Frugal Living: Jan 16, 2008

Wednesday, January 16, 2008

24 new messages in 13 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Plastic grocery bag debate question
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/76c040c2f7b9f6a6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:11 pm
From: "Lou"

"Shawn Hirn" <srhi@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:srhi-0F40AD.06584515012008@newsgroups.comcast.net...
> In article
> <921f68af-02e2-4c6b-9c97-8dcc7ad6cf91@e10g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> val189 <gwehrenb@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> > On Jan 14, 7:10 pm, hchick...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > ...and never wash it, since the manufacture of the detergent, the
> > > heating of the water, the power for the washer and dryer, and the gas
> > > or electricity for the dryer totally obliviate and
> >
> > Aw c'mon - having an extra bag it the washer and hanging it out on the
> > fencepost to dry adds no expense. But I get your point.... although,
> > what's obliviate? :))
> >
> > More supermarkets should offer easy access recycling bins for paper
> > and plastic bags, and for those @$#%$ foam trays too. Many people
> > will recycle if it's made convenient.
>
> I totally disagree. In my office suite there are at least fifty people.
> Each office has a white bin to recycle paper and other bin for
> non-recyclable trash. Many of my colleagues just use their white
> recycling bin as another trash can. When I ask them why they don't make
> the simple effort to drop ONLY their recyclables in the recycling bin,
> they just shrug and say they don't think about it. This has been
> happening for many years where I work.

I've worked in offices that were similarly equipped, and the whole thing is
a rather poor joke. Stayed late one night, and when the custodial staff
came by to empty the trash, the contents of both bins went into the same
barrel.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:16 pm
From: Jamie

Are those vinyl bags they suggest using really a good alternative?
How easy is it to take them with you to the store all the time? Most
of these bags are too small. I have a Target Visa, and they sent me a
Target bag. I never take it to stores because it's not big enough for
groceries. It's not even big enough to use as a beach bag, and if I
had a child in school he or she probably could not use it for a book
bag!

I, too, use my grocery store and other store (Target, Rite Aid, etc)
bags for garbage liners because it's easier than buying garbage liners
all the time. I recycle these bags once my drawer in which I keep
them becomes too full.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Best cheap LED flashlight from Walmart?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/289e1ab2c0f56d4c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:22 pm
From: Dennis

On Tue, 15 Jan 2008 01:04:53 -0500, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:

>Almost all the Amish I knew had a one AAA Dorcy LED light. Just enough
>light to get around and very small, but dependable.

This is the LED flashlight that I carry with me most of the time. It
is barely bigger than an AA cell and works great for
emergencies/casual use:

http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/cmg_infinity_ultra.htm

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:31 pm
From: Anthony Matonak

Dennis wrote:
> This is the LED flashlight that I carry with me most of the time. It
> is barely bigger than an AA cell and works great for
> emergencies/casual use:
>
> http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/cmg_infinity_ultra.htm

I have one of those tiny dollar store flashlights on my keychain.
It's bright enough to keep me from tripping over things in a
blackout while I look for a brighter light.

It looks like this...
http://www.milkhoneyland.com/keychain-flashlight-p-697.html

I also got a handful of those single AA flashlights off Ebay.
Even though they are pretty cheaply designed they seem to work
OK and they're a lot safer to use than candles.

The only picture I could find easily is here...
http://www.marketworks.com/storefrontprofiles/processfeed.aspx?sfid=65170&i=230931950&mpid=3888&dfid=1

Anthony

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Why we don't need Mexicans
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a33d78e3d758123f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:23 pm
From: Ben Sharvy

Fourteen reasons we don't need your racism....

On Jan 17, 4:20 am, Ted <tedor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Jan 16, 9:52 am, Righteous Dude <n...@hotmail.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Here are 14 reasons why the US has to cut benefits to senior citizens.
> > "Snopes" is provided for any doubters. I hope the following reasons are
> > forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the
> > reader gets sick of reading them.
> > I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.
>
> >http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
>
> > 1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens
> > each year.http://tinyurl.com/zob77
>
> > 2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs
> > such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>
> > 3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal
> > aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>
> > 4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school
> > education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of
> > English!http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html
>
> > 5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the
> > American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> > 6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> > 7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> > 8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare &
> > social services by the American taxpayers.http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
>
> > 9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused
> > by the illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> > 10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's
> > two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular,
> > their
> > children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the UShttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html
>
> > 11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens
> > that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal
> > aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine,
> > meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern
> > border. Homeland Security Report:http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
>
> > 12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of
> > mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average
> > cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period."http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf
>
> > 13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back
> > to their countries of origin.http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm
>
> > 14. Nearly One Million Sex Crimes were Committed by Illegal Immigrants
> > In The United States.http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
>
> > The total cost is $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS per YEAR
>
> > Deportation would be cheaper than maintenance or amnesty for illegals.
>
> Does anyone still support the government in Washington, DC?
>
> ted- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:38 pm
From: Marsha

What does raciscm have to do with illegal aliens?

Ben Sharvy wrote:

> Fourteen reasons we don't need your racism....
>
> On Jan 17, 4:20 am, Ted <tedor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Jan 16, 9:52 am, Righteous Dude <n...@hotmail.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>Here are 14 reasons why the US has to cut benefits to senior citizens.
>>>"Snopes" is provided for any doubters. I hope the following reasons are
>>>forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the
>>>reader gets sick of reading them.
>>>I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.
>>
>>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
>>
>>>1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens
>>>each year.http://tinyurl.com/zob77
>>
>>>2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs
>>>such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>
>>>3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal
>>>aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>
>>>4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school
>>>education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of
>>>English!http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html
>>
>>>5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the
>>>American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare &
>>>social services by the American taxpayers.http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused
>>>by the illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's
>>>two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular,
>>>their
>>>children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the UShttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html
>>
>>>11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens
>>>that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal
>>>aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine,
>>>meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern
>>>border. Homeland Security Report:http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
>>
>>>12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of
>>>mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average
>>>cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period."http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf
>>
>>>13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back
>>>to their countries of origin.http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm
>>
>>>14. Nearly One Million Sex Crimes were Committed by Illegal Immigrants
>>>In The United States.http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
>>
>>>The total cost is $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS per YEAR
>>
>>>Deportation would be cheaper than maintenance or amnesty for illegals.
>>
>>Does anyone still support the government in Washington, DC?
>>
>>ted- Hide quoted text -
>>
>>- Show quoted text -
>
>

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 7:41 pm
From: "Billzz"

"Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message news:fmmf3p$lnl$4@news.datemas.de...
> What does raciscm have to do with illegal aliens?

