http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
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Today's topics:
* Surviving high heating oil prices - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a184bef53e828bc7?hl=en
* Is this frugal? - 5 messages, 5 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/060ca487b986915a?hl=en
* Spacing Trips to the Grocery Store? - 11 messages, 8 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9e5316c7228e6cd4?hl=en
* how's this for an economic mess? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3a370d079370dd0b?hl=en
* You are not frugal if...... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3c5261ec65743940?hl=en
* POISONOUS COUNTERFEIT TOOTHPASTE SEIZED IN CONNECTICUT - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ac5b13498eafe67f?hl=en
* Believe it or not.....!!!!!!! - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9421bedb8701e43a?hl=en
* Garage Sales - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f1826c8cd57abac7?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Surviving high heating oil prices
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a184bef53e828bc7?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:01 am
From: Jeff
GregS wrote:
> In article <g57q21$ekg$1@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu>, zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com (GregS) wrote:
>> In article <MPG.22e123dbff71726b989e7e@news.individual.net>, krw
>> <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
>>> In article <g57jos$d36$2@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu>,
>>> zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com says...
>>>> In article <MPG.22e067da4eb0bb1e989e77@news.individual.net>, krw
>>> <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
>>>>> In article <g54uji$nkv$1@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu>,
>>>>> zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com says...
>>>>>> In article <MPG.22df1c1ee7abf69f989e70@news.individual.net>, krw
>>>>> <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
>>>>>>> In article <g52fmu$u9q$1@aioe.org>, tmclone@searchmachine.com
>>>>>>> says...
>>>>>>>> <hchickpea@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:33i974tg8ojk98l0l343fnj8iravfqutmg@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 22:50:07 -0400, "JonquilJan" <ward39@imcnet.net>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There was one home about half a mile from me - where it was tried to
>>>>>>>>>> insulate. Once they took off the outer shell, there was a frame of
>>> very
>>>>>>>>>> large hand hewn (could see the ax marks) beans - filled in with
>>> bricks
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> mortar between.
>>>>>>>> Everything in my house was hand hewn. The home inspector who did the
>>>>> report
>>>>>>>> before I bought the place thought the joists weren't real wood because
>>>>> they
>>>>>>>> were "misshapen and just way too big" (his words). When I pointed out
>>> that
>>>>>>>> the house was nearly 200 years old, he then assumed that the wood
>> would
>>> be
>>>>>>>> rotten. He was extremely surprised that everything in the house was
>>> just
>>>>>>>> fine. He commented that the house was "better built than anything
>>> they're
>>>>>>>> making now". Well, yeah, since my house was built to last, not to
>>> current
>>>>>>>> "code". 24" on center. Are they crazy? Everything in my house is
>> 12-15"
>>> on
>>>>>>>> center, and 4x4, not 2x4. Hardwood floors over diagonally laid tongue
>>> and
>>>>>>>> groove subfloor over wide plank pine. An elephant could jump up and
>>> down
>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> my floors and you'd never feel it. I would never live in a "new"
>> house.
>>>>>>> I would bet that a "properly built" house today will use a lot less
>>>>>>> heat than yours. 2x6s 24" on center construction is certainly
>>>>>>> better than 2x4s on 16" centers, and even somewhat better than 2x6s
>>>>>>> 16" on center. Wood is a pretty poor insulator.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1 inch of dry wood = R1.
>>>>> Yes, pretty damned poor.
>>>>>
>>>>>> 2 inches = R2
>>>>> Rather obvious.
>>>> Put a reflective surface on that and you can add 1.5. Sometimes a reflective
>>>> surface can be much more than R 1.5 depending if there are really hot
>>>> areas involved, or high differentials.
>>> Not that it has anything to do with the issue at hand, but this is
>>> simply wrong. The reflective barrier will not keep heat in; zero R
>>> value. It will *reflect* IR radiation and is useful in areas with
>>> lots of sun, but it adds zero to the R value.
>>>
>> Tell that to the people who label their foam products at the home stores.
>> The reflective factor is added to the R value.
