Frugal Living: Aug 6, 2007

Monday, August 6, 2007

25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Made in China Bogeyman
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6b5476492d573449?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:42 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:58:52 -0400, Ward Abbott <presby@terian.com>
wrote:

>On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 23:37:58 +0530, "Pss" <pss@ssp.com> wrote:
>
>>If cows & chickens can be sold for food, why can't cats & dogs
>>be???
>
>
>possums, skunks, armadillo?

Shhhh. Don't even suggest it. Chinese will demand this as an exotic
food and there goes your ecosystem.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:58 pm
From: clams casino

PaPaPeng wrote:

>On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:58:52 -0400, Ward Abbott <presby@terian.com>
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 23:37:58 +0530, "Pss" <pss@ssp.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>If cows & chickens can be sold for food, why can't cats & dogs
>>>be???
>>>
>>>
>>possums, skunks, armadillo?
>>
>>
>
>
>Shhhh. Don't even suggest it. Chinese will demand this as an exotic
>food and there goes your ecosystem.
>
>
umm - Chinese buffets..................

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Anti-Tax guys won -- round 2
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b15b2290838aeb55?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:46 pm
From: The Real Bev

Rod Speed wrote:

> clams casino <PeterGriffin@drunkin-clam.com> wrote
>> The Real Bev wrote
>>> Dennis wrote
>
>>>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a national sales tax/VAT.
>
>>> For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to charge
>>> (and remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the professional sellers
>>> actually do it.
>
>> Which is why the IRS would have to triple in size if the US went to a
>> national sales or Vat tax.
>
> Nope, most countrys dont tax garage sales when they have a national sales or GST/VAT.

It's a state and city tax, not national. We could get screwed BOTH ways.

--
Cheers,
Bev
=====================================================
It's 95% of the lawyers making the other 5% look bad.

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:49 pm
From: The Real Bev

Binyamin Dissen wrote:

> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> :>Dennis wrote:
>
> :>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a national sales
> :>> tax/VAT.
>
> :>For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to charge (and
> :>remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the professional sellers actually do it.
>
> Even when they already paid sales tax when purchasing the product?

Yes. It's a tax on the sales transaction, not the product. No matter how
many times it's resold, the sales tax is supposed to be paid. If the seller
doesn't charge (and remit) the tax, the buyer is supposed to do it.

Yeah, right.

--
Cheers, Bev
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
The volume of a pizza of thickness 'a' and radius 'z'
is given by pi*z*z*a

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:16 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Rod Speed wrote:
>
>> clams casino <PeterGriffin@drunkin-clam.com> wrote
>>> The Real Bev wrote
>>>> Dennis wrote
>>
>>>>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a national
>>>>> sales tax/VAT.
>>
>>>> For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to
>>>> charge (and remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the
>>>> professional sellers actually do it.
>>
>>> Which is why the IRS would have to triple in size if the US went to
>>> a national sales or Vat tax.
>>
>> Nope, most countrys dont tax garage sales when they have a national
>> sales or GST/VAT.

> It's a state and city tax, not national.

What was being discussed was a national tax.

> We could get screwed BOTH ways.

You already are with income tax.

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:17 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Binyamin Dissen wrote:
>
>> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Dennis wrote:
>>
>>>>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a national
>>>>> sales tax/VAT.
>>
>>>> For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to
>>>> charge (and remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the
>>>> professional sellers actually do it.
>>
>> Even when they already paid sales tax when purchasing the product?
>
> Yes. It's a tax on the sales transaction, not the product.

Not always.

> No matter how many times it's resold, the sales tax is supposed to be paid.

Not always. Many states except second hand goods
and transactions that arent commercial transactions.

> If the seller doesn't charge (and remit) the tax, the buyer is supposed to do it.

Bet there are some exemptions.

> Yeah, right.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:27 pm
From: The Real Bev

Rod Speed wrote:
> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Binyamin Dissen wrote:
>>> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Dennis wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a
>>>>>> national sales tax/VAT.
>>>
>>>>> For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to
>>>>> charge (and remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the
>>>>> professional sellers actually do it.
>>>
>>> Even when they already paid sales tax when purchasing the product?
>>
>> Yes. It's a tax on the sales transaction, not the product.
>
> Not always.

If they call it a "sales tax" then yeah, it is. Not all sales require sales
tax, though; the sale of services is NOT taxed, so housecleaning and
prostitution carry no sales tax.

>> No matter how many times it's resold, the sales tax is supposed to be
>> paid.
>
> Not always. Many states except second hand goods and transactions that
> arent commercial transactions.
>
>> If the seller doesn't charge (and remit) the tax, the buyer is supposed
>> to do it.
>
> Bet there are some exemptions.

"Here" means Pasadena, California. YMMV. You used to be able to avoid
sales tax by mail-ordering stuff from out of state. If, however, a business
has a location in the state of California then they have to charge the
proper sales tax even if you're buying from the Nashville TN location.

>> Yeah, right.

--
Cheers,
Bev
============================================
"People are too stupid to realize they are."
--JoHn DoH KeLm

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:23 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Rod Speed wrote:
>> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Binyamin Dissen wrote:
>>>> The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Dennis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> But I wouldn't mind seeing the income tax replaced by a
>>>>>>> national sales tax/VAT.
>>>>
>>>>>> For garage sales too? Theory has it that they're supposed to
>>>>>> charge (and remit) sales tax (8.5% here), but only the
>>>>>> professional sellers actually do it.
>>>>
>>>> Even when they already paid sales tax when purchasing the product?
>>>
>>> Yes. It's a tax on the sales transaction, not the product.
>>
>> Not always.

> If they call it a "sales tax" then yeah, it is.

Nope, plenty of sales taxes only apply to retail
transactions, not other stuff like garage sales.

We had national sales taxes before we changed to a
GST and garage sales did not have sales taxes payable
and the GST isnt payable on those even now.

> Not all sales require sales tax, though;

Yep, including garage sales in many places that have sales taxes.

> the sale of services is NOT taxed, so housecleaning and prostitution carry no sales tax.

There's plenty of taxes on the sale of services.

>>> No matter how many times it's resold, the sales tax is supposed to be paid.

