Frugal Living: Nov 18, 2009

Wednesday, November 18, 2009

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 14 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* found a site, shipping container and other green stuff - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/c188e775b9c024c3?hl=en
* ｡◕＾◕｡ 2009 Low price Wholesale Nike Air Max shoes at website www.fjrjtrade.
com <Paypal Payment> - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/86cc1ac691592692?hl=en
* Shortage of Doctors - 8 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/259d3006048a5d48?hl=en
* Discount AAA real leather Handbags & Purses wholesale Free shipping (www.
dotradenow.com) - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/27e104283b2fe5df?hl=en
* Subsidy Nonsense Yet Again (The Coherency of Rod Speed) - 2 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/dff28f482d02ae5c?hl=en
* hot-shop - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/922055e37ee8bf54?hl=en
* ｡◕０◕｡ 2009 Discount Nike Jordan shoes at website: www.fjrjtrade.com <paypal
payment> - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d28591cfe41f2380?hl=en
* ♥ ๑♣๑♥ Hot sale Timberland Boots, Edhardy boots and Fashion Lady High heels
www.ecyaya.com FASHION !!! - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/33e303b9cdd19eac?hl=en
* Cheap Wholesale Coach Boots,Chanel Boots,Fendi Boots,Dior Boots,Versace
Boots,Timberland Shoes,GUCCI Boots shoes (www.dotradenow.com) - 2 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e5a15bca4905294a?hl=en
* §§§ Cheap price wholesale LV handbag and purse at WEBSITE: www.fjrjtrade.com
【paypal payment】 - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/81e8c2fecdad116e?hl=en
* （（（（ ۞）））） free shipping wholesale cheap fashionable brands T-shirts
in www.ecyaya.com - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6b42c950a237cf22?hl=en
* @@@@@@ 2009 HOT Sale!!! Cheap wholesale ED Hardy Long Sleeve, G-star Long
Sleeve, LV Long Sleeve, Gucci Long Sleeve ect at www.fjrjtrade.com <Paypal
Payment> - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/7eb595079ed32900?hl=en
* Solar cells for less than 1 USD per Watt - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/b1250060e08f1f1e?hl=en
* Cookware - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1fbe380ec171a5e2?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: found a site, shipping container and other green stuff
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/c188e775b9c024c3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 8:53 pm
From: "sr"

"clams_casino" <PeterGriffin@DrunkinClam.com> wrote in message
news:pk_Lm.29141$X01.19851@newsfe07.iad...
> sr wrote:
>
>>---
>>I am not interested in housing codes, reason for unrestricted land. No
>>codes. Fee will, self responsibility. If it goes wrong, you have only
>>yourself to blame. That's how I live my life, which is getting more
>>difficult as society becomes more and more a "nanny state" putting
>>restrictions on its citizens.
>>
>>
> And pity the poor sucker who may eventually own your (dangerous) piece of
> crap.
>
> Thanks for an excellent example as to why building codes are a necessity.
>
> Of course, it's people like you who have made the need for so many laws of
> protection.
======You are welcom, house is remodeled and standing after all these years,
you are just jealous that someone
is selfsufficient , makes errors, learns from mistakes and takes it to the
next level.
Or, I could just whine and go on the state like the young fellow next door.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ｡◕＾◕｡ 2009 Low price Wholesale Nike Air Max shoes at website www.
fjrjtrade.com <Paypal Payment>
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/86cc1ac691592692?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 12:13 am
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Shortage of Doctors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/259d3006048a5d48?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 1:05 am
From: Samatha Hill -- take out TRASH to reply

The Real Bev wrote:
>
> I don't trust people who make money by NOT providing services :-(

No kidding!

== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 9:00 am
From: "Bob F"

The Real Bev wrote:
> Bob F wrote:
>
>> The Real Bev wrote:
>>> Rod Speed wrote:
>>>> The Real Bev wrote
>>>>
>>>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh (AP article from Washington Post)
>>>>
>>>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the
>>>>> number of students enrolling?
>>>>
>>>> Nope.
>>>
>>> You sure about that?
>>>
>>>>> And doesn't a doctor shortage keep doctors' incomes higher than
>>>>> they would be if there were more competition?
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but there is no doctor shortage.
>>>>
>>>>> And doesn't that contribute to the high cost of medical care?
>>>>
>>>> Nope, because there is no doctor shortage.
>>>
>>> It took me two months to get an appointment with my ophthalmologist,
>>> and then she had to cancel because the tech who does the field tests
>>> got sick. Another 1.5 months. My GP only took a month, but I had
>>> to go back because
>>> SOMEBODY lost my blood and pee. I got in to see the new orthopedist
>>> in 2 weeks, and he schedules surgery 3 weeks in advance. I got
>>> there 15 minutes early for my 9:30 appointment and I didn't
>>> actually see him until 10:30, although I did have an x-ray in the interim.
>>>
>>> A month is typical lead time for an appointmen, and a doc told me
>>> (in strict confidence, of course) that if the patient was out the door
>>> within an hour of the nominal appointment time it was regarded as
>>> "on time". I looked at a gastroenterologist's appointment book once --
>>> he had 4 patients scheduled for each 15 minutes.
>>>
>>> If there were more doctors they would neither have to do nor get
>>> away with shit like that.
>>
>> Either you need to find some new doctors, or you live in a really
>> bad place for doctors.
>
> This is my experience with my own doctors and the doctors of my
> mother and mother-in-law -- between one and two dozen of them over a
> 10-year period. And did I mention the parking situation? There is
> no on-street parking in the "medical district" where all the doctors
> practice, and parking costs between $2 and $4/hour. So in addition
> to hanging out in the waiting room, we also pay for the privilege of
> being sneezed on by strangers.
> We live in Pasadena, CA. Thousands of doctors in all specialties. Within an
> hour's drive of half a dozen major hospitals and at least
> three medical schools.

I think I had a two week wait to get my eyes examined. I frequently can see my
GP within a day, sometimes the same day I call.

== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 10:14 am
From: Cindy Hamilton

On Nov 17, 9:52 pm, The Real Bev <bashley...@gmail.com> wrote:

> This is my experience with my own doctors and the doctors of my mother and
> mother-in-law -- between one and two dozen of them over a 10-year period. And
> did I mention the parking situation? There is no on-street parking in the
> "medical district" where all the doctors practice, and parking costs between $2
> and $4/hour. So in addition to hanging out in the waiting room, we also pay
> for the privilege of being sneezed on by strangers.

Pasadena makes its doctors practice in a ghetto? Doctors here are
free
to practice wherever they can rent or buy space. Sure, it can be
difficult to
park to patronize those who locate downtown, but there are plenty out
in
strip-mall land. Mine is in a little office park a stone's throw from
a freeway
exit, and a mile or two from my office (thus, five or six miles from
my house).
(And there's a coffee shop quite nearby, to tank up after those
fasting blood
draws.)

Wow, I knew Califonia is restrictive, but I had no idea it goes this
far.

> We live in Pasadena, CA. Thousands of doctors in all specialties. Within an
> hour's drive of half a dozen major hospitals and at least three medical schools.

Ann Arbor, Michigan. But I'd only go to the University of Michigan
hospital if I
was unconscious and in an ambulance. Otherwise, it's St. Joe's in
Ypsilanti,
which is probably quicker, anyway, from the places I usually hang out.

Cindy Hamilton

== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 11:56 am
From: "h"

"Cindy Hamilton" <angelicapaganelli@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:5ce5cd40-1bc6-486f-9850-9eadbda9c9d5@c3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 17, 9:52 pm, The Real Bev <bashley...@gmail.com> wrote:

> This is my experience with my own doctors and the doctors of my mother and
> mother-in-law -- between one and two dozen of them over a 10-year period.
> And
> did I mention the parking situation? There is no on-street parking in the
> "medical district" where all the doctors practice, and parking costs
> between $2
> and $4/hour. So in addition to hanging out in the waiting room, we also
> pay
> for the privilege of being sneezed on by strangers.

Wow, I knew Califonia is restrictive, but I had no idea it goes this
far.

> We live in Pasadena, CA. Thousands of doctors in all specialties. Within
> an
> hour's drive of half a dozen major hospitals and at least three medical
> schools.