>> The reflective surface also inhibits radiation as well as reflecting radiation.
>
> A reflective surface needs open space for it to reflect. If there is no space
> its worthless.
Yes, It also depends on the mounting direction and direction of heat
flow, that is part of the convective loss.
You will always have radiative heat transfer, if you have a temperature
difference between the surface and ambient temperatures and some
emissivity of the surface. Lowering the emissivity lowers the loss,
shiny = low e. That's why good windows have a low e coating.
So, you have three methods that heat can be transferred: conductive
(which is the only R that krw understands), convective and radiative.
Lets look at convective losses for a moment as they have a lot to do
with R values. That's why although air is a much better insulator than
wood, that 6" of wood is R6 and 6" of air is only about R1. It's the
convective air currents and is why breaking up the air space with
fiberglass strands increases the effective R value.
Jeff
On a building here, they specified foil backed drywall
> for RF interference. This is also mold proof, and I don't know why its not
> usually seen at the home buiding stores, and of course can add some
> R value if used in that way.
>
> greg
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:12 pm
From: nick@acadia.ece.villanova.edu (Nick Pine)
GregS <zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com> wrote:
>I looked very closely at the foam sheeting at the home building center.
>The R value is definately added with the foil backed foams.
What would lead you to believe that? The FTC says that's illegal.o
Polyisocyanurate often has foil, unlike Styrofoam, but its bulk R-value is
higher and the foil helps the foam avoid outgassing which lowers the R-value.
Nick
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 11:25 am
From: zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com (GregS)
In article <g5g8fa$k2t@acadia.ece.villanova.edu>, nick@acadia.ece.villanova.edu (Nick Pine) wrote:
>GregS <zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com> wrote:
>
>>I looked very closely at the foam sheeting at the home building center.
>>The R value is definately added with the foil backed foams.
>
>What would lead you to believe that? The FTC says that's illegal.o
>
>Polyisocyanurate often has foil, unlike Styrofoam, but its bulk R-value is
>higher and the foil helps the foam avoid outgassing which lowers the R-value.
>
>Nick
You could be right. I was assuming all the foams have similar R value.
I think I was also looking at the ratings of say, 1 inch compared to two inches.
If the reflective value is there, two inches will not be twice the R of 1 inch.
greg
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Is this frugal?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/060ca487b986915a?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:08 am
From: The Real Bev
clams_casino wrote:
> James wrote:
>
>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7502071.stm
>>
>>Living in a world without waste
34 containers? I don't think so!
>>MHO
>>For one thing having to wash and dry before recycling can be a waste
>>of clean water.
Son in North Carolina has to pay $80 for 3,000 gallons. Gardening in
the neighborhood is generally minimal -- a serious gardener up the
street pays $700/month for water. They don't wash their recyclables either.
> Why would you wash and dry cans / bottles for recycling? A quick rinse
> is all that's required.
a. Some people are really anal.
b. The Recycler may require it.
We pay extra for recycling -- not that there's any choice. I toss all
plastic, metal, glass and paper (excluding used paper towels, which go
in the trash) into the recycling container unwashed. If they want it,
they can wash it.
Water is nearly free, so it's just time. And the principle of the
thing, of course. Some cities figure that just tossing everything --
garbage and recyclables -- into the same container and sorting it at the
plant saves money. Fewer trucks required, for one thing.
--
Cheers, Bev
================================
Eat right. Stay fit. Die anyway.
== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:18 am
From: unow@example.com
I'm going to have a big ER bill from recyling, cut myself on a can lid that was
in the bin. I was pushing some newspaper in.
== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:54 am
From: Seerialmom
On Jul 14, 10:08 am, The Real Bev <bashley101+use...@gmail.com> wrote:
> clams_casino wrote:
> > James wrote:
>
> >>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7502071.stm
>
> >>Living in a world without waste
>
> 34 containers? I don't think so!
>
> >>MHO
> >>For one thing having to wash and dry before recycling can be a waste
> >>of clean water.
