Frugal Living: Jun 21, 2008

Saturday, June 21, 2008

25 new messages in 14 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

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TOPIC: Earn 25 US$ in just 5 mins . . .
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/20ddcd9946756337?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 10:27 pm
From: sweta

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TOPIC: Would you tip this person?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1737a3480cc643dc?hl=en
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== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 1:01 am
From: JonL

NB wrote:
> I took my car in to the dealer for maintenance. They have a free
> shuttle that will take you anywhere (like to your job), and then pick
> you up when they are done with the maintenance. Should the driver be
> tipped? If so, how much?

No, cuz they're not driving for a living.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 8:03 am
From: val189

On Jun 19, 10:41 am, NB <nobuy...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I took my car in to the dealer for maintenance. They have a free
> shuttle that will take you anywhere (like to your job), and then pick
> you up when they are done with the maintenance. Should the driver be
> tipped? If so, how much?

Offer a tip - it won't put you in the poorhouse and it just might
brighten someone's day.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 8:41 am
From: James

On Jun 20, 8:35 pm, Seerialmom <seerial...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jun 19, 4:27 pm, James <jl...@idirect.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jun 19, 3:00 pm, Seerialmom <seerial...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jun 19, 7:41 am, NB <nobuy...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > I took my car in to the dealer for maintenance. They have a free
> > > > shuttle that will take you anywhere (like to your job), and then pick
> > > > you up when they are done with the maintenance. Should the driver be
> > > > tipped? If so, how much?
>
> > > I never have...and I didn't see anyone else do it, either. I suppose
> > > where I work we figure he's getting a union paycheck so why would we?
> > > From what I can tell it's just one of the service advisers, they
> > > rotate the van driving.
>
> > Depends on the dealership. I've been to hundreds of dealerships as
> > aprt of my job, never seen a union one.
>
> > First off not many are union. Some hire someone to be the driver -
> > usually look for retired people pay them lower.
>
> > Sometimes its the parts runner - the guy who picks up parts.
>
> > Sometimes its the service advisor.
>
> > James
>
> Aren't the service advisers of the big dealerships (not talking about
> Joe Schmo's Used Car Corral) union like the mechanics? Maybe not.
> But I have known service advisers for major dealerships and the pay
> wasn't low. I suppose if I knew for a fact it was a "retiree" doing
> this part time to supplement his SS check..I might think more about
> tipping the driver

Maybe its different in the US, but in Canada, I've never seen or heard
of any union shops ever, including mechanics. It is much harder to
organize a union in a small business. Now mechanics generally get paid
under a specific guide for licensed mechanics that says the customer
is charged and the mechanic paid not on actual hours, but based on the
standards set in certain labour time guides. Quebec doesn't allow
this, and they pay per hour actual. The Quebec way helps the new
mehcanics and the slow mechanics but penalizes the experienced fast
mechanics.

A good service advisor can make decent pay, but they usually don't get
that role straight out of college, even if they took a diploma in
automotive.

The retirees I've seen are in situations where they have a dedicated
customer shuttle - so they do enough service business not to lose a
valuable advisor for 20 minutes at a time. They often use the same
person as a parts runner - if they don't have stock of a part and
can't wait a day, they wil buy it off their competition. They will
send the shuttle driver to pick up the part. The same shuttle driver
might also move cars around the lot, drive a car to another dealer
(dealers trade used vehicles between each other).

I wouldn't tip the service advisor, he is shuttling you so he can
impress you with the companies service, not for tips. And he gets
bonuses based on the profitability of the service department, so it
pays him indirectly to make you happy and keep you coming back. The
same thing goes with dealers who offer free or cheap oil changes -
they want to build some loyalty so that if and when you do have an
issue you won't go anywhere else.

The key to a profitable dealership is in the service department. Good
dealers know that and focus on that, and use the new cars sales to
bring customers into service.

James

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TOPIC: XXX-secret WEBCAMS at LADIES HOSTEL-XXX
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3c8caf85894dad7a?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 2:28 am
From: rosyworld@gmail.com

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TOPIC: frugal towels?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7e4690da26b3e36b?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 4:38 am
From: Silfax

On Sun, 01 Jun 2008 23:28:55 -0500, Logan Shaw regurgitated the following

>
> I wonder if there is something about towels which causes them to dry
> better after they've been worn in a bit, sort of like how an old pair of
> jeans is more comfortable than a new one.

The fibers seperate a bit, making for more surface area.
More surface area == more liquid that can be soaked up

--
--
Silfax

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TOPIC: ai jordan fusion force sneakers on sale at www.getvogue.com
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 7:15 am
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TOPIC: Easy way to learn English ***** download materials
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c53551eda37665c8?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 7:20 am
From: Al Bundy

On Jun 21, 12:51 am, Suganya <senthil...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Easy way to learn English ***** download materials
>
> Change ur language and you change ur thoughts.
> Learn English and free download Grammar & dictionary.
>

>
> "Give a man fish and he'll eat once!
> Teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime".
>
Walk a mile an another man's shoes.
Then you're a mile away and have a new pair of shoes.

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TOPIC: Sleazy Wall Steet/Chamber of Commerce bloats tout offshore drilling.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/965646d3be1e6878?hl=en
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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 8:30 am
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 10:14 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:

you keep posting known propaganda shill. besides, your feeble
attempts at confusion are hilarious. either that or your multiple
personalites are showing:)
http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/006040.html

They want it all. The very heart and soul of the oil industry is an
unfettered and unlimited access to all suspected deposits of oil
reserves, they sit on proven reserves till the price goes up, then
they dribble it out, It is therefore crucial to the oil corporations
to secure leases on all potential oil reserves