As someone who has neither health insurance nor a doctor (I was informed
that until I had a "complete physical with blood work" at the cost of
hundreds of $ I was "no longer considered a patient") I go to the local
"urgent care" office. They're open 20 hours a day and they share a practice
with the doctor who fired me as a patient, so at least my records are there.
Granted, I haven't seen any doctor in 10 years (haven't need one) but the
last time it was for a tick bite. I only needed the antibiotics, but I still
had to have at least 5 different doctors and 2 nurses look at the bite,
exclaim, "Wow, that sure is a classic target, must be a tick bite", before I
could get the prescription. The fact that I had actually been able to remove
the tick and had it in a baggie for them to look at didn't even seem to
register. "Umm, yeah, of COURSE it's a tick bite, here's the damn tick!
Where's my 'script?"

I didn't have to make an appointment (you can't, it's walk-in only), waited
about 20 minutes, then walked out with the prescription after paying $75.
The prescription cost another $25, so the whole thing was $100 plus about 25
minutes of wasted time by 5 doctors. What was the point of all that? We have
a seriously screwed up health care system. Anyone who had eyes could have
diagnosed my problem, and antibiotics aren't/shouldn't be that expensive.
What a total waste of time and money. My current plan is to never visit a
doctor ever again. I'm mid-50s, so it's looking pretty good!

== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 4:02 pm
From: Marsha

Bob F wrote:
> I think I had a two week wait to get my eyes examined. I frequently can see my
> GP within a day, sometimes the same day I call.
>

The time it takes me to get into my GP depends on what I tell them my
symptoms are when I call.

Marsha

== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 4:45 pm
From: The Real Bev

Marsha wrote:

> Bob F wrote:
>> I think I had a two week wait to get my eyes examined. I frequently can see my
>> GP within a day, sometimes the same day I call.
>>
> The time it takes me to get into my GP depends on what I tell them my
> symptoms are when I call.

Certainly. If I'm in pain they'll squeeze me in within a day or so, but I'd
just as soon not get a rep for ALWAYS being in pain.

--
Cheers, Bev
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
Nobody needs to speak on behalf of idiots, they manage
to speak entirely too much for themselves already.

== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 4:53 pm
From: The Real Bev

Cindy Hamilton wrote:

> On Nov 17, 9:52 pm, The Real Bev <bashley...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> This is my experience with my own doctors and the doctors of my mother and
>> mother-in-law -- between one and two dozen of them over a 10-year period.
>> And did I mention the parking situation? There is no on-street parking in
>> the "medical district" where all the doctors practice, and parking costs
>> between $2 and $4/hour. So in addition to hanging out in the waiting
>> room, we also pay for the privilege of being sneezed on by strangers.
>
> Pasadena makes its doctors practice in a ghetto? Doctors here are free to
> practice wherever they can rent or buy space.

There are lovely new expensive medical hi-rises clustered near Huntington
Memorial Hospital. This is where most of the specialists practice. Others are
located in convenient free-parking locations, but a distinct minority, and
others are located in more distant medical buildings with expensive parking,
the most expensive of which is $6/hour. For that one I dropped my MIL off at
the front door and found free on-street parking -- limited to one hour, so I
had to jog back to move the car on perhaps half the visits.

> Sure, it can be difficult to
> park to patronize those who locate downtown, but there are plenty out in
> strip-mall land. Mine is in a little office park a stone's throw from a
> freeway exit, and a mile or two from my office (thus, five or six miles from
> my house). (And there's a coffee shop quite nearby, to tank up after those
> fasting blood draws.)

That's why I always get early-morning appointments, but I don't think it really
matters much.

> Wow, I knew Califonia is restrictive, but I had no idea it goes this far.
>
>> We live in Pasadena, CA. Thousands of doctors in all specialties. Within
>> an hour's drive of half a dozen major hospitals and at least three medical
>> schools.
>
> Ann Arbor, Michigan. But I'd only go to the University of Michigan hospital
> if I was unconscious and in an ambulance. Otherwise, it's St. Joe's in
> Ypsilanti, which is probably quicker, anyway, from the places I usually hang
> out.