>> Not always. Many states except second hand goods and transactions that arent commercial
>> transactions.

>>> If the seller doesn't charge (and remit) the tax, the buyer is supposed to do it.

>> Bet there are some exemptions.

> "Here" means Pasadena, California.

Bet there are some exemptions there too.

> YMMV. You used to be able to avoid sales tax by mail-ordering stuff from out of state. If,
> however, a business has a location in the state of California then they have to charge the proper
> sales tax even if you're buying from the Nashville TN location.

Irrelevant to whether many jurisdictions have sales taxes payable on garage sales.

>>> Yeah, right.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Photo scanning service? - Follow up
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9f598948386130fc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:10 pm
From: The Real Bev

me@privacy.net wrote:

> What brand/model all in one scanner/printer would you
> advise? Any god all in ones with a god scanner
> portion?

I'm happy with my Canon Canoscan 8400F which I've had since June 2005.
<http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=120&modelid=10242>

Does prints, 35mm and 2.25 slides and negatives, and can work as a slow
copier. Lowest price I saw was $140+shipping etc., but I didn't look very
hard. I wasn't interested in normal printing or faxing, but it's fine for
scanning.

--
Cheers, Bev
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
The volume of a pizza of thickness 'a' and radius 'z'
is given by pi*z*z*a

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Food Fraud: Not China this time
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/245ac529c9e4870a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:14 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 06 Aug 2007 22:52:32 +0200, Peter Bruells <pb@ecce-terram.de>
> wrote:
>
>> PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> writes:
>>
>>> Fair enough. Everything is happening at lighting speed in China.
>>> Things like formal and scientific methods for industrial process
>>> food production have to be accomplished in a very compressed time.
>>> Problems and oversights will inevitably happen and will be
>>> immediately addressed and the solution found. There are no complex
>>> technologies involved or have to be invented. Safe products are as
>>> important to domestic consumers as they are to export customers.
>>> Furthermore there is no profit in running a sub-standard production
>>> line for domestic consumption.
>>
>
>
> Until very recently there was no such thing as factory produced
> national branded foods and goods and people pretty much have to rely
> on their smarts on what they buy. Brand names don't mean heck of a
> lot today either and people still haven't lost their smarts. You'll
> get the consumer injury cases whether they are unclean peasant made
> stuff or the factory made stuff. But somehow the severity of the
> damage in China is never the extent you get in the States.

Only because the public health systems are so primitive there.

> Do Chinese have better smarts and iron constitutions
> as compared to delicate Westerners? Probably.

Nope, they died like flys before the west eliminated smallpox.

>> In China, there is. Because a large number of customers will not know
>> better. And if there's an accident: We are talking about a country
>> where people who lose an arm in factory accident get the equivalent
>> of 150 Euro (170 USD) and a pink slip.

> Given the direction this thread is going we might as well attribute
> the factory with grinding that arm into the mix too. After all
> protein is protein and Soylent Green is a western delicacy.

== 2 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:10 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 06:43:27 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>
>> But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
>> the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
>> something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.

> It will take too much effort to go into the whole economic history
> of Chinese agriculture. Here something for you to chew on.

Nope.

> On 7 per cent of the world's agricultural land China supports
> 20 per cent of the world's population. This is possible only
> because the Chinese have evolved methods (in its over 5000
> year history) to farm the land to provide maximum output yet
> without ruining the land. That is quite an accomplishment.

Nope, the first world has done much better than that food production wise.

AND managed to leave the chinese for dead with modern medicine too.

> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.

But you may well get stuck with them if you visit china.

> Don't worry your pretty little head what stuff trhe Chinese eat in
> their homes any more they worry about what you eat in yours.

No one cares what they eat themselves except when they
insist on raping the world's eco systems for exotic food.

The first world worked out LONG ago the down side of using
untreated human shit when growing food for human consumption.

And its no coincidence that SARS etc came out of china either.

== 3 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:19 pm
From: "dfr"

dfr <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
> PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 06:43:27 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>>
>>> But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
>>> the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
>>> something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.
>
>> It will take too much effort to go into the whole economic history
>> of Chinese agriculture. Here something for you to chew on.
>
> Nope.
>
>> On 7 per cent of the world's agricultural land China supports
>> 20 per cent of the world's population. This is possible only
>> because the Chinese have evolved methods (in its over 5000
>> year history) to farm the land to provide maximum output yet
>> without ruining the land. That is quite an accomplishment.
>
> Nope, the first world has done much better than that food production
> wise.
> AND managed to leave the chinese for dead with modern medicine too.
>
>> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
>> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.

Thats just plain wrong with seafood particularly.

> But you may well get stuck with them if you visit china.
>
>> Don't worry your pretty little head what stuff trhe Chinese eat in
>> their homes any more they worry about what you eat in yours.
>
> No one cares what they eat themselves except when they
> insist on raping the world's eco systems for exotic food.
>
> The first world worked out LONG ago the down side of using
> untreated human shit when growing food for human consumption.
>
> And its no coincidence that SARS etc came out of china either.

== 4 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:28 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:19:13 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:

>>
>>> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
>>> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.
>
>Thats just plain wrong with seafood particularly.

You don't know your science. The fish and shrimp compalints refer to
farm raised fresh water stock in polluted water and too much
antibiotics in the feed. Seafood is exactly the same stuff your
fishermen catch. They are much too valued for local consumption in
the China market for them to be exported.

== 5 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:49 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:10:36 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:

>PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 06:43:27 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>>
>>> But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
>>> the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
>>> something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.
>
>> It will take too much effort to go into the whole economic history
>> of Chinese agriculture. Here something for you to chew on.
>
>Nope.
>
>> On 7 per cent of the world's agricultural land China supports
>> 20 per cent of the world's population. This is possible only
>> because the Chinese have evolved methods (in its over 5000
>> year history) to farm the land to provide maximum output yet
>> without ruining the land. That is quite an accomplishment.
>
>Nope, the first world has done much better than that food production wise.

Its based on cheap oil for the farm machinery and to produce the
fertilizers, etc. Its obvious you have never met a tree hugger, a
Greens or an eco-terrorist who can wise you up on the unsustainability
of your style of industrialized agroculture.
>
>AND managed to leave the chinese for dead with modern medicine too.