>
> Son in North Carolina has to pay $80 for 3,000 gallons. Gardening in
> the neighborhood is generally minimal -- a serious gardener up the
> street pays $700/month for water. They don't wash their recyclables either.
>
3000 gallons for $80?? Ugh...we just went to metered water in my
area...right now our water usage is still "drought level" (dead
backyard, front yard half dead, dishwasher only when full, etc).
Luckily the toilet that's used a lot by my son is a low flow 1.6. Our
utility will charge flat rate for the next couple of months but show
what we would be charged if it was the metered rate, too. That way we
can do whatever cutbacks we need to before they actually bill us that
way.
I agree with some others about the needing to "rinse"; if it's going
to take extra water or energy to do that I'll toss it as well.
== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:02 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
James <j0069bond@hotmail.com> wrote:
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7502071.stm
> Living in a world without waste
> MHO
> For one thing having to wash and dry before recycling can be a waste of clean water.
Yes, but its always more frugal than manufacturing it again.
> Another is what you time is worth.
It often isnt worth anything in the sense that its got a value.
> Assuming a low $10/hr it would be a lot cheaper just to toss out
> garbage than to spend the time to wash and sort everything.
Yes, but thats a completely bogus way to analyse it.
== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 2:40 pm
From: Coffee's For Closers
In article <96c900da-6ced-403a-bdbd-
018f865f1277@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, j0069bond@hotmail.com
says...
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7502071.stm
>
> Living in a world without waste
>
> MHO
> For one thing having to wash and dry before recycling can be a waste
> of clean water. Another is what you time is worth. Assuming a low
> $10/hr it would be a lot cheaper just to toss out garbage than to
> spend the time to wash and sort everything.
Personally, it takes very little effort for me. I just give
containers a quick rinse, and toss them into my recycle bin,
right there in my kitchen. Biodegradable waste like food scraps
go into a bucket, which I empty every couple of days into my
compost bin outside. I later apply the finished compost to my
vegetable garden.
As far as money, it comes out positive. The water isn't metered,
so no extra cost for the rinsing. I set out the recycle bin at
the curb every week, and it is emptied for free. Whereas, in my
area, regular rubbish must be in special city council bags, which
cost more than plain bags, with the premium helping to pay for
the pickup. So recycling and composting mean using fewer rubbish
bags, for a small savings.
As far as the theoretical dollar value of my time, this only
involves less than one minute per day (rinsing the containers,
and dumping stuff into the compost.)
--
Get Credit Where Credit Is Due
http://www.cardreport.com/
Credit Tools, Reference, and Forum
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Spacing Trips to the Grocery Store?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9e5316c7228e6cd4?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:16 am
From: unow@example.com
I tossed out the breadmachine and switched to using a mixer to knead bread. The
results are better. But the bread machine was nice for just making dough.
On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 02:53:42 -0400, in misc.consumers.frugal-living Neon John
<no@never.com> wrote:
>On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 14:24:04 +1000, "FarmI" <ask@itshall be given> wrote:
>
>
>>> Makes more sense to get a bread machine and bake more often.
>>
>>Not to us. We prefer a bigger loaf than machines make as we eat a lot of
>>bread, we hated the hole in the bottom of the bread and the cleaning up and
>>we prefer the flavour of oven baked bread.
>>
>
>I'm with you on that. I *hated* the bread machine that I briefly owned. Tiny
>little loaves that tasted nothing like what I make by hand, even using the
>same recipe.
>
>I make plain old French bread almost exclusively. I'd much rather spend a day
>every so often baking, vacuum packaging and freezing a large quantity than I
>would fooling with the machine, even if the product came out the same.
>
>I generally like kitchen gadgets but a bread machine is a glaring exception.
>
>John
== 2 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 10:12 am
From: chessucat
X-No-Archive: yes
On Jul 12, 4:09 pm, Jonathan Grobe wrote:
> Since I live several miles from the nearest grocery
> store and since gas prices are rapidly increasing, I
> have been thinking I should increase the time between
> trips to the grocery store. The problem is perishables.
> While some can be frozen, others can't.
