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* Math on the bailout doesn't add up... - 8 messages, 6 authors
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* Hussein Obama's First 10 Executive Orders - 13 messages, 13 authors
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Math on the bailout doesn't add up...
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3213ff522966e10e?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Oct 12 2008 11:36 pm
From: Michael Coburn
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 05:13:35 +0000, Michael Coburn wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 05:07:33 -0400, Neil Jones wrote:
>
>> Jitney wrote:
>>> It is hard to find statistics on the mortgage crisis, so I'm making an
>>> estimate. There are about 100 million households in the USA, assuming
>>> 10% are in default or foreclosure, which I think is a high estimate,
>>> subtracting rentals from the 100 million (if you can refute me from a
>>> credible authority, I would love to be corrected). Ten million divided
>>> into 700 billion works out to $700,000 per distressed property, which
>>> should on the average buy out each property twice. What is happening
>>> to the rest? I think this is a massive raid on the US treasury, with a
>>> threat of a Great Depression if we don't pay up, and that isn't even
>>> counting AIG, Countrywide, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and Bear Stearns.
>>> Wall Street is stealing more than the Huns that raided the Roman
>>> Empire, with similar results. And this is not the end. Congress forked
>>> over 25 Billion to the automakers, the airlines are next, and who
>>> then? Ben and Jerries? We are looking at a new Dark Ages.
>>
>> McCain's plan to buy back bad mortgages from owners is rewarding bad
>> behavior of people who could not afford those houses. If I had known
>> this, I would have bought a huge home and waited for McCain to come and
>> rescue me. Darn it.
>>
>> According this McCain's plan, all normal people living within their
>> means are stupid and greedy behavior should be rewarded. Isn't McCain
>> supporting one of the christian principles in "The 7 deadly sins" which
>> is GREED? (I am not a christian but I like somethings in
>> Christianity).
>
> It is a case by case basis that should recognize that there was a bubble
> caused by the Wall Street Weasels and encouraged by the "We don't want
> no stinkin' regulation" Republican government.
>
> However:
>
> You will not convince me that a person that put no money down on a
> subprime loan is supposed to be "saved" by a bailout. The person will
> be "inconvenienced" if forced to move to other accommodations. But the
> person has been minimally harmed financially. This assumes a rewrite of
> the bankruptcy code and the tax code to prevent enslavement of the home
> buyers who in most cases were acting in goof faith.
That was to have been "good faith" as opposed to "goof faith".
== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 3:35 am
From: clams_casino
habshi wrote:
> Those who sold the property to poor people at inflated prices
>should be forced to give 100% of it back to the banks.
>
>
Does that include Walmart, Coca Cola and GM?
== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:30 am
From: "RM V2.0"
> It is a case by case basis that should recognize that there was a bubble
> caused by the Wall Street Weasels and encouraged by the "We don't want no
> stinkin' regulation" Republican government.
the Democrats forced the bad loans, Repugs warned against it.
>
> However:
>
> You will not convince me that a person that put no money down on a
> subprime loan is supposed to be "saved" by a bailout. The person will be
> "inconvenienced" if forced to move to other accommodations. But the
> person has been minimally harmed financially. This assumes a rewrite of
> the bankruptcy code and the tax code to prevent enslavement of the home
> buyers who in most cases were acting in goof faith.
Taxpayers shouldnt be forced to pay for individuals stupidity.
== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 11:18 am
From: Curly Surmudgeon
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 14:30:12 +0000, RM V2.0 wrote:
>> It is a case by case basis that should recognize that there was a
>> bubble caused by the Wall Street Weasels and encouraged by the "We
>> don't want no stinkin' regulation" Republican government.
>
> the Democrats forced the bad loans, Repugs warned against it.