Modern medicine? The West truly has the world's unreserved gratitude
for this technology. No contest.
>
>> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
>> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.
>
>But you may well get stuck with them if you visit china.

Been there. Done it. Love it. Will do it again any time.
>
>> Don't worry your pretty little head what stuff trhe Chinese eat in
>> their homes any more they worry about what you eat in yours.
>
>No one cares what they eat themselves except when they
>insist on raping the world's eco systems for exotic food.

I am totally with you on this issue. Wildlife in their natural
environment has too much beauty and wonder to be harvested for food.
There is no need to exploit wildlife for food or for pets.
>
>The first world worked out LONG ago the down side of using
>untreated human shit when growing food for human consumption.
>
>And its no coincidence that SARS etc came out of china either.

Again your science is wanting. SARS has nothing to do with eating
shit. Its processing wildlife for food (see above) and coming in
contact with the animal's raw body fluids passes on the virus to
humans.

By the way raw human shit has to be processed before it can be used as
fertilizer. The raw form will burn and kill the crops. Treating it
(I don't know how) kills the pathogens. Its too bad the Chinese aid
workers haven't managed to persuade Africans to use human waste as
fertilizer. I came across several reports that it is a common
practice in African shanty towns for people to shit into a plastic bag
and toss it over the fence. Thus there are bags and bags of human
excrement in the open next to human habitation and into their open
sewers for flies and all manner of noxious germs to breed. This of
course becomes a public health hazard. That shit in a plastic bag
scene at the exclusive dinner club in Borat ain't funny at all.

== 6 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:56 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:14:46 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:

>> Do Chinese have better smarts and iron constitutions
>> as compared to delicate Westerners? Probably.
>
>Nope, they died like flys before the west eliminated smallpox.

And what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Look at the population
curve for China throughout 4000 years of history. Through famines,
plagues, wars, natural disaster that wiped out millions and even tens
of millions per episode. Anywhere else that would have wiped out a
whole country and even civilization. Damn. Nothing changed and the
numbers come back more than before. Double damn. Chinese are sure
hard to kill.

== 7 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:06 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:19:13 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>
>>>
>>>> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
>>>> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.
>>
>> Thats just plain wrong with seafood particularly.

> You don't know your science.

Fraid so.

> The fish and shrimp compalints refer to farm raised fresh water
> stock in polluted water and too much antibiotics in the feed.

Both you dont see when they come from the first world.

> Seafood is exactly the same stuff your fishermen catch.

No it isnt. Farm raised is nothing like wild.

> They are much too valued for local consumption
> in the China market for them to be exported.

Have fun explaining the chinese exports that have just recently
been banned in the US and other countrys like Australia.

== 8 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:15 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:10:36 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>
>> PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 06:43:27 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
>>>> the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
>>>> something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.
>>
>>> It will take too much effort to go into the whole economic history
>>> of Chinese agriculture. Here something for you to chew on.
>>
>> Nope.
>>
>>> On 7 per cent of the world's agricultural land China supports
>>> 20 per cent of the world's population. This is possible only
>>> because the Chinese have evolved methods (in its over 5000
>>> year history) to farm the land to provide maximum output yet
>>> without ruining the land. That is quite an accomplishment.
>>
>> Nope, the first world has done much better than that food production
>> wise.

> Its based on cheap oil for the farm machinery and to produce the fertilizers, etc.

Its much more than that, most obviously with plant breeding.

> Its obvious you have never met a tree hugger, a Greens or an eco-terrorist

Wrong again.

> who can wise you up on the unsustainability
> of your style of industrialized agroculture.

Just as sustainable as anything the chinese get up to.

>> AND managed to leave the chinese for dead with modern medicine too.

> Modern medicine? The West truly has the world's
> unreserved gratitude for this technology. No contest.

>>> By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown
>>> veggies in your grocery stores or canned ones either.

>> But you may well get stuck with them if you visit china.

> Been there. Done it. Love it. Will do it again any time.

Irrelevant to that silly claim you made.

>>> Don't worry your pretty little head what stuff trhe Chinese eat in
>>> their homes any more they worry about what you eat in yours.

>> No one cares what they eat themselves except when they
>> insist on raping the world's eco systems for exotic food.

> I am totally with you on this issue. Wildlife in their natural environment
> has too much beauty and wonder to be harvested for food.
> There is no need to exploit wildlife for food or for pets.

And medicine in spades when no one has ever been able to show that
any of the stupid chinese crap like rhino horn etc does a damned thing etc.

>> The first world worked out LONG ago the down side of using
>> untreated human shit when growing food for human consumption.

>> And its no coincidence that SARS etc came out of china either.

> Again your science is wanting.

Nope.

> SARS has nothing to do with eating shit.

Never said it did. Everything to do with how the chinese produce food tho.

> Its processing wildlife for food (see above) and coming in contact
> with the animal's raw body fluids passes on the virus to humans.

That aint what produced SARS.

> By the way raw human shit has to be processed before it can
> be used as fertilizer. The raw form will burn and kill the crops.
> Treating it (I don't know how) kills the pathogens.

No it doesnt. And it aint treated in that sense, just left to rot before its used.

> Its too bad the Chinese aid workers haven't managed
> to persuade Africans to use human waste as fertilizer.

That would only make the HIV/AIDS problem much worse.

> I came across several reports that it is a common practice
> in African shanty towns for people to shit into a plastic bag
> and toss it over the fence.

The west worked out the downsides with what the chinese do centurys ago now.

> Thus there are bags and bags of human excrement in the
> open next to human habitation and into their open sewers
> for flies and all manner of noxious germs to breed. This of
> course becomes a public health hazard. That shit in a plastic
> bag scene at the exclusive dinner club in Borat ain't funny at all.

Neither is what the chinese get up to either.

== 9 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:19 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:14:46 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:
>
>>> Do Chinese have better smarts and iron constitutions
>>> as compared to delicate Westerners? Probably.
>>
>> Nope, they died like flys before the west eliminated smallpox.

> And what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

Fantasy with smoking most obviously.

> Look at the population curve for China throughout 4000 years of history.

Mao always maintained that the reason for that is that the chinese
had nothing better to do in the evenings than fuck. He's likely right.