Based on my experience with the friendly local hospital and local doctor that
killed my mom, I would ALWAYS go to the biggest teaching hospital if there were
any question about the diagnosis. Most especially do not go to a hospital in
the process of seeking out buyers.

And should cancer be a possibility, choose the City of Hope emergency room;
they can't kick you out, but they can prevent you from coming in if your case
doesn't look hopeful.

--
Cheers, Bev
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
Nobody needs to speak on behalf of idiots, they manage
to speak entirely too much for themselves already.

== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 5:24 pm
From: Marsha

The Real Bev wrote:
> Marsha wrote:
>> The time it takes me to get into my GP depends on what I tell them my
>> symptoms are when I call.
>
> Certainly. If I'm in pain they'll squeeze me in within a day or so, but
> I'd just as soon not get a rep for ALWAYS being in pain.
>

Me either. I was just pointing out that doctors are like hair stylists
- they have double scheduling books for <relative> emergencies.

Marsha

==============================================================================
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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/27e104283b2fe5df?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: Subsidy Nonsense Yet Again (The Coherency of Rod Speed)
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==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 1:45 am
From: Jym Dyer

>>> He's actually pretty coherent today. I know Rod very well
>>> from sci.econ.
>> They must love him there.
> You've no idea. I thought he was a 'bot for the longest time.

=v= Well, judging from his contributions to this thread, I'm
not convinced he isn't. It would help if he could, you know,
pass the Turing Test.
<_Jym_>

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 1:56 am
From: Jym Dyer

>> You need to understand that you are attempting to discuss
>> a topic with a troll that lives under an outhouse (thus no
>> costs) - logic / facts will be meaningless.
> Rod Speed ... doesn't live under the outhouse. He lives
> quite comfortably in a nice, suburban house in a nice area.
> Although his parents are hoping that he will move out some
> time before the age of fifty.

=v= I have to admit, I find his _nom_de_'net_ to be very, very
poignant in its obliviousness.

=v= You see, he resembles nothing so much as a car enginew with
a thrown rod. You can try revving and revving it, but you won't
get where you're going nearly as fast as you'd like, and you'll
make a whole lot of worse-than-useless noise along the way.
<_Jym_>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: hot-shop
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/922055e37ee8bf54?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: Solar cells for less than 1 USD per Watt
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/b1250060e08f1f1e?hl=en
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 11:44 am
From: Sustainable Future

Do you know that you can find solar cells for less than 1 USD per Watt
on www.ebay.com ?

Regards.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 1:24 pm
From: Al

On Nov 18, 2:44 pm, Sustainable Future
<sustainable.future...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Do you know that you can find solar cells for less than 1 USD per Watt
> onwww.ebay.com?
>
> Regards.

Interesting, and it sounds cheap, but the cost of a cell in only a
fraction of what one pays. You need storage devices, controllers,
inverters and backup. The payback just is not there in many cases for
the system. We don't get much sun here. The cells would under perform.
That 10¢/KWH still looks pretty good. We were getting power outages
all the time a few years ago. Now they replaced much aging equipment
and it's been trouble free for three years. I like the sun too. I just
can't afford to purchase the sun right now.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cookware
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/1fbe380ec171a5e2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 5:45 pm
From: Marsha

We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the price
or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of cookware really
make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We just want skillets
that last more than a year or two. Thanks for the input.

Marsha

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Nov 18 2009 5:55 pm
From: Vic Smith

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009 20:45:29 -0500, Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:

>We're looking for good quality cookware. Is Calphalon worth the price
>or are you just paying for the name? Does a good set of cookware really
>make a difference? We are not gourmet cooks. We just want skillets
>that last more than a year or two. Thanks for the input.
>
As long as it's not too thin it doesn't make any difference.
Keeping it frugal, you can often get good quality cookware
second-hand. Wife's still using a skillet she bought for 4 bucks at a
used store 12 years ago. Teflon still in good shape.
She's a professional cook.
Another way to save is pick up pieces individually instead of sets.

