Frugal Living: Nov 20, 2009

Friday, November 20, 2009

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 16 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Surprise! California does something stupid - again.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/48d02eb74da95076?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 11:19 pm
From: "Annie Woughman"

"Chilly8" <Chilly8@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:he43h9$esl$1@aioe.org...
>
> "Ohioguy" <none@none.net> wrote in message
> news:qFeNm.6320$cX4.472@newsfe10.iad...
>> http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20091118/ap_on_hi_te/us_california_tv_energy
>>
>>
>> "Some manufacturers said implementing a power standard will limit
>> consumer choice and harm California retailers because consumers could
>> simply buy TVs out of state or order them online. Industry
>
Californians already come up to Oregon in droves to buy everything from flat
screen televisions, computers, and any type of luxury items, but it isn't
because they can't buy them in California--it is because of the 10% sales
tax (Oregon has none.) Any day of the week you can drive to our local
Costco and every other car (as well as U-Haul trucks and trailers) in the
lot is from California. I overheard one guy telling a clerk that it wasn't
only the sales tax, California also charges a luxury tax on items like
big-screen TV's. Groups of people take turns making the trip filling out
lists for their friends and neighbors. The amount they save in sales and
luxury tax makes it worth the amount spent on gas--especially when they
trade off.

> That is very true. All one would have to do is draw out enough
> cash from the bank, then go across the state line and buy one.
> By using cash, no credit cards or checks, there is no paper
> trail the state could use to find people using such sets, if they
> were to go the next step and outlaw posession.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 7:19 am
From: "Bill"

> California just passed another anti-consumer law. The focus is TV
> energy efficiency...
>

Actually I want my TV and appliances to be energy efficient! So this is a
good thing if you ask me. It will lead to the same basic TV looking just as
good, but using less electricity to operate...

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 10:23 am
From: "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

In article
<UprNm.32235$Zu5.27484@newsfe24.iad>,
"Annie Woughman"
<anniewoughman@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Chilly8" <Chilly8@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:he43h9$esl$1@aioe.org...
> >
> > "Ohioguy" <none@none.net> wrote in message
> > news:qFeNm.6320$cX4.472@newsfe10.iad...
> >> http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20091118/ap_on_hi_te/us_california_tv_energy
> >>
> >>
> >> "Some manufacturers said implementing a power standard will limit
> >> consumer choice and harm California retailers because consumers could
> >> simply buy TVs out of state or order them online. Industry
> >
> Californians already come up to Oregon in droves to buy everything from flat
> screen televisions, computers, and any type of luxury items, but it isn't
> because they can't buy them in California--it is because of the 10% sales
> tax (Oregon has none.) Any day of the week you can drive to our local
> Costco and every other car (as well as U-Haul trucks and trailers) in the
> lot is from California.

> I overheard one guy telling a clerk that it wasn't
> only the sales tax, California also charges a luxury tax on items like
> big-screen TV's.

Can you provide some sort of link about
this "luxury tax"?

> Groups of people take turns making the trip filling out
> lists for their friends and neighbors. The amount they save in sales and
> luxury tax makes it worth the amount spent on gas--especially when they
> trade off.
>
> > That is very true. All one would have to do is draw out enough
> > cash from the bank, then go across the state line and buy one.
> > By using cash, no credit cards or checks, there is no paper
> > trail the state could use to find people using such sets, if they
> > were to go the next step and outlaw posession.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 11:50 am
From: "Annie Woughman"

"Malcom "Mal" Reynolds" <atlas-bugged@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:atlas-bugged-826084.10232820112009@aries.ka.weretis.net...
> In article
> <UprNm.32235$Zu5.27484@newsfe24.iad>,
> "Annie Woughman"
> <anniewoughman@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "Chilly8" <Chilly8@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:he43h9$esl$1@aioe.org...
>> >
>> > "Ohioguy" <none@none.net> wrote in message
>> > news:qFeNm.6320$cX4.472@newsfe10.iad...
>> >> http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20091118/ap_on_hi_te/us_california_tv_energy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Some manufacturers said implementing a power standard will limit
>> >> consumer choice and harm California retailers because consumers could
>> >> simply buy TVs out of state or order them online. Industry
>> >
>> Californians already come up to Oregon in droves to buy everything from
>> flat
>> screen televisions, computers, and any type of luxury items, but it isn't
>> because they can't buy them in California--it is because of the 10% sales
>> tax (Oregon has none.) Any day of the week you can drive to our local
>> Costco and every other car (as well as U-Haul trucks and trailers) in the
>> lot is from California.
>
>
>
>> I overheard one guy telling a clerk that it wasn't
>> only the sales tax, California also charges a luxury tax on items like
>> big-screen TV's.
>
> Can you provide some sort of link about
> this "luxury tax"

No, I was just sharing what I heard a guy tell the clerk. I was standing
behind him in the check-out line. I'm sorry if I passed on erroneous
information.

>> Groups of people take turns making the trip filling out
>> lists for their friends and neighbors. The amount they save in sales and
>> luxury tax makes it worth the amount spent on gas--especially when they
>> trade off.
>>
>> > That is very true. All one would have to do is draw out enough
>> > cash from the bank, then go across the state line and buy one.
>> > By using cash, no credit cards or checks, there is no paper
>> > trail the state could use to find people using such sets, if they
>> > were to go the next step and outlaw posession.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cookware
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1fbe380ec171a5e2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:29 am
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote
> Rod Speed wrote
>> The Real Bev wrote
>>> frater mus wrote
>>>> Marsha wrote:

>>>>> We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the
>>>>> price or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of
>>>>> cookware really make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We
>>>>> just want skillets that last more than a year or two. Thanks for the input.

>>>> Cal is nice but overpriced; folks that buy it on name only seem to
>>>> either not use it (display only) or want it to act like teflon
>>>> (which it's not, so it doesn't). Used Cal has often been abused by
>>>> non-foodie heathens but you may find some in good condition in
>>>> garage sales.

>>> If you CAN abuse it it's not worth the price they ask. Pots are
>>> tools and should be able to stand up to whatever use they get
>>> without whining.

> I wasn't clear. I meant if abuse HURTS the pot it's not worth the price... Carry on.

>>>> I like heavy, no-frills commercial gear from the local restaurant
>>>> supply store. Oven-safe, tough, reasonably-priced. Only buy the
>>>> pieces you need.

>>> I would LOVE to have one of those 20-gallon aluminum stock pots. I
>>> have no idea what I'd do with it and no place to put it, but I WANT one!

>> Stainless is better, you cant do some stuff like marmalade in aluminum.

> That's interesting. I've made my own lemon curd, but it had never occurred to me to make marmalade.

I did that because the manufacturer of the lemon and lime marmalade I liked stopped making
it and made lemon and lime and grapefruit instead, and I didnt like it anything like as much.

> Why won't aluminum work?

Aluminum doesnt like citrus juices.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 1:07 am
From: frater mus

The Real Bev wrote:

> I wasn't clear. I meant if abuse HURTS the pot it's not worth the
> price... Carry on.

I think it was clear enough, although I might disagree with the point.

One has to treat teflon (or calphalon, or those hideous induction
stovetops, or nice knives) specially to avoid damaging them but this is
a consumer education issue and a personal choice.