> Through famines, plagues, wars, natural disaster that wiped out
> millions and even tens of millions per episode. Anywhere else
> that would have wiped out a whole country and even civilization.

Fantasy. Bet you cant list even a single country or civilisation that disappeared that way.

> Damn. Nothing changed and the numbers come back more
> than before. Double damn. Chinese are sure hard to kill.

Have fun explaining why they died like flys before the west eliminated smallpox.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: used car
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4bc91883e5c3df2a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:58 pm
From: Gordon

gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston) wrote in
news:13bc2o4amlcvh3e@corp.supernews.com:

> In article <1186302293.715367.140610@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> <bob@coolgroups.com> wrote:
>>I was just wondering if there's a good way to ensure that a car hasn't
>>been smoked in when buying a used car. Sometimes it's hard to tell at
>>the dealership.
>
> Check the ashtray for signs of recent use.
>
>
> Gary
>

Best advice yet. Also check the lighter (if it has one)
and check for use.

Another idea: Check for yellow nicotine residue in some hard to
reach places. Look carefully around the edges of the windshield.
No mater how well they detail a car, they always leave a small
strip of yellow residue along there somewhere.
You might also get some alcahol wipes and swab some hard to reach
areas under the dash. (or the back of the rear view mirror,
underside of the steering collumn, Intake for the heater core).

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Excuse me!!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8dc27f26c48c008d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:12 pm
From: "Tockk"

<z.m.adel@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1186441025.643634.76710@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
> Excuse me!! Would you stop for a moment?!
> Have you seen a design which hasn't a designer ?!

Hmmm . . . have you seen a designer that did not have a designer himself?

And have you ever seen a designer's designer that did not have a designer
himself?

And have you ever seen a designer's designer's designer that did not have a
designer himself?

And have you ever seen a designer's designer's designer's designer that did
not have a designer himself?

Do you know where God came from? Why should we bother worshipping God (or,
in your case, Allah) when there are bigger Gods than Him that are more
deserving of our attention?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:24 pm
From: clams casino

z.m.adel@gmail.com wrote:

>Excuse me!!
>

Sorry, but there is no excusing a slimy, low-life spammer.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hand wash???
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3dd642fdb1e8579d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:41 pm
From: hchickpea@hotmail.com

We grabbed some new dishtowels from Kmart on a recent shopping trip,
Martha Stewfart approved if that matters. Washed them and they came
out incredibly wrinkled. Looked on the label... Made in India, 100%
cotton. HAND WASH in cold water. Right, we'll get mammy to do that
next time. WTF??? HAND WASH dish towels??? Gee, what next, ironing
paper towels before use?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:19 pm
From: Anthony Matonak

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:
> We grabbed some new dishtowels from Kmart on a recent shopping trip,
> Martha Stewfart approved if that matters. Washed them and they came
> out incredibly wrinkled. Looked on the label... Made in India, 100%
> cotton. HAND WASH in cold water. Right, we'll get mammy to do that
> next time. WTF??? HAND WASH dish towels??? Gee, what next, ironing
> paper towels before use?

It's that 100% cotton that is the wrinkle magnet. I don't know about
hand washing them but you probably want to line dry and iron. :)

Anthony

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Best Internet Service Provider
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8918ee09f99ddf76?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:25 pm
From: Stuart

I want to change my ISP and need your input.
Tell me what you use, how fast are downloads, and how much it costs.
Thank you all,
S2

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:53 pm
From: Anthony Matonak

Stuart wrote:
> I want to change my ISP and need your input.
> Tell me what you use, how fast are downloads, and how much it costs.

Perhaps you might want to limit replies to people living in the
same country as yourself? Maybe even the same State or City?

What I want is FIOS, 30Mbps to start and Gigabit for a little more.

I could turn blue, die, decompose and come back as Elvis before
they'll install it though. Why sell real broadband where there
is plenty of DSL to go around?

<Sigh>

Anthony

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25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: FREE! A GLOBAL HOME BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY FREE!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5864ef692ac1cc9a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 10:19 am
From: George Grapman

If it is free why do the want my credit card?

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 11:07 am
From: "Pss"

Meghan Noecker wrote:
> Do you think the people in China give a damn about our cats and dogs?
> I've seen videos of the cats and dogs in cages at marketplaces being
> sold for food, so I don't think they really have a clue what they mean
> to us here.

If cows & chickens can be sold for food, why can't cats & dogs
be???

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:17 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 02:25:58 -0700, Meghan Noecker
<friesian@zoocrewphoto.com> wrote:

>So, no, I will never buy pet food with wheat gluten in it ever again.
>And I will not buy the brands of food that got hit by this either
>since I have seen no proof that they will discontinue using
>ingredients from China. I see no reason to buy food products from
>China until they follow our standards in producing and handling the
>food.

An excellent attitude. Be discriminating and smart in anything you
do.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:58 pm
From: Ward Abbott

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 23:37:58 +0530, "Pss" <pss@ssp.com> wrote:

>If cows & chickens can be sold for food, why can't cats & dogs
>be???

possums, skunks, armadillo?

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:54 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Ward Abbott <presby@terian.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 23:37:58 +0530, "Pss" <pss@ssp.com> wrote:
>
>> If cows & chickens can be sold for food, why can't cats & dogs
>> be???
>
>
> possums, skunks, armadillo?

The chinese have always been notorious for eating absolutely anything.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Conspiracies Revealed!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/abcba658bc9c8333?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 11:08 am
From: conspiracy.black@gmail.com

http://nasaconspiracy.net/conspiracy - Find out who really shot JFK!,
learn how they faked the lunar landing, see what they are putting in
our milk to enlarge young womens breasts in a goal to raise the
declining birth rate. Proof of extraterrestrial life and much more
revealed here.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Rod Speed, how is Australia ?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6af50f3e8b494e32?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 11:22 am
From: "Rod Speed"

me@privacy.net wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

>>> How is the weather down there?

>> Not bad, winter here, significant rain,

> Rod I forget....what city you in in Aus?

> And.... what is the average winter temp there?

Mean max in July, the coldest month is 14.3C, 58F
Mean min is 2.3C, 38F

> Does it get below freezing?