June 18, 2008
Oil & Gasoline: The Politics

There is a factual story to be told about the multi-million dollar war
being waged between the Oil and Gas and Republican team on the one
side, and the Democrats, consumer, and environmental groups on the
other. The factual story however, leaves much room for guesswork as to
why the facts are as they are. Let's examine this story as logically
as possible.
Folks don't want oil derricks in on their front lawns, town squares,
or Central Park. Hence, laws were passed ages ago regulating where
mining and drilling operations may take place, to protect towns,
farmlands, and even waterways, all necessary to American life.
The cost to the oil industry to buy up private properties where oil
might sit, is a very expensive proposition. Oil companies seek oil
deposits in the least expensive places possible to drill. Those places
happen to be on Federal lands, bought and paid for by taxpayers,
otherwise called the Public, and offshore.
Therefore, the Oil based corporations seek control of the reins of
government power to avail themselves and shareholders of the least
cost and maximum profit potential as possible, both now and into the
distant future. These oil corporations are spending millions on TV
advertising promoting an image of responsible management of America's
energy needs, as environmentally friendly investors in the future, and
in lobbying efforts seeking the authority to drill wherever and
whenever it will be most profitable.
The Republicans are tied to these oil corporation efforts by campaign
contributions, and more importantly, by their supporter's major
investments in oil stocks and corporations. Democrats are being
lobbied by the oil corporations as well, but view themselves as the
champions of the environment and alternative non-polluting energy
sources, which a majority of Americans also sanction. And here lies
the field of battle between the Democrats, Environmentalists, and
Coastal local governments on the one side, and Republicans, oil
corporations and their shareholders on the other.
10's of billions in tax payer dollars are the prize being fought for
on the U.S. Congress floor. Democrats want to subsidize alternative
energy source innovation and production and foster independence from
foreign oil which will require a long term commitment to that goal.
Republicans want the oil companies to have nearly unrestricted access
to oil deposits anywhere and anytime they discover them even though,
this would reduce dependence upon imported oil very little as our
domestic demand will increase as domestic supplies are increased.
However, more native oil supplies would mean more profits for American
oil corporations into the future.
It is a fact that the U.S. government has issued vast leases for oil
drilling on land and offshore which the oil corporations have sat on
without drilling them. There are 1 million square acres of Gulf Of
Mexico oil leases purchased by oil corporations which remain untapped.
Which begs the question, why are oil corporations fighting for oil
rights on the East and West Coast continental shelves and the Arctic
National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) when they have leases for vast areas
of federal lands and offshore sites which they have not begun to
drill?
It is a question no one in government or the media seems to want to
ask, nor are capable of answering with certainty and evidence. Which
leaves the answer open to speculation. But, there is an obvious
answer. This little known fact of sitting on, and not drilling,
available oil field leases has the effect of lowering oil supply of
domestic oil. Which in turn creates both higher profits on current oil
tapped as well as, and this is important, the illusion that there is
an emergency situation regarding shortage of oil the Republicans and
oil corporations can use to argue their need to get leases for areas
previously denied them.
They want it all. The very heart and soul of the oil industry is an
unfettered and unlimited access to all suspected deposits of oil
reserves. If alternative sources of energy are found to replace oil,
the oil corporations are out of the oil business, which has been an
extremely profitable business to be in. It is therefore, crucial to
the oil corporations to secure leases on all potential oil reserves
BEFORE such alternative energy sources are developed. Once alternative
energy sources and technologies are developed and marketed to the
point of being cost competitive with oil based energy, the oil
industry will immediately become less profitable as it competes with
alternatives for a lower price.
The oil industry with record profits today, can afford to fight this
battle on the airwaves and in the Congress to secure access to all of
America's oil reserves. Once alternatives to oil energy are
marketable, their profits will reduce, and the costs of fighting these
battles with environmentalists and Democrats will become less
affordable. Therefore, it is in their interest to promote the false
image of oil shortages and emergency need to secure access to all oil
reserves everywhere, despite the fact that millions of acres untapped
leases to drill are already available to the oil corporations.
This "crisis" is their means of swaying both the public and the
Congress to grant rights to drill on the East and West Coasts and
ANWR, while they can afford to wage that public perception war. There
are many issues being fought over, federalism and state's rights to
preserve the aesthetics and tourism industries for their coast lines,
for example, and taxation of oil corporations while they are reaping
historical records in profits. But, the core and central issue is
whether oil will remain the mainstay of energy and product development
for the rest of this century, or not.
In other words, this is a battle between the oil industry of the 20th
century, and alternative energy industries present and future of the
21st century. This is a transition point in history. There is every
indication that if sufficient investments are made today in
alternative energies and non-oil based technologies, that America
could become extremely oil independent, not just independent of
foreign oil imports, over the next 25 years. That would spell an
unprecedented decline in the oil industry and severe contraction in
their profitability margins throughout the rest of this century and
beyond.
The oil industry and Republicans view the Democrat's proposal to
increase taxes on oil corporations and invest those revenues in the
demise of the oil industry by fostering research and development of
alternative energies and technologies as unconscionable. The
Democrat's and Environmentalist's view as unconscionable the Oil
industry's sitting on thousands of untapped oil drilling leases, all
the while crying oil shortage.
You will hear Republicans say drilling in ANWR will reduce our oil
dependence. This will be true, 10 years from now, and perhaps for no
more than a couple years. You will hear Democrats say taxing oil
corporations and funding energy alternatives with those taxes will
reduce our dependence on foreign oil. This may be true in from 5 to 20
years from now, depending on how quickly alternatives can be perfected
and marketed. The bottom line is, higher oil prices are hear to stay
until competitive alternatives are put in place. Oil may drop as low
as $80 to $100 per barrel in the future for a short period. That drop
however, will only be part of a 2 steps higher one step lower trend in
oil prices, until there is an available competitively priced
alternative energy source for oil.
Gasoline is a matter of refinery capacity. There is no oil shortage in
the world. We know this because not a single oil tanker anywhere in
the world has pulled up to a port to fill up and been turned away
empty or less than full. In America, there is an oil refinery capacity
problem which creates seasonal and regional gasoline shortages. As
these shortages occur more frequently, the price of gasoline spikes
higher. And because they are occurring more frequently, the price dips
don't dip as low as the previous one. This creates a trend of ever
higher gasoline prices overall.
There is also the speculative pressure on gasoline prices. If the
Democrats and environmentalists and alternative energy technology
start-ups win their battle against the oil industry and Republicans,
there will be no need for newer oil refineries. This makes the
investment in new oil refineries a very risky one, until the outcome
of the war over oil is determined.
It is crucial for the future of America that voters and the public
bear this discussion in mind going forward. It is after all, their,
and our children's future and pocketbooks which are hanging in the
balance. It is the environmental quality of our nation and earth also
hanging in the balance.
Some excellent article sources for the political battles being waged
over this issue are:
Billions could be lost in Gulf oil leases.
Happy Earth Day, How About An Oil Lease?
Democrats take jab at holders of unused oil leases.
Posted by David R. Remer at June 18, 2008 04:51 PM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080612/pl_nm/usa_congress_energy_dc

House Republicans vow push on oil drilling
By Donna Smith
Thu Jun 12, 3:58 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Congressional Republicans vowed on Thursday to
make a major push for more U.S. oil and gas drilling and in the
process force Democrats to cast difficult votes at a time of
skyrocketing gasoline prices.
With the November congressional and presidential elections looming,
Republicans and Democrats in the U.S. House of Representatives are
blaming each other for rising energy costs and gasoline prices that
are topping $4 a gallon.
Republicans cited Democratic opposition to opening up the Arctic
National Wildlife Refuge and more offshore areas to oil and gas
exploration and drilling.
House Minority Leader John Boehner of Ohio said Republicans would try
to raise public awareness and force more votes on the issue. He said
Republicans would back a comprehensive approach of more oil and gas
drilling as well as energy conservation and moves toward alternative
fuels supported by Democrats.
"Over the next five months, House Republicans will fight every single
day to hold Democrats accountable for their dismal record on producing
more energy in our country," Boehner told reporters.
Many democrats oppose opening ANWR and more offshore sites to oil and
gas drilling and support conservation and developing more alternative
energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on foreign oil. But
Republicans believe rising gasoline prices will build public support
for expanding U.S. oil and gas development.
"We cannot drill our way out of this," House Speaker Nancy Pelosi of
California countered. Opening the wildlife refuge in Alaska would
reduce U.S. gasoline prices by one penny per gallon, she said. She and
other Democrats blame President George W. Bush's energy policies for
the gasoline price spike.
"A barrel of oil now costs four times more than it did when President
Bush took office," Pelosi said. "Two oil men in the White House, cost
of oil four times higher. Price at the pump: $4 a gallon."
She said oil companies already lease about 68 million acres of land
that is not being drilled. She questioned why oil companies were
pushing to open up the ANWR in Alaska when so many acres they
currently hold are not being developed.
On that point, a group of Democratic lawmakers introduced legislation
that would compel oil companies to drill in lands they are now leasing
from the federal government.
"Oil corporations are trying to take control of as much land now
during the oil-friendly Bush administration years, but are holding off
on drilling until the price of oil soars to $200 or $300 a barrel so
they can make even greater profits," said Rep. Maurice Hinchey, a New
York Democrat and a sponsor of the drilling bill.
The bill would force oil companies to pay fees for leased lands that
go unused. The fees would increase over time. Republicans argue
current law already requires oil companies to "use or lose" the lands
they lease.
(Reporting by Donna Smith; Editing by David Alexander and Christian
Wiessner)

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 10:15 am
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 10:14 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>
> you keep posting known propaganda

You keep lying, ASSHOLE!

http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/analysispaper/congr/

The Energy Information Administration (EIA) collects1 and reports2 total
U.S. crude oil and natural gas reserves. Moreover, the Form EIA-23
survey requires participants to report nonproducing reserves, which can
be used to infer producing reserves, by subtracting nonproducing
reserves from total reserves.

Crude Oil Reserve Trends

nonproducing crude oil reserves grew steadily from 1985 through 2004
rather than growing within a relatively limited time frame like natural
gas. Total nonproducing crude oil reserves grew from 2.6 billion
barrels at year-end 1985 to 5.6 billion barrels at year-end 2004. At
year-end 1985, U.S. nonproducing crude oil reserves were 10 percent of
total crude oil reserves; by year-end 2004, they were 26 percent of
total crude oil reserves.

Offshore Crude Oil Reserves

The Offshore Gulf of Mexico is the only region to post an increase in
total crude oil reserves, although much of this increase was due to the
growth in nonproducing crude oil reserves. Offshore Gulf of Mexico
nonproducing crude oil reserves grew from 0.8 billion barrels at
year-end 1985 to 2.9 billion barrels at year-end 2004. The Offshore
Gulf of Mexico's increase in nonproducing reserves largely offset the
growth in this region's total crude oil reserves so that Offshore Gulf
of Mexico producing crude oil reserves increased only slightly from 1.5
billion barrels at year-end 1985 to 1.7 billion barrels at year-end 2004.