I do not know what this is doing in soc.veterans, but as an old observer of
the American scene, I believe that it comes from Gus Hall, of the American
Communist Party, who invented the "blame America first" argument technique.
If anyone proposed anything that he was against he would immediately launch
into a tirade about how America had slaves! And since you had slaves! How
could you say anything about anything!!! ( I spare you the long-winded
rant.)

So if you say anything about illegal aliens you will be greeted with the
argument that "This is Racism!" In other words *you* can't say anything,
and why? Because you are a racist! And that should be repeated at least
three times. There is nothing that you can say, about the subject, because
the subject has now been changed to you (or anyone who wants to talk about
the subject.) If you want to talk about the subject, then you cannot,
because you are a racist!

Gus Hall's students went to some fine colleges to learn this stuff, and it
always works. All of the media is full of people who will immediately *not*
talk about the subject, but will characterize, as a racist, any speaker of
the subject.

The idea is that *YOU* may not speak of this subject. If you do, then, by
definition, you are a racist. Only they may speak of the subject, and when
they do, the first thing that they will do is characterize you as a racist.
Commie 101.

But, as the American economy declines into a depression (we are already in a
recession) then the attraction of illegal aliens will be less, and the
problem will solve itself. It is simply too expensive to make anything in
the United States, even with illegal aliens. And the purchasing power of
the average American, is declining very fast, and inflation is going up,
very fast. We probably won't decline to third-world status in the next ten
years, but that's the way the United States is heading. And at that point
there will be no incentive for illegal aliens to come here. In fact, they
will flee.

Probably not what anyone wanted to hear.

>
>
> Ben Sharvy wrote:
>
>> Fourteen reasons we don't need your racism....
>>
>> On Jan 17, 4:20 am, Ted <tedor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Jan 16, 9:52 am, Righteous Dude <n...@hotmail.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Here are 14 reasons why the US has to cut benefits to senior citizens.
>>>>"Snopes" is provided for any doubters. I hope the following reasons are
>>>>forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the
>>>>reader gets sick of reading them.
>>>>I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.
>>>
>>>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
>>>
>>>>1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens
>>>>each year.http://tinyurl.com/zob77
>>>
>>>>2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs
>>>>such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal
>>>>aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>>
>>>>3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal
>>>>aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>>
>>>>4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school
>>>>education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of
>>>>English!http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html
>>>
>>>>5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the
>>>>American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor
>>>>babies.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal
>>>>aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal
>>>>aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare &
>>>>social services by the American
>>>>taxpayers.http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused
>>>>by the illegal
>>>>aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's
>>>>two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular,
>>>>their
>>>>children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the
>>>>UShttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html
>>>
>>>>11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens
>>>>that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal
>>>>aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine,
>>>>meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern
>>>>border. Homeland Security Report:http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
>>>
>>>>12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of
>>>>mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average
>>>>cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year
>>>>period."http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf
>>>
>>>>13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back
>>>>to their countries of origin.http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm
>>>
>>>>14. Nearly One Million Sex Crimes were Committed by Illegal Immigrants
>>>>In The United States.http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
>>>
>>>>The total cost is $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS per YEAR
>>>
>>>>Deportation would be cheaper than maintenance or amnesty for illegals.
>>>
>>>Does anyone still support the government in Washington, DC?
>>>
>>>ted- Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>>- Show quoted text -
>>
>>
>

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:59 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Billzz <billzzstring@starband.net> wrote
> Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote

>> What does raciscm have to do with illegal aliens?

> I do not know what this is doing in soc.veterans,

Nothing, the redneck does bombing runs everywhere.

> but as an old observer of the American scene, I believe that it comes from Gus Hall, of the American Communist Party,
> who invented the "blame America first" argument technique.

Nope. While its not technically correct to characterise the
redneck that JUST mindlessly rants about illegal aliens as
a racist, thats just because there isnt a more accurate
description for his mindless obsession about illegal aliens.

> If anyone proposed anything that he was against he would immediately launch into a tirade about how America had
> slaves! And since you had slaves! How could you say anything about anything!!! ( I spare you the long-winded rant.)

That isnt what Marsha's comment is about.

> So if you say anything about illegal aliens you will be greeted with the argument that "This is Racism!"

The redneck wasnt 'saying anything about illegal aliens',
its obsessed about them, and just presents completely
one eyed rant about what is purportedly what they produce.

> In other words *you* can't say anything, and why? Because you are a racist! And that should be repeated at least
> three times. There is nothing that you can say, about the subject, because the subject has now been changed to you (or
> anyone who wants to talk about the subject.) If you want to talk about the subject, then you cannot, because you are
> a racist!

That aint what Marsha's comment was about.

> Gus Hall's students went to some fine colleges to learn this stuff, and it always works.

No it doesnt.

> All of the media is full of people who will immediately *not* talk about the subject, but will characterize, as a
> racist, any speaker of the subject.

That aint what Marsha's comment was about.

> The idea is that *YOU* may not speak of this subject. If you do, then, by definition, you are a racist. Only they may
> speak of the subject, and when they do, the first thing that they will do is characterize you as a racist. Commie 101.

That aint what Marsha's comment was about.

> But, as the American economy declines into a depression

Taint gunna happen and even if it did, even a depression on the scale
of the great depression wouldnt be anything like that was again.

> (we are already in a recession) then the attraction of illegal aliens will be less,

Nope. The absolute vast bulk of americans wont ever be doing
the absolute dregs work that the illegals have no choice but to
do, and modern welfare ensures that they wont need to either.

> and the problem will solve itself.

How odd that it didnt even during the great depression.

> It is simply too expensive to make anything in the United States, even with illegal aliens.

Have fun explaining what still gets made in america, all the
fast food, all the cars, heavy aircraft, software, etc etc etc.

