
>
> Zero, nada, ziltch.

One can not set aside what when does not have.
>
>

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 3:09 pm
From: "JonquilJan"

Guess that all depends on what you mean by entertainment. My concept is
very different from yours. I have seen one movie in a theatre since moving
here in 1981 (Jurrasic Park). And renting videos stopped for me about 10
years ago. I have eaten from McDonalds once this year - and from the
oriental take out twice this year (once using a gift certificate). No trips
to the sub shop or the pizza place. And no restaturants - I can fix
something much less expensively at home - and with my dietary problems -
feel much more comfortable later.

Books - have plenty - and the library fee is $1 - for 3 years. The library
is 1 mile from my home. Cancelled book clubs a while ago.

Perhaps magazine subscriptions - I do have some of those - but usually get
them when the really big offers come through.

But my form of entertainment - 3 trips a week to Physical Therapy for a
workout - and socialization. That costs $30 a month. Yeds, it is a very
different kind of medical clinic. More of a family and friends along with
the healing therapies.

JonquilJan

Learn something new every day
As long as you are learning, you are living
When you stop learning, you start dying

==============================================================================
TOPIC: vacuum cleaner new
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/2e8cc394cc50a344?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:34 pm
From: Siskuwihane

On Oct 28, 2:04 pm, "Percival P. Cassidy" <nob...@notmyISP.net> wrote:
> On 10/27/08 06:05 am max wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >> If you want a cyclone cleaner that works, you're really going
> >> to struggle with anything other that a Dyson. Dyson have a stack
> >> of patents relating to designing cyclones small enough to be part
> >> of a vacuum cleaner which actually work, that's it's pretty
> >> impossible for other manufacturers to come close. His original
> >> dual cyclone patent expired which is why you now see other
> >> manufacturers doing those, but they're stuck with following all
> >> his advances 25 years behind.
>
> > horse shit. utter horseshit. Dyson's vacuums are devoid of any genuine
> > innovation whatsoever. His patents are as meritous as AOL's attempt to
> > patent the smiley face emoticon. He adapted the cyclone filter to a
> > carpet sucker. whoopie. wow!!! His innovation has a great more to do
> > with the advances made in material science making available to him the
> > possibility of doing something different. . A Dyson-style vacuum made
> > in 1950 would have been beyond the means of 75% of consumers.
>
> > His brushless air jet models are polycarbonate frauds.
>
> Hoover and the rest denigrated Dyson's ideas at first but then copied
> them. I happened to be in the UK when the court found Hoover guilty of
> infringing Dyson's patents.
>
> We love our Dyson.

A Dyson doesn't lose suction because it doesn't have any to start with.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Where are YOU cutting back?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a47415e5933d30b8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:43 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Scritch <info@mymainstreet.info> wrote
> Too_Many_Tools <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote

>> In tough times consumers tend to cut back...so where are you cutting
>> back, reprioritizing resources, whatever to make that dollar go farther?

>> I am also posting this in the metal and wood working groups to hear
>> how those who pursue the hobby are allotting their resources.

> It's time to start home brewing again.

I never stopped. Leaves the commercial crap for dead.

> It might not cost less per bottle,

Costs a hell of a lot less here, like 85% less.

> but it'll keep me from drinking more.

Makes no difference to how much I drink.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 2:26 pm
From: Gerald Miller

On Tue, 28 Oct 2008 12:28:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
<too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote:

>And I should note that used machine supplies have other uses too...why
>that used sandpaper works just fine in the bathroom. ;<)
>
>TMT
A number of years ago, the building maintenance supervisor, in an
economy drive, removed the roll holders and installed folded tissue
dispensers in the stalls in our building. I made so many remarks about
"Dickey Wipers", "Body sanding", and other terms, that, eventually he
gave in and re-installed the roll holders. I'm glad they hadn't
invented the 3" paper ribbon yet.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 2:36 pm
From: Robatoy

On Oct 28, 5:26 pm, Gerald Miller <grmil...@rogers.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Oct 2008 12:28:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
>
> <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >And I should note that used machine supplies have other uses too...why
> >that used sandpaper works just fine in the bathroom. ;<)
>
> >TMT
>
> A number of years ago, the building maintenance supervisor, in an
> economy drive, removed the roll holders and installed folded tissue
> dispensers in the stalls in our building. I made so many remarks about
> "Dickey Wipers", "Body sanding", and other terms, that, eventually he
> gave in and re-installed the roll holders. I'm glad they hadn't
> invented the 3" paper ribbon yet.
> Gerry :-)}
> London, Canada

London always was a bit weird.