--Vic

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Google Groups: http://groups.google.com/?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 23 new messages in 13 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 16 2009 10:02 pm
From: The Real Bev

Samatha Hill -- take out TRASH to reply wrote:

> The Real Bev wrote:
>>
>> If all that is true I would think it was actionable and that large
>> medical practices who don't sue ought to. Maybe a class action suit
>> with other medical practices. No hungry lawyers to take a piece of the
>> action?
>
> That's a thought... but I am 100% positive the insurance companies have
> plenty of lawyers to ensure that they have loopholes to fall comfortably
> into.

In theory that's the stuff that judges are supposed to sort out. I believe
that lawyers need doctors more than doctors need lawyers.

> I was just trying to say that the insurance companies are not without
> fault, and the insurance that is run by the federal government is
> actually one of the biggest offenders. I know there are undoubtedly
> doctors out there who are just as bad.

I don't trust people who make money by NOT providing services :-(

--
Cheers, Bev
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime
is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin
is stupidity." -- H.S. Thompson

== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 12:42 am
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote
> Bob F wrote
>> The Real Bev wrote

>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh
>>> (AP article from Washington Post)

>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the number of students enrolling?

>> I have never heard that. So, did he?

> News item, and then nothing.

Which means it was only ever some journalist's lie.

> It doesn't sound unreasonable, does it?

Corse it does, they dont need to be bribed to do that.

> The AMA is just a high-class union, dedicated to enriching its members. Unions traditionally support the Democrats.

And the AMA never has.

== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 12:48 am
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote
> Rod Speed wrote
>> The Real Bev wrote

>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh (AP article from Washington Post)

>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the number of students enrolling?

>> Nope.

> You sure about that?

Yep, if it had ever happened, plenty would have howled about it.

>>> And doesn't a doctor shortage keep doctors' incomes higher than they would be if there were more competition?

>> Yes, but there is no doctor shortage.

>>> And doesn't that contribute to the high cost of medical care?

>> Nope, because there is no doctor shortage.

> It took me two months to get an appointment with my ophthalmologist, and then she had to cancel because the tech who
> does the field tests got sick. Another 1.5 months.

I walked in off the street and got seen straight away.

> My GP only took a month, but I had to go back because SOMEBODY lost my blood and pee.

My GP's practice has someone who can see you the same day.

> I got in to see the new orthopedist in 2 weeks, and he schedules surgery 3 weeks in advance. I got there 15 minutes
> early for my 9:30 appointment and I didn't actually see him until 10:30, although I did have an x-ray in the interim.

> A month is typical lead time for an appointmen,

Not here it aint.

> and a doc told me (in strict confidence, of course) that if the patient was out the door within an hour of the nominal
> appointment time it was regarded as "on time". I looked at a gastroenterologist's appointment book once -- he had 4
> patients scheduled for each 15 minutes.

My GP and cardiologist are nothing like that stupid/gouging.

> If there were more doctors they would neither have to do nor get away with shit like that.

There is no doctor shortage.

== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 4:08 am
From: George

The Real Bev wrote:
> Samatha Hill -- take out TRASH to reply wrote:
>
>> clams_casino wrote:
>> >
>> > Although I'm not aware of shortages in this area, I am aware that many
>> > will not take on new patients. Some just don't want to deal with
>> > medicare & select insurers.
>>
>> There are two sides to the story.
>>
>> I can tell you what the biller at the doctor's office I work at (a
>> specialty practice that gets patients by referral only, not a primary
>> care provider) says about Medicare -- if your claim is not 100%
>> technically accurate and 100% photogenically perfect (e.g., if your
>> printer doesn't print text totally within their OCR boxes), they
>> reject your claim out of hand and you are not allowed to correct it
>> and resubmit.
> ...etc.
>
> If all that is true I would think it was actionable and that large
> medical practices who don't sue ought to. Maybe a class action suit
> with other medical practices. No hungry lawyers to take a piece of the
> action?
>

Maybe but thats the very problem with mega organizations that folks seem
to love so much. They can definitely outgun most everyone. But so what
small is rotten and evil and mega huge with the tremendous power it
brings is a good thing. Just ask all of those huge mega bankers who
screwed so many folks and then had the politicians they own pick our
pockets to bail them out when things went bad for them.

== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 4:11 am
From: George

The Real Bev wrote:
> Samatha Hill -- take out TRASH to reply wrote:
>
>> The Real Bev wrote:
>>>
>>> If all that is true I would think it was actionable and that large
>>> medical practices who don't sue ought to. Maybe a class action suit
>>> with other medical practices. No hungry lawyers to take a piece of
>>> the action?
>>
>> That's a thought... but I am 100% positive the insurance companies
>> have plenty of lawyers to ensure that they have loopholes to fall
>> comfortably into.
>
> In theory that's the stuff that judges are supposed to sort out. I
> believe that lawyers need doctors more than doctors need lawyers.
>

It doesn't work that way. Big giant organizations own lots of
politicians. They pretty much get what they want. Just ask anyone who
has gone up against them. Cutsey little guy triumphs over super giant
mega corp (that everyone loves) is a once every ten year event.

>> I was just trying to say that the insurance companies are not without
>> fault, and the insurance that is run by the federal government is
>> actually one of the biggest offenders. I know there are undoubtedly
>> doctors out there who are just as bad.
>
> I don't trust people who make money by NOT providing services :-(
>

== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 5:16 pm
From: "Bob F"

The Real Bev wrote:
> Bob F wrote:
>
>> The Real Bev wrote:
>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh
>>> (AP article from Washington Post)
>>>
>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the
>>> number of students enrolling?
>>
>> I have never heard that. So, did he?
>
> News item, and then nothing. It doesn't sound unreasonable, does it?
> The AMA is just a high-class union, dedicated to enriching its
> members. Unions traditionally support the Democrats.

Is that the kind of documentation you normally accept as proof?

Yes, it does sound unreasonable. Sort of like a Fox "news" news item.

== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 5:18 pm
From: "Bob F"

The Real Bev wrote:
> Rod Speed wrote:
>
>> The Real Bev wrote
>>
>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh (AP article from Washington Post)
>>
>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the
>>> number of students enrolling?
>>
>> Nope.
>
> You sure about that?
>
>>> And doesn't a doctor shortage keep doctors' incomes higher than
>>> they would be if there were more competition?
>>
>> Yes, but there is no doctor shortage.
>>
>>> And doesn't that contribute to the high cost of medical care?
>>
>> Nope, because there is no doctor shortage.
>
> It took me two months to get an appointment with my ophthalmologist,
> and then she had to cancel because the tech who does the field tests
> got sick. Another 1.5 months. My GP only took a month, but I had to go back
> because
> SOMEBODY lost my blood and pee. I got in to see the new orthopedist
> in 2 weeks, and he schedules surgery 3 weeks in advance. I got there
> 15 minutes early for my 9:30 appointment and I didn't actually see
> him until 10:30, although I did have an x-ray in the interim.
>
> A month is typical lead time for an appointmen, and a doc told me (in
> strict confidence, of course) that if the patient was out the door
> within an hour of the nominal appointment time it was regarded as "on
> time". I looked at a gastroenterologist's appointment book once --
> he had 4 patients scheduled for each 15 minutes.
>
> If there were more doctors they would neither have to do nor get away
> with shit like that.

Either you need to find some new doctors, or you live in a really bad place for
doctors.

== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 6:52 pm
From: The Real Bev

Bob F wrote:

> The Real Bev wrote:
>> Rod Speed wrote:
>>> The Real Bev wrote
>>>
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/yefvczh (AP article from Washington Post)
>>>
>>>> Didn't Bill Clinton offer bribes to medical schools to limit the
>>>> number of students enrolling?
>>>
>>> Nope.
>>
>> You sure about that?
>>
>>>> And doesn't a doctor shortage keep doctors' incomes higher than
>>>> they would be if there were more competition?
>>>
>>> Yes, but there is no doctor shortage.
>>>
>>>> And doesn't that contribute to the high cost of medical care?
>>>
>>> Nope, because there is no doctor shortage.
>>
>> It took me two months to get an appointment with my ophthalmologist,
>> and then she had to cancel because the tech who does the field tests
>> got sick. Another 1.5 months. My GP only took a month, but I had to go back
>> because
>> SOMEBODY lost my blood and pee. I got in to see the new orthopedist
>> in 2 weeks, and he schedules surgery 3 weeks in advance. I got there
>> 15 minutes early for my 9:30 appointment and I didn't actually see
>> him until 10:30, although I did have an x-ray in the interim.
>>
>> A month is typical lead time for an appointmen, and a doc told me (in
>> strict confidence, of course) that if the patient was out the door
>> within an hour of the nominal appointment time it was regarded as "on
>> time". I looked at a gastroenterologist's appointment book once --
>> he had 4 patients scheduled for each 15 minutes.
>>
>> If there were more doctors they would neither have to do nor get away
>> with shit like that.
>
> Either you need to find some new doctors, or you live in a really bad place for
> doctors.