The overnight minimum does.

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:00 pm
From: me@privacy.net

"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

>me@privacy.net wrote
>> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>
>>>> How is the weather down there?
>
>>> Not bad, winter here, significant rain,
>
>> Rod I forget....what city you in in Aus?
>
>> And.... what is the average winter temp there?
>
>Mean max in July, the coldest month is 14.3C, 58F
>Mean min is 2.3C, 38F
>
>> Does it get below freezing?
>
>The overnight minimum does.
>

Still tho.... a lot milder than winter here in northern
Missouri! <g>

Id say we have abt two week of weather in mid January
where temps never get above 20 degrees F. Maybe lower

So the Aussie climate sounds MUCH more agreeable to me!

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:53 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

me@privacy.net wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>> me@privacy.net wrote
>>> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

>>>>> How is the weather down there?

>>>> Not bad, winter here, significant rain,

>>> Rod I forget....what city you in in Aus?

>>> And.... what is the average winter temp there?

>> Mean max in July, the coldest month is 14.3C, 58F
>> Mean min is 2.3C, 38F

>>> Does it get below freezing?

>> The overnight minimum does.

> Still tho.... a lot milder than winter here in northern Missouri! <g>

Sure, its a lot closer to non coastal Texas, but without the snow.

> Id say we have abt two week of weather in mid January
> where temps never get above 20 degrees F. Maybe lower

Its very rare that the daily max doesnt get above 32F, like once in a decade or more.

> So the Aussie climate sounds MUCH more agreeable to me!

Yeah, tho its pretty hot in summer, 10 days over 100F isnt that unusual.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 4:22 pm
From: Millhaven

Is marijuana legal? What about prostitution?

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:18 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Millhaven <millhaven@intergate.com> wrote:

> Is marijuana legal?

Technically its decriminalised rather than legal in some states and territorys.

In practice you dont even get fined unless its commercial quantitys and cultivation etc.

> What about prostitution?

That was never illegal here. Some activitys like soliciting for prostitution,
brothels and living off prostitutes, was illegal is mostly legal now.
The main exception is a few special cases like soliciting for prostitution
outside schools etc and fucking in the street etc isnt legal, but then that
last isnt legal even when its not for money.

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 11:27 am
From: "Rod Speed"

Peter Bruells <pb@ecce-terram.de> wrote
> Anthony Matonak <anthonym40@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> writes
>> Dennis wrote

>>> I agree. And here's another aspect: The western industrialized
>>> world has been and continues to be regularly beat up for all the
>>> mistakes that it made on the way up. The Chinese might as well
>>> accept that it's part of the package and deal with it.

>> The mistakes are now known. The Chinese don't have to repeat all of them.

Its non trivial to ensure compliance by all manufacturers in an operation of that size.

Its clear that even a very gung ho death penalty for corruption isnt enough.

> Repeating mistakes other people made is a human pastime.

And the same complaints were made about the Japs at one time too.

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:24 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 12:21:50 -0400, "Chloe" <justsayno@spam.com> wrote:

>I read a pretty thoughtful article on this subject recently, that said the
>Chinese are pretty much where the U.S. was a hundred years or so ago in the
>development of an industrial economy. As PaPa doesn't seem to realize or
>perhaps be willing to acknowledge, this does not necessarily make the
>Chinese evil or ignorant in the eyes of Western observers, it just means
>they have quite a bit of evolution still to do in areas like quality control
>and safety. I suspect they'll go through all the steps pretty quickly, but
>they'll still have to go through them. The spin you're talking about is one
>of those steps <g>.
>

Fair enough. Everything is happening at lighting speed in China.
Things like formal and scientific methods for industrial process food
production have to be accomplished in a very compressed time.
Problems and oversights will inevitably happen and will be immediately
addressed and the solution found. There are no complex technologies
involved or have to be invented. Safe products are as important to
domestic consumers as they are to export customers. Furthermore there
is no profit in running a sub-standard production line for domestic
consumption.

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:43 pm
From: "dfr"

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 12:21:50 -0400, "Chloe" <justsayno@spam.com> wrote:
>
>> I read a pretty thoughtful article on this subject recently, that
>> said the Chinese are pretty much where the U.S. was a hundred years
>> or so ago in the development of an industrial economy. As PaPa
>> doesn't seem to realize or perhaps be willing to acknowledge, this
>> does not necessarily make the Chinese evil or ignorant in the eyes
>> of Western observers, it just means they have quite a bit of
>> evolution still to do in areas like quality control and safety. I
>> suspect they'll go through all the steps pretty quickly, but they'll
>> still have to go through them. The spin you're talking about is one
>> of those steps <g>.
>>
>
>
> Fair enough. Everything is happening at lighting speed in China.
> Things like formal and scientific methods for industrial process food
> production have to be accomplished in a very compressed time.
> Problems and oversights will inevitably happen and will be immediately
> addressed and the solution found. There are no complex technologies
> involved or have to be invented. Safe products are as important to
> domestic consumers as they are to export customers.

But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.

> Furthermore there is no profit in running a sub-standard
> production line for domestic consumption.

Mindlessly silly.

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:52 pm
From: Peter Bruells

PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> writes:

> Fair enough. Everything is happening at lighting speed in China.
> Things like formal and scientific methods for industrial process food
> production have to be accomplished in a very compressed time.
> Problems and oversights will inevitably happen and will be immediately
> addressed and the solution found. There are no complex technologies
> involved or have to be invented. Safe products are as important to
> domestic consumers as they are to export customers. Furthermore there
> is no profit in running a sub-standard production line for domestic
> consumption.

In China, there is. Because a large number of customers will not know
better. And if there's an accident: We are talking about a country
where people who lose an arm in factory accident get the equivalent of
150 Euro (170 USD) and a pink slip.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:29 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On Tue, 7 Aug 2007 06:43:27 +1000, "dfr" <dfr@dfr.com> wrote:

>But the mindset is completely different, most obviously with
>the use of human shit on vegetables for human consumption,
>something that just doesnt happen in the first world anymore.