While the Republicans deregulated leverage:
in 1999 there was $160m of subprime loans with a default rate of about 2%
as the CDA was offset by strong anti-predatory lending laws and state
enforcement.
in 2002 the Executive branch of govt began pre-emption policy telling
state AGs not to enforce state laws on predatory lending that were tougher
than federal laws. ( http://www.napawash.org/resources/peirce...
in 2002 at the urging of Republican Congress and White House, Alan
Greenspan loosens credit and floods market with dollars.
in 2003 the SEC with a Bush minion lifted 12:1 leverage limit on
investment banks.
in 2004 federal pre-emption regarding predatory lending became rule, via
directive of the Office of the Comptroller, a division of Treasury (Bush
appointees).
in 2005 dollar begins to tank in a more pronounded way due to huge money
supply and soaring U.S. debts piled up past few years.
in 2006 subprime loans grew to $600b.
in 2007 energy prices (and other commodities such as food) soar, making
paying mortgages and other expenses more difficult for middle Americans.
in 2007 Investment Banks were levered to about 40:1, except at month end
to satisfy regulators when they were about 30:1
in 2008 foreclosures soar approaching 9% and show no sign of abating until
mid to late 2009.
in 2008 Bear Stearns, Lehman, Merrill, Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley
all had to recapitalize at draconian terms, go bust or be bought for less
than 10% of their previous value.
in 2008 credit so siezed up that banks won't even lend to each other for
longer than a day or two, creating a business cash shortage and forcing
many businesses to cut expenses decreasing employment levels to their
lowest pct of workforce in over a decade and a half.
in 2008 bailouts of financial institutions by the Federal Govt will exceed
$1 trillion, the economy is noticably slowing, household income is down
and unemployment continues to ramp up.
>> However:
>>
>> You will not convince me that a person that put no money down on a
>> subprime loan is supposed to be "saved" by a bailout. The person will
>> be "inconvenienced" if forced to move to other accommodations. But the
>> person has been minimally harmed financially. This assumes a rewrite
>> of the bankruptcy code and the tax code to prevent enslavement of the
>> home buyers who in most cases were acting in goof faith.
> Taxpayers shouldnt be forced to pay for individuals stupidity.
Absolute agreement. Removing consequences for risk encourages repeated
behavior. Especially when the reward is hundreds of millions of dollars
in salary and perks.
--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Remember to use birth control when nailing the underage daughter
of an anti-abortion VP candidate during an election year.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
................................................................
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== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 3:40 pm
From: AL
Whatever your opinion on the bailout, mortgage insanity, market
insanity, etc - this is a great time to make money. I hope the market
continues the rollercoster for another year at with 2000 point swings -
what a time to buy & sell!!! Volatility can make people rich - stability
makes them lazy...
== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 4:09 pm
From: habshi@anony.com (habshi)
If he had not voted against investigating Fannie May and
Freddie Mac two years ago , when McCain tried to get it done, these
trillions of dollars would not have been taken by the crooks.
He doesnt deserve to be elected.
In the late 1990s, a Democrat-controlled Congress virtually
compelled US banks to advance mortgages irrespective of the
applicants' financial status. Racial factors played a role in this; a
large percentage of sub-prime borrowers were Black or Hispanic. But
everything was underpinned by economic optimism. The assumption was
that the economy would just keep on growing, so that even the poorest
families could have their stake in the American dream.
Greed did kick in. Higher lending did boost bankers' incomes,
otherwise they might have protested more about being locked in to
imprudent practices, and there was a further factor. Over the years,
banks had come to assume that any inter-bank transaction was
gold-plated: that all bank assets were secure. That should not have
applied to the market in sub-prime lo
== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 4:33 pm
From: Michael Coburn
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 11:18:46 -0700, Curly Surmudgeon wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 14:30:12 +0000, RM V2.0 wrote:
>
>>> It is a case by case basis that should recognize that there was a
>>> bubble caused by the Wall Street Weasels and encouraged by the "We
>>> don't want no stinkin' regulation" Republican government.
>>
>> the Democrats forced the bad loans, Repugs warned against it.
Horsecrap:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_/ai_92843512 ----
WASHINGTON--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Oct. 15, 2002
The National Association of Realtors(R) announced today that it has made
a pledge to the White House to help meet the President's challenge to
increase the number of minority homeowners in America by 5.5 million
before the end of the decade.
----------------------------------------------------------------
The (P)resident made this commitment to increase home ownership at a time
when home ownership was already rising very fast. The initial housing
bubble actually started in 1999/2000 after the 1997 zero capital gains
taxes on residences used for only 2 years, and the slashing of capital
gains taxes from 28% to 20%.