> And the purchasing power of the average American, is declining very fast,

Pigs arse it is. Have fun explaining the FACT that home
ownership is at historical record highs and car ownership
in spades, let alone all the consumer stuff.

> and inflation is going up, very fast.

Wrong again.

> We probably won't decline to third-world status in the next ten years,

Corse that wont happen. That didnt even happen during the
great depression and we wont be seeing another one of those.

> but that's the way the United States is heading.

Nope. In the real world manufacturing is only ever a small part of
any modern first world economy and there are plenty of jobs in the
service sector to produce an unemployment rate of only 4.x%

> And at that point there will be no incentive for illegal aliens to come here.

Mindless silly stuff. Their situation in america will always be much better
than back where they are coming from, so they will keep coming for
precisely the same reason they have been coming up till now.

> In fact, they will flee.

Have fun explaining how come that didnt even happen during the great depression.

> Probably not what anyone wanted to hear.

Yep, mindless hysterical hyperventilation like yours isnt even amusing. Just pathetic.

>> Ben Sharvy wrote:
>>
>>> Fourteen reasons we don't need your racism....
>>>
>>> On Jan 17, 4:20 am, Ted <tedor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Jan 16, 9:52 am, Righteous Dude <n...@hotmail.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Here are 14 reasons why the US has to cut benefits to senior
>>>>> citizens. "Snopes" is provided for any doubters. I hope the
>>>>> following reasons are forwarded over and over again until they
>>>>> are read so many times that the reader gets sick of reading them.
>>>>> I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.
>>>>
>>>>> http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
>>>>
>>>>> 1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal
>>>>> aliens each year.http://tinyurl.com/zob77
>>>>
>>>>> 2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance
>>>>> programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for
>>>>> illegal aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>>>
>>>>> 3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal
>>>>> aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>>>>
>>>>> 4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary
>>>>> school education for children here illegally and they cannot
>>>>> speak a word of
>>>>> English!http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html
>>>>
>>>>> 5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the
>>>>> American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor
>>>>> babies.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal
>>>>> aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal
>>>>> aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for
>>>>> Welfare & social services by the American
>>>>> taxpayers.http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are
>>>>> caused by the illegal
>>>>> aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate
>>>>> that's two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In
>>>>> particular, their
>>>>> children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the
>>>>> UShttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html
>>>>
>>>>> 11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal
>>>>> aliens that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500
>>>>> illegal aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs,
>>>>> cocaine, meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from
>>>>> the Southern border. Homeland Security
>>>>> Report:http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
>>>>
>>>>> 12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost
>>>>> of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an
>>>>> average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five
>>>>> year
>>>>> period."http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf
>>>>
>>>>> 13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances
>>>>> back to their countries of
>>>>> origin.http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm
>>>>
>>>>> 14. Nearly One Million Sex Crimes were Committed by Illegal
>>>>> Immigrants In The United States.http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
>>>>
>>>>> The total cost is $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS per YEAR
>>>>
>>>>> Deportation would be cheaper than maintenance or amnesty for
>>>>> illegals.
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone still support the government in Washington, DC?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Home envy and pride
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/473445cf4b5a8b03?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:31 pm
From: "Lou"

> <hchickpea@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:ot1no39m1skj50t69kangercl1e58thpve@4ax.com...
> > The other home show I watched last night was on some couples "moving
> > up," with couple A selling their old home to couple B who then sold
> > their old home to couple C. Each couple hated the decorating of the
> > previous owners, even though those owners had spent a lot of effort
> > and money making their homes into what they thought were showcases.
> >
> > I guess that the snarky comments and snide remarks about bad taste
> > were good television for this era of viewers. However, they were at
> > the same time juvenile and happened to reinforce my thoughts that
> > building and decorating a home to impress other people makes as much
> > sense as gilding a barn. Unless you find a cow that appreciates gold
> > colored beams, you are wasting your efforts.
> >
> > IMO, having a home that is comfortable and meets the needs of the
> > occupants is a much saner approach to decorating than spending money
> > trying to impress guests that may be in the home for a few hours a
> > year. Skimping on decorator frou frou can be a good way to save money
> > and time spent cleaning.
> >

I think I saw the same show - a gay couple moving to a horse farm, and an
unmarried straight couple buying the gay couple's city residence. I thought
both couples more than a little profligate, but all the parties were adults
and as such are presumed competent to handle their finances. Not that the
particular episode matters.

I can certainly understand that some people might not like, might actively
dislike, the decorating choices of others, no matter how much it cost, and
want to redo it. There's a house in my neighborhood I feel that way about -
the original owners did it up in psuedo country/early American/colonial.
They were proud of it, you could see it in their eyes, but to me it was
surpassingly ugly, and if I were to move into such a place, I'd be itching
to change it as soon as possible.

How fortunate when stuff like this are our biggest problems.

Anyway, some of this tendency to spend a lot may be inherent human nature,
though it's hard/impossible to determine how much of our behavior is
hard-wired by biology and how much is due to culture.

But some recent research (
http://www.sciam.com/podcast/episode.cfm?id=7A81E74F-E554-39DF-62E0C6F540A3CDF8 )
seems to show that people enjoy wine more when they think it's more
expensive, and it isn't just lip service - MRI scans show increased activity
in brain pleasure centers.

While generalizations can be risky, it's at least possible that what's true
for wine may be true generally, and as a whole we tend to value expensive
things more than inexpensive things, and our pleasure is enhanced simply
because a thing is expensive. And that could include housing. Fortunate
are those who can indulge this particular quirk.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:57 pm
From: Seerialmom

On Jan 14, 8:20 am, hchick...@hotmail.com wrote:
> The other home show I watched last night was on some couples "moving
> up," with couple A selling their old home to couple B who then sold
> their old home to couple C. Each couple hated the decorating of the
> previous owners, even though those owners had spent a lot of effort
> and money making their homes into what they thought were showcases.
>
> I guess that the snarky comments and snide remarks about bad taste
> were good television for this era of viewers. However, they were at
> the same time juvenile and happened to reinforce my thoughts that
> building and decorating a home to impress other people makes as much
> sense as gilding a barn. Unless you find a cow that appreciates gold
> colored beams, you are wasting your efforts.
>
> IMO, having a home that is comfortable and meets the needs of the
> occupants is a much saner approach to decorating than spending money
> trying to impress guests that may be in the home for a few hours a
> year. Skimping on decorator frou frou can be a good way to save money
> and time spent cleaning.
>
> Harry, constantly amazed at how callous people can be in judging
> others sensibilities.