It will take too much effort to go into the whole economic history of
Chinese agriculture. Here something for you to chew on. On 7 per
cent of the world's agricultural land China supports 20 per cent of
the world's population. This is possible only because the Chinese
have evolved methods (in its over 5000 year history) to farm the land
to provide maximum output yet without ruining the land. That is quite
an accomplishment.

By the way you won't ever come across Chinese fresh grown veggies in
your grocery stores or canned ones either. Don't worry your pretty
little head what stuff trhe Chinese eat in their homes any more they
worry about what you eat in yours.

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:41 pm
From: PaPaPeng

On 06 Aug 2007 22:52:32 +0200, Peter Bruells <pb@ecce-terram.de>
wrote:

>PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> Fair enough. Everything is happening at lighting speed in China.
>> Things like formal and scientific methods for industrial process food
>> production have to be accomplished in a very compressed time.
>> Problems and oversights will inevitably happen and will be immediately
>> addressed and the solution found. There are no complex technologies
>> involved or have to be invented. Safe products are as important to
>> domestic consumers as they are to export customers. Furthermore there
>> is no profit in running a sub-standard production line for domestic
>> consumption.
>

Until very recently there was no such thing as factory produced
national branded foods and goods and people pretty much have to rely
on their smarts on what they buy. Brand names don't mean heck of a
lot today either and people still haven't lost their smarts. You'll
get the consumer injury cases whether they are unclean peasant made
stuff or the factory made stuff. But somehow the severity of the
damage in China is never the extent you get in the States. Do Chinese
have better smarts and iron constitutions as compared to delicate
Westerners? Probably.

>In China, there is. Because a large number of customers will not know
>better. And if there's an accident: We are talking about a country
>where people who lose an arm in factory accident get the equivalent of
>150 Euro (170 USD) and a pink slip.

Given the direction this thread is going we might as well attribute
the factory with grinding that arm into the mix too. After all
protein is protein and Soylent Green is a western delicacy.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Backhoe or dozer rental
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/62c19fdb9643f800?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 1:47 pm
From: Dennis

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:50:25 -0000, Brian Elfert <belfert@visi.com>
wrote:

>Do rental places really rent dozers, backhoes, and the like to folks who
>have no experience with them?
>
>Sure, they want the money from the rental, but they also don't want a
>$20,000 and up machine damaged or destroyed due to inexperience.

The rental places that I have seen use a contract that makes the
renter liable for damages beyond normal wear and tear. Evidently it
is sufficient, given that many such places stay in business.

Seems like equipment rental businesses must have a similar
situation/practice as those that rent cars.

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: NICEOFFERS.COM
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/4d9f93fe0d3ac5f4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:27 pm
From: Duke

We are an online database of special offers and deals. The offers and
deals are searchable and organized so they can be found quickly and
easily. We save consumers valuable time (no need to search through
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they use the coupons. Another benefit is that we will have many
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: OK to cut vitamins in half?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a8fd0a8f8cf6b86d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:33 pm
From: me@privacy.net

Been thinking abt starting to take a daily vitamin such
as Centrum

But got to looking at label and some of the doses are
at 400%!!

I don't want to mega dose anything..... just get "some"
dose for each thing

Think it OK to cut vitamins in half or even quarters
and take that way? Or do they have some kind of
enteric coating on them that slows down absorption that
cutting would hinder?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:48 pm
From: spinner.barry@gmail.com

On Aug 6, 5:33 pm, m...@privacy.net wrote:
> Been thinking abt starting to take a daily vitamin such
> as Centrum
>
> But got to looking at label and some of the doses are
> at 400%!!
>
> I don't want to mega dose anything..... just get "some"
> dose for each thing
>
> Think it OK to cut vitamins in half or even quarters
> and take that way? Or do they have some kind of
> enteric coating on them that slows down absorption that
> cutting would hinder?

Yes, to first Q. And yes, to second Q when there is a special-
purpose coating only.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Find out How to Unlock your car with a cell phone Video
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/612188418648f19c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:56 pm
From: "Don K"

"bosad87" <revenuesharing@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1186337548.105885.32140@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
> Watch out How to Unlock your car with a cell phone Video...

That's ridiculous. My cell phone doesn't fit into the keyhole.

Don

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Walgreen printer cart refills
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e8d0982d83a41da6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:35 pm
From: Gregory Morrow

Ken Knecht wrote:

> Anyone tried the $10 injet cartridge refills at Walgreens? How long does
> it actually take them to refill a cartridge? Do the cartridges work well?
> I have a black HP 832 cartridge I'm tempted to try.

I just got the carts for my HP 842C inkjet refilled at Walgreens (one
color, one b/w), I'm very pleased. Can't beat the price @ $25.00 for
both refills...

--
Best
Greg

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:57 pm
From: z.m.adel@gmail.com

Excuse me!! Would you stop for a moment?!
Haven't you thought-one day- about yourself ?
Who has made it?
Have you seen a design which hasn't a designer ?!
Have you seen a wonderful, delicate work without a worker ?!
It's you and the whole universe!.. Who has made them all ?!!
You know who ?.. It's "ALLAH",prise be to him.
Just think for a moment. How are you going to be after death ?!
Can you believe that this exact system of the universe and all of
these great creation will end in nothing...just after death!
Haven't you thought about what is the right religion?!
Here you will get the answer

http://al-sunnah.com/
http://www.islam-guide.com/
http://www.thelastingmiracle.com/eng/
http://www.harunyahya.com/index.php
http://www.islamqa.com/special/index.php?subsite=12&ln=eng

==============================================================================
TOPIC: More Mexican Famiy Values
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7e4b4b4273b9bb9a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 5:17 pm
From: Ted