***********************************************************
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/10/20031015-10.html ---
October 15, 2003
President Calls on Senate to Pass American Dream Downpayment Act
Remarks by the President on Housing and the Economy
Ruiz Foods
Dinuba, California
(...)
THE PRESIDENT: Como esta? (Applause.) Me, too. (Laughter.)
(...)
But here are some of the things that we intend to do and we discussed
today earlier. Sometimes people have trouble finding the down payment for
a home. It makes them nervous when they hear the down payment. We need to
have a down payment fund to help people with down payments if they
qualify. The Congress -- the House passed my request for $200 million a
year. It's stuck in the Senate. The Senate needs to act. If they're
interested in closing the minority home ownership gap, they need to act
on the down payment fund.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
This actually turned out to be a way to induce people who could not
afford the home into buying the home. Yet the Republicans want to blame
Freddie.
**********************************************************
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/12/20031216-9.html ---
For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
December 16, 2003
President Bush Signs American Dream Downpayment Act of 2003
(...)
This administration will constantly strive to promote an ownership
society in America. We want more people owning their own home. It is in
our national interest that more people own their own home. After all, if
you own your own home, you have a vital stake in the future of our
country. And this is a good time for the American homeowner. Today we
received a report that showed that new home construction last month
reached its highest level in nearly 20 years. (Applause.)
------------------------------------------------------------
This is actually the American Dream _NO_ Downpayment Act and it was
part of the Bush and Republican dream of currency destruction as a way of
destroying the US government and replacing it with a fascist Republican
state.
And here we have the wraparound and the whole enchilada. We have no
downpayment and no taxation on home speculation. This doesn't even count
the mortgage deductability. That interest is 99.9% of the payment on the
home and it is deductible. The untaxed appreciation of the home and the
government subsidy as a break on the interest was actually a way to live
in the house essentially for free. Just sell it at the end of 2 years or
refinance it and you were the smartest kid on the block. You be in the
fast lane.
*********************************************************************
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb5246/is_200403/ai_n19793121 ---
Mortgage Banking, March, 2004
FANNIE MAE HAS ANNOUNCED A PLEDGE to help 6 million families--including
1.8 million minority families--become first-time homeowners over the next
decade. The pledge boosts the company's commitment to President Bush's
Minority Homeownership Initiative and will help raise the minority
homeownership rate from 50.6 percent currently to 55 percent, with the
ultimate goal of closing the gap between minority homeownership rates and
nonminority homeownership rates.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The Democrats had control of George Bush and his mouth at all times.
Bush was the Democrat's dummy and Fannie Mae was acting completely on its
own in this lowball mortgage scam.
B O T T O M L I N E &&&&&&
The Republicans were in total control of every facet of the Government in
the years 2001 - 2007. The operations of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are
the responsibility of the people in control in the government and that is
the Republicans and not the Democrats. This argument over more oversight
at Fannie Mea is rather silly in view of the fact that The Office of
Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight (OFHEO) was able to remove Frank
Raines from his position of CEO and replace him in 2004. And it is
assumed that he was replaced with someone more approved by the Bush
Republicans as that person was able to write off $6B in Fannie
misrepresentations. I got some news for the Republican noise machine nit
pickers. $6B is peanuts and the Republicans took it all over in 2004.
So with the OFHEO able to remove the CEO I am not quite sure why the
current oversight mechanism needs to be adjusted or exactly how Freddie
is accountable for the Bush policies that it tried to follow.
== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 4:59 pm
From: Michael Coburn
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 23:09:41 +0000, habshi wrote:
> If he had not voted against investigating Fannie May and Freddie Mac two
> years ago , when McCain tried to get it done, these trillions of dollars
> would not have been taken by the crooks. He doesnt deserve to be
> elected.