Don't you get annoyed sometimes at the realtor or potential buyer walk-
thrus where they're constantly saying this or that is "dated"?
WTH...do you have to update your house every 5 years?? If you do
nothing...eventually the style comes back, right?

I kinda wouldn't mind having a skyblue bathtub, toilet and sink ;)
It'd go well with my avocado kitchen appliances.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 5:28 pm
From: KarlMarx_MiddleClass_Ipod_HipHop

On Jan 14, 11:20 am, hchick...@hotmail.com wrote:
> The other home show I watched last night was on some couples "moving
> up," with couple A selling their old home to couple B who then sold
> their old home to couple C.

All these reality shows remind me of the old Saturday Night Live
episode parody called "Real Incredible People". The hosts were in awe
of someone who read books.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Internet TV vs regular TV?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/f04f08d896e09fd2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 4:44 pm
From: Dennis

On Mon, 14 Jan 2008 14:07:47 -0600, me@privacy.net wrote:

>Question...rather than viewing TV shows on your
>computer via TV signal input..... how possible is it to
>get TV shows right OFF the Internet period thereby
>bypassing the normal channels for TV anyway?

Another option that I have not seen mentioned: A $9/mo NetFlix
subscription gets you unlimited DVDs by mail, (one out at a time -- I
can usually turn around two per week), plus unlimited online viewing.
Currently their online catalog is somewhat limited (at least compared
to their DVD catalog), but it may improve. Both include TV series as
well as movies.

The quality of the online viewing with my DSL connection is
acceptable, but not up to broadcast level.

Dennis (evil)
--
The honest man is the one who realizes that he cannot
consume more, in his lifetime, than he produces.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: nice
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/adb2596e398814a6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 5:37 pm
From: bery.x@hotmail.com

We are wholesale with Nike Shoes, clear Jordan Shoes.clear Air Force
One,clear Bape Shoes, Adidas, Ice Cream,Puma ,Timberland shoes.Red
Monkey Jean,Bape Hoodies,Lacoste T-shirt, CHANEL,LV Bag, Bape
Shorts,and tiffany.
www.picknicekicks.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Make Money Guaranteed.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/bc0ee12201a1885b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:12 pm
From: "cashmoneyjaj@gmail.com"

Goto http://www.makemoneyanybody.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: temporary health insurance for a recent graduate
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ca3c7cbfde6133a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:31 pm
From: "Jeff Thompson"

"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5v4mkeF1k3044U1@mid.individual.net...
>h wrote:

>> I've only spent $1,500 on medical care since 1999 (10 stitches in the
>> ER),
>
> Thats pretty typical for someone of that age that isnt into high injury
> risk sports.

Can you provide a cite? It seems highly unlikely to be typical for someone
"well into (their) 50's" to have spent $1,500 in eight years for medical
care. I'm not disputing the poster's claim to have spent that much but
rather your assertion that it's "pretty typical".

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:43 pm
From: "Sally Robertson"

<h> wrote in message news:478d997a$0$5106$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>
> I have a very different take on medical stuff. I don't take medications
> and would not ever consider the treatment options available for diseases
> like cancer (chemo, radiation, etc.) It's quite pointless to go to have
> checkups because I wouldn't follow the doctor's advice if they found
> anything, nor would I be interested in any further tests. I exercise 90
> minutes a day, every day, I maintain a healthy weight, and I eat no more
> than 30 grams of carbs a day. I don't smoke and I rarely drink more than
> one glass of wine. I'm healthier now in my 50s than I was in my 20s. It
> also helps that I never had kids, so my body wasn't ravaged by breeding.
> All the women in my family drop dead at 91 (really, all of them on both
> sides!) and we never see doctors. It's not that I'm being smug or
> blissfully ignorant, I'm counting on genetics and lifestyle. My mom's 88
> and hasn't seen a doctor since she had me.

"Ravaged by breeding"? Apparently it didn't much harm the other women in
your family, who by your own account all lived to be 91 and in at least some
of those cases must have been "ravaged" or we wouldn't be having this
discussion. In any case, given the perjorative choice of words you used to
describe having children, I think it's safe to say that you've done us all a
favor by declining to "breed".

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 7:03 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Jeff Thompson <jt8396@verizon.net> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>> h wrote:

>>> I've only spent $1,500 on medical care since 1999 (10 stitches in the ER),

>> Thats pretty typical for someone of that age that isnt into high injury risk sports.

> Can you provide a cite?

Nope, that's personal experience.

> It seems highly unlikely to be typical for someone "well into (their) 50's" to have spent $1,500 in eight years for
> medical care.

That was before he stated the age, I assumed he was
talking about the same age as the OP which was 24.

> I'm not disputing the poster's claim to have spent that much but rather your assertion that it's "pretty typical".

Its not that uncommon for someone of that age either. I never bothered with
a doctor at all at that age except for accidents etc, and even one of those in
10 years that needed a doctor wasnt common, even when I physically built
my house myself, I didnt get a single injury that needed a doctor.

The only time I saw a doctor was for the legally mandated checkup for the flying license.

Corse there are always some fools that go and see a doctor when
they get a common cold, but thats a different matter entirely.

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:16 pm
From:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Jeff Thompson" <jt8396@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:u6zjj.11548$cz3.4449@trnddc06...
> "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:5v4mkeF1k3044U1@mid.individual.net...
>>h wrote:
>
>>> I've only spent $1,500 on medical care since 1999 (10 stitches in the
>>> ER),
>>
>> Thats pretty typical for someone of that age that isnt into high injury
>> risk sports.
>
> Can you provide a cite? It seems highly unlikely to be typical for someone
> "well into (their) 50's" to have spent $1,500 in eight years for medical
> care. I'm not disputing the poster's claim to have spent that much but
> rather your assertion that it's "pretty typical".