A more detailed examination of Offshore Gulf of Mexico nonproducing
crude oil reserves indicates that this region's increase in nonproducing
crude oil reserves is largely a Louisiana-Federal Offshore phenomenon
(Figure 5).9 At year-end 2004, the Louisiana-Federal Offshore region
accounted for 2.7 billion barrels of out of the 5.6 billion barrels of
U.S. nonproducing crude oil reserves, which was 48 percent of the U.S.
nonproducing crude oil reserves.

Onshore Crude Oil Reserves

Nonproducing crude oil reserves increased in most onshore regions. The
largest increase in onshore nonproducing crude oil reserves occurred in
the Southwest, which increased by 580 million barrels, going from 140
million barrels at year-end 1985 to 720 million barrels at year-end
2004. The Southwest region is also notable for posting the largest
volumetric drop in onshore producing crude oil reserves, which declined
from 5.7 billion barrels at year-end 1985 to 3.7 billion barrels at
year-end 2004. The Rocky Mountain region posted the next largest
increase in onshore lower 48 nonproducing crude oil reserves, by
increasing 300 million barrels from year-end 1985 through year-end 2004.

Potential Causes for the Growth in Nonproducing Crude Oil and Natural
Gas Reserves

Onshore, the growth in nonproducing crude oil and natural gas reserves
could reflect the development constraints caused by environmental
regulations and litigation. Some of this litigation is by parties
wishing to stop drilling and production on State and Federal lands. Some
of this litigation is by surface owners who do not own the crude oil and
natural gas mineral rights, and therefore have no direct financial
incentive to permit crude oil and natural gas drilling and
infrastructure on their land. Instead, the surface owners have a
financial incentive to litigate the drilling and production of crude oil
and natural gas in order to extract as large a rent concession from the
mineral producer as possible.

Offshore, the growth in nonproducing crude oil and natural gas reserves
could reflect an increase in the time required to bring an offshore
project into production, as the crude oil and natural gas industry
progresses from the shallow-water Gulf of Mexico into the deep-water
Gulf. The dramatic rise in Louisiana-Federal Offshore nonproducing
crude oil reserves is consistent with this hypothesis; because most of
the Gulf's deep-water crude oil and natural gas development is occurring
in this region.

Another potential cause for the growing proportion of nonproducing crude
oil and natural gas reserves could be that the crude oil and natural gas
industry might have increasingly relied on improvements in the
collection, processing, and interpretation of seismic data to delineate
the dimensions of newly discovered fields as a substitute for drilling
field delineation wells.10 If new crude oil and natural gas reserves
were increasingly being determined by seismic data rather than by the
existence of producing wells, then this would increase the proportion of
nonproducing crude oil and natural gas reserves relative to total
reserves. There is, however, no direct evidence to confirm whether this
is the case.

Conclusions

The Form EIA-23 survey's collection of nonproducing reserves data
permits an evaluation of those crude oil and natural gas reserves which
are available to the crude oil and natural gas markets, and those crude
oil and natural gas reserves which are not available to the markets, but
which are expected to be available sometime in the future. In this
context, the EIA producing and nonproducing reserve concepts are similar
to, but not equivalent to the SEC definitions of proved developed
reserves and proved undeveloped reserves.

The growth in nonproducing reserves is a phenomenon common to both crude
oil and natural gas from year-end 1985 through year-end 2004 and is
apparent in all the major domestic crude oil and natural gas basins.
There are, however, some significant differences in this phenomenon as
it pertains to crude oil and natural gas.

The increase in nonproducing natural gas reserves occurred over a
relatively short 7 year period (i.e., from year-end 1997 through
year-end 2004), and accounted for 80 percent of the new incremental
growth in total natural gas reserves during this period. In contrast,
the growth in nonproducing crude oil reserves has occurred at a
relatively consistent pace over the 1985 through 2004 period.
The rise in nonproducing crude oil reserves is largely a
Louisiana-Federal Offshore region phenomenon, while the growth in
nonproducing natural gas reserves is largely an onshore lower 48 phenomenon.
The growing proportion of nonproducing crude oil reserves relative to
total crude oil reserves has accelerated the decline in producing crude
oil reserves, whereas the growth in nonproducing natural gas reserves
has served more to limit the growth in producing natural gas reserves.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 10:56 am
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 21, 12:15 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:

just keep posting shill, the longer this post stays fresh, people
will be able to read the truth i and others have posted. by now most
know what you are anyways:)

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 12:31 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 21, 12:15 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>
>
> just keep posting shill, the longer this post stays fresh, people
> will be able to read the truth i and others have posted. by now most
> know what you are anyways:)

You have no truth, you lying assbag.

I, otoh, have the EIA data, now suck on that, asswipe:

http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/analysispaper/congr/

Crude Oil Reserve Trends

Offshore Crude Oil Reserves

Onshore Crude Oil Reserves

Potential Causes for the Growth in Nonproducing Crude Oil and Natural
Gas Reserves

Conclusions

==============================================================================
TOPIC: CBS News on the economy and grocery shopping
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1ad6efab460db467?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 10:02 am
From: lenona321@yahoo.com

This includes at least one video.

http://search.cbsnews.com/?source=cbs&q=saving+money+food

Lenona.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 10:54 am
From: Anthony Matonak

lenona321@yahoo.com wrote:
> This includes at least one video.
>
> http://search.cbsnews.com/?source=cbs&q=saving+money+food

The two biggest parts of anyones budget these days is housing
and transportation. It would make more sense to save lots of
money on those two first and have a little extra to spend on
food than the other way around.

Anthony

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Water 4 Gas
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1eb6c2388ced324e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 10:34 am
From: "Bob"

"max" :
> "Bob" wrote:
>
>> "max" :
>> > "Bob" wrote:
>> >> ...
>> >> HHO increases mileage simply because an automobile is only about
>> >> 20-30%
>> >> efficient.
>> >
>> > Your next assignment is to make a logical connection between the
>> > elements of the sentence above.
>>
>> Your next assignment is to quit acting like a pedantic grade school
>> teacher who doesn't know anything outside his limited range of
>> experience.
>
> gosh, i almost forgot, because it was so long ago. Almost 3 decades ...
>
> see, i've _actually_ done the experiment. I used to use my very own
> highly enriched U235 reactor to split water and fed the resultant gases
> into a pair of diesel engines. Did it myself, regularly. Even wrote
> down the data.

Your very own reactor? You get that thing on Ebay, or what?
You sound like a bureaucratic clerk with mad scientist aspirations.

> Yep, i got about 3% more power out of the diesels. Sad to say, but that
> 3% gain was grossly outpaced by the reactor power necessary for
> hydrolysis.
>
> So... my "limited" experience is exactly congruous with the topic at
> hand. I've run hydrocarbon ICE's on an HHO boost. I know _exactly_ what
> happens.
>

"exactly congruous"? Hardly.

There's a bit of difference between using a nuclear reactor to generate HHO
to augment diesel engines, and making a small modification to use the waste
energy generated by an auto engine. If you took some time to look at the
large number of experiences of people who've done this, perhaps you could
comment in a meaningful way. As it is, you still sound pedantic.

The parts required to do this fairly simple modification cost less than a
few hundred. People claim 20-50% better mileage. But after looking at a good
bit of real-world anecdotes about it, I can think of a number of reasons why
it's not economically feasible. And they have nothing to do with hydrogen
flames, UV detectors, blow-out walls, or nuclear reactors.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 1:16 pm
From: max

In article <BY2dnfi-WJc9psDVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
"Bob" <ma@trix.net> wrote:

> "max" :
> > "Bob" wrote:
> >
> >> "max" :
> >> > "Bob" wrote:
> >> >> ...
> >> >> HHO increases mileage simply because an automobile is only about
> >> >> 20-30%
> >> >> efficient.
> >> >
> >> > Your next assignment is to make a logical connection between the
> >> > elements of the sentence above.
> >>
> >> Your next assignment is to quit acting like a pedantic grade school
> >> teacher who doesn't know anything outside his limited range of
> >> experience.
> >
> > gosh, i almost forgot, because it was so long ago. Almost 3 decades ...
> >
> > see, i've _actually_ done the experiment. I used to use my very own
> > highly enriched U235 reactor to split water and fed the resultant gases
> > into a pair of diesel engines. Did it myself, regularly. Even wrote
> > down the data.
>
> Your very own reactor? You get that thing on Ebay, or what?
> You sound like a bureaucratic clerk with mad scientist aspirations.

aspire hell, i do it for the money. and the chicks.