>
> Any thoughts on the longest interval one should have
> between trips? (For me it looks like milk would be
> the determining factor).
>
> What is you policy on this? What are you freezing because
> of the freshness problem...
>
Get a dairy cow or stock up on powder milk! Buy a couple of Rhode
Island Reds or buy some powered eggs boxes.
Gas will continue to rise and oil will go to $200 a barrel. We can't
drill our way out of this, I'm not opposed to drilling off the
Florida's Keys or in ANWR, but we won't see that fuel come to the
pumps for ten years, at best. A Depression can be survived if you
budget and prepared for it! Prices drop like rock during a
Depression, land, houses, and commodities are dirt cheap, or so they
say.
<chessucat advises>
== 3 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:20 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Jul 12, 1:09 pm, Jonathan Grobe <gr...@netins.net> wrote:
> Since I live several miles from the nearest grocery
> store and since gas prices are rapidly increasing, I
> have been thinking I should increase the time between
> trips to the grocery store. The problem is perishables.
> While some can be frozen, others can't.
>
> Any thoughts on the longest interval one should have
> between trips? (For me it looks like milk would be
> the determining factor).
>
> What is you policy on this? What are you freezing because
> of the freshness problem...
>
> --
> Jonathan Grobe Books
> Browse our inventory of thousands of used books at:http://www.grobebooks.com
Milk can be frozen or you could use powdered. I don't drink milk so
it's not a problem. You could also look into "delivery" of some of
these items. Perhaps it would be cheaper to have the "milkman"
deliver milk and eggs or there could be a local farmer who sells it.
I'm sure the people in Alaska would be able to answer this better
though.
== 4 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:29 pm
From: me@privacy.net
Seerialmom <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Milk can be frozen
How long can it last in frozen block state? Forever?
== 5 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:30 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Jul 13, 9:56 am, Larry Caldwell <firstnamelastinit...@peaksky.com>
wrote:
> In article <4879c32c$0$29804$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-
> 01.iinet.net.au>, ask@itshall (FarmI) says...
>
> > I always have UHT milk on hand for when we run out of fresh and I would have
> > no trouble just using that all the time. I also keep UHT cream for the rare
> > times we use it.
>
> By UHT, do you mean the irradiated stuff you store at room temperature
> in boxes? We still can't get irradiated food at markets in the USA,
> which would make fresh food storage a lot easier. The military uses it
> a lot, though.
>
> --
> For email, replace firstnamelastinitial
> with my first name and last initial.
I was able to get some at the local Grocery Outlet a while back, they
were selling 1 liter packages $1 for 2 packages as I recall. I don't
use/drink milk but my son said it tasted fine in his cereal. Of
course this was a one time thing, you never know what Grocery Outlet
will have (it's like a Big Lots but for groceries and only in a few
states on the west coast).
== 6 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:30 pm
From: Seerialmom
On Jul 13, 3:04 pm, Goomba <Goomb...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Ann wrote:
> > Wegmans supermarket chain in the northeast began selling irradiated beef
> > in 2002. I never bought it, but the last I noticed, it was still in the
> > meat case.
>
> The same meat!? WOW, that irradiation IS some preserver, huh? LOL
heheh...I was thinking the same thing!
== 7 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 1:23 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
me@privacy.net wrote
> Seerialmom <seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote
>> Milk can be frozen
> How long can it last in frozen block state?
A year or so fine. Really depends on when you decide you
dont like the taste anymore and thats a very personal thing.
> Forever?
Nothing lasts forever, including you |-)
== 8 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 6:12 pm
From: Neon John
On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:47:57 -0700, unow@example.com wrote:
>On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 02:49:00 -0400, in misc.consumers.frugal-living Neon John
><no@never.com> wrote:
>
>>A pressure canning cycle takes about 45 minutes so a cycle uses
>>2.1*0.75 = 1.6kWh of electricity.
>
>
>What are you pressure cooking for 45 minutes? I don't think that meat even
>needs to be pressure cooked for that long.
That's the whole time the burner is on and includes heating up the water and
the contents before anything starts to boil.