Same with exotic sports cars; you can't drive them 30mph over
speedbumps but they may still be worth 200k for their intended purpose
and environment. Mishandling them may cause $$$ damage.

I have used one Cal saute pan in one commercial and liked it. I did
not like it $80 worth (or whatever) or I would have bought one by now

> That's interesting. I've made my own lemon curd, but it had never
> occurred to me to make marmalade. Why won't aluminum work?

I suspect it's a reference to the generic problem of reactivity when
cooking acids in aluminum. Calphalon gets around that problem with
anodizing (at least until somebody damages the surface, as discussed above).

--
brother mouse
composed offline and synced later.
http://www.mousetrap.net/mouse/offline.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Christian Louboutin Shoes real leather wholesale free shipping (www.
dotradenow.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/541b418ce0c0531d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:46 am
From: tradenow

Cheap Wholesale Gucci Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale GUCCI Boots
Cheap Wholesale Lacoste Shoes
Cheap Wholesale LV Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale LV Boots
Cheap Wholesale Prada Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Timberland Shoes
Cheap Wholesale D&G Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale D&G Boots
Cheap Wholesale Puma Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Puma AAA (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale UGG Boots Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Bikkem Bergs Shoes (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale Mauri Shoes Man
Cheap Wholesale Versace Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Versace Boots
Cheap Wholesale Paul Smith Shoes (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale BOSS Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Burberry Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Dsquared shoes
Cheap Wholesale Dior Shoes (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale Dior Boots
Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Boots
Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Shoes Man (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Fendi Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Fendi Boots
Cheap Wholesale AFF Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Evisu Shoes (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale 4US Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Sebago Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Supra Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Hight Converse Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Coach Boots
Cheap Wholesale Coach Shoes
Women Christian Louboutin (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Chanel Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Chanel Boots (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale Bape Shoes
Cheap Wholesale Adidas Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Adicolor (free shipping)
Cheap Wholesale Adidas 35TH (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Adidas NBA
Cheap Wholesale Adidas Running (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )
Cheap Wholesale Adidas Y3
Cheap Wholesale Soccer Shoes (paypal payment)
(www.dotradenow.com )

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ¤¤¤ 2009 New Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Sweater, Lacoste Sweater, GUCCI
Sweater ect at www.fjrjtrade.com <Paypal Payment>
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1ed995f2bae52881?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:53 am
From: "www.fjrjtrade.com"

¤¤¤ 2009 New Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Sweater, Lacoste Sweater, GUCCI
Sweater ect at www.fjrjtrade.com <Paypal Payment>

Welcome to website

www.fjrjtrade.com

Cheap Wholesale Sweaters

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2096-Sweaters.html

Cheap Wholesale ED Hardy Sweaters

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2097-ED-Hardy-Sweaters.html

Cheap Wholesale Lacoste Sweaters

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2098-Lacoste-Sweaters.html

Cheap Wholesale Lacoste Sweaters Man

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2099-Lacoste-Sweaters-Man.html

Cheap Wholesale Lacoste Sweaters Women

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2100-Lacoste-Sweaters-Women.html

Cheap Wholesale GUCCI Sweaters

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2148-GUCCI-Sweaters.html

Cheap Wholesale GUCCI Sweaters Man

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2149-GUCCI-Sweaters-Man.html

Cheap Wholesale GUCCI Sweaters Women

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2150-GUCCI-Sweaters-Women.html

Cheap Wholesale Ralph Lauren Sweaters

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2101-Ralph-Lauren-Sweaters.html

More models at website:
http://www.fjrjtrade.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ☆°ω°☆【Paypal】 Wholesale Cheap Boots brand shoes ( www.ecyaya.com )
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a602f4e04837f30d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:58 am
From: hero

☆°ω°☆【Paypal】 Wholesale Cheap Boots brand shoes ( www.ecyaya.com )

Footwear (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )

wholesale DIOR Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale DIOR Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Burberry Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Burberry Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Chanel Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Chanel Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale COACH Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale COACH Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale D&G Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale DIOR Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale DIOR Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale ED Hardy Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Fendi Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale GUCCI Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale GUCCI Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale LV Boots in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale LV Sandal in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale UGG Boots Shoes in www.ecyaya.com
wholesale Versace Boots in www.ecyaya.com
Paul Smith shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Jordan shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Bape shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Chanel shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
D&G shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Dior shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
ED hardy shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Evisu shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Fendi shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Gucci shoe (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Hogan shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Lv shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Prada shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Timberland shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Tous shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Ugg shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Ice cream shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Sebago shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Lacoste shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
Air force one shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
TODS shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )
AF shoes (paypal payment)( www.ecyaya.com )

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Help desperately needed...
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3bc61634a67ee8ad?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 1:52 am
From: "friesian@zoocrewphoto.com"

On Nov 15, 4:47 pm, maryatbe...@webtv.net (Mary Mathews) wrote:
> During the storm this past week my car leaked and the water puddled on
> the floor board behind the driver's seat. I got the water out, but there
> is a terrible odor. Does anyone know of a strong deodorizer that I could
> use on my car. Thank you, sincerely. Mary

Odorz Out

It's a canister of granular powder, found at the pet store, that
absorbs odors. It works great for everything I have tried, including
some musty rug after a water leak that went unnoticed for a while and
mildewed a bit.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Subscribe to 3 free technology magazines with no strings attached
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6c02466513d2952c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 3:51 am
From: "Hiker"

No purchase or credit card required.

http://www.theupperdeck.com/?p=225
--

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Best Work at Home Jobs Online - Online Jobs For College Students and
More
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d227d85e62f2e1ef?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 4:10 am
From: chinni

Are you looking for online jobs for college students? Or are you
simply looking for the best work at home jobs online so that you don't
have to work that boring 9 to five job any more?

Well if you are you a college student who doesn't have time for a full
time job but needs some extra cash and you're looking for online jobs
from home or you're someone who simply needs a different line of work,
then you've come to the right article!

Today a lot of people are looking for online work and are getting into
what is known as affiliate marketing. Why? Because it has a lot of
incredible benefits. Benefits you won't find with any other job.

Just Visit :

http://www.inetearnings.com

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 4:28 am
From: AMISHA

Are you looking for online jobs for college students? Or are you
simply looking for the best work at home jobs online so that you don't
have to work that boring 9 to five job any more?