LIE! The McCain fish story bill was never debated or voted outside of
committee. Obama was nor any other Democrat not on the committee was
ever given a "vote".
http://desertbeacon.blogspot.com/2008/09/ultimate-fish-story-john-
mccain.html
> http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/bruce-anderson/bruce-
anderson-yes-the-tories-should-blame-brown-959312.htmlIn
>
> In the late 1990s, a Democrat-controlled Congress virtually
> compelled US banks to advance mortgages irrespective of the applicants'
> financial status. Racial factors played a role in this; a large
> percentage of sub-prime borrowers were Black or Hispanic. But everything
> was underpinned by economic optimism. The assumption was that the
> economy would just keep on growing, so that even the poorest families
> could have their stake in the American dream. Greed did kick in. Higher
> lending did boost bankers' incomes, otherwise they might have protested
> more about being locked in to imprudent practices, and there was a
> further factor. Over the years, banks had come to assume that any
> inter-bank transaction was gold-plated: that all bank assets were
> secure. That should not have applied to the market in sub-prime lo
The "Community Reinvestment Act" was a nit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act
The Act requires the appropriate federal financial supervisory agencies
to encourage regulated financial institutions to meet the credit needs of
the local communities in which they are chartered, consistent with safe
and sound operation.
---------------------------------------------------------------
The problems were not in depressed neighborhoods targeted by this act.
The problems were in places that the "would be" titans of real estate
speculation did their "flipping".
==============================================================================
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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/db85a7e9b7f74e2d?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: How to build a cell phone interceptor video
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ee727e61af43fb04?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 3:41 am
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hussein Obama's First 10 Executive Orders
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/eef1f93b8617a8e7?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 4:15 am
From: wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr)
In article <gctmvm$98n$1@registered.motzarella.org>,
"Dano" <janeanddano@yahoo.com> said:
> It seems as if the idiots are growing exponentially in numbers.
> Amazing.
There's probably a provable mathematical inverse relationship
between that and "number of days remaining until the election,
while $OTHER_CANDIDATE holds a lead in the polls."
(Indeed, I have a truly marvelous proof of this proposition which
this margin is too narrow to contain.)
-- wds
== 2 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:10 am
From: jdoe
On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:14:42 GMT, aemeijers <aemeijers@att.net> wrote:
>wismel@yahoo.com wrote:
>> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:18:13 -0400, TheTruth <no404@bellsouth.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hussein Obama's First 10 Executive Orders
>>>
>>> Quotes from BarrackObama.com
>>>
>>> • Obama enacts stronger "federal hate crimes legislation" to
>>> "reinvigorate enforcement at the Department of Justice's Criminal Section."
>>>
>>> • Obama creates "a fund to help people refinance their mortgages and
>>> provide comprehensive supports to innocent homeowners."
>>>
>>> • Obama, following through on his pledge to "meet with the leaders of
>>> all nations, friend and foe," signs a non-agression pact with the Hitler
>>> of Iran.
>>>
>>> • Obama doubles foreign aid to $50 billion to cut "poverty around the
>>> world in half by 2015."
>>>
>>> • Obama removes our troops from Iraq, leaving a power vacuum filled by Iran.
>>>
>>> • Obama enacts socialized medicine, destroying small businesses with
>>> taxes to pay for illegal alien healthcare.
>>>
>>> • Obama enacts amnesty for illegal aliens.
>>>
>>> • Obama enacts legislation demanding carbon friendly cars, hammering the
>>> final nail in the coffin of the US car industry.
>>>
>>> • Barack Obama enact laws to reinforce affirmative action by funneling
>>> money to "women and minority-owned businesses."
>>>
>>> • Obama repeals the Bush tax cuts.
>>>
>>> • Obama enacts the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to entrench the
>>> power of the homosexual lobby.
>>
>> Whaaaaaaaata jigaboo!
>>
>> ted
>There are maybe 2 things on that list POTUS has any control over. The
>rest are controlled by Congress.
barrack hussein obama and a compliant congress, one that is leftist
controlled, will almost certainly be able to do irreparable damage
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
== 3 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:22 am
From: TruthTeller@nospam.net
In <7jl6f4ldenr79pkva926m7fv4tlva508p3@4ax.com>, on 10/13/2008
at 10:10 AM, jdoe <jdoe@aol.com> said:
>On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:14:42 GMT, aemeijers <aemeijers@att.net> wrote:
>>wismel@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:18:13 -0400, TheTruth <no404@bellsouth.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hussein Obama s First 10 Executive Orders
>>>>
>>>> Quotes from BarrackObama.com
>>>>
>>>> Obama enacts stronger federal hate crimes legislation to
>>>> reinvigorate enforcement at the Department of Justice's Criminal Section.