Yes, I've only spent $1,500 since 1999 because the only time I've been to
the doctor was to the ER for stitches (cut my right hand open, so couldn't
stitch it up myself). I think the other poster thought that I was the OP or
someone in their 20s, and I'd have to agree that's a "pretty typical"
expenditure for 20-something.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:22 pm
From: tmclone@searchmachine.com

On Jan 16, 9:43 pm, "Sally Robertson" <eva_...@gmail.com> wrote:
> <h> wrote in messagenews:478d997a$0$5106$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>
> > I have a very different take on medical stuff. I don't take medications
> > and would not ever consider the treatment options available for diseases
> > like cancer (chemo, radiation, etc.) It's quite pointless to go to have
> > checkups because I wouldn't follow the doctor's advice if they found
> > anything, nor would I be interested in any further tests. I exercise 90
> > minutes a day, every day, I maintain a healthy weight, and I eat no more
> > than 30 grams of carbs a day. I don't smoke and I rarely drink more than
> > one glass of wine. I'm healthier now in my 50s than I was in my 20s. It
> > also helps that I never had kids, so my body wasn't ravaged by breeding.
> > All the women in my family drop dead at 91 (really, all of them on both
> > sides!) and we never see doctors. It's not that I'm being smug or
> > blissfully ignorant, I'm counting on genetics and lifestyle. My mom's 88
> > and hasn't seen a doctor since she had me.
>
> "Ravaged by breeding"? Apparently it didn't much harm the other women in
> your family, who by your own account all lived to be 91 and in at least some
> of those cases must have been "ravaged" or we wouldn't be having this
> discussion. In any case, given the perjorative choice of words you used to
> describe having children, I think it's safe to say that you've done us all a
> favor by declining to "breed".

Whatever. Breeding does horrendous things to your body, even if you
only have one. My great-grandmother was a midwife, so the women in my
family definitely saw all the horrors of spawning and most didn't do
it if they could avoid it. My mother's was the first generation in my
family to have access to birth control, and she only had one. My aunts
had none. Most of my grandmother's generation would have been
childfree as well, if they could have been. My great aunt always said,
"I love my kids, but if I could choose again, I'd have stayed single!"
Back in those days, that meant no kids. Oh, and by the way, PLONK.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Quality Web & Design Services at Bargain Prices
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c4ff60a2c7cf463a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:38 pm
From: services.wosg@gmail.com

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Being The Frugal Person..What Did You Buy This Christmas?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/23d6fe7a657db887?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 6:40 pm
From: Marsha

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

> Curious...as a frugal person what did you buy this Christmas?
>
> TMT

Nothing.

Marsha/Ohio

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to turn $10 into $10,000 in 14 days with Paypal !
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6c5ed8f3954ce18f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 7:32 pm
From: noelvought@hotmail.com

How to turn $10 into $10,000 in 14 days with Paypal !
" I WAS SHOCKED WHEN I SAW HOW MUCH MONEY
CAME FLOODING INTO MY PAYPAL ACCOUNT." -Mark 2004

Dear Friend,

This is a new program as you will see. It can be for
the U.S. or the U.K. This is a fantastic opportunity,
try it for yourself!! EVERYTHING DONE ONLINE ! !
With just £5 or $10 and a Paypal PREMIER or BUSINESS
account, you could make $$Thousands$$ in 2 SIMPLE
STEPS ! !

READ THIS VERY CAREFULLY THEN READ IT AGAIN. THIS IS
FAST, THIS IS NOT THE ONE YOU WILL BE WAITING TO WORK.

GUARANTEED - you will have $10,000 in two weeks.
Only $10, a Paypal PREMIER or BUSINESS account and 30
min are all that is needed to get this going.

GIFTING MADE EASY, PLEASE READ ON TO FIND OUT HOW

If you want to make a few thousand dollars real quick,
then please take a moment to read and understand the
MLM program I'm sharing with you. NO IT'S NOT what you
think. YOU DON'T have to send $10 to five or six
people
to buy a report, receipt or get on
their mailing list. Nor will you need to invest more
money later to get things
going. THIS IS THE FASTEST, EASIEST PROGRAM EVER, you
will be able to complete it in LESS THAN 30 MINUTES
and you will never forget the day you first viewed
this online.

If you're already running a home business, you can
easily do this one along
with it. If not, this is the FASTEST and EASIEST way
to earn serious money
online that you've ever seen so far in the history of
the Internet! This
program works no matter what country you are in, or
what currency you use.
It doesn't matter how old or how young you are. And
you certainly won't need
any special knowledge or talent. You won't need to run
a website, or make
phone calls, or make photocopies, or send out letters
through the mail, or
pay for advertising, etc. The only things you will
need are:

* An email address
* A Premier or Business PayPal account with at least
$10 deposited in it
* 30 minutes of your time

ONLY 2 SIMPLE AND EASY STEPS ! !

If you are doing other programs, by all means stay
with them. The more the
merrier, BUT PLEASE READ ON!! First of all, there are
only TWO POSITIONS, not
four, five or six like many other programs. This
program is more realistic and
much, MUCH FASTER. Because it is so easy, the response
rate for this program is
VERY HIGH and VERY FAST, and you will receive your
reward in FOURTEEN
DAYS. That's only TWO WEEKS - not one or two months.
Just in time for next months BILLS.

TRUE STORY --> Grace Kelly tells how she ran this
gifting summation four times last year. The first
time, she received $6,000 in cash in two weeks and
then $14,000 in cash the next three times.

When this program is continued, as it should be,
EVERYONE PROFITS!! DON'T BE AFRAID to send gifts to
strangers. It will come back to you ten folds. A
person can give you up to $10,000 per year and you
don't have to report it to the IRS.