Just Visit :

http://www.inetearnings.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ♣°ω°♣wholesale cheap Jewelrys ∴factory price∴ by paypal at www.ecyaya.
com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/c1c90bb41c8c9a71?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 5:56 am
From: hero

♣°ω°♣wholesale cheap Jewelrys ∴factory price∴ by paypal at www.ecyaya.com

Chanel Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Coach Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

D&G Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Dior Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Gucci Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Juicy Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Links Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

LV Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Pandora Chain Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Swarovski Chain Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

Tiffany Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

TOUS Jewelrys at www.ecyaya.com
Bracelet earing necklace

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cheap Wholesale Miumiu real leather Handbags, Juicy real leather
Handbags, Chanel, LV real leather Purse Handbag(www.dotradenow.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/ebc6f8c8f87fabd5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 6:21 am
From: yoyotrade

Discount wholesale Handbags

AAA real leather Handbags http://www.dotradenow.com/category-882-b0-AAA-True-Leather.html
Cheap Wholesale Balenciaga real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com
paypal payment>
Cheap Wholesale Balenciaga real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Bally real leather Purse <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale BOSS real leather Purse <www.dotradenow.com paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Burberry real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Chanel real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Chanel real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Chloe real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Chloe real leather Purse <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Coach real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Coach real leather Purse <www.dotradenow.com paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale D&G real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale D&G real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Dior real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Dunhill real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Fendi real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Gucci real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Gucci real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Hermes real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Hermes real leather Purse <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Jimmy Choo real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Jimmy Choo real leather Purse <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Juicy real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Kooba real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Lancel real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Loewe real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale LV real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale LV real leather Purse <free shipping paypal payment>
Cheap Wholesale Marc Jacobs real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com
paypal payment>
Cheap Wholesale Miumiu real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Mulberry real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Prada real leather Handbags <free shipping paypal
payment>
Cheap Wholesale Prada real leather Purse
Cheap Wholesale Thomaswlde real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com
paypal payment>
Cheap Wholesale Valentnv real leather Handbags
Cheap Wholesale Versace real leather Handbags <www.dotradenow.com
paypal payment>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ๑۩๑۩๑ cheap wholesale pants belts bikinis underwear at www.ecyaya.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/13fce563d27e6145?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 8:00 am
From: hero

๑۩๑۩๑ cheap wholesale pants belts bikinis underwear at www.ecyaya.com

fahionable pants
cheap wholesale A&F Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Affliction Pants with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Artful Dodger Pants with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Bape Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale BBC Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Christian Audigier Pants with high quality and low
price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Coogi Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale ED Hardy Pants with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Evisu Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale RMC Pants with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com

cool belts
the hottest Afflirtion Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Armani Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Bape Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Boss Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Burberry Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest C.D Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Chanel Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest CK Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest D&G Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Diesel Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest DSQ Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest ED Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Gucci Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Hermes Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Levfs Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest LV Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Polo Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Prada Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
the hottest Versace Belt with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com

beautiful bikinis
cheap wholesale Bureriy Swimming with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Chanel Swimming with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Ed Hardy Swimming with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Gucci Swimming with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale LV Swimming with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Touse Swimming with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com

well-selling underwear
cheap wholesale A&F Underwear with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Armani Underwear with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale BOSS Underwear with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale CK Underwear with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale Ed Hardy Underwear with high quality and low price on
www.ecyaya.com
cheap wholesale LV Underwear with high quality and low price on www.ecyaya.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Discount Wholesale Affliction Jeans, BAPE Jeans, Coogi Jeans, D&G Jeans,
G-STAR Jeans, LRG Jeans(www.dotradenow.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/12a43609f4a204ee?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 9:11 am
From: tradeyoyo

Jeans

Discount Wholesale Affliction Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale AK Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Armani Jeans
Discount Wholesale Artful Dodger Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale BAPE Jeans
Discount Wholesale BBC Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Black Label Jeans
Discount Wholesale Cavalli Jeans
Discount Wholesale Christian Audigier Jeans
Discount Wholesale Coogi Jeans
Discount Wholesale Crown Holder Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale D&G Jeans
Discount Wholesale Diesel Jeans
Discount Wholesale ECKO Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale ED Hardy Jeans
Discount Wholesale Evisu Jeans
Discount Wholesale G-STAR Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale GUCCI Jeans
Discount Wholesale Iceberg Jeans
Discount Wholesale Kanji Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Laguna Beach Jeans
Discount Wholesale Levi s Jeans
Discount Wholesale LRG Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale LV Jeans
Discount Wholesale Prada Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale RMC Jeans
Discount Wholesale Roca Wear Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale Rock&Republic Jeans
Discount Wholesale True Religion Jeans <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale Versace Jeans
Discount Wholesale ZEN Jeans ( www.dotradenow.com )

Belt <free shipping paypal payment>( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Armani Belt
Discount Wholesale Bape Belt
Discount Wholesale BOSS Belt ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Burberry Belt
Discount Wholesale CA Belt
Discount Wholesale Chanel Belt <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale CK Belt
Discount Wholesale D&G Belt <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale Diesel Belt
Discount Wholesale Dior Belt ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale DSQ Belt
Discount Wholesale ED Belt ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Fendi Belt <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale Gucci Belt
Discount Wholesale Hermes Belt ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Levis Belt
Discount Wholesale LV Belt <free shipping paypal payment>
Discount Wholesale POLO Belt ( www.dotradenow.com )
Discount Wholesale Prada Belt
Discount Wholesale Versace Belt <free shipping paypal payment>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: National Broadband Plan
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/54777a3787644a5e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 9:14 am
From: Michael Black

On Thu, 19 Nov 2009, BigDog1 wrote:

> And by the way, no one "can't afford" a computer. What that usually
> translates to is they don't want to pay for one. Basic laptops can be
> had for less than $400.00 and basic desktops for around $250.00 these
> days. I recently saw an ad for a refurbished Dell Aspire laptop for
> $265.00. Anyone who's truly too poor to afford one, or too stupid to
> manage their money so they can buy a basic computer, doesn't need the
> internet and doesn't care.
>
You're paying too much. There are lots of used computers available for
less that are available cheap. Or as a hand me down from someone they
know.

What would be the limiting factor is internet access. A monthly bill
that may be harder to scrape up the money to pay for than to find a decent
free or cheap computer.

Years ago, some people felt internet access was so important that it
should be free, hence the freenet or community network movement. Sadly,
that's pretty much faded, initially internet access was so unavailable
that people who could pay would be getting access via freenets, and they
helped support it for those who couldn't pay (well theoretically, it's
never been clear if the people who had no money actually got online as a
result). But as the commercial ISP rose up, people went to those for
the lack of limitations, and freenets faded, often unable to support
themselves.

Michael

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:14 pm
From: BigDog1

On Nov 20, 10:14 am, Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009, BigDog1 wrote:
> > And by the way, no one "can't afford" a computer. What that usually
> > translates to is they don't want to pay for one. Basic laptops can be
> > had for less than $400.00 and basic desktops for around $250.00 these
> > days. I recently saw an ad for a refurbished Dell Aspire laptop for
> > $265.00. Anyone who's truly too poor to afford one, or too stupid to
> > manage their money so they can buy a basic computer, doesn't need the
> > internet and doesn't care.
>
> You're paying too much. There are lots of used computers available for
> less that are available cheap. Or as a hand me down from someone they
> know.

No, not really. I was referring to new equipment and should have been
more specific. I take your point though. But, used is a problem for
me. In my state used merchandise is sold, by law, "as is, where is."
What you see is what you get. Great deals can certainly be had, but
let's face it; anyone who in 2009 is just buying their first computer
probably isn't savvy enough to properly check out a used one to make
sure they're getting something serviceable. Yeah, there are civil
remedies for something that's not useful for it's intended purpose
(ie: warranty of merchantability), but whose going to jump through
those hoops over a $100 used computer? Anyone who comes to me for
advice about buying a computer or major peripheral, gets warned off of
used stuff.

Hand me downs to/from friends and family members are a different
matter. But I don't think those happen often enough to be a viable
source in general terms.

> What would be the limiting factor is internet access. A monthly bill
> that may be harder to scrape up the money to pay for than to find a decent
> free or cheap computer.