>>>>
>>>> Obama creates a fund to help people refinance their mortgages and
>>>> provide comprehensive supports to innocent homeowners.
>>>>
>>>> Obama, following through on his pledge to meet with the leaders of
>>>> all nations, friend and foe, signs a non-agression pact with the Hitler
>>>> of Iran.
>>>>
>>>> Obama doubles foreign aid to $50 billion to cut poverty around the
>>>> world in half by 2015.
>>>>
>>>> Obama removes our troops from Iraq, leaving a power vacuum filled by Iran.
>>>>
>>>> Obama enacts socialized medicine, destroying small businesses with
>>>> taxes to pay for illegal alien healthcare.
>>>>
>>>> Obama enacts amnesty for illegal aliens.
>>>>
>>>> Obama enacts legislation demanding carbon friendly cars, hammering the
>>>> final nail in the coffin of the US car industry.
>>>>
>>>> Barack Obama enact laws to reinforce affirmative action by funneling
>>>> money to women and minority-owned businesses.
>>>>
>>>> Obama repeals the Bush tax cuts.
>>>>
>>>> Obama enacts the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to entrench the
>>>> power of the homosexual lobby.
>>>
>>> Whaaaaaaaata jigaboo!
>>>
>>> ted
>>There are maybe 2 things on that list POTUS has any control over. The
>>rest are controlled by Congress.
>barrack hussein obama and a compliant congress, one that is leftist
>controlled, will almost certainly be able to do irreparable damage
Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>__________________________________________
>Never argue with an idiot.
>They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
== 4 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:46 am
From: Larry Sheldon
TruthTeller@nospam.net wrote:
> Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
> erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Read, whatzizname Dowd all
rightwingers!??!
Wow. Who knew.
Hundreds of thousands of illegal registrations.
> That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
--
Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics
of System Administrators:
Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to
learn from their mistakes.
Eppure si rinfresca
ICBM Targeting Information: http://tinyurl.com/4sqczs
== 5 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:57 am
From: aemeijers
jdoe wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:14:42 GMT, aemeijers <aemeijers@att.net> wrote:
>
>> wismel@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:18:13 -0400, TheTruth <no404@bellsouth.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hussein Obama's First 10 Executive Orders
>>>>
>>>> Quotes from BarrackObama.com
>>>>
>>>> • Obama enacts stronger "federal hate crimes legislation" to
>>>> "reinvigorate enforcement at the Department of Justice's Criminal Section."
>>>>
>>>> • Obama creates "a fund to help people refinance their mortgages and
>>>> provide comprehensive supports to innocent homeowners."
>>>>
>>>> • Obama, following through on his pledge to "meet with the leaders of
>>>> all nations, friend and foe," signs a non-agression pact with the Hitler
>>>> of Iran.
>>>>
>>>> • Obama doubles foreign aid to $50 billion to cut "poverty around the
>>>> world in half by 2015."
>>>>
>>>> • Obama removes our troops from Iraq, leaving a power vacuum filled by Iran.
>>>>
>>>> • Obama enacts socialized medicine, destroying small businesses with
>>>> taxes to pay for illegal alien healthcare.
>>>>
>>>> • Obama enacts amnesty for illegal aliens.
>>>>
>>>> • Obama enacts legislation demanding carbon friendly cars, hammering the
>>>> final nail in the coffin of the US car industry.
>>>>
>>>> • Barack Obama enact laws to reinforce affirmative action by funneling
>>>> money to "women and minority-owned businesses."
>>>>
>>>> • Obama repeals the Bush tax cuts.
>>>>
>>>> • Obama enacts the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to entrench the
>>>> power of the homosexual lobby.
>>> Whaaaaaaaata jigaboo!
>>>
>>> ted
>> There are maybe 2 things on that list POTUS has any control over. The
>> rest are controlled by Congress.
> barrack hussein obama and a compliant congress, one that is leftist
> controlled, will almost certainly be able to do irreparable damage
> __________________________________________
> Never argue with an idiot.