THIS CAN AND WILL WORK FOR YOU! HERE ARE THE DETAILS:

Post this letter in 50 message boards, chat rooms, or
newsgroup. You don't need to post 200 like other
programs or email 100 people just to get started. Even
if you are already in a program like the send twenty
dollars to six people. CONTINUE IT and stay with it,
THOSE DO PAY OUT, but do yourself a favor, DO THIS ONE
TODAY as well, RIGHT NOW!!! It is simple and takes a
very small investment, only $10 and a Paypal PREMIER
or
BUSINESS account. iT WORKS AND IS DONE IN 2 SIMPLE AND
EASY STEPS ! ! This program WILL PAY FASTER before the
other programs you are working on even trickle in!!
Just give one person $10. THAT'S IT!! Follow the
simple
instructions and in
two weeks, you should have $10,000 because most PEOPLE
WILL RESPOND due to the LOW ONE TIME INVESTMENT, SPEED
AND HIGH PROFIT POTENTIAL.PLUS, since its done all
ONLINE, there is no time wasted mailing out letters
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other in these tough times. We all owe money to bill
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take the time to help each other, the good fortune
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gives back TODAY ! !.

Simply send a $10 gift to the person at POSITION #1,
if
your birthday is BETWEEN JAN 1 THRU JUNE 30, OR, if
your birthday is BETWEEN JULY 1 THRU DEC 31, send the
gift to the person at POSITION # 2.

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STEP 1

Ok, if you're not already a PayPal user, the very
first thing you need to do
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just two minutes!

Here's the URL:

https://www.paypal.com/us/mrb/pal=AQH5ZY3CXRHZN

Be sure to use this link so you can sign up for a free
PREMIER or BUSINESS
account. You'll need to have a PREMIER or BUSINESS
account (and not a
PERSONAL account) otherwise you won't be able to
receive credit card
payments from other people.

STEP 2

It is an undeniable law of the universe that we must
first give in order to
receive. So the first thing to do when you have your
Premier/Business PayPal
account is to IMMEDIATELY send a $10 payment from your
PayPal account to the email address in the position (1
or 2 - depending on your birthday in the timeline),
along with a note saying: "HERE IS A $10 GIFT FOR
YOU."
Be certain to add this note, as this is what KEEPS
THIS PROGRAM LEGAL. Instructions on how to send a
payment are under "SEND MONEY" at the Paypal Site.
It's so Easy!!

When you send your $10 payment to the first address in
the list, do it with a
great big smile on your face because "as you sow, so
shall you reap!"

After you have transferred a $10 payment to the email
address, something very eerie happens. It gives you an
indescribable, overwhelming sense of certainty, belief
and conviction in the system. You've just proved to
yourself that, because you have done it, there must be
a great number of other people ready to do exactly the
same. Thus you have now seen for yourself, first hand,
that this business actually works!

REMOVE the email address you are replacing (the one
you sent $10 to), and REPLACE it with your own email
address.

REMEMBER: Use the same EMAIL ADDRESS that is used with
YOUR Paypal account ! !

Paste your newly typed email address over the old one
and then post to 50 Message Boards, Chat Rooms, or
Newsgroups. DON'T MULL OVER IT, JUST 30 MIN OF YOUR
TIME, THAT'S IT THERE IS NO MORE TO DO!!

ACT FAST AND GET THE GIFT. HONESTLY AND INTEGRITY MAKE
THIS
PLAN WORK!! DO TO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE THEM DO
TO YOU .

POSITION#1 --- noelvought@hotmail.com

POSITION#2 --- drmarksut...@hotmail.com

YOUR NAME COULD CYCLE FOR A LONG TIME ! ! THIS MAKES
IT THE GIFT THAT KEEPS ON GIVING.

This is excellent seed money to start or expand a
business, buy you dream home, car,
and pay off what ever bills you may have. Good luck
and God Bless. Play fairly, Good fortune will follow.

WHY THIS PROGRAM WORKS:

!! HONESTY AND INTEGRITY !!

Straight to the point, the reason this program is SO
SUCCESSFUL is beacuse when you follow these
instructions EXACTLY = GIVE A $10 GIFT and POST this
in
50 different message boards, there are only TWO
outcomes.

(1) A persons birthday will fall on the same half as
yours, therefore, YOU GET THE $10 . .

OR,

(2) a persons birthday will fall on the other half of
the timeline, therefore, YOU STAY IN YOUR POSITION and
get posted in 50 other MESSAGE BOARDS, etc . .

BOTTOMLINE: Either you get the $10 or your name gets
passed on for other people to give YOU $10 or pass
YOUR
name on to other people that will. It makes you think
though, the more you POST YOUR OWN POSTS, the BETTER
the results ! !

4 FACTORS THAT MAKE THIS PROGRAM SO SUCCESSFUL. . .

* EXTREMELY FAST RESPONSE

* EXTREMELY HIGH RESPONSE RATE

* UNLIMITED PROFIT POTENTIAL

* QUICK, SIMPLE AND CHEAP TO GET STARTED

So there it is. You now have the knowledge that will
enable you to make over
$10,000 within the next two weeks. The only thing that
can hold you back now
is a lack of faith or a lack of self-belief. However,
any doubts you may
currently have will disappear within a few days of
putting this plan into
practice. Trust me on this! You certainly won't regret
it.

SOME NOTES FROM PAYPAL WHICH YOU MAY FIND USEFUL

PayPal lets you pay anyone with an email address and
is the world's Number 1
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million eBay auctions
as well as a countless number of online shops. You can
also use PayPal to
pay your friends - for example, it's a convenient way
to split the phone
bill with your room-mate, send cash to your kids in
college, or send cash to
someone in another country. Better yet, you can also
earn a referral bonus
of up to $100 each time someone signs up for a PayPal
account using your
referral URL!

When you send money through PayPal, you can fund your
payments with your
credit card or checking account. You won't have to worry
about your privacy,
because PayPal keeps your accounting information safe
and secure. Making a
purchase with PayPal is far more secure than mailing a
check or giving your
credit card number to a stranger. That's why over 9
MILLION people from
around the world use PayPal to move money. Signing up
for a PayPal account
is free, easy, and it takes only a couple of minutes.