Very true. But it depends on where you are. My local phone company
offers an entry level 785Kbps (or there-abouts) DSL service for $19.95
a month. That's a fixed price, not a low ball introductory offer. By
broadband standards thats not very fast, but it's way better than dial-
up, and more than adequate for email, on line banking and bill paying,
shopping, and general surfing. Most dial up providers in this area
charge about $15 or more per month. I have no idea why anyone would
pay that, when for a few dollars more they could have DSL. If they
can afford one, they can afford the other. And there are tons of free
hot spots like the libraries and a quite a few local coffee shops.
Not very convenient, but in my opinion, better than dial up at home.

> Years ago, some people felt internet access was so important that it
> should be free, hence the freenet or community network movement. Sadly,
> that's pretty much faded, initially internet access was so unavailable
> that people who could pay would be getting access via freenets, and they
> helped support it for those who couldn't pay (well theoretically, it's
> never been clear if the people who had no money actually got online as a
> result). But as the commercial ISP rose up, people went to those for
> the lack of limitations, and freenets faded, often unable to support
> themselves.

I think internet access is that important! I'm old enough to have
spent the majority of my adult life without home computers, the
internet, cell phones, and satellite TV. I enjoy having all of it,
but I could learn to get along without my cell phone and satellite
TV. In fact, I think in many ways my life would be better without
them. But no computer or internet! Perish the thought.

The internet is much more important to our economy, the environment,
and general quality of life, even if they don't use it, than many
people realize. From my perspective, we'd all be better off if the
government spent more of it's time and energy, and my tax dollars,
getting high speed internet and wifi deployed either free, or
sufficiently subsidized that it's affordable to everyone, than most of
the social and environmental engineering programs currently underway.

> Michael

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 2:53 pm
From: Artys

On Nov 20, 2:14 pm, BigDog1 <bigdog...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 20, 10:14 am, Michael Black <et...@ncf.ca> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 19 Nov 2009, BigDog1 wrote:
> > > And by the way, no one "can't afford" a computer. What that usually
> > > translates to is they don't want to pay for one. Basic laptops can be
> > > had for less than $400.00 and basic desktops for around $250.00 these
> > > days. I recently saw an ad for a refurbished Dell Aspire laptop for
> > > $265.00. Anyone who's truly too poor to afford one, or too stupid to
> > > manage their money so they can buy a basic computer, doesn't need the
> > > internet and doesn't care.
>
> > You're paying too much. There are lots of used computers available for
> > less that are available cheap. Or as a hand me down from someone they
> > know.
>
> No, not really. I was referring to new equipment and should have been
> more specific. I take your point though. But, used is a problem for
> me. In my state used merchandise is sold, by law, "as is, where is."
> What you see is what you get. Great deals can certainly be had, but
> let's face it; anyone who in 2009 is just buying their first computer
> probably isn't savvy enough to properly check out a used one to make
> sure they're getting something serviceable. Yeah, there are civil
> remedies for something that's not useful for it's intended purpose
> (ie: warranty of merchantability), but whose going to jump through
> those hoops over a $100 used computer? Anyone who comes to me for
> advice about buying a computer or major peripheral, gets warned off of
> used stuff.
>
> Hand me downs to/from friends and family members are a different
> matter. But I don't think those happen often enough to be a viable
> source in general terms.
>
> > What would be the limiting factor is internet access. A monthly bill
> > that may be harder to scrape up the money to pay for than to find a decent
> > free or cheap computer.
>
> Very true. But it depends on where you are. My local phone company
> offers an entry level 785Kbps (or there-abouts) DSL service for $19.95
> a month. That's a fixed price, not a low ball introductory offer. By
> broadband standards thats not very fast, but it's way better than dial-
> up, and more than adequate for email, on line banking and bill paying,
> shopping, and general surfing. Most dial up providers in this area
> charge about $15 or more per month. I have no idea why anyone would
> pay that, when for a few dollars more they could have DSL. If they
> can afford one, they can afford the other. And there are tons of free
> hot spots like the libraries and a quite a few local coffee shops.
> Not very convenient, but in my opinion, better than dial up at home.
>
> > Years ago, some people felt internet access was so important that it
> > should be free, hence the freenet or community network movement. Sadly,
> > that's pretty much faded, initially internet access was so unavailable
> > that people who could pay would be getting access via freenets, and they
> > helped support it for those who couldn't pay (well theoretically, it's
> > never been clear if the people who had no money actually got online as a
> > result). But as the commercial ISP rose up, people went to those for
> > the lack of limitations, and freenets faded, often unable to support
> > themselves.
>
> I think internet access is that important! I'm old enough to have
> spent the majority of my adult life without home computers, the
> internet, cell phones, and satellite TV. I enjoy having all of it,
> but I could learn to get along without my cell phone and satellite
> TV. In fact, I think in many ways my life would be better without
> them. But no computer or internet! Perish the thought.
>
> The internet is much more important to our economy, the environment,
> and general quality of life, even if they don't use it, than many
> people realize. From my perspective, we'd all be better off if the
> government spent more of it's time and energy, and my tax dollars,
> getting high speed internet and wifi deployed either free, or
> sufficiently subsidized that it's affordable to everyone, than most of
> the social and environmental engineering programs currently underway.
>
> > Michael

Hello everybody,
You must not have much unemployment in your area. We do. People
are afraid they will be out of their houses and apartments, and that
is why they do not try to get internet access where they live. Food
is important to most people.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ♡.-♡ 2009 Discount Gucci Coat, ED Hardy Coat, Bape Man Coat ect at
website www.fjrjtrade.com <Paypal Payment>
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/69b1c0aa81f7b58e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 9:21 am
From: "www.fjrjtrade.com"

♡.-♡ 2009 Discount Gucci Coat, ED Hardy Coat, Bape Man Coat ect at
website www.fjrjtrade.com <Paypal Payment>

Discount Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/804-Coat.html

Discount 999 Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1901-999-Coat.html

Discount A Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1904-A-Coat.html

Discount Adidas Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1906-Adidas-Coat.html

Discount Coogi Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2068-Coogi-Coat.html

Discount Gino Green Global Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/2069-Gino-Green-Global-Coat.html

Discount Gndigo Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1909-Gndigo-Coat.html

Discount Gucci Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1911-Gucci-Coat.html

Discount KA Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1900-KA-Coat.html

Discount Lacoste Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1902-Lacoste-Coat.html

Discount Parish Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1903-Parish-Coat.html

Discount Pjmark Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1905-Pjmark-Coat.html

Discount POLO Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1907-POLO-Coat.html

Discount Rogawpar Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1908-Rogawpar-Coat.html

Discount Sean And Joh Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1910-Sean-And-Joh-Coat.html

Discount 10DEEP Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/805-10DEEP-Man-Coat.html

Discount Bape Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/808-Bape-Man-Coat.html

Discount BBC Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/809-BBC-Man-Coat.html

Discount Christan Audigier Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/810-Christan-Audigier-Coat.html

Discount Christan Audigier Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/818-Christan-Audigier-Man-Coat.html

Discount ED Hardy Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/813-ED-Hardy-Coat.html

Discount ED Hardy Coat Kid's

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/1912-ED-Hardy-Coat-Kids.html

Discount ED Hardy Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/820-ED-Hardy-Man-Coat.html

Discount ED hardy Women Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/821-ED-hardy-Women-Coat.html

Discount Evisu Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/814-Evisu-Man-Coat.html