45 minutes is a SWAG. May be more or less. I was just looking for orders of
magnitude numbers.
>
>I make a huge batch of blackberry jam about every three years, it only goes in
>the pressure cooker for 5 minutes but I pressure cooker is not needed for jam.
>I'm sure it costs less to can it then it costs to make and store freezer jam for
>three years. This is a jam year the supplies are running low but the black
>berries will be ripe next month.
I don't keep anything past a year. I still have these visions that haunt me
of those 5-10 year old green beans that my granny would sometimes dig out of
the cellar and cook. Bleached white and yuck!
I'm sure that jams would be OK longer than a year but I generally don't do
those. I have a nice friend who keeps me stocked in freezer jams. She even
makes 'em with Splenda (I'm a diabetic).
John
--
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.johndearmond.com <-- best little blog on the net!
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
Who is General Failure and why is he reading my disk?
== 9 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 6:14 pm
From: BR
chessucat wrote:
> X-No-Archive: yes
>
> On Jul 12, 4:09 pm, Jonathan Grobe wrote:
>> Since I live several miles from the nearest grocery
>> store and since gas prices are rapidly increasing, I
>> have been thinking I should increase the time between
>> trips to the grocery store. The problem is perishables.
>> While some can be frozen, others can't.
>>
>> Any thoughts on the longest interval one should have
>> between trips? (For me it looks like milk would be
>> the determining factor).
>>
>> What is you policy on this? What are you freezing because
>> of the freshness problem...
>>
>
> Get a dairy cow or stock up on powder milk! Buy a couple of Rhode
> Island Reds or buy some powered eggs boxes.
>
I go once a week. Since I don't use milk for a beverage, just cooking,
powdered milk works just fine. Store bought eggs will keep for two
weeks, so you could stretch it to every other week if you don't have
your own hens.
--
Remove the TOS star ship captain to reply privately.
== 10 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 6:17 pm
From: Neon John
On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:54:36 -0700, unow@example.com wrote:
>On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 02:49:00 -0400, in misc.consumers.frugal-living Neon John
><no@never.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>At first blush, it would appear that canning has almost a 10:1 cost advantage,
>>though the absolute dollar amount is very small in either case - using the
>>current electric rate of $.073970/kWh*, that's $3.73 for canning, $34.69 for
>>freezing. But that doesn't figure in the cost of jars. Quart jars were close
>>to a dollar a jar last year but let's say $0.75 to account for some reuse and
>>to offset the cost of zip-lock bags for freezing. 225 jars * $0.75 = $168.75.
>
>
>Jars can be reused many times. Rings can be re-used for years and years.. only
>the lids should be purchased every month. One of my Grandma's even re-used the
>rings but I don't. I am using both of my dead Grandma's jars and even some of
>my Great-Grandma's canning jars in addition to some that I bought. Sometimes a
>jar will burst so I toss it out and use a different one. Jars are often quite
>cheap in the thrift shops. Not too many people can stuff anymore so if you ask
>around you can find probably find some free jars.
Oh, I know. Both methods can be optimized. I could buy new high efficiency
freezers or just better insulate the ones that I have. Again, I was just
piddling with numbers, looking for order-of-magnitude. If canning had turned
out to be 20X or 50X or 100X cheaper than freezing then I'd take a second
look. Since they're in the same order of magnitude, even when ignoring the
cost of jars and since the cost in either case is minimal, I'll stick with the
kind of food I like best - fresh from the freezer :-)
John
--
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.johndearmond.com <-- best little blog on the net!
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
Save a tree, kill a beaver
== 11 of 11 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 7:29 pm
From: Terri
unow@example.com wrote in news:ak0n74d9j76po9gviu8jku8dpe04actl5i@4ax.com:
> On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 02:49:00 -0400, in misc.consumers.frugal-living Neon
> John
><no@never.com> wrote:
>
>>A pressure canning cycle takes about 45 minutes so a cycle uses
>>2.1*0.75 = 1.6kWh of electricity.
>
>
> What are you pressure cooking for 45 minutes? I don't think that meat
> even needs to be pressure cooked for that long.