Thank you, and good luck in your ventures

P.S. Does this sound too good? Well maybe to some
skeptics it is. But it
actually works, and is worth the 30 minutes of your
time now. So, just make
a nice cup of tea and get started on it now. After
all, you can't lose, but
you stand to gain more in the next few weeks than many
people earn in a
Post a follow-up to this message

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Making The Decision To Refinance Your Car Loan - 3 Things To Consider
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/775f03e020ec28c3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:18 pm
From: rota6566@yahoo.com.tw

Before you make the decision to refinance your car loan, there are
some things you need to consider. This article offers tips on what to
consider before refinancing your car loan:

Interest Rate

The most common reason a person wants to refinance is to get a better
interest rate. Perhaps you had bad credit when you took out your car
loan, and, now that your credit has improved, you want to refinance
under a better interest rate. Or, perhaps the prime rate is lower now
than it was when you financed, and you want to take advantage of lower
rates. A lower interest rate will save you a lot of money if you have
more than a year left on your car loan; however, interest rates are
not the only things you need to consider.

Prepayment Penalties

So, you've done all of your calculations, and you know that
refinancing under a better interest rate will save you a lot of money.
However, you need to consider prepayment penalties in your
calculations. Say that refinancing will save you $2000 over the life
of your loan. If your current loan has $2000 in prepayment penalties,
it's not going to benefit you to refinance. Check your loan documents
for information on prepayment penalties. If you'll be charged them,
make sure to add that amount into your calculations.

Length of the New Loan

If you currently have two years left on your loan, you're not going to
save money by refinancing under a better interest rate for a longer
number of years. For

http://www.dontplayplay.com/html/Finances/20060928/17181.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cheap Adidas Evisu Burberry Hogan Shoes www.globwholesale.com Discount
Juicy D&B Fendi Miumiu Gucci Prada Handbag
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/e92349c88bb8182f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
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25 new messages in 19 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: Why I hate Geico ads
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c126ff8f6e76bda5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 7:45 am
From: "John A. Weeks III"

In article <478d9daa$0$5209$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com>,
TomAldrich@newshosting.com wrote:

> On 15-Jan-2008, Daniel Carey <DanielFCarey@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > TiVo, dude... TiVo.
>
> And for those of you with Satelite TV, it ain't gping to be TIVO soon.

What do you mean? Both Dish and Direct TV offer DVR service.
And for cable TV, the Motorola HD DVR does a very nice job.

-john-

--
======================================================================
John A. Weeks III 612-720-2854 john@johnweeks.com
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com

======================================================================

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 11:46 am
From: "Kim"

TomAldrich@newshosting.com wrote:
> On 15-Jan-2008, Daniel Carey <DanielFCarey@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > TiVo, dude... TiVo.
>
> And for those of you with Satelite TV, it ain't gping to be TIVO soon.

--
--
Kim
www.thedarwinexception.wordpress.com
* I got a sweater for Christmas. I really wanted a screamer or a
moaner.*

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 2:07 pm
From: ebenZEROONE@verizon.net (Hactar)

In article <john-423A62.09455016012008@sn-radius.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net>,
John A. Weeks III <john@johnweeks.com> wrote:
> In article <478d9daa$0$5209$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com>,
> TomAldrich@newshosting.com wrote:
>
> > On 15-Jan-2008, Daniel Carey <DanielFCarey@comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > TiVo, dude... TiVo.
> >
> > And for those of you with Satelite TV, it ain't gping to be TIVO soon.
>
> What do you mean? Both Dish and Direct TV offer DVR service.
> And for cable TV, the Motorola HD DVR does a very nice job.

For less than $200 and a spare computer, you can build your own.

--
-eben QebWenE01R@vTerYizUonI.nOetP

http://royalty.mine.nu:81
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political
view or strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof
is left as an exercise for your kill-file." -- Bertil Jonell

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 2:07 pm
From: ebenZEROONE@verizon.net (Hactar)

In article <Katjj.8076$s67.937@trndny05>,
Kim <darwinexceptiontakethisout@verizon.net> wrote:
> TomAldrich@newshosting.com wrote:
> > On 15-Jan-2008, Daniel Carey <DanielFCarey@comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > > TiVo, dude... TiVo.
> >
> > And for those of you with Satelite TV, it ain't gping to be TIVO soon.

Since it eventually goes to something which can be displayed on a TV,
you can use _some_ DVR, even if not a TiVo.

--
-eben QebWenE01R@vTerYizUonI.nOetP

http://royalty.mine.nu:81
Are you confident that you appear to be professional in your electronic
communication? Consider this: A: No
Q: Can I top post? from nick@xx.co.uk

==============================================================================
TOPIC: buy cheap shoes (www.shoes-ec.com)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/6c15d8859991cdf0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:01 am
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TOPIC: Nike Air Force Ones,Air Force One Air Force One-1
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/94e1419a1573fd77?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:17 am
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== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:30 am
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TOPIC: Nike Air Force Ones,Air Force One Air Force One-1,
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/0361f553ad7d1e3c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:20 am
From: doris.liu9@gmail.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: FREE" online shopping system that provides cash rebates for items
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/8c3b6874e7aa2bbe?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:41 am
From: "Gregory"

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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 8:46 am
From: "wincommunications@gmail.com"

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TOPIC: RodSpeed
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7846240150597272?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 9:56 am
From: KarlMarx_MiddleClass_Ipod_HipHop

On Jan 16, 1:38 am, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Nope, there has been plenty of PM in the adjustment of interest rates
> as required and adding to liquidity when that has been a problem.

Do you think they (the banks, hedge funds, governments,etc.) even know
what the actual market value of anything is at this point? From what I
am reading, the unchecked electronic issuance of asset "value" is way
out of whack from any calculable expectation of what it should be. We
are talking about credit loans and the expectation of that credit
being paid off.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 10:46 am
From: "Rod Speed"

KarlMarx_MiddleClass_Ipod_HipHop <kwokx2@hotmail.com> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote
>> KarlMarx_MiddleClass_Ipod_HipHop <kwokx2@hotmail.com> wrote

>>> do you think that we will have a global meltdown any day now for stock markets

>> Nope. The system is quite adequate at avoiding those now.

>>> or do you think that the US government is scrambling to prevent the
>>> machine from seizing up from lack of preventative maintenance?

>> Nope, there has been plenty of PM in the adjustment of interest rates
>> as required and adding to liquidity when that has been a problem.

> Do you think they (the banks, hedge funds, governments,etc.) even
> know what the actual market value of anything is at this point?

That isnt relevant to what they do except with the banks.