Discount LRG Man Coat

http://www.fjrjtrade.com/817-LRG-Man-Coat.html

More models at website:
http://www.fjrjtrade.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ۞__۞__۞paypal wholesale cheap replica hangbags & purse at www.ecyaya.
com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/506515cc2710478b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 10:00 am
From: hero

۞__۞__۞paypal wholesale cheap replica hangbags & purse at www.ecyaya.com

replica bag replica prada bag replica new prada bag replica claasic

prada bag replica prada handbag replica shoulder bags replica Prada

Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag on www.ecyaya.com

Replica Prada Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag detail below:

The replica Prada Cervo Pleat hobo Bag is an ordinary deerskin

handbag www.ecyaya.com

with a pleated top, but the option of the stunning clear-ocean

turquoise color makes this handbag stand out.The great thing about

this replica Prada cervo pleat Bag is the slouch along with the

removable shoulder strap, which gives the option to wear it cross-

body. It feels very LA or SoHo. There are open pockets on the side

and www.ecyaya.com

the dimensions are ample to wear and lug the daily necessities. www.ecyaya.com

The dimension of this Prada cervo pleat hobo bag is 16 1/2″H x 10″W x

5″D approximately. www.ecyaya.com

replica bag replica prada bag replica new prada bag replica claasic

prada bag replica prada handbag replica prada shoulder bags replica

Prada Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag on www.ecyaya.com

The replica Prada Handbags ang bag come with serial number,

authenticity card, Prada dust bag, and care booklet. you will get is

same as the original.www.ecyaya.com

we can make sure that all of replica bag replica prada bag replica

new prada bag replica claasic prada bag replica prada handbag replica

shoulder bags replica Prada Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag come with high

quality. www.ecyaya.com

you need not worry about the quality of our replic prada bag or other

replica bags. www.ecyaya.com

we also offer best sale service to you .

i suggest you to buy one for you friend or you or your lover.

if you buy replica bag replica prada bag replica new prada bag

replica www.ecyaya.com

Classic prada bag replica prada handbag replica shoulder bags replica

Prada Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag from www.ecyaya.com

i think you will be very satisfied with our replica bag.

we will sent you the goods to you within 48 hours after we get your

payment. www.ecyaya.com

you will get the package in 5-7 working day.

waitting for your order about replica bag replica prada bag replica

new prada bag replica claasic prada bag replica prada handbag replica

shoulder bags replica Prada Cervo Pleat Hobo Bag on www.ecyaya.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Please do not buy a new car.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a8576659714369dc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 11:46 am
From: "Annie Woughman"

"Al" <albundy2@mailinator.com> wrote in message
news:9826021f-2a04-4f35-b2d9-c7b45ebe0878@e23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 19, 6:09 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> >Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
>> >high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
>> >push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
>> >repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
>> >still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
>> >exercise to those in business and government would got
>> >us into this probably terminal condition.
>>
>> ted
>
> So what's your point? You have to drive something usually. Pick
> whatever works for you. I used to buy new. In recent years I've gotten
> steals on used vehicles. Car companies are aware of your cunning plan.
> They have tended to raise the price of repair parts in an effort to
> encourage people to dump old iron. Eventually, the Chinese will
> dictate price.

Actually the subject line is a good one. Buying a NEW car is never frugal.
The minute you drive it off the lot it depreciates by thousands of dollars.
We always buy am American made mid-sized sedan that is a rental return or a
fleet car. These cars usually only have about 11,000 miles on them are in
mint condition, fully loaded and are less than half the price of a new car.
My last "new" to me car is a 2002 Ford Taurus we bought in 2003 for $11,400.
It has leather seats, a moon roof, CD player, climate control, etc and 9,275
miles. Mid-sized sedans are also frugal because they are cheaper to insure
than any of the sporty models. My husband's job keeps him on the road a lot
so he is on his fifth such vehicle. The other four are still in the
family--we just passed them on to the kids. All are running fine in spite of
lots of miles (all freeway) on them now, but with proper maintenance and
upkeep we have had very few repair bills.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 12:07 pm
From: "h"

"Annie Woughman" <anniewoughman@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tmCNm.4589$kY2.3139@newsfe01.iad...
>
>
> "Al" <albundy2@mailinator.com> wrote in message
> news:9826021f-2a04-4f35-b2d9-c7b45ebe0878@e23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>> On Nov 19, 6:09 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> >Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
>>> >high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
>>> >push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
>>> >repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
>>> >still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
>>> >exercise to those in business and government would got
>>> >us into this probably terminal condition.
>>>
>>> ted
>>
>> So what's your point? You have to drive something usually. Pick
>> whatever works for you. I used to buy new. In recent years I've gotten
>> steals on used vehicles. Car companies are aware of your cunning plan.
>> They have tended to raise the price of repair parts in an effort to
>> encourage people to dump old iron. Eventually, the Chinese will
>> dictate price.
>
> Actually the subject line is a good one. Buying a NEW car is never
> frugal. The minute you drive it off the lot it depreciates by thousands of
> dollars. We always buy am American made mid-sized sedan that is a rental
> return or a fleet car. These cars usually only have about 11,000 miles on
> them are in mint condition, fully loaded and are less than half the price
> of a new car. My last "new" to me car is a 2002 Ford Taurus we bought in
> 2003 for $11,400. It has leather seats, a moon roof, CD player, climate
> control, etc and 9,275 miles. Mid-sized sedans are also frugal because
> they are cheaper to insure than any of the sporty models. My husband's
> job keeps him on the road a lot so he is on his fifth such vehicle. The
> other four are still in the family--we just passed them on to the kids.
> All are running fine in spite of lots of miles (all freeway) on them now,
> but with proper maintenance and upkeep we have had very few repair bills.

I always buy a small Subaru that's at least 10 years old. I paid $5k for my
last one 3 years ago. I only drive about 3k miles a year, so they last about
10 years. I don't expect this one to die for at least 7 years.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Nov 20 2009 1:22 pm
From: clams_casino

Annie Woughman wrote:

>
>
> "Al" <albundy2@mailinator.com> wrote in message
> news:9826021f-2a04-4f35-b2d9-c7b45ebe0878@e23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>
>> On Nov 19, 6:09 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> >Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
>>> >high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
>>> >push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
>>> >repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
>>> >still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
>>> >exercise to those in business and government would got
>>> >us into this probably terminal condition.
>>>
>>> ted
>>
>>
>> So what's your point? You have to drive something usually. Pick
>> whatever works for you. I used to buy new. In recent years I've gotten
>> steals on used vehicles. Car companies are aware of your cunning plan.
>> They have tended to raise the price of repair parts in an effort to
>> encourage people to dump old iron. Eventually, the Chinese will
>> dictate price.
>
>
> Actually the subject line is a good one. Buying a NEW car is never
> frugal.

This has been disproven many times. It really depends on one's typical
mileage. For low mileage drivers and those who value their time making
repairs at zero, buying used makes much sense. For high mileage
drivers, new can make sense. The costs of buying a used car every few
years soon offsets a single car purchase, especially considering new
cars rarely require any repairs for the first 100K miles.

> The minute you drive it off the lot it depreciates by thousands of
> dollars.

Are you trying to suggest used cars don't depreciate the moment you
drive off the lot? Too many times, the new car depreciation is
considered off the list price. Does anyone pay list?