(Sarnia here... even weirder.)

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 1:51 pm
From: "Cwatters"

"john d hamilton" <bluestar@mail.invalid> wrote in message
news:gdncvd$p0c$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>I recently installed a yardmaster metal shed in the garden. After a good
> shower of rain the inside has huge wet patches on the concrete floor.
>
> The sheds on a cement base with the top three or four inches being a mix
> of
> one cement to four sharp sand and under that top layer, it's a mix of one
> cement to three sharp sand and three Wickes ballast (gravel).
>
> I have put a bead of *clear* silicone around the metal frame base of the
> shed, but its obviouslly not enough to stop the problem.

I think you need to check with a hose to see where it's getting in.

On the first picture it looks like a bit is missing. On the right of the
picture there appears to be a triangular bead but on the left there appears
to be none or even a U shape channel.

> My thoughts are, is the cement porous like blotting paper? thus
> soaking up a lot of water on these larger flat areas and transferring it
> inside the shed? If the cement base is in fact behaving like this, then
> i'm guessing i would have to seal the whole width of the base area around
> the shed.

Cement/concrete isn't totally waterproof but I doubt that's the cause. The
rate at which water penetrates is very very slow and unlikely to cause
obvious puddles.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: how to get your money back on any product that fails
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/cf36a607cf5a61cd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 5:09 pm
From: "Lou"

<misterfact@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a45e1f80-9f6a-496b-8e85-47ec830afa1d@b38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> How to get your money back on most any product that fails just after
> its flimsy, short-term, worthless warranty expires:
>
> Good examples of junk products that fail in less than 180 days:
>
> Belkin (cigarette lighter plug-in) cell phone chargers
>
> SONY microcassette tape-recorders
>
> any compact flourescent light bulb
>
> digital cameras, electronics equipment, etc
>
>
> SIMPLY:
>
> 1. Buy the SAME product at any store.
>
> 2. Take advantage of the store's return policy! Wait two weeks; then
> put the failed product in the new product's packaging and return it to
> the store with the new product's sales receipt. Get your money back!
>
> The more people who do this- the sooner these sloppy manufacturers
> will make a quality product and give a reasonable warranty! That even
> goes for the cheap Chinese items at the Dollar Store.

While I suppose that would work, it strikes me as slightly dishonest, and
even worse, it seems that you'd end up putting yourself on an endless
treadmill. A better solution would be to buy decent products in the first
place - even if the initial cost is somewhat higher, the life cycle cost
would be less.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 7:25 pm
From: George Grapman

Lou wrote:
> <misterfact@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a45e1f80-9f6a-496b-8e85-47ec830afa1d@b38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>> How to get your money back on most any product that fails just after
>> its flimsy, short-term, worthless warranty expires:
>>
>> Good examples of junk products that fail in less than 180 days:
>>
>> Belkin (cigarette lighter plug-in) cell phone chargers
>>
>> SONY microcassette tape-recorders
>>
>> any compact flourescent light bulb
>>
>> digital cameras, electronics equipment, etc
>>
>>
>> SIMPLY:
>>
>> 1. Buy the SAME product at any store.
>>
>> 2. Take advantage of the store's return policy! Wait two weeks; then
>> put the failed product in the new product's packaging and return it to
>> the store with the new product's sales receipt. Get your money back!
>>
>> The more people who do this- the sooner these sloppy manufacturers
>> will make a quality product and give a reasonable warranty! That even
>> goes for the cheap Chinese items at the Dollar Store.
>
> While I suppose that would work, it strikes me as slightly dishonest, and
> even worse, it seems that you'd end up putting yourself on an endless
> treadmill. A better solution would be to buy decent products in the first
> place - even if the initial cost is somewhat higher, the life cycle cost
> would be less.