> They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Oh, the country will survive. We may all be working at Wally World and
selling McFries to each other, but the country will survive. Other than
the outright wackos, nobody wants the USA to go out of business, because
for most of those countries, we are there best customer and source of
cash flow.
--
aem sends...
== 6 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 8:28 am
From: "Sure,Not"
On Oct 13, 10:22 am, TruthTel...@nospam.net wrote:
> In <7jl6f4ldenr79pkva926m7fv4tlva50...@4ax.com>, on 10/13/2008
> at 10:10 AM, jdoe <j...@aol.com> said:
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:14:42 GMT, aemeijers <aemeij...@att.net> wrote:
> >>wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >>> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:18:13 -0400, TheTruth <no...@bellsouth.net>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> HusseinObamas First 10 Executive Orders
>
> >>>> Quotes from BarrackObama.com
>
> >>>> Obamaenacts stronger federal hate crimes legislation to
> >>>> reinvigorate enforcement at the Department of Justice's Criminal Section.
>
> >>>> Obamacreates a fund to help people refinance their mortgages and
> >>>> provide comprehensive supports to innocent homeowners.
>
> >>>> Obama, following through on his pledge to meet with the leaders of
> >>>> all nations, friend and foe, signs a non-agression pact with the Hitler
> >>>> of Iran.
>
> >>>> Obamadoubles foreign aid to $50 billion to cut poverty around the
> >>>> world in half by 2015.
>
> >>>> Obamaremoves our troops from Iraq, leaving a power vacuum filled by Iran.
>
> >>>> Obamaenacts socialized medicine, destroying small businesses with
> >>>> taxes to pay for illegal alienhealthcare.
>
> >>>> Obamaenacts amnesty for illegal aliens.
>
> >>>> Obamaenacts legislation demanding carbon friendly cars, hammering the
> >>>> final nail in the coffin of the US car industry.
>
> >>>> BarackObamaenact laws to reinforce affirmative action by funneling
> >>>> money to women and minority-owned businesses.
>
> >>>> Obamarepeals the Bush tax cuts.
>
> >>>> Obamaenacts the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to entrench the
> >>>> power of the homosexual lobby.
>
> >>> Whaaaaaaaata jigaboo!
>
> >>> ted
> >>There are maybe 2 things on that list POTUS has any control over. The
> >>rest are controlled by Congress.
> >barrack husseinobamaand a compliant congress, one that is leftist
> >controlled, will almost certainly be able to do irreparable damage
>
> Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
> erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
>
> That son, is whyObamais going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>
>
>
> >__________________________________________
> >Never argue with an idiot.
> >They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
The right wingers crashed the market? For the people? Cite?
== 7 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 9:09 am
From: George Grapman
Larry Sheldon wrote:
> TruthTeller@nospam.net wrote:
>
>> Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
>> erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
>
> Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Read, whatzizname Dowd all
> rightwingers!??!
>
> Wow. Who knew.
Right, two years of a Democratic congress offset 12 years of
Republicans and six years where Republicans controlled everything.
>
> Hundreds of thousands of illegal registrations.
Have a cite for that number.
>
>> That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>
== 8 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 9:11 am
From: Tom
On Oct 12, 3:33 pm, "Dano" <janeandd...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Benj wrote:
> > On Oct 12, 11:41 am, George Grapman <sfgeor...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> >> wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >> A president can not enact or repeal legislation.
>
> > Never heard of "executive orders" and the "unitary executive" I take
> > it. All a president needs to do is issue some decree (to be authorized
> > under an emergency) and then create the "emergency" to enable it.
> > Simple.
>
> >>>> • Barack Obama enact laws to reinforce affirmative action by
> >>>> funneling money to "women and minority-owned businesses."
>
> > Well, unless the women are religious, pro-life, pro-gun, honest, Cute,
> > Republican, pro-beauty pageant, pro-shaved armpits, or held elected
> > office as other than a Democrat.
>
> > As for "minorities" anyone with even a drop of minority blood shall be
> > considered a full-blooded minority for the purposes of this money
> > give- away.
>
> It seems as if the idiots are growing exponentially in numbers. Amazing.
Let's just hope they're not registered to vote!