On Aug 6, 12:05 pm, gringogirl <sumarli...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> To the willfully malicious Mexican with two toddlers and three Jack
> Russell Terriers at Hazeldale dog park August 5, 2007,
>
> You disgust me! Your existence blights the human race. You are a key
> reason people want illegal Mexicans deported.
>
> The negligence you displayed with your children and dogs was
> incredibly shocking. You thought it was funny when your puppy almost
> hanged itself while being tied up to a picnic table in an off leash
> fenced in dog park while you ignored it. Even more shocking was when
> you lifted the puppy up to your toddler daughter and let her
> repeatedly hit the puppy in the face! At one point, while you were
> watching your daughter, she stepped on the puppy's neck pinning it
> down to yell at it!
>
> What do you think you are teaching your children? How do you think the
> dog is going to react? When the child beats on the dog, the dog
> doesn't understand it and will likely bite the child in fear and
> defense -- then you beat the dog. Are you that stupid of a human or do
> you not have a single scruple in your head? I think it is the later
> because when I confronted you, you pretended not to speak English,
> however only ten minutes before you spoke to me in English!
>
> I feel so badly for your kids and the dogs. You are lucky I could not
> find the police before you left. Maybe I should have bought the dogs
> from you right on the spot, then reported you to child services.
>
> You deserve to be hung by a leash in a field full of people who will
> ignore your cries for help.
>
> Location: Beaverton
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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24 new messages in 14 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Welcome To FreeLife : The Himalayan Goji Company : Gained Global
Residual Online Income Opportunity Now !!!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3cc720b8ce2a2919?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 12:15 am
From: "worldbiz4u@gmail.com"

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: wholesale sport shoes,clothing,electronics in china www.fashion-sky.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e82d3ed8c49fee12?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 12:38 am
From: fashion-sky@msn.com

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: HARAJUKU
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0e83b4e6126016bc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 5 2007 11:41 am
From: "Mike Lyle"

lihatlahmereka@gmail.com wrote:
> Harajuku fashion gets its name from the Harajuku district of Tokyo.
> All the switched-on harajuku kids go there to explore the many clothes
> shops and gather Yoyogi Park, the cafes in Omotesando Street or on the
> way to the Meiji shrine to display their latest harajuku creations for
> tourists as well as for their friends.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/yuz2ns

Lots of fun Ggl images under <Harajuku>, including seriously unscary
"Scary Goth girls in Harajuku" and "Walking the Cabbage. . ."

--
Mike.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 2:25 am
From: Meghan Noecker

On Sat, 04 Aug 2007 16:59:42 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Will US consumers stop buying Made in China goods? It
>never even happened in the first place because the benefits and
>utility far outweigh the anti-China hype.

Unfortunately, the US consumer cannot go after the guilty parties in
these cases.

My cat is dead. Because somebody in China thought it was okay to put
plastic in the wheat gluten. The US gets 80% of its wheat gluten from
China. The comanies here did not do anything wrong, but they are the
ones taking the financial loss.

Do you think the people in China give a damn about our cats and dogs?
I've seen videos of the cats and dogs in cages at marketplaces being
sold for food, so I don't think they really have a clue what they mean
to us here. Will the stop putting melamine in the wheat gluten? Maybe
for awhile, and then they will just use lower amounts.

So, no, I will never buy pet food with wheat gluten in it ever again.
And I will not buy the brands of food that got hit by this either
since I have seen no proof that they will discontinue using
ingredients from China. I see no reason to buy food products from
China until they follow our standards in producing and handling the
food.

Anytime I have a choice to avoid a Chinese product, I will. I wish it
wasn't so hard to avoid buying Chinese products. I see no reason to
reward them financially when my cat is dead. They don't give a damn
about me. Why should I invest in them?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: wholesale sport shoes,clothing,electronics in china www.shopbb.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e231aa744271d717?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:28 am
From: shopbb@hotmail.com

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== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:29 am
From: shopbb@hotmail.com

this is our website http://www.shopbb.com

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== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 3:30 am
From: shopbb@hotmail.com

this is our website http://www.shopbb.com

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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 7:20 am
From: "Melissa"

"bosad87" <revenuesharing@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1186337548.105885.32140@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
> Watch out How to Unlock your car with a cell phone Video...
>
http://mobilephone-guide.blogspot.com/2007/07/how-to-unlock-your-car-with-cell-phone.html
>

http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/keyless.asp

Melissa

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wholesale NIKE .AF1.TN.Jordan.shoes http://www.new-nikeshoes.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1d528d85533d3eca?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 6:29 am
From: new-nikeshoes

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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:27 am
From: me@privacy.net

Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:

>So I was in a Walgreens Friday and checked things out. You can scan the
>photos yourself and get a CD created for only $2.99. Again though - the
>key here to the $2.99 frugal part is standing there and scanning the
>photos yourself. Originally you were asking about having someone else do
>it so I don't know if this option will interest you.

Yes.... thanks so much for your report Rick!

I am the guy who posted abt scanning and saving old
photos. I don't have ANY computer equip to do myself
at the moment.

Anyway..... yes.... the resolution the Walgreens and
Walmart kiosks save in does concern me. I do need a
good "archival" quality resolution as these photos are
very old BW photos.

I'm a poor starving college student.... not working, no
income right now

I do, however, have some money to spend and could buy
my own flatbed scanner to hook up to someone elses or
the colleges computer I guess.

What brand/model all in one scanner/printer would you
advise? Any god all in ones with a god scanner
portion?

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:29 am
From: me@privacy.net

Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:

>Good idea to bring your own spray cleaner and a soft cloth. These stores
>aren't known for actually cleaning the scanner glass. It was disgusting
>in this store - looked like it hadn't been Windexed in a good six
>months.

yeah....another god reason for me to just break down
and buy equip to my myself!

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:25 am
From: Dennis

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 10:29:09 -0500, me@privacy.net wrote:

>Rick <rickajho@rcn.com> wrote:
>
>>Good idea to bring your own spray cleaner and a soft cloth. These stores
>>aren't known for actually cleaning the scanner glass. It was disgusting
>>in this store - looked like it hadn't been Windexed in a good six
>>months.
>
>yeah....another god reason for me to just break down
>and buy equip to my myself!

Have you recently found religion, or do you just have a flakey 'o'
key?

Dennis (evil)
--
"There is a fine line between participation and mockery" - Wally

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:59 am
From: me@privacy.net

Dennis <dgw80@hotmail.com> wrote:

>>yeah....another god reason for me to just break down
>>and buy equip to my myself!
>
>Have you recently found religion, or do you just have a flakey 'o'
>key?

sorry..flaky spell check

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:30 am
From: me@privacy.net

"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

>> How is the weather down there?
>
>Not bad, winter here, significant rain,

Rod I forget....what city you in in Aus?

And.... what is the average winter temp there? Does it
get below freezing?