> We always buy am American made mid-sized sedan that is a rental return
> or a fleet car.

Ours have always ben American. Our last three have been by Honda.
None of those GM / Ford imports for us.

> These cars usually only have about 11,000 miles on them are in mint
> condition, fully loaded and are less than half the price of a new car.
> My last "new" to me car is a 2002 Ford Taurus we bought in 2003 for
> $11,400. It has leather seats, a moon roof, CD player, climate
> control, etc and 9,275 miles.

So how many total miles do you typically get from these fleet cars? Are
they in as good of condition as the typical rental car? Until we went
Honda, we only averaged about 125 miles per car before excessive repairs
/ maintenance made them too costly to keep. Our 2000 Accord now has
180K and runs as well as any low mileage GM that I've rented. My 2005
Pilot has 110k miles and runs essentially when it was brand new (any GM
or Ford I've ever owned had about 10K miles before it felt well broken
in (down?). I went in to replace the tires (original) several weeks
ago, but the tire dealer said I had at least another 10k-20K miles.
Its suspension is simply outstanding.

==============================================================================

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "misc.consumers.frugal-living"
group.

To post to this group, visit http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to misc.consumers.frugal-living+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com

To change the way you get mail from this group, visit:
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/subscribe?hl=en

To report abuse, send email explaining the problem to abuse@googlegroups.com

==============================================================================
Google Groups: http://groups.google.com/?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 21 new messages in 7 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* National Broadband Plan - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/54777a3787644a5e?hl=en
* Surprise! California does something stupid - again. - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/48d02eb74da95076?hl=en
* Please do not buy a new car. - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a8576659714369dc?hl=en
* Shortage of Doctors - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/259d3006048a5d48?hl=en
* Cookware - 5 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1fbe380ec171a5e2?hl=en
* Enjoy a New Lifestyle with Work From Home Online Jobs - 2 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e70af30adcc04fc3?hl=en
* Learn More About Where to Look for Real Online Jobs - 2 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/cf99897686855046?hl=en

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 3:46 pm
From: Shawn Hirn

In article
<1dc73b57-d5e5-4c23-9342-ecc2bd970bb7@s31g2000yqs.googlegroups.com>,
Artys <lajolie@GMI.net> wrote:

> Hello group,
>
> Here I am on dial-up, and I went to the library and read the Wall
> Street Journal. It had an article about the FCC trying to force
> people onto broadband by a new law. They want to increase taxes on
> telephones, and perhaps other things. Here in my area, so many people
> cannot afford a computer, that the library ones are always crowded. I
> guess the companies like netzero will be forced out of business. I
> have my art website and email, and they are important to me, but I
> cannot afford the higher prices. If you agree with me, call your
> Congressman and tell them that you oppose this plan.

It would help if you cited a bill number. Also, what's your monthly
payment for dial-up ISP service and where do you live? DSL is getting so
cheap these days in many areas that for a modest fee that's typically no
more then paying for a second line to use for dial-up, you can get
broadband Internet service that blows away your dial-up service in speed
even though its not as fast as the higher priced broadband plans.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 7:24 pm
From: Al

On Nov 19, 3:10 pm, Artys <lajo...@GMI.net> wrote:
> Hello group,
>
> Here I am on dial-up, and I went to the library and read the Wall
> Street Journal. It had an article about the FCC trying to force
> people onto broadband by a new law. They want to increase taxes on
> telephones, and perhaps other things. Here in my area, so many people
> cannot afford a computer, that the library ones are always crowded. I
> guess the companies like netzero will be forced out of business. I
> have my art website and email, and they are important to me, but I
> cannot afford the higher prices. If you agree with me, call your
> Congressman and tell them that you oppose this plan.

If people in your area can't afford a computer, they don't have to
worry about dial up versus broadband. Have them vote for more library
computers. The only thing forcing dial up out is the fact that DSL and
others are now so cheap. DSL only cost $19.95/mo. where I live and I
still use dial up for $9.95. I'll be changing soon.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 8:10 pm
From: Les Cargill

Artys wrote:
> Hello group,
>
> Here I am on dial-up, and I went to the library and read the Wall
> Street Journal. It had an article about the FCC trying to force
> people onto broadband by a new law. They want to increase taxes on
> telephones, and perhaps other things. Here in my area, so many people
> cannot afford a computer, that the library ones are always crowded. I
> guess the companies like netzero will be forced out of business.

Not necessarily. Is this the article?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125858121746254383.html

It says nothing about new taxes.

I
> have my art website and email, and they are important to me, but I
> cannot afford the higher prices. If you agree with me, call your
> Congressman and tell them that you oppose this plan.

It is just my particular situation, but I pay less for cable
modem (plus cable TV) than I would for dial up plus a phone
line. I have VoIP phone service that works better than* a
land line. It is totally frugal.

*quality is better, but it won't be there in a power failure
unless I buy a good UPS. I have my cel phone.

Are you positive you cannot get DSL? By the '96 Telecomms Act,
your phone company must at least have a plan in place. You may
be eligible for low-cost service and not know it. WiMax is
becoming commonplace in "underserved areas."

One possible resource is a Linux Users Group in your
area. They probably have a website, and are frequently
knowlegeable about these things. And if nothing else,
buy a WAP* that can be configured as a wireless bridge
and cantenna and find a sympathetic neighbor with
broadband.

*wireless access point, possibly running dd-wrt or the like.

I put all them ten dollar words in there so you can use them to
ask questions of people local to you.

--
Les Cargill

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 8:15 pm
From: BigDog1

On Nov 19, 4:10 pm, Artys <lajo...@GMI.net> wrote:
> Hello group,
>
> Here I am on dial-up, and I went to the library and read the Wall
> Street Journal. It had an article about the FCC trying to force
> people onto broadband by a new law. They want to increase taxes on
> telephones, and perhaps other things. Here in my area, so many people
> cannot afford a computer, that the library ones are always crowded. I
> guess the companies like netzero will be forced out of business. I
> have my art website and email, and they are important to me, but I
> cannot afford the higher prices. If you agree with me, call your
> Congressman and tell them that you oppose this plan.

The FCC is not trying to force anyone off of dial up and on to
broadband. And there's no "new law." What they're doing is
increasing the deployment of broadband service into areas that don't
have it. See:

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/

Those who wish to join the 21st century will be able to. Those who
wish to stay in the 80's and remain on dial up will be free to do
that. What will probably happen though, is that dial up service
providers will begin to die off as their subscribers move to
broadband. That's a good thing. Dial up sucks. If I lived where
dial up was my only option I'd move...really...seriously...I'd move!

And by the way, no one "can't afford" a computer. What that usually
translates to is they don't want to pay for one. Basic laptops can be
had for less than $400.00 and basic desktops for around $250.00 these
days. I recently saw an ad for a refurbished Dell Aspire laptop for
$265.00. Anyone who's truly too poor to afford one, or too stupid to
manage their money so they can buy a basic computer, doesn't need the
internet and doesn't care.