Tom
== 9 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 11:55 am
From: "RM V2.0"
>
>
> Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
> erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
>
> That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>
>
I hope he does win.
== 10 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 12:06 pm
From: Jeff
George Grapman wrote:
> Larry Sheldon wrote:
>> TruthTeller@nospam.net wrote:
>>
>>> Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
>>> erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
>>
>> Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Read, whatzizname Dowd all
>> rightwingers!??!
>>
>> Wow. Who knew.
>
> Right, two years of a Democratic congress offset 12 years of
> Republicans and six years where Republicans controlled everything.
When it was asked of McCain who would be his Treasury Secretary he
mentioned Warren Buffet. Buffet is, of course, a top Obama supporter.
http://econ4obama.blogspot.com/2008/06/obama-economic-advisors-and-economic.html
Economists Support Obama Over McCain By More Than 2 to 1
Note that former Fed Chairman Paul Volcker who predicted that this was
more likely to end in collapse than any other alternative back in the
heady Republican days of '2005 is a top adviser.
The crux of the whole Republican Economic Agenda has had three
central pillars.
1) Trickle down (by any name) economics
2) Deficits don't matter.
3) Deregulation of financial markets
Now, you Republicans can keep buying into that. And I don't doubt
that you will.
In the meantime, how are you enjoying George W Bush, America's first
Socialist President? I see you have your hopes set on Sara, who
socialized Wasilla in 3 years with over $40,000 in earmarks for each
resident. And who as governor of Alaska has over 1/3 of it's residents
on the government payroll and each citizen of which is cut a $1,000 +
check each year.
Republicans are the true socialist welfare recipients, their only
concern is that nobody else gets in on the gravy train.
Wasilla Earmarks:
http://www.taxpayer.net/resources.php?category=&type=Project&proj_id=1284&action=Headlines%20By%20TCS
>>
Jeff
>> Hundreds of thousands of illegal registrations.
>
> Have a cite for that number.
>>
>>> That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>>
== 11 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 12:19 pm
From: "ChairMan"
In news:7jl6f4ldenr79pkva926m7fv4tlva508p3@4ax.com,
jdoe <jdoe@aol.com>spewed forth:
> On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:14:42 GMT, aemeijers <aemeijers@att.net> wrote:
>
>> wismel@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:18:13 -0400, TheTruth <no404@bellsouth.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hussein Obama's First 10 Executive Orders
>>>>
>>>> Quotes from BarrackObama.com
>>>>
>>>> . Obama enacts stronger "federal hate crimes legislation" to
>>>> "reinvigorate enforcement at the Department of Justice's Criminal
>>>> Section."
>>>>
>>>> . Obama creates "a fund to help people refinance their mortgages
>>>> and provide comprehensive supports to innocent homeowners."
>>>>
>>>> . Obama, following through on his pledge to "meet with the leaders
>>>> of
>>>> all nations, friend and foe," signs a non-agression pact with the
>>>> Hitler
>>>> of Iran.
>>>>
>>>> . Obama doubles foreign aid to $50 billion to cut "poverty around
>>>> the
>>>> world in half by 2015."
>>>>
>>>> . Obama removes our troops from Iraq, leaving a power vacuum
>>>> filled by Iran.
>>>>
>>>> . Obama enacts socialized medicine, destroying small businesses
>>>> with
>>>> taxes to pay for illegal alien healthcare.
>>>>
>>>> . Obama enacts amnesty for illegal aliens.
>>>>
>>>> . Obama enacts legislation demanding carbon friendly cars,
>>>> hammering the final nail in the coffin of the US car industry.
>>>>
>>>> . Barack Obama enact laws to reinforce affirmative action by
>>>> funneling money to "women and minority-owned businesses."
>>>>
>>>> . Obama repeals the Bush tax cuts.
>>>>
>>>> . Obama enacts the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to entrench
>>>> the
>>>> power of the homosexual lobby.
>>>
>>> Whaaaaaaaata jigaboo!
>>>
>>> ted
>> There are maybe 2 things on that list POTUS has any control over. The
>> rest are controlled by Congress.