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 8:51 am
From: Dennis

On Fri, 03 Aug 2007 00:12:47 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:

>China's about-face on product safety
>By Antoaneta Bezlova
>August 3, 2007
>http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Business/IH03Cb01.html
>
>BEIJING - Dogged by a plethora of reports in the foreign media
>highlighting problem Chinese goods and worried that product-safety
>recalls are spiraling into a major problem for its export juggernaut,
>Beijing has shifted gears to defend its battered "Made in China"
>reputation.

So, it looks like the Chinese are shifting from denial that there is a
problem to a grand public display of their concern for the safety of
their exports.

Say, isn't that pretty much exactly what your reaction to this
situation has been, too? Hmm...

Dennis (evil)
--
"There is a fine line between participation and mockery" - Wally

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:21 am
From: "Chloe"

"Dennis" <dgw80@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tngeb3hrakg2s0p6ngmsoksf050oau1sfe@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 03 Aug 2007 00:12:47 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>China's about-face on product safety
>>By Antoaneta Bezlova
>>August 3, 2007
>>http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Business/IH03Cb01.html
>>
>>BEIJING - Dogged by a plethora of reports in the foreign media
>>highlighting problem Chinese goods and worried that product-safety
>>recalls are spiraling into a major problem for its export juggernaut,
>>Beijing has shifted gears to defend its battered "Made in China"
>>reputation.
>
> So, it looks like the Chinese are shifting from denial that there is a
> problem to a grand public display of their concern for the safety of
> their exports.
>
> Say, isn't that pretty much exactly what your reaction to this
> situation has been, too? Hmm...
>
> Dennis (evil)

I read a pretty thoughtful article on this subject recently, that said the
Chinese are pretty much where the U.S. was a hundred years or so ago in the
development of an industrial economy. As PaPa doesn't seem to realize or
perhaps be willing to acknowledge, this does not necessarily make the
Chinese evil or ignorant in the eyes of Western observers, it just means
they have quite a bit of evolution still to do in areas like quality control
and safety. I suspect they'll go through all the steps pretty quickly, but
they'll still have to go through them. The spin you're talking about is one
of those steps <g>.

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:34 am
From: Dennis

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 12:21:50 -0400, "Chloe" <justsayno@spam.com> wrote:

>"Dennis" <dgw80@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:tngeb3hrakg2s0p6ngmsoksf050oau1sfe@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 03 Aug 2007 00:12:47 GMT, PaPaPeng <PaPaPeng@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>China's about-face on product safety
>>>By Antoaneta Bezlova
>>>August 3, 2007
>>>http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Business/IH03Cb01.html
>>>
>>>BEIJING - Dogged by a plethora of reports in the foreign media
>>>highlighting problem Chinese goods and worried that product-safety
>>>recalls are spiraling into a major problem for its export juggernaut,
>>>Beijing has shifted gears to defend its battered "Made in China"
>>>reputation.
>>
>> So, it looks like the Chinese are shifting from denial that there is a
>> problem to a grand public display of their concern for the safety of
>> their exports.
>>
>> Say, isn't that pretty much exactly what your reaction to this
>> situation has been, too? Hmm...
>>
>> Dennis (evil)
>
>I read a pretty thoughtful article on this subject recently, that said the
>Chinese are pretty much where the U.S. was a hundred years or so ago in the
>development of an industrial economy. As PaPa doesn't seem to realize or
>perhaps be willing to acknowledge, this does not necessarily make the
>Chinese evil or ignorant in the eyes of Western observers, it just means
>they have quite a bit of evolution still to do in areas like quality control
>and safety. I suspect they'll go through all the steps pretty quickly, but
>they'll still have to go through them. The spin you're talking about is one
>of those steps <g>.
>

I agree. And here's another aspect: The western industrialized world
has been and continues to be regularly beat up for all the mistakes
that it made on the way up. The Chinese might as well accept that
it's part of the package and deal with it.

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:45 am
From: Anthony Matonak

Dennis wrote:
...
> I agree. And here's another aspect: The western industrialized world
> has been and continues to be regularly beat up for all the mistakes
> that it made on the way up. The Chinese might as well accept that
> it's part of the package and deal with it.

The mistakes are now known. The Chinese don't have to repeat all of
them. The problem is that they are trying to rush their country through
hundreds of years of development as quickly as possible in order to
compete against the world. This means they are cutting corners. This
lack of concern about safety and the environment is one of the corners
they are cutting.

Anthony

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:50 am
From: Peter Bruells

Anthony Matonak <anthonym40@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> writes:

> Dennis wrote:
> ...
> > I agree. And here's another aspect: The western industrialized world
> > has been and continues to be regularly beat up for all the mistakes
> > that it made on the way up. The Chinese might as well accept that
> > it's part of the package and deal with it.
>
> The mistakes are now known. The Chinese don't have to repeat all of
> them.

Repeating mistakes other people made is a human pastime.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Inexpensive hotels in Westchester county
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8190c4a851d209cd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:31 am
From: "hankus"

WE need to be in Westchester county the second and third weeks in September
and will be visiting the NEW BABY in Mt Vernon...we will have our car so RR
access is not needed...any reasonably priced places to stay?

--
Thanks
Hank

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:35 am
From: ranck@vt.edu

bob@coolgroups.com wrote:
> I was just wondering if there's a good way to ensure that a car hasn't
> been smoked in when buying a used car. Sometimes it's hard to tell at
> the dealership.

Turn on both the heat and AC. Drive it around for a half hour or so.
If you can't smell it during those tests, you probably never will.
If that's not good enough, buy a new car, then you can be sure.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 9:50 am
From: Brian Elfert

hchickpea@hotmail.com writes:

>Anyone ever rented and used a backhoe or bulldozer? I have some land
>that I need to level and grade, and the price I was quoted was about
>three times what I had expected. Looks like I could rent a dozer for
>a week and pay only about 1/6th the cost of having the work done.

Do rental places really rent dozers, backhoes, and the like to folks who
have no experience with them?

Sure, they want the money from the rental, but they also don't want a
$20,000 and up machine damaged or destroyed due to inexperience.

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 10:06 am
From: Duke

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== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Aug 6 2007 10:08 am
From: Duke

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