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 5:21 pm
From: Paul_E_Wog

Ohioguy wrote:

> "The average plasma TV uses more than three times as much energy as an
> old cathode-ray tube set. Liquid-crystal display, or LCD, TVs guzzle
> less — about 43 percent more energy than tube sets, according to a study
> by Pacific Gas & Electric Co., the state's largest utility. LCDs now
> account for about 90 percent of the 4 million TVs sold in California
> each year."
>
> - so in other words, the market is already switching to LCD's for the
> most part, and they save 43% off of the tube TV's most of us were using
> just a few years ago. Great! A 43% difference in just a decade is
> fantastic, but people making good choices on their own is still not good
> enough for some special interests.

I believe you don't have that quite right. The article states, (and
further research appears to confirm):

"Liquid-crystal display, or LCD, TVs guzzle less — about 43 percent
----> more <---- energy than --> tube <--- sets, according to a study by
Pacific Gas & Electric Co., the state's largest utility."

They don't use 43% less than tube sets, they use 43% less than plasma
sets. If Plasma sets use "more than three times as much energy as an
old cathode-ray tube set" then an LCD would still be about 30% more than
a cathode-ray tube.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 5:40 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)

In article <qFeNm.6320$cX4.472@newsfe10.iad>, Ohioguy <none@none.net> wrote:
>http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20091118/ap_on_hi_te/us_california_tv_energy
[ ... ]

> - so in other words, the market is already switching to LCD's for the
>most part, and they save 43% off of the tube TV's most of us were using
>just a few years ago. Great! A 43% difference in just a decade is
>fantastic, but people making good choices on their own is still not good
>enough for some special interests.
[ ... ]

I think you have something backwards--your quote from the article says
LCD TVs use 43% _more_ power than CRTs, so there's no savings in power.

However, without knowing what size/model LCDs were being compared with
what size/model CRTs, those numbers are all meaningless. I'm sure the
old 25" console CRT in the other house draws lots more than a 25" LCD,
but probably less than a 52" plasma.

Good old government surveys...

Gary

--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
"Where large, expensive pieces of exotic woods are converted to valueless,
hard to dispose of sawdust, chips and scraps." Charlie B.s' definition of
woodworking.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 7:00 pm
From: The Real Bev

Gary Heston wrote:

> In article <qFeNm.6320$cX4.472@newsfe10.iad>, Ohioguy <none@none.net> wrote:
>>http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20091118/ap_on_hi_te/us_california_tv_energy
> [ ... ]
>
>>"The average plasma TV uses more than three times as much energy as an
>>old cathode-ray tube set. Liquid-crystal display, or LCD, TVs guzzle
>>less — about 43 percent more energy than tube sets, according to a study
>>by Pacific Gas & Electric Co., the state's largest utility. LCDs now
>>account for about 90 percent of the 4 million TVs sold in California
>>each year."

And of course PG&E wants everybody to cut down on the amount of electricity
they use -- it's well known that they charge by the month and not the
kilowatt-hour :-(

>> - so in other words, the market is already switching to LCD's for the
>>most part, and they save 43% off of the tube TV's most of us were using
>>just a few years ago. Great! A 43% difference in just a decade is
>>fantastic, but people making good choices on their own is still not good
>>enough for some special interests.

I'm ashamed of California. I was born here and have lived here all my life,
and I HATE what we're become. Biggest recent disappointment was Ahnold, who
talked a good game before he was elected.

> I think you have something backwards--your quote from the article says
> LCD TVs use 43% _more_ power than CRTs, so there's no savings in power.
>
> However, without knowing what size/model LCDs were being compared with
> what size/model CRTs, those numbers are all meaningless. I'm sure the
> old 25" console CRT in the other house draws lots more than a 25" LCD,
> but probably less than a 52" plasma.

My 23" LCD is nowhere near as warm as my 21" CRT.

> Good old government surveys...

Results first, survey afterward.

--
Cheers, Bev
=========================================================
"Anonymity is a shield from the tyranny of the majority."
-- U.S. Supreme Court, McIntyre v Ohio Elections,1995

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 11:19 pm
From: "Annie Woughman"

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 6:09 pm
From: wismel@yahoo.com

On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wismel@yahoo.com wrote:

>Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
>high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
>push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
>repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
>still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
>exercise to those in business and government would got
>us into this probably terminal condition.
>
>Some years back in Virgina's fox hunting country region,
>it became apparent that those with the most money
>and status drove below average vehicles, some of
>them quite trashy. But they knew their place in
>society and simply didn't give a hoot about a vehicle.
>
>Minor repairs can be done duct tape.
>
>ted

The days one's merit was based on what they drove exists
only in the ghettos. Best Washington, DC traffic car I owned
was a 15 year old AMC Hornet(1974 model). Painted a sort of orange.
People
were careful to stay as it was obvious that the driver simply
didn't give a shit.

ted

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 7:21 pm
From: Al

On Nov 19, 6:09 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
> >high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
> >push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
> >repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
> >still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
> >exercise to those in business and government would got
> >us into this probably terminal condition.
>
> >Some years back in Virgina's fox hunting country region,
> >it became apparent that those with the most money
> >and status drove below average vehicles, some of
> >them quite trashy. But they knew their place in
> >society and simply didn't give a hoot about a vehicle.
>
> >Minor repairs can be done duct tape.
>
> >ted
>
> The days one's merit was based on what they drove exists
> only in the ghettos. Best Washington, DC traffic car I owned
> was a 15 year old AMC Hornet(1974 model). Painted a sort of orange.
> People
> were careful to stay as it was obvious that the driver simply
> didn't give a shit.
>
> ted

So what's your point? You have to drive something usually. Pick
whatever works for you. I used to buy new. In recent years I've gotten
steals on used vehicles. Car companies are aware of your cunning plan.
They have tended to raise the price of repair parts in an effort to
encourage people to dump old iron. Eventually, the Chinese will
dictate price.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 9:03 pm
From: --Bryan

On Nov 19, 9:21 pm, Al <albun...@mailinator.com> wrote:
> On Nov 19, 6:09 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:38:55 -0700, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > >Product still grossly overpriced. Workers still getting those very
> > >high wages. Government will again bail them out but the
> > >push for more efficient vehicles will escalate Do what ever
> > >repairs are required even if it means a new engine. You'll
> > >still be ahead of the game. Make this a thumb-your-nose
> > >exercise to those in business and government would got
> > >us into this probably terminal condition.
>
> > >Some years back in Virgina's fox hunting country region,
> > >it became apparent that those with the most money
> > >and status drove below average vehicles, some of
> > >them quite trashy. But they knew their place in
> > >society and simply didn't give a hoot about a vehicle.
>
> > >Minor repairs can be done duct tape.
>
> > >ted
>
> > The days one's merit was based on what they drove exists
> > only in the ghettos. Best Washington, DC traffic car I owned
> > was a 15 year old AMC Hornet(1974 model). Painted a sort of orange.
> > People
> > were careful to stay as it was obvious that the driver simply
> > didn't give a shit.
>
> > ted
>
> So what's your point? You have to drive something usually.

So what's *your* point? You could drive lots of things. You could
drive a golfball. You could drive cattle on the Chisholm trail. You
could drive your mother freakin' crazy for that matter.

--Bryan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Shortage of Doctors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/259d3006048a5d48?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 6:43 pm
From: The Real Bev

h wrote:

> "The Real Bev" <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> And should cancer be a possibility, choose the City of Hope emergency
>> room; they can't kick you out, but they can prevent you from coming in if
>> your case doesn't look hopeful.
>
> Wow. So you get to die in the street if they "think" they can't save you?
> Glad I live in NY.