I have never had a problem returning a defective product. While I
like local stores the chains are often better because the person
processing the return has no financial stake in the matter.
A few weeks ago I purchased an HP printer at Office Max. It made
great copies but I could not print anything from my computer. Tech
support had me going around in circles repeating the same things over
and over (uninstall CD,reboot computer,unplug/plug in cable). They guy
finally admitted that this printer had what he called "interface issues"
with about 10 percent of the PCs it was used with and then insisted I
retry those steps. I thanked him and hung up. The next day the store
took it back no questions asked,they did not even ask why.
>
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Costco guest passes
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1a28391830066fbd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 6:03 pm
From: Evelyn Leeper

Evelyn Leeper wrote:
> SMS wrote:
>>
>> Costco saves most people such an enormous amount of money that the
>> membership fee is lost in the noise (and with the rebate on the
>> executive membership, we actually don't pay anything for the
>> membership). Certain items we buy at Costco are stuff that regular
>> stores charge so much more for that we wouldn't even consider buying
>> them if not for Costco.
>>
>> A few items that are much cheaper at Costco are:
>>
> ...
>
> Batteries (Kirkland brand)
>
> Actually, just about anything Kirkland brand. Kirkland grape juice is
> the cheapest around (and beat out four other national brans in a blind
> taste taste my husband did),

Let me add a couple of more items that Kirkland is higher quality on:
men's T-shirts (much thicker than the average brand) and woolen trail
socks. (I just bought some and they are *really* comfy!) T-shirts come
in a pack of six, socks in a pack of 4 pair.

--
Evelyn C. Leeper
Loyalty to petrified opinion never broke a chain or freed a human soul.
-Mark Twain

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Isn't This A Screw Job?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a9edc171a4be3330?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 6:12 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)

In article <BqmdnSMwNbgqhJrUnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@centurytel.net>, curly'q wrote:
>
>"The available balance and available credit information displayed
>through 'W**** F**** Online' is updated immediately to reflect your
>transaction. However, it will take 2-3 business days to fully process
>this transaction and update the outstanding credit balance and history."
>
>OK, so they can withdraw money instantly from an interest bearing
>account, but it takes 2-3 days (in 2008?) to credit a loan account.
>
>Something smells.

How about how long it takes a bank to clear a check?

It appears to me that most banks will put an artificial hold of 4
business days or whatever on checks over $5,000 - without exception for
ones easy to know are good.

Also - checks on foreign banks - even if the foreign country is Canada
and my country is USA and the bank that I deposited the check into has
corporate headquarters in the same country as does the bank that the check
is drawn on - my bank tries to tell me that the check has a 10 or so day
hold because they find cause to believe that the check may not be paid.
And the bank that it was drawn on paid it the day after I deposited it!

Many banks put long holds on checks if the checks were deposited by a
customer that has recently been overdrawn. What - even if the check is
easy to know to be good, the bank wants their customer to be a repeat
customer for overdraft and under-minimum-balance and bounced-check fees?
Is not penalty for the original overdraft sin supposed to be the
overdraft fee and any bounced check fees for the "original sin" and a ding
on credit report/score from the "original sin"?

(Thankfully I know the smelly game played by banks well enough to not
have been overdrawn as a result. I did switch from a bank that got
an under-minimum-balance fee from me by placing a BS hold on a large
check.)

The way I have heard it in newspapers, someone in a G8 country in Europe
can get a check cleared same-day even if it was from a different G8
European country.

Are banks operating in America tempting Americans to push Congress to
pass more laws telling businesses how to operate in America?

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

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TOPIC: FS: Boys Timberland boots & dress shoes (sz 6)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9d8cc2cd625380a0?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 10:04 pm
From: ClothesOut

Hi,

I just listed two pairs of boys shoes - both size 6. One is a pair of
wheat-colored Timberlands with a denim roll top. Auction starts at
$24.99.

The other is a pair of leather-look black dress shoes made by State
Street. Auction starts at $9.99.

Both items are gently used and the auctions end on Nov. 2nd. So, place
your bid today! To view the photos and full descriptions, go to
http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZhelporgs

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 28 2008 10:50 pm
From: madhurimaniknepal

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