>
>
> > Yep, i got about 3% more power out of the diesels. Sad to say, but that
> > 3% gain was grossly outpaced by the reactor power necessary for
> > hydrolysis.
> >
> > So... my "limited" experience is exactly congruous with the topic at
> > hand. I've run hydrocarbon ICE's on an HHO boost. I know _exactly_ what
> > happens.
> >
>
> "exactly congruous"? Hardly.
>
> There's a bit of difference between using a nuclear reactor to generate HHO
> to augment diesel engines, and making a small modification to use the waste
> energy generated by an auto engine.

no, there isn't. Energy is energy and it always flows downhill.

> If you took some time to look at the
> large number of experiences of people who've done this, perhaps you could
> comment in a meaningful way.

No. I've seen these cockamamie water-for-gas schemes since first i got
my first vax account in 1985 and wasted my time reading news on a mail
to uucp gateway. I am not going to read the 2000th version of the same
dipshit claims that have been soundly debunked (or, in my case,
disproven as simple matter of course) for decades.

Maybe you can pull out the infinite-magnet generator next?

>As it is, you still sound pedantic.

That's probably because i'm sick and tired of the old brown's
gas/HH0/make hydrogen with your cigarette lighter nonsense. Of people
who rub their two brain cells together and suddenly discover a secrit
method to double their >whatever< with a couple tubing connectors and a
Mr. Coffee.

> The parts required to do this fairly simple modification cost less than a
> few hundred. People claim 20-50% better mileage. But after looking at a good
> bit of real-world anecdotes about it, I can think of a number of reasons why
> it's not economically feasible. And they have nothing to do with hydrogen
> flames, UV detectors, blow-out walls, or nuclear reactors.

The point of all this is that i do have a fairly extensive experience
with a number of engineering disciplines directly related to the
generation, use and transformation of energy.

And one of the things i have a very acute sense of the risks associated
with playing around with things you don't understand. Energy sources
have a tendency to teach lessons to the needful.

You want to start fucking around with stoichiometric mixtures of
hydrogen and oxygen, feel free. My two thesis are: A, you're wasting
your time and B, if you're stupid enough not to know A, then you're
probably not smart enough to avoid injury. I've seen hydrogen
explosions. You haven't.

sorry it was so hard for you to keep up, but you got there eventually,
even if you don't know why. congratulations!

--
This signature can be appended to your outgoing mesages. Many people include in
their signatures contact information, and perhaps a joke or quotation.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 2:17 pm
From: "Bob"

"max" <betatron@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:betatron-124FE9.15165221062008@news.ftupet.com...
> In article <BY2dnfi-WJc9psDVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
> "Bob" <ma@trix.net> wrote:
>
>> "max" :
>> > "Bob" wrote:
>> >
>> >> "max" :
>> >> > "Bob" wrote:
>> >> >> ...
>> >> >> HHO increases mileage simply because an automobile is only about
>> >> >> 20-30%
>> >> >> efficient.
>> >> >
>> >> > Your next assignment is to make a logical connection between the
>> >> > elements of the sentence above.
>> >>
>> >> Your next assignment is to quit acting like a pedantic grade school
>> >> teacher who doesn't know anything outside his limited range of
>> >> experience.
>> >
>> > gosh, i almost forgot, because it was so long ago. Almost 3 decades
>> > ...
>> >
>> > see, i've _actually_ done the experiment. I used to use my very own
>> > highly enriched U235 reactor to split water and fed the resultant gases
>> > into a pair of diesel engines. Did it myself, regularly. Even wrote
>> > down the data.
>>
>> Your very own reactor? You get that thing on Ebay, or what?
>> You sound like a bureaucratic clerk with mad scientist aspirations.
>
> aspire hell, i do it for the money. and the chicks.
>
>>
>>
>> > Yep, i got about 3% more power out of the diesels. Sad to say, but that
>> > 3% gain was grossly outpaced by the reactor power necessary for
>> > hydrolysis.
>> >
>> > So... my "limited" experience is exactly congruous with the topic at
>> > hand. I've run hydrocarbon ICE's on an HHO boost. I know _exactly_
>> > what
>> > happens.
>> >
>>
>> "exactly congruous"? Hardly.
>>
>> There's a bit of difference between using a nuclear reactor to generate
>> HHO
>> to augment diesel engines, and making a small modification to use the
>> waste
>> energy generated by an auto engine.
>
> no, there isn't. Energy is energy and it always flows downhill.

Energy flows downhill? Well, let's use your quaint image to illustrate what
these guys claim. Since less than 20% of the energy "flow" from a car's
engine gets to the wheel, "they say" that some excess is used to fractionate
a small amount of water into HHO, which is sent to the carbuerator.
As a putative scientist, you should know there are few (if any) actual
facts in science. Scientists just use the best theories which fit their
observations. To dismiss any "weird" claim without considering the
information, isn't very professional.

>
>> If you took some time to look at the
>> large number of experiences of people who've done this, perhaps you could
>> comment in a meaningful way.
>
> No. I've seen these cockamamie water-for-gas schemes since first i got
> my first vax account in 1985 and wasted my time reading news on a mail
> to uucp gateway. I am not going to read the 2000th version of the same
> dipshit claims that have been soundly debunked (or, in my case,
> disproven as simple matter of course) for decades.
>
> Maybe you can pull out the infinite-magnet generator next?
>
>>As it is, you still sound pedantic.
>
> That's probably because i'm sick and tired of the old brown's
> gas/HH0/make hydrogen with your cigarette lighter nonsense. Of people
> who rub their two brain cells together and suddenly discover a secrit
> method to double their >whatever< with a couple tubing connectors and a
> Mr. Coffee.
>
>
>> The parts required to do this fairly simple modification cost less than
>> a
>> few hundred. People claim 20-50% better mileage. But after looking at a
>> good
>> bit of real-world anecdotes about it, I can think of a number of reasons
>> why
>> it's not economically feasible. And they have nothing to do with hydrogen
>> flames, UV detectors, blow-out walls, or nuclear reactors.
>
> The point of all this is that i do have a fairly extensive experience
> with a number of engineering disciplines directly related to the
> generation, use and transformation of energy.
>
> And one of the things i have a very acute sense of the risks associated
> with playing around with things you don't understand. Energy sources
> have a tendency to teach lessons to the needful.
>
> You want to start fucking around with stoichiometric mixtures of
> hydrogen and oxygen, feel free. My two thesis are: A, you're wasting
> your time and B, if you're stupid enough not to know A, then you're
> probably not smart enough to avoid injury. I've seen hydrogen
> explosions. You haven't.
>
> sorry it was so hard for you to keep up, but you got there eventually,
> even if you don't know why. congratulations!

Sorry? Really?

Your pedantic, dismissive attitude may impress the chicks. But you admit to
not having kept up with what people are doing nowadays. So you actually do
not know what you're talking about when it comes to this modification done
on an automobile engine.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: wholesale cheap china authentic abercrombie jeans silver jeans true
religion jeans evisu jeans red monkey jeans
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9528fc7cf8c482de?hl=en
==============================================================================

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: You think fuel speculation was bad, wait until you get hit in the bread
basket
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f48f032d2fcb16fd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 12:07 pm
From: wismel@yahoo.com

On Fri, 20 Jun 2008 18:50:05 -0500, "NotMe" <me@privacy.net> wrote:

>Last week, new consumer price data released by the US Labor Department
>confirmed what most shoppers already suspected: Food prices, which took
>their biggest one-month leap in nearly two decades in April, rose even
>further in May. Energy costs, too, went up last month. The big question,
>though, is why?
>
>Commodity analysts are quick to pinpoint reasons: Midwest flooding affecting
>food, livestock feed overdrive provoked by the Chinese, biofuel-related
>demand, and a weak dollar. These reasons all have some merit, but I'd argue
>it's speculation that's skyrocketed prices higher faster, not supply vs.
>demand.
>
>At the financial leaders G8 summit that wrapped up over the weekend, food
>and oil speculation were front and center.And G8 leaders aren't the only
>ones expressing concern over traders profiting from the world's pain. Major
>hedge-fund stars like George Soros and Michael Masters are also screaming
>moral foul on commodity speculation--a clear signal there's more fire than
>smoke on the horizon.
>
>more @
>
>http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2008/06/who-benefits-from-high-food-prices.html
>

It would be nice for the general public health if Americans dropped
their caloric intake a minimum of 10%.

ted
>

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 12:12 pm
From: Rudy Canoza

wismel@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Jun 2008 18:50:05 -0500, "NotMe" <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>> Last week, new consumer price data released by the US Labor Department
>> confirmed what most shoppers already suspected: Food prices, which took
>> their biggest one-month leap in nearly two decades in April, rose even
>> further in May. Energy costs, too, went up last month. The big question,
>> though, is why?
>>
>> Commodity analysts are quick to pinpoint reasons: Midwest flooding affecting
>> food, livestock feed overdrive provoked by the Chinese, biofuel-related
>> demand, and a weak dollar. These reasons all have some merit, but I'd argue
>> it's speculation that's skyrocketed prices higher faster, not supply vs.
>> demand.