No. If you have cancer and are in a different hospital you have to have your
doctors APPLY, there has to be at least SOME hope of a cure, and I believe the
case must be interesting. The process takes weeks.

If you turn up in their emergency room with serious cancer, I don't believe
they'll send you somewhere else, but they might. Once you're in you get
excellent care, it's just getting in that's the problem. Like Caltech or Stanford.

--
Cheers, Bev
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
"If you put the government in charge of the desert, there would
be a sand shortage within ten years." -- M. Friedman (?)

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 6:49 pm
From: The Real Bev

Marsha wrote:

> Samatha Hill -- take out TRASH to reply wrote:
>> Marsha wrote:
>>> We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the price
>>> or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of cookware
>>> really make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We just want
>>> skillets that last more than a year or two. Thanks for the input.
>>
>> My suggestion for skillets that will last a long time: Cast iron.
>
> I agree, and we have one, but use it just for steaks. For everything
> else, we'd like something that needs less maintenance.

What maintenance? Once you get it burned black you can treat it like anything
else, just don't soak it for a couple of days or it will find a spot to rust.

Stainless steel lasts forever, just make sure the handles are attached well.
ALWAYS buy used unless it's an emergency. Non-stick coatings aren't all
they're cracked up to be.

--
Cheers, Bev
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
"If you put the government in charge of the desert, there would
be a sand shortage within ten years." -- M. Friedman (?)

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 6:52 pm
From: The Real Bev

frater mus wrote:

> Marsha wrote:
>> We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the price
>> or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of cookware really
>> make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We just want skillets
>> that last more than a year or two. Thanks for the input.
>
> Cal is nice but overpriced; folks that buy it on name only seem to
> either not use it (display only) or want it to act like teflon (which
> it's not, so it doesn't). Used Cal has often been abused by non-foodie
> heathens but you may find some in good condition in garage sales.

If you CAN abuse it it's not worth the price they ask. Pots are tools and
should be able to stand up to whatever use they get without whining.

> I like heavy, no-frills commercial gear from the local restaurant supply
> store. Oven-safe, tough, reasonably-priced. Only buy the pieces you need.

I would LOVE to have one of those 20-gallon aluminum stock pots. I have no
idea what I'd do with it and no place to put it, but I WANT one!

--
Cheers, Bev
=========================================================
"Anonymity is a shield from the tyranny of the majority."
-- U.S. Supreme Court, McIntyre v Ohio Elections,1995

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 7:16 pm
From: Michael Black

On Thu, 19 Nov 2009, The Real Bev wrote:

> Stainless steel lasts forever, just make sure the handles are attached well.
> ALWAYS buy used unless it's an emergency. Non-stick coatings aren't all
> they're cracked up to be.
>
Definitely. I bought a non-stick frying pan years ago, and it took a lot
less time than I would have expected for the coating to start coming off.
I scrapped that, was given a new one for Christmas as a replacement, which
didn't last any longer.

I came across a store that had stainless steel frying pans with a heavy (I
guess aluminum) plate on the bottom and the price was low enough that I
figured it was a clearance. I don't have problems with things sticking,
but it sure lasts long, and no worry about damaging the coating.

It was either that store, or something similar, where I got a nice pot
with a similar aluminum plate on the bottom, with a steamer insert, for
an equally low price.

Buying bit by bit is definitely the way to go. Then you can look for
clearance or used, but also you pick what you get, rather than having
to live with a set that might have a good price if you could figure out a
use for that tiny pot you never use.

Michael

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 9:17 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote:
> frater mus wrote:
>
>> Marsha wrote:
>>> We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the
>>> price or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of
>>> cookware really make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We
>>> just want skillets that last more than a year or two. Thanks for
>>> the input.
>>
>> Cal is nice but overpriced; folks that buy it on name only seem to
>> either not use it (display only) or want it to act like teflon (which
>> it's not, so it doesn't). Used Cal has often been abused by
>> non-foodie heathens but you may find some in good condition in
>> garage sales.
>
> If you CAN abuse it it's not worth the price they ask. Pots are
> tools and should be able to stand up to whatever use they get without
> whining.
>> I like heavy, no-frills commercial gear from the local restaurant
>> supply store. Oven-safe, tough, reasonably-priced. Only buy the
>> pieces you need.
>
> I would LOVE to have one of those 20-gallon aluminum stock pots. I
> have no idea what I'd do with it and no place to put it, but I WANT one!

Stainless is better, you cant do some stuff like marmalade in aluminum.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 9:48 pm
From: The Real Bev

Rod Speed wrote:

> The Real Bev wrote:
>> frater mus wrote:
>>
>>> Marsha wrote:
>>>> We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the
>>>> price or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of
>>>> cookware really make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We
>>>> just want skillets that last more than a year or two. Thanks for
>>>> the input.
>>>
>>> Cal is nice but overpriced; folks that buy it on name only seem to
>>> either not use it (display only) or want it to act like teflon (which
>>> it's not, so it doesn't). Used Cal has often been abused by
>>> non-foodie heathens but you may find some in good condition in
>>> garage sales.
>>
>> If you CAN abuse it it's not worth the price they ask. Pots are
>> tools and should be able to stand up to whatever use they get without
>> whining.

I wasn't clear. I meant if abuse HURTS the pot it's not worth the price...
Carry on.

>>> I like heavy, no-frills commercial gear from the local restaurant
>>> supply store. Oven-safe, tough, reasonably-priced. Only buy the
>>> pieces you need.
>>
>> I would LOVE to have one of those 20-gallon aluminum stock pots. I
>> have no idea what I'd do with it and no place to put it, but I WANT one!
>
> Stainless is better, you cant do some stuff like marmalade in aluminum.

That's interesting. I've made my own lemon curd, but it had never occurred to
me to make marmalade. Why won't aluminum work?

--
Cheers, Bev
------------------------------------------------------------------
Always carry a length of fiber-optic cable in your pocket. Should
you be shipwrecked and find yourself stranded on a desert island,
bury the cable in the sand. A few hours later, a guy driving a
backhoe will be along to dig it up. Ask him to rescue you.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Enjoy a New Lifestyle with Work From Home Online Jobs
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e70af30adcc04fc3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 8:47 pm
From: Aitla Bhagya

Today with the internet is possible to make the leap from a
traditional office job to work from home online jobs. Many people have
tried work from home online jobs and every day more and more people
are interested in this new trend of work. Therefore many business
companies are offering freelance jobs opportunities. These freelance
jobs offer many benefits to both employers and employees.

Just Visit :
http://www.inetearnings.com

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 9:34 pm
From: Aitla Bhagya

Just Visit :
http://www.inetearnings.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Learn More About Where to Look for Real Online Jobs
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/cf99897686855046?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 8:51 pm
From: Aitla Bhagya

Have you ever wanted to have a part time job? In case you do; then I
suggest you read this article. It is possible that you will find the
part time job that you are looking for. Now I will tell you some thing
about myself. I am a professional Doctor and I work in a Private
hospital (a big one). My salary is about $4000 a month but I wanted to
earn more. So how can I do a part time job when I have to spend almost
10 hours in the hospital?

Just Visit :
http://www.yourforexmoney.com

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 19 2009 9:32 pm
From: Aitla Bhagya