> From what I am reading, the unchecked electronic issuance of asset "value"
> is way out of whack from any calculable expectation of what it should be. We
> are talking about credit loans and the expectation of that credit being paid off.

Thats been the case for centurys and hasnt stopped the credit system working fine.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Most Frugal and Practical Pickup Truck?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1010359dbc3b29b0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 10:27 am
From: "RAM³"

Too_Many_Tools <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote in news:b41fb467-5caf-4ccd-
895a-6bd845cb95f9@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com:

> I am considering getting my next pickup truck...what is in your
> opinion the best candidate for a frugal and practical pickup truck?

One with a Diesel engine BUT expect to pay a premium price for one in good
shape:

Before I bought mine [2003.5 Dodge/Cummins 1-ton] I checked around to see
what might be available on the used market and was universally told that
the gassers that came in had worn-out engines and that the Diesels had good
engines but everything else was "shot".

Obviously, the "answer" was to buy 2 trucks (1 gasser & 1 diesel) and
convert the gasser into a diesel. [An expensive option.]

If you're insistent upon a gasoline-engined truck, the Dodge RAM comes with
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cloth Diapers & Soap Nuts
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a35a803954003b9a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 10:57 am
From: 7match777

My wife recently purchased a bag of soap nuts to use for cleaning
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== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 2:22 pm
From: Al Bundy

On Jan 16, 1:57 pm, 7match777 <mej...@telus.net> wrote:
> My wife recently purchased a bag of soap nuts to use for cleaning
> cloth diapers for our baby girl. They worked better than any other
> laundry detergent she had tried. She was so impressed that she bought
> them in bulk & opened up an e-store so that she have a home-based
> business and still raise our daughter.

Maybe we should just buy in bulk too instead of paying $25/lb. for
soap and hoping 2oz of shells will clean a load.

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TOPIC: Chanel Handbags ,Miu Miu Handbags ,Hermes Handbags
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== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 11:20 am
From: Ted

On Jan 16, 9:52 am, Righteous Dude <n...@hotmail.uk> wrote:
> Here are 14 reasons why the US has to cut benefits to senior citizens.
> "Snopes" is provided for any doubters. I hope the following reasons are
> forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the
> reader gets sick of reading them.
> I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.
>
> http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
>
> 1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens
> each year.http://tinyurl.com/zob77
>
> 2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs
> such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>
> 3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal
> aliens.http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html
>
> 4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school
> education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of
> English!http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html
>
> 5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the
> American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> 6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> 7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> 8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare &
> social services by the American taxpayers.http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
>
> 9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused
> by the illegal aliens.http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html
>
> 10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's
> two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular,
> their
> children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the UShttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html
>
> 11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens
> that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal
> aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine,
> meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern
> border. Homeland Security Report:http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
>
> 12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of
> mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average
> cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period."http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf
>
> 13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back
> to their countries of origin.http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm
>
> 14. Nearly One Million Sex Crimes were Committed by Illegal Immigrants
> In The United States.http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
>
> The total cost is $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS per YEAR
>
> Deportation would be cheaper than maintenance or amnesty for illegals.

Does anyone still support the government in Washington, DC?

ted

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Free Discount Prescription Drug Card
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1b5bb13f473b8d81?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 12:31 pm
From: "news.earthlink.net"

Save average 15% on brand names.
Save average 46% on generic drugs.
Use over and over again.

Go to www.paylessdrugcard.com and print your card for immediate use.
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cellphone battery life
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ca4d0c8b9093ec56?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 2:28 pm
From: Al Bundy

Terry Terry wrote:
> I have a Tracfone. I bought it for emergencies a month ago. The
> instructions say that the phone will withstand temperatures to -10C
> and will hold a charge for 10 days.
>
> They lie.
>
> Because I only use my phone for emergencies, I left my phone in my car
> for two nights. The temperature came near freezing, but did not drop
> to freezing.
>
> The phone battery died.
>
> I took it back. The girl at the counter said that all phones are like
> that. Don't leave the phone in the car. Is she telling the truth or
> should I insist on another phone?

Maybe the battery was bad or not fully charged. Since you only use it
for emergencies, presumably outgoing calls, why not remove or
disconnect the battery when not in use. It should keep it's charge for
weeks or months. I have a couple in a drawer here and I charge them
every 2-3 months, but they are still plenty live enough to make a call
even then. I am speaking about lithium-ion batteries. NI-CAD or NMH
won't hold a charge as long as they have a shorter shelf life.

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 2:33 pm
From: "John Weiss"

"Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote...
> Curious...as a frugal person what did you buy this Christmas?

Nothing.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wholesale NBA Nike Jordan Sports Shoes, Cheap Ugg Timberland Chanel
Gucci Boots at www.globwholesale.com
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/23dbfeac21caeacd?hl=en
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Get Outta Here!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c09214b4db07a6a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 3:11 pm
From: prqview200@yahoo.com.tw

We've all heard the phrase, "no man is an island."

Well, baby, I'm an island.

I'm the closest thing to it.

I'm a rock.

And a rock feels no pain. And an island never cries.

Shielded in my armor. I've got my poetry to protect me.

I touch no one and no one touches me!

I think it's time maybe that I count the average number of times in a
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here!"

I drive to work on Monday, and a guy who should yield pulls his car
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Get outta here!

I pull into a parking lot and at the only parking space left, someone
is standing there, talking to someone else.

Get outta here!

My neighbor, I derisively nicknamed him "Dutch boy"

He's an immigrant from Finland who talks with an accent. All he does
is walk his dog in front of my yard which sets my dog off barking.
Dutch boy is retired, worthless, so all he does is walk his dog, but
only in front of my yard.

Get outta here!

My other neighbor, I nicknamed "Gumdrop" (I have nicknames for all my
neighbors) was told by his doctor to walk each day. He wears a little
elf-like jogging

http://www.dontplayplay.com/html/Humor/20060929/25456.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: RodSpeed, this a laugh
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/86d34aa09cc879fb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jan 16 2008 3:13 pm
From: KarlMarx_MiddleClass_Ipod_HipHop

LOL :

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Sell coupons, go to jail.

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Wednesday, January 16, 2008

24 new messages in 13 topics - digest

25 new messages in 19 topics - digest