Speculation is *part* of supply and demand.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 1:14 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Rudy Canoza <pipes@thedismalscience.not> wrote
> wismel@yahoo.com wrote
>> NotMe <me@privacy.net> wrote

>>> Last week, new consumer price data released by the US Labor
>>> Department confirmed what most shoppers already suspected: Food
>>> prices, which took their biggest one-month leap in nearly two
>>> decades in April, rose even further in May. Energy costs, too, went
>>> up last month. The big question, though, is why?

>>> Commodity analysts are quick to pinpoint reasons: Midwest flooding
>>> affecting food, livestock feed overdrive provoked by the Chinese,
>>> biofuel-related demand, and a weak dollar. These reasons all have
>>> some merit, but I'd argue it's speculation that's skyrocketed
>>> prices higher faster, not supply vs. demand.

> Speculation is *part* of supply and demand.

Nope.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 21 2008 1:42 pm
From: Al Bundy

On Jun 21, 3:07 pm, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Jun 2008 18:50:05 -0500, "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> >Last week, new consumer price data released by the US Labor Department
> >confirmed what most shoppers already suspected: Food prices, which took
> >their biggest one-month leap in nearly two decades in April, rose even
> >further in May. Energy costs, too, went up last month. The big question,
> >though, is why?
>
> >Commodity analysts are quick to pinpoint reasons: Midwest flooding affecting
> >food, livestock feed overdrive provoked by the Chinese, biofuel-related
> >demand, and a weak dollar. These reasons all have some merit, but I'd argue
> >it's speculation that's skyrocketed prices higher faster, not supply vs.
> >demand.
>
> >At the financial leaders G8 summit that wrapped up over the weekend, food
> >and oil speculation were front and center.And G8 leaders aren't the only
> >ones expressing concern over traders profiting from the world's pain. Major
> >hedge-fund stars like George Soros and Michael Masters are also screaming
> >moral foul on commodity speculation--a clear signal there's more fire than
> >smoke on the horizon.
>
> >more @
>
> >http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2008/06/who-benefits-fr...
>
> It would be nice for the general public health if Americans dropped
> their caloric intake a minimum of 10%.
>
> ted
>
>

We might fuel our vehicles a long time on just the excess biofuel
people are carrying around on them.
I like that statement made about the overweight Australians when the
report was issued last week.
"Too many shrimp on the Barbies, mate."

==============================================================================
TOPIC: www.china-ebay.com jerseys,nfl jrseys, nba jerseys, mlb jerseys, ncaa
apparel,college sports apparel
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/d68071d6cf790d79?hl=en
==============================================================================

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18 new messages in 7 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Water 4 Gas - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1eb6c2388ced324e?hl=en
* How to re-program car remotes - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6dcc4ba7e27a87b5?hl=en
* Sleazy Wall Steet/Chamber of Commerce bloats tout offshore drilling. - 12
messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/965646d3be1e6878?hl=en
* Would you tip this person? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1737a3480cc643dc?hl=en
* Easy way to learn English ***** download materials - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c53551eda37665c8?hl=en
* You won;t believe this! - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b259b042c3da62f5?hl=en
* Earn 25 US$ in just 5 mins . . . - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/20ddcd9946756337?hl=en

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 2:32 pm
From: max

In article <0sednTrXCs2RS8bVnZ2dnUVZ_uadnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
"Bob" <ma@trix.net> wrote:

> "max" :
> > "Bob" wrote:
> >> ...
> >> HHO increases mileage simply because an automobile is only about 20-30%
> >> efficient.
> >
> > Your next assignment is to make a logical connection between the
> > elements of the sentence above.
>
> Your next assignment is to quit acting like a pedantic grade school
> teacher who doesn't know anything outside his limited range of experience.

gosh, i almost forgot, because it was so long ago. Almost 3 decades ...

see, i've _actually_ done the experiment. I used to use my very own
highly enriched U235 reactor to split water and fed the resultant gases
into a pair of diesel engines. Did it myself, regularly. Even wrote
down the data.

Yep, i got about 3% more power out of the diesels. Sad to say, but that
3% gain was grossly outpaced by the reactor power necessary for
hydrolysis.

So... my "limited" experience is exactly congruous with the topic at
hand. I've run hydrocarbon ICE's on an HHO boost. I know _exactly_ what
happens.

.max

--
This signature can be appended to your outgoing mesages. Many people include in
their signatures contact information, and perhaps a joke or quotation.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to re-program car remotes
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6dcc4ba7e27a87b5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 4:14 pm
From: imascot

Kompu Kid <deguza@hotmail.com> wrote in news:4b64f4de-f75a-4ea2-a877-21c5d54ca678
@q27g2000prf.googlegroups.com:

> Hello All:
>
> I am about to purchase a Chevrolet remote for the doors to replace my
> broken one.
>
> How do I program it to work with my door? Do I go to the dealer? Can a
> lock smith do it?
>
> Thanks
>
> Deguza

http://chevrolet.justanswer.com/chevy/o2bp-reprogram-new-remote-alarm

== 1 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 4:30 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
> >>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
> >>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
> >> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
> >> up what that guy said?
>
> >> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
>
> > then, why have the cons
>
> That would be NO CITE, NO EVIDENCE, NOTHING at all.
>
> As predicted.

as predicted, a different handle. snicker. evidence, someone like
you needs none. you already know what the articles states is true.

== 2 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 4:32 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 20, 1:03 am, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com>
> > wrote:
> >> <Vide...@tcq.net> wrote in message
>
> >>news:f840a28f-6dc3-4ffe-88eb-1f5ce402a1f4@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>
> >>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
> >>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
> >>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
> >>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
> >>>> up what that guy said?
> >>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
> >>> then, why have the cons not called the democrats out when they stated
> >>> it? the democrats announced that charge right in front of the whole
> >>> world. so, refute it. also refute the oil companies statements that
> >>> they do not even have the resources to develop what they already have
> >>> leased, yet, they are wanting more, eh, shill.
> >> That's our Spammy. Changes nyms daily, thinks it keeps her out of
> >> killfiles.
>
> >> Here's all you need to know about her:
>
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crapflooding
>
> >> HTH,
> >> Jim
>
> > yea, i have seen the creep all over the net for years. insults will
> > not replace reality.
>
> Yet when pressed for facts and cites you folded like a cheap card table,
> you motherfucking lying piece of shit.

you already have them crank,

what is the definition of a crank? one who gives out advise that
makes no sense at all.
what is the definition of a crank? one who accepts, or embraces
advise that makes no sense at all.

definition of a cult:Confusing Doctrine Encouraging blind acceptance
and rejection of logic through complex lectures on an incomprehensible
doctrine, Chanting and Singing Eliminating non-cult ideas through
group repetition of mind-narrowing chants or phrases