Actually, it does. Even longer, according to the recipes in my canning
books. Glancing at Ball Blue Book for poulty, seafood, tuna and
beef I see a minimum of 1 hour at 10 pnds. It ranges anywhere from 80
minutes to 1 hour and 30 minutes.
Even whole kernel corn in quarts is recommended for over an hour.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: how's this for an economic mess?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3a370d079370dd0b?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 11:27 am
From: Cheapo Groovo
Rod, what reality are you living in?
In article <6doc8fF3jho5U1@mid.individual.net>, rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com
says...
> Mr.SmartyPants <georgewkspam@humboldt1.com> wrote:
>
> > What's the best way to get into a financial mess? I'm not an economist,
>
> Or anything else either.
>
> > but the best way I know of is to borrow more money than you can pay back.
>
> Mindlessly superficial. It isnt always that easy to work out what you can pay back.
>
> And those who have got stinking rich have got that way by doing that anyway.
>
> > Here's what Ron Paul says:
>
> That fool has never ever had a clue.
>
> > "Ron Paul: How We Got into this Mess
>
> > By: The Mess that Greenspan Made
>
> Nothing to do with Greenspan, fool.
>
> > Thursday, July 10, 2008 5:41 PM
> > Sectors: Finance
>
> > From Ron Paul's Campaign for Liberty
>
> Wota fucking wanker...
>
> > come these thoughts
>
> Those arent thoughts, they're just more steaming turds.
>
> > about how we got into such a mess with a financial
> > system apparently falling apart at the seams
>
> It aint falling apart, fool.
>
> > and soaring inflation
>
> And there aint soaring inflation either, fool.
>
> > for nearly everything but the consumer price index.
>
> Pity about what it measures, fool.
>
> > The entire statement was to be read into the Congressional Record earlier this week
>
> Just another steaming turd dropped in there.
>
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:09 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
Cheapo Groovo <ccsj@nospam.com> wrote:
> Rod, what reality are you living in?
Same one you are, unfortunately.
> Rod Speed rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com wrote
>> Mr.SmartyPants <georgewkspam@humboldt1.com> wrote
>>> What's the best way to get into a financial mess? I'm not an
>>> economist,
>>
>> Or anything else either.
>>
>>> but the best way I know of is to borrow more money than you can pay
>>> back.
>>
>> Mindlessly superficial. It isnt always that easy to work out what
>> you can pay back.
>>
>> And those who have got stinking rich have got that way by doing that
>> anyway.
>>
>>> Here's what Ron Paul says:
>>
>> That fool has never ever had a clue.
>>
>>> "Ron Paul: How We Got into this Mess
>>
>>> By: The Mess that Greenspan Made
>>
>> Nothing to do with Greenspan, fool.
>>
>>> Thursday, July 10, 2008 5:41 PM
>>> Sectors: Finance
>>
>>> From Ron Paul's Campaign for Liberty
>>
>> Wota fucking wanker...
>>
>>> come these thoughts
>>
>> Those arent thoughts, they're just more steaming turds.
>>
>>> about how we got into such a mess with a financial
>>> system apparently falling apart at the seams
>>
>> It aint falling apart, fool.
>>
>>> and soaring inflation
>>
>> And there aint soaring inflation either, fool.
>>
>>> for nearly everything but the consumer price index.
>>
>> Pity about what it measures, fool.
>>
>>> The entire statement was to be read into the Congressional Record
>>> earlier this week
>>
>> Just another steaming turd dropped in there.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: You are not frugal if......
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3c5261ec65743940?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 12:14 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
George <george@nospam.invalid> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote
>> George <george@nospam.invalid> wrote
>>> Dennis wrote
>>>>> I might have some money for a replacement car, thinking along
>>>>> the lines of a Honda Civic HX, if I can find one. That gets 40 +
>>>>> on the highway. With that kind of mileage I can drive like it's
>>>>> 2007 all over again!
>>>> Why did they quit making models like the HX? Nowadays, they act like it's a big deal when a compact 4-banger gets
>>>> 30mpg.