> barrack hussein obama and a compliant congress, one that is leftist
> controlled, will almost certainly be able to do irreparable damage
nobama and pelosi have already met and plan to call a special session
immediately after the election in hopes of passing legislation to spend
almost $150 billion in extended benefits.
http://www.wral.com/news/political/story/3719193/
== 12 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 12:37 pm
From: Fiftycal@abcnnbcbs.com
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 15:06:16 -0400, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:
>> Right, two years of a Democratic congress offset 12 years of
>> Republicans and six years where Republicans controlled everything.
>
> When it was asked of McCain who would be his Treasury Secretary he
>mentioned Warren Buffet. Buffet is, of course, a top Obama supporter.
>
>
>Economists Support Obama Over McCain By More Than 2 to 1
Hundreds of Economists Sign Letter Opposing Obama's Tax Plan
Hundreds of economists (including Nobel Prize winners Gary Becker,
James Buchanan, Robert Mundell, Edward Prescott, and Vernon Smith)
have signed letters opposing Barack Obama's economic and tax plans
(here, here, and here):
We are equally concerned with his proposals to increase tax rates on
labor income and investment. His dividend and capital gains tax
increases would reduce investment and cut into the savings of millions
of Americans. His proposals to increase income and payroll tax rates
would discourage the formation and expansion of small businesses and
reduce employment and take-home pay, as would his mandates on firms to
provide expensive health insurance.
After hearing such economic criticism of his proposals, Barack Obama
has apparently suggested to some people that he might postpone his tax
increases, perhaps to 2010. But it is a mistake to think that
postponing such tax increases would prevent their harmful effect on
the economy today. The prospect of such tax rate increases in 2010 is
already a drag on the economy. Businesses considering whether to hire
workers today and expand their operations have time horizons longer
than a year or two, so the prospect of higher taxes starting in 2009
or 2010 reduces hiring and investment in 2008.
http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2008/10/hundres-of-econ.html
== 13 of 13 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 1:58 pm
From: clams_casino
TruthTeller@nospam.net wrote:
>
>
>
>Considering that you right wingers have crashed the stock market and
>erased 80 years of progress for the people, anyone can do better.
>
>That son, is why Obama is going to be Mr. President. Deal with it.
>
>
>
>
>
It took some work, but GW has finally been able to undo most all the
Clinton gains.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Which department stores sell Wrangler's?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5aceab7c2e4f59c0?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 7:43 am
From: Seerialmom
On Oct 12, 7:46 pm, James <j0069b...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Went into Kohl's looking to replace my jeans. They have Lee's and
> Levi's. The Levi's were over $30 and the Lee's were $20. Are prices
> pretty much the same at other stores or are some store better for
> buying jeans?
K-Mart does as I recall as does Wal-Mart. Just to save you time and
because I thought I'd check; their website does have a "where to buy"
link:
http://wranglerjeansco.wrangler.com/wjc_contact
==============================================================================
TOPIC: KFC 9.99 bucket
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5651e6f0a42596cd?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Oct 13 2008 3:56 pm
From: Observer
On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 08:33:24 -0700 (PDT), Seerialmom
<seerialmom@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Oct 8, 8:54 pm, James <j0069b...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> How much would the raw chicken cost you at regular supermarket
>> prices? At sale prices? Assume you cook regularly and have all the
>> other stuff necessary for fried chicken so their cost is minor.
>
>I tend to roll my eyes at that commercial. Yes, if you had to buy all
>the ingredients from scratch i.e. bag of flour, spices, baking
>powder, bottle of oil, chicken, cabbage, carrots, potatoes, coleslaw
>dressing (bottled or ingredients) corn cobs, it likely would exceed
>$10. The same is true for most other fast foods. The other part of
>that commercial says you can't do it because you wouldn't know what to
>buy for the 11 secret spices.
It was either Cecil Adams or "Big Secrets" that got some dry mix
coating from a KFC and sent it to a lab for analysis.
The 11 secret herbs and spices turned out to be: (No particular
order)
Flour
Salt
Pepper
MSG
The lab tested for anything more abundant than 1 part per billion.
And, at that rate, would not allow for more than a an occasional piece
of chicken getting said spice.
__
Peak oil? I dunno.
Obama vs McCain? PEAK BULLSHIT!
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