== 3 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 4:35 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 19, 11:15 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>> On Jun 19, 5:29 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Jun 19, 1:01 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 12:38 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:22:15 -0700, retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:25:13 -0700, "Clave"
> >>>>>>>>>>>> <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are no Chinese rigs drilling on the Cuba side of the Florida
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Strait according people in our government. But there is some truth
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to your MIMBY prosecution.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> You believe our government? There's your problem right there
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The U.S. Congress has voted consistently to keep 85% of America's
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> offshore oil and gas off-limits, while China and Cuba drill 60 miles from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Key West, Fla. The U.S. Minerals Management Service says that the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricted areas contain 86 billion barrels of oil and 420 trillion cubic
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> feet of natural gas."
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20080609/bs_ibd_ibd/20080609issues01
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> That's an unsourced op-ed, and it's full of shit.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/40776.html
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's
> >>>>>>>>>>>> shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off
> >>>>>>>>>>>> the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> "China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy
> >>>>>>>>>>>> at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and
> >>>>>>>>>>>> has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> territory to domestic production.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Vice President Dick Cheney, in a speech Wednesday to the U.S. Chamber
> >>>>>>>>>>>> of Commerce, picked up the refrain. Cheney quoted a column by George
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Will, who wrote last week that "drilling is under way 60 miles off
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. The drilling is being done by China, in cooperation with
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Cuba, which is drilling closer to South Florida than U.S. companies
> >>>>>>>>>>>> are."
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I think Congress should haul Cheney's but in front of a committee and
> >>>>>>>>>>>> roast him for lying again. These grandiose lies serve as a great
> >>>>>>>>>>>> entre to hold up how much he personally is liable for lying us into
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Iraq. he repeatedly told lies on the Sunday talking heads programs
> >>>>>>>>>>>> even after the intelligence agencies told him thy were lies.
> >>>>>>>>>>> LOL. Seems Cheney realized his liability and "corrected" it.
> >>>>>>>>>>http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/china_starts_oil_drilling.html
> >>>>>>>>>> The Chinese have forged a deal with Cuban leader Fidel Castro to explore
> >>>>>>>>>> and tap into massive oil reserves almost within sight of Key West,
> >>>>>>>>>> Florida. At the same time, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
> >>>>>>>>>> controls the largest oil reserves in the Western Hemisphere, is making
> >>>>>>>>>> deals to sell his country?s oil to China, oil that is currently coming
> >>>>>>>>>> to the United States.
> >>>>>>>>>> Meanwhile, a new left-wing populist regime in Bolivia has nationalized
> >>>>>>>>>> the natural gas industry, threatening to cut off supplies to the United
> >>>>>>>>>> States.
> >>>>>>>>>> SLANT DRILLING
> >>>>>>>>>> There are new reports out circulating that Chinese firms are planning to
> >>>>>>>>>> slant drill off the Cuban coast near the Florida Straits, tapping into
> >>>>>>>>>> U.S. oil reserves that are estimated at 4.6 billion to 9.3 billion barrels.
> >>>>>>>>>> China is eager to tap into oil reserves in the Florida Straits and then
> >>>>>>>>>> make a deal with Castro to control it. The Chinese have already reopened
> >>>>>>>>>> an abandoned Russian oil refinery in Cuba. Much of the gas refined there
> >>>>>>>>>> is believed to be destined for Freeport in the Bahamas, where the
> >>>>>>>>>> Chinese, through front company Hutchison-Whampoa, has developed a
> >>>>>>>>>> massive port facility and airfield.
> >>>>>>>>>> With the refinery reopened and expanded it will also meet the needs of
> >>>>>>>>>> Castro.
> >>>>>>>>>> Sen. Larry Craig (R-Idaho) has introduced legislation to ease U.S.
> >>>>>>>>>> restrictions that prevent dealing with Cuba to drill in the Florida
> >>>>>>>>>> Straits. It is hoped that Florida regulations that prevent U.S. oil
> >>>>>>>>>> drilling off the state?s coasts could also be eased.
> >>>>>>>>> now there is a name that you can count on to be truthful,
> >>>>>>>> No factual rebuttal, thanks for taking the bait- hook,line and sinker.
> >>>>>>>> You stupid piece of shit.
> >>>>>>>http://www.boiseweekly.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A156914
> >>>>>>> Lifetime achievement
> >>>>>>> This year's Lifetime Achievement Dud goes to part-time senator/full-
> >>>>>>> time special interest shill Larry Craig,
> >>>>>> That's it?
> >>>>>> You took the bait hook line and sinker!
> >>>>>> You moron.
> >>>>> if you think larry is honest,
> >>>> Can you refute the legislation introduced?
> >>>> No?
> >>>> Then STFU.
> >>> they should be forced into
> >> SHADDUP ASSHOLE!
>
> > snicker!
>
> DROP DAMNED DEAD YOU LYING PIECE OF SHIT!

you still have not refuted what the democrats have stated that there
are millions of acres of leased land standing idle crank:)

== 4 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 6:48 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
>>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
>>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
>>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
>>>> up what that guy said?
>>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
>>> then, why have the cons
>> That would be NO CITE, NO EVIDENCE, NOTHING at all.
>>
>> As predicted.
>
> as predicted, a different handle.

No facts, you simply whimped out, you lying scumbag.

== 5 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 6:48 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 20, 1:03 am, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> <Vide...@tcq.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:f840a28f-6dc3-4ffe-88eb-1f5ce402a1f4@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
>>>>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
>>>>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
>>>>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
>>>>>> up what that guy said?
>>>>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
>>>>> then, why have the cons not called the democrats out when they stated
>>>>> it? the democrats announced that charge right in front of the whole
>>>>> world. so, refute it. also refute the oil companies statements that
>>>>> they do not even have the resources to develop what they already have
>>>>> leased, yet, they are wanting more, eh, shill.
>>>> That's our Spammy. Changes nyms daily, thinks it keeps her out of
>>>> killfiles.
>>>> Here's all you need to know about her:
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crapflooding
>>>> HTH,
>>>> Jim
>>> yea, i have seen the creep all over the net for years. insults will
>>> not replace reality.
>> Yet when pressed for facts and cites you folded like a cheap card table,
>> you motherfucking lying piece of shit.
>
> you already have them

Not from you, assburp!

== 6 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 6:50 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 19, 11:15 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 5:29 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 1:01 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 12:38 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:22:15 -0700, retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:25:13 -0700, "Clave"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are no Chinese rigs drilling on the Cuba side of the Florida
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Strait according people in our government. But there is some truth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to your MIMBY prosecution.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You believe our government? There's your problem right there
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The U.S. Congress has voted consistently to keep 85% of America's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> offshore oil and gas off-limits, while China and Cuba drill 60 miles from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Key West, Fla. The U.S. Minerals Management Service says that the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricted areas contain 86 billion barrels of oil and 420 trillion cubic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feet of natural gas."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20080609/bs_ibd_ibd/20080609issues01
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's an unsourced op-ed, and it's full of shit.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/40776.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> territory to domestic production.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vice President Dick Cheney, in a speech Wednesday to the U.S. Chamber
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Commerce, picked up the refrain. Cheney quoted a column by George
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Will, who wrote last week that "drilling is under way 60 miles off
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. The drilling is being done by China, in cooperation with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cuba, which is drilling closer to South Florida than U.S. companies
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think Congress should haul Cheney's but in front of a committee and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> roast him for lying again. These grandiose lies serve as a great
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> entre to hold up how much he personally is liable for lying us into
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iraq. he repeatedly told lies on the Sunday talking heads programs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even after the intelligence agencies told him thy were lies.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> LOL. Seems Cheney realized his liability and "corrected" it.
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/china_starts_oil_drilling.html
>>>>>>>>>>>> The Chinese have forged a deal with Cuban leader Fidel Castro to explore
>>>>>>>>>>>> and tap into massive oil reserves almost within sight of Key West,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. At the same time, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
>>>>>>>>>>>> controls the largest oil reserves in the Western Hemisphere, is making
>>>>>>>>>>>> deals to sell his country?s oil to China, oil that is currently coming
>>>>>>>>>>>> to the United States.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Meanwhile, a new left-wing populist regime in Bolivia has nationalized
>>>>>>>>>>>> the natural gas industry, threatening to cut off supplies to the United
>>>>>>>>>>>> States.
>>>>>>>>>>>> SLANT DRILLING
>>>>>>>>>>>> There are new reports out circulating that Chinese firms are planning to
>>>>>>>>>>>> slant drill off the Cuban coast near the Florida Straits, tapping into
>>>>>>>>>>>> U.S. oil reserves that are estimated at 4.6 billion to 9.3 billion barrels.
>>>>>>>>>>>> China is eager to tap into oil reserves in the Florida Straits and then
>>>>>>>>>>>> make a deal with Castro to control it. The Chinese have already reopened
>>>>>>>>>>>> an abandoned Russian oil refinery in Cuba. Much of the gas refined there
>>>>>>>>>>>> is believed to be destined for Freeport in the Bahamas, where the
>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese, through front company Hutchison-Whampoa, has developed a
>>>>>>>>>>>> massive port facility and airfield.
>>>>>>>>>>>> With the refinery reopened and expanded it will also meet the needs of
>>>>>>>>>>>> Castro.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Larry Craig (R-Idaho) has introduced legislation to ease U.S.
>>>>>>>>>>>> restrictions that prevent dealing with Cuba to drill in the Florida
>>>>>>>>>>>> Straits. It is hoped that Florida regulations that prevent U.S. oil
>>>>>>>>>>>> drilling off the state?s coasts could also be eased.
>>>>>>>>>>> now there is a name that you can count on to be truthful,
>>>>>>>>>> No factual rebuttal, thanks for taking the bait- hook,line and sinker.
>>>>>>>>>> You stupid piece of shit.
>>>>>>>>> http://www.boiseweekly.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A156914
>>>>>>>>> Lifetime achievement
>>>>>>>>> This year's Lifetime Achievement Dud goes to part-time senator/full-
>>>>>>>>> time special interest shill Larry Craig,
>>>>>>>> That's it?
>>>>>>>> You took the bait hook line and sinker!
>>>>>>>> You moron.
>>>>>>> if you think larry is honest,
>>>>>> Can you refute the legislation introduced?
>>>>>> No?
>>>>>> Then STFU.
>>>>> they should be forced into
>>>> SHADDUP ASSHOLE!
>>> snicker!
>> DROP DAMNED DEAD YOU LYING PIECE OF SHIT!
>
> you still have not refuted what the democrats have stated that there
> are millions of acres of leased land standing idle crank:)