>>>> I bought my first brand-new car in 1980, a Datsun (now Nissan)
>>>> 200SX. It had a 2.0L 4-cylinder, 5-speed manual transmission. It was supposed to be a sporty little brother to the
>>>> 280ZX. I used to average 35mpg commuting with it, and once got 38mpg over a couple tanks on a longer trip down the
>>>> freeway (in July with the A/C going). OK, it had electronic ignition, fuel injection, etc, but it was almost (now)
>>>> 30-year-old technology! Why can't the manufacturers at least match that today?
>>> They can.
>> Nope.
>>> Unfortunately the US manufacturers decided fluffed up trucks with
>>> 18 cup holders, 600 HP engines and 195,000lb towing capacity were
>>> what the average US driver needed to transport themselves and a
>>> large coffee.
>> Doesnt explain why Datsun doesnt get the result they used to get.
>>> I had a Ford Fiesta that they imported for only a few years and it got similar mileage to what you described with
>>> the Datsun. They still make and sell the Fiesta in Europe and Asia. The new version gets 34 mpg
>>> city/ 43 highway and 38.9 combined. The turbodiesel version gets 64
>>> mpg combined.
>>> If Ford is still in business they won't even be able to offer the
>>> Fiesta gas version in the US until at least October, 2009 because
>>> of all of the reliance they put on selling fluffed up trucks here.
>> Doesnt explain why Datsun doesnt get the result they used to get.
> It doesn't but that wasn't the question.
I was commenting on your answer, not the question.
>> The real reason its got worse is the pollution controls that are now mandated.
>>>>> I don't get this whole ethanol bit, beyond the big Agra boost.
>>>>> Methanol makes more sense if we have to have some such stuff as it doesn't boost food costs. Even Bio Diesel makes
>>>>> more sense.
>>>> Ethanol in fuel, at least as it is implemented today, makes no sense for the driving public.
>>> Heavily subsidizing grinding up food to make ethanol to keep the SUVs going will definitely go into the history
>>> books as one of the dumbest ideas the politicians ever came up with.
>> I doubt it. Look at what Brazil is doing sometime.
> You mean they cluelessly decided to use a crop to make ethanol without any planning like the politicians in the US did
> ?
They worked out a way of producing their own transport fuel
instead of importing crude oil and it works quite effectively for them.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: POISONOUS COUNTERFEIT TOOTHPASTE SEIZED IN CONNECTICUT
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ac5b13498eafe67f?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 1:11 pm
From: BeaForoni
On Jul 13, 6:41 am, balanc...@yahoo.com wrote:
> http://consumerist.com/consumer/chinese-poison-train/700-tubes-of-poi...
>
> Over 700 tubes of poisonous counterfeit toothpaste were seized in
> Connecticut, according to The New York Times. The toothpaste is
> flavored with diethylene glycol, a sweet-tasting chemical more
> commonly found in anti-freeze. It can cause liver and kidney damage if
> swallowed.
Pikers. You want to see consumer ripoffs, nothing beats the Chinese. I
submit for your dicussion: http://www.snopes.com/medical/toxins/hairband.asp
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Believe it or not.....!!!!!!!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9421bedb8701e43a?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 4:09 pm
From: Al Bundy
On Jul 10, 3:18 pm, George Grapman <sfgeo...@paccbell.net> wrote:
> I always love sites that require you to accept the terms of service
> when those terms are not on the site.
I'm not carrying water for the guy, but the TOS is right there with a
live link. It appears to be standard boiler plate stuff-no adult
content, no software piracy, and so on.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Garage Sales
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f1826c8cd57abac7?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 14 2008 4:18 pm
From: Al Bundy
On Jul 10, 1:16 am, JMILGTP <jeremy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
> I just finished writing my E-Book on what to look for at Garage Sales
> to sell on Ebay! This book is 17 pages long and provides a vast
> amount of informatoin.
> Theres the link for the auction! Don't miss out on this book!
Seventeen pages is not really a book. It's more of a memo.
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