Here's a clue, oil companies paid big $$ for those leases, do you
believe they'd let them sit idle if there was oil to be had at today's
prices?

Just screw some damned brains in and try and logically ponder things,
you detestable assburp.

== 7 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 7:57 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 8:48 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> >> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
> >>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
> >>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
> >>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
> >>>> up what that guy said?
> >>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
> >>> then, why have the cons
> >> That would be NO CITE, NO EVIDENCE, NOTHING at all.
>
> >> As predicted.
>
> > as predicted, a different handle.
>
> No facts, you simply whimped out, you lying scumbag.

snicker, nothing i see. at least you have not changed handles again,
how many do you have sweetie:)

== 8 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 7:59 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 8:48 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> >> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>> On Jun 20, 1:03 am, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> <Vide...@tcq.net> wrote in message
> >>>>news:f840a28f-6dc3-4ffe-88eb-1f5ce402a1f4@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> >>>>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
> >>>>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
> >>>>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
> >>>>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
> >>>>>> up what that guy said?
> >>>>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
> >>>>> then, why have the cons not called the democrats out when they stated
> >>>>> it? the democrats announced that charge right in front of the whole
> >>>>> world. so, refute it. also refute the oil companies statements that
> >>>>> they do not even have the resources to develop what they already have
> >>>>> leased, yet, they are wanting more, eh, shill.
> >>>> That's our Spammy. Changes nyms daily, thinks it keeps her out of
> >>>> killfiles.
> >>>> Here's all you need to know about her:
> >>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crapflooding
> >>>> HTH,
> >>>> Jim
> >>> yea, i have seen the creep all over the net for years. insults will
> >>> not replace reality.
> >> Yet when pressed for facts and cites you folded like a cheap card table,
> >> you motherfucking lying piece of shit.
>
> > you already have them
>
> Not from you, assburp!

snicker, still nothing. why aren't you going after the democrats for
their alleged lying? because they are not, ROTFLOL!!!!!!!!!

== 9 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 8:05 pm
From: Video61@tcq.net

On Jun 20, 8:50 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> > On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
> >> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>> On Jun 19, 11:15 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Jun 19, 5:29 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 1:01 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 12:38 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:22:15 -0700, retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:25:13 -0700, "Clave"
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are no Chinese rigs drilling on the Cuba side of the Florida
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Strait according people in our government. But there is some truth
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to your MIMBY prosecution.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You believe our government? There's your problem right there
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The U.S. Congress has voted consistently to keep 85% of America's
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> offshore oil and gas off-limits, while China and Cuba drill 60 miles from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Key West, Fla. The U.S. Minerals Management Service says that the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricted areas contain 86 billion barrels of oil and 420 trillion cubic
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feet of natural gas."
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20080609/bs_ibd_ibd/20080609issues01
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's an unsourced op-ed, and it's full of shit.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/40776.html
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> territory to domestic production.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vice President Dick Cheney, in a speech Wednesday to the U.S. Chamber
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Commerce, picked up the refrain. Cheney quoted a column by George
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Will, who wrote last week that "drilling is under way 60 miles off
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. The drilling is being done by China, in cooperation with
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cuba, which is drilling closer to South Florida than U.S. companies
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are."
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think Congress should haul Cheney's but in front of a committee and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> roast him for lying again. These grandiose lies serve as a great
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> entre to hold up how much he personally is liable for lying us into
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iraq. he repeatedly told lies on the Sunday talking heads programs
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> even after the intelligence agencies told him thy were lies.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> LOL. Seems Cheney realized his liability and "corrected" it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/china_starts_oil_drilling.html
> >>>>>>>>>>>> The Chinese have forged a deal with Cuban leader Fidel Castro to explore
> >>>>>>>>>>>> and tap into massive oil reserves almost within sight of Key West,
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. At the same time, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
> >>>>>>>>>>>> controls the largest oil reserves in the Western Hemisphere, is making
> >>>>>>>>>>>> deals to sell his country?s oil to China, oil that is currently coming
> >>>>>>>>>>>> to the United States.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Meanwhile, a new left-wing populist regime in Bolivia has nationalized
> >>>>>>>>>>>> the natural gas industry, threatening to cut off supplies to the United
> >>>>>>>>>>>> States.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> SLANT DRILLING
> >>>>>>>>>>>> There are new reports out circulating that Chinese firms are planning to
> >>>>>>>>>>>> slant drill off the Cuban coast near the Florida Straits, tapping into
> >>>>>>>>>>>> U.S. oil reserves that are estimated at 4.6 billion to 9.3 billion barrels.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> China is eager to tap into oil reserves in the Florida Straits and then
> >>>>>>>>>>>> make a deal with Castro to control it. The Chinese have already reopened
> >>>>>>>>>>>> an abandoned Russian oil refinery in Cuba. Much of the gas refined there
> >>>>>>>>>>>> is believed to be destined for Freeport in the Bahamas, where the
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese, through front company Hutchison-Whampoa, has developed a
> >>>>>>>>>>>> massive port facility and airfield.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> With the refinery reopened and expanded it will also meet the needs of
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Castro.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Larry Craig (R-Idaho) has introduced legislation to ease U.S.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> restrictions that prevent dealing with Cuba to drill in the Florida
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Straits. It is hoped that Florida regulations that prevent U.S. oil
> >>>>>>>>>>>> drilling off the state?s coasts could also be eased.
> >>>>>>>>>>> now there is a name that you can count on to be truthful,
> >>>>>>>>>> No factual rebuttal, thanks for taking the bait- hook,line and sinker.
> >>>>>>>>>> You stupid piece of shit.
> >>>>>>>>>http://www.boiseweekly.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A156914
> >>>>>>>>> Lifetime achievement
> >>>>>>>>> This year's Lifetime Achievement Dud goes to part-time senator/full-
> >>>>>>>>> time special interest shill Larry Craig,
> >>>>>>>> That's it?
> >>>>>>>> You took the bait hook line and sinker!
> >>>>>>>> You moron.
> >>>>>>> if you think larry is honest,
> >>>>>> Can you refute the legislation introduced?
> >>>>>> No?
> >>>>>> Then STFU.
> >>>>> they should be forced into
> >>>> SHADDUP ASSHOLE!
> >>> snicker!
> >> DROP DAMNED DEAD YOU LYING PIECE OF SHIT!
>
> > you still have not refuted what the democrats have stated that there
> > are millions of acres of leased land standing idle crank:)
>
> Here's a clue, oil companies paid big $$ for those leases,

so you do admit that there are leases. we are making progress:)

do you
> believe they'd let them sit idle if there was oil to be had at today's
> prices?
>

why yes, how do you think they manufactured this crisis in the first
place. you know nothing about economics i see. scarcity is the friend
of the free market.

> Just screw some damned brains in and try and logically ponder things,
> you detestable assburp.

supply and demand evades you. quite embarrassing yourself.

== 10 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 8:09 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 8:48 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
>>>>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
>>>>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
>>>>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
>>>>>> up what that guy said?
>>>>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
>>>>> then, why have the cons
>>>> That would be NO CITE, NO EVIDENCE, NOTHING at all.
>>>> As predicted.
>>> as predicted, a different handle.
>> No facts, you simply whimped out, you lying scumbag.
>
> snicker, nothing i see.

Nothing you say or add.

== 11 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 8:09 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 8:48 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 20, 1:03 am, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> <Vide...@tcq.net> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:f840a28f-6dc3-4ffe-88eb-1f5ce402a1f4@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 11:14 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> we know they are sitting on untapped oil, shill.
>>>>>>>>>> At Gull Island, right...conspiracy KOOK!
>>>>>>>>> the non drilling of millions of acres,
>>>>>>>> Do you have some independent data sources or corroborative urls to back
>>>>>>>> up what that guy said?
>>>>>>>> I mean, really, just go for it, put them here:______________________.
>>>>>>> then, why have the cons not called the democrats out when they stated
>>>>>>> it? the democrats announced that charge right in front of the whole
>>>>>>> world. so, refute it. also refute the oil companies statements that
>>>>>>> they do not even have the resources to develop what they already have
>>>>>>> leased, yet, they are wanting more, eh, shill.
>>>>>> That's our Spammy. Changes nyms daily, thinks it keeps her out of
>>>>>> killfiles.
>>>>>> Here's all you need to know about her:
>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crapflooding
>>>>>> HTH,
>>>>>> Jim
>>>>> yea, i have seen the creep all over the net for years. insults will
>>>>> not replace reality.
>>>> Yet when pressed for facts and cites you folded like a cheap card table,
>>>> you motherfucking lying piece of shit.
>>> you already have them
>> Not from you, assburp!
>
> snicker, still nothing.

Agreed, you have nothing.

== 12 of 12 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 8:14 pm
From: edelbrock

Video61@tcq.net wrote:
> On Jun 20, 8:50 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>> On Jun 20, 1:56 pm, edelbrock <m...@i.fold> wrote:
>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 19, 11:15 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 6:17 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 5:29 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 1:01 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Vide...@tcq.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 19, 12:38 pm, singularity <r...@kurtz.wheel> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:22:15 -0700, retrogro...@comcast.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:25:13 -0700, "Clave"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are no Chinese rigs drilling on the Cuba side of the Florida
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Strait according people in our government. But there is some truth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to your MIMBY prosecution.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You believe our government? There's your problem right there
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The U.S. Congress has voted consistently to keep 85% of America's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> offshore oil and gas off-limits, while China and Cuba drill 60 miles from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Key West, Fla. The U.S. Minerals Management Service says that the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricted areas contain 86 billion barrels of oil and 420 trillion cubic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feet of natural gas."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20080609/bs_ibd_ibd/20080609issues01
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's an unsourced op-ed, and it's full of shit.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/40776.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> territory to domestic production.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vice President Dick Cheney, in a speech Wednesday to the U.S. Chamber
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Commerce, picked up the refrain. Cheney quoted a column by George
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Will, who wrote last week that "drilling is under way 60 miles off
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. The drilling is being done by China, in cooperation with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cuba, which is drilling closer to South Florida than U.S. companies
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think Congress should haul Cheney's but in front of a committee and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> roast him for lying again. These grandiose lies serve as a great
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> entre to hold up how much he personally is liable for lying us into
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iraq. he repeatedly told lies on the Sunday talking heads programs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even after the intelligence agencies told him thy were lies.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> LOL. Seems Cheney realized his liability and "corrected" it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/china_starts_oil_drilling.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Chinese have forged a deal with Cuban leader Fidel Castro to explore
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and tap into massive oil reserves almost within sight of Key West,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida. At the same time, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controls the largest oil reserves in the Western Hemisphere, is making
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deals to sell his country?s oil to China, oil that is currently coming
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to the United States.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Meanwhile, a new left-wing populist regime in Bolivia has nationalized
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the natural gas industry, threatening to cut off supplies to the United
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> States.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SLANT DRILLING
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are new reports out circulating that Chinese firms are planning to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slant drill off the Cuban coast near the Florida Straits, tapping into
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U.S. oil reserves that are estimated at 4.6 billion to 9.3 billion barrels.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> China is eager to tap into oil reserves in the Florida Straits and then
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make a deal with Castro to control it. The Chinese have already reopened
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an abandoned Russian oil refinery in Cuba. Much of the gas refined there
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is believed to be destined for Freeport in the Bahamas, where the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese, through front company Hutchison-Whampoa, has developed a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> massive port facility and airfield.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With the refinery reopened and expanded it will also meet the needs of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Castro.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sen. Larry Craig (R-Idaho) has introduced legislation to ease U.S.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restrictions that prevent dealing with Cuba to drill in the Florida
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Straits. It is hoped that Florida regulations that prevent U.S. oil
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> drilling off the state?s coasts could also be eased.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> now there is a name that you can count on to be truthful,
>>>>>>>>>>>> No factual rebuttal, thanks for taking the bait- hook,line and sinker.
>>>>>>>>>>>> You stupid piece of shit.
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.boiseweekly.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A156914
>>>>>>>>>>> Lifetime achievement
>>>>>>>>>>> This year's Lifetime Achievement Dud goes to part-time senator/full-
>>>>>>>>>>> time special interest shill Larry Craig,
>>>>>>>>>> That's it?
>>>>>>>>>> You took the bait hook line and sinker!
>>>>>>>>>> You moron.
>>>>>>>>> if you think larry is honest,
>>>>>>>> Can you refute the legislation introduced?
>>>>>>>> No?
>>>>>>>> Then STFU.
>>>>>>> they should be forced into
>>>>>> SHADDUP ASSHOLE!
>>>>> snicker!
>>>> DROP DAMNED DEAD YOU LYING PIECE OF SHIT!
>>> you still have not refuted what the democrats have stated that there
>>> are millions of acres of leased land standing idle crank:)
>> Here's a clue, oil companies paid big $$ for those leases,
>
> so you do admit that there are leases. we are making progress:)

You fucking moron, I never once intimated there were not.

Wake up, asshat.

> do you
>> believe they'd let them sit idle if there was oil to be had at today's
>> prices?
>>
>
> why yes, how do you think they manufactured this crisis in the first
> place.

Right...black helicopter alert!

> you know nothing about economics i see. scarcity is the friend
> of the free market.

If they have the oil they will produce it to pay for the leases.

>> Just screw some damned brains in and try and logically ponder things,
>> you detestable assburp.
>
> supply and demand evades you. quite embarrassing yourself.

Paranoiac conspiracy defines you - provide some facts, ah well, no
matter - right back to it:

http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/analysispaper/congr/

Crude Oil Reserve Trends

Offshore Crude Oil Reserves

Onshore Crude Oil Reserves

Potential Causes for the Growth in Nonproducing Crude Oil and Natural
Gas Reserves

Conclusions

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 5:35 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Jun 19, 4:27 pm, James <jl...@idirect.com> wrote:
> On Jun 19, 3:00 pm, Seerialmom <seerial...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jun 19, 7:41 am, NB <nobuy...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I took my car in to the dealer for maintenance. They have a free
> > > shuttle that will take you anywhere (like to your job), and then pick
> > > you up when they are done with the maintenance. Should the driver be
> > > tipped? If so, how much?
>
> > I never have...and I didn't see anyone else do it, either. I suppose
> > where I work we figure he's getting a union paycheck so why would we?
> > From what I can tell it's just one of the service advisers, they
> > rotate the van driving.
>
> Depends on the dealership. I've been to hundreds of dealerships as
> aprt of my job, never seen a union one.
>
> First off not many are union. Some hire someone to be the driver -
> usually look for retired people pay them lower.
>
> Sometimes its the parts runner - the guy who picks up parts.
>
> Sometimes its the service advisor.
>
> James

Aren't the service advisers of the big dealerships (not talking about
Joe Schmo's Used Car Corral) union like the mechanics? Maybe not.
But I have known service advisers for major dealerships and the pay
wasn't low. I suppose if I knew for a fact it was a "retiree" doing
this part time to supplement his SS check..I might think more about
tipping the driver.

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 9:51 pm
From: Suganya

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TOPIC: You won;t believe this!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/b259b042c3da62f5?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Jun 20 2008 10:04 pm
From: Gordon

afterapril@gmail.com wrote in news:a24000b9-48dc-46ac-b489-
b0e9a20bffbb@i18g2000prn.googlegroups.com:

> http://www.moreniche.com/join.html?w=131686&ttp=3

You're right, I won't. Well, atleast i won't fall for it.

== 1 of 1 ==
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