This is my experience with my own doctors and the doctors of my mother and
mother-in-law -- between one and two dozen of them over a 10-year period. And
did I mention the parking situation? There is no on-street parking in the
"medical district" where all the doctors practice, and parking costs between $2
and $4/hour. So in addition to hanging out in the waiting room, we also pay
for the privilege of being sneezed on by strangers.

We live in Pasadena, CA. Thousands of doctors in all specialties. Within an
hour's drive of half a dozen major hospitals and at least three medical schools.

--
Cheers, Bev
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TOPIC: Good News SAVE money for this year Christmasday!
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== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 6:40 am
From: VFW

Yes, Life will go on and the Earth will heal after the human parasites
becomes extinct.
they destroyed the qualities on earth that made their "lives" possible.
the planet will be better for this extinction out of many.
IMHO
--
money; what a concept!

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== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: Subsidy Nonsense Yet Again
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/dff28f482d02ae5c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 10:06 am
From: Cindy Hamilton

On Nov 16, 11:56 pm, Les Cargill <lcargil...@comcast.net> wrote:

> He's actually pretty coherent today. I know Rod very well from sci.econ.

They must love him there.

Cindy Hamilton

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 6:16 pm
From: Les Cargill

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Nov 16, 11:56 pm, Les Cargill <lcargil...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> He's actually pretty coherent today. I know Rod very well from sci.econ.
>
> They must love him there.
>
> Cindy Hamilton

You've no idea. I thought he was a 'bot for the longest time.

--
Les Cargill

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== 1 of 1 ==
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: O.T? the Neo-Con try to con Iraq.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/81a0d378d56bae64?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 5:00 pm
From: VFW

Iraqi Lawmakers Question Oil-Development Deals

By GINA CHON

BAGHDAD‹A handful of lawmakers from the Iraqi parliament's oil and gas
committee on Sunday questioned the legality of petroleum-development
deals signed last week with BP PLC, Exxon Mobil Corp. and other big oil
companies.

The opposition isn't likely to derail the agreement, but it raises the
specter of fresh political uncertainty for foreign oil executives, who
have just recently warmed to the idea of investing in Iraq's vast but
undertapped oil fields. Last week, the Iraqi oil ministry signed initial
deals with consortia led by Exxon and Eni SpA, along with a final
agreement with a consortium headed by BP and China National Petroleum
Corp.

for the rest of this art. visit the Wall St. Journal;

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703808904574523491165534988
.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
--
money; what a concept!
--
money; what a concept!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: America's Greatest Speaker, (51 seconds)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/750ae064f8a5937e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 7:00 pm
From: martin

On Nov 17, 7:48 pm, martin <martin.secrest...@gmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUPK5UOO6pA
>
> Compare this to the drivel coming from Washington, DC!
>
> Martin

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I need you opinion; help me finish my dissertation
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d3a8ec9220b826f0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 7:13 pm
From: jean.jerry@verizon.net

If you could take 10 minutes from your busy schedule to complete my
survey it will help me finish my research. Your opinon and your
knowledge are important.

http://www.kwiksurveys.com/online-survey.php?surveyID=LNEDH_baa961d3

Many thanks in advance.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 8:01 pm
From: "h"

<jean.jerry@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:d64a8c7f-3362-4320-9066-c7184a9d245d@r5g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
> If you could take 10 minutes from your busy schedule to complete my
> survey it will help me finish my research. Your opinon and your
> knowledge are important.
>
Wow! A typo in the subject and another in the two-sentence body. Hope you
didn't pay much for your doctoral coursework. I seriously doubt your
dissertation defense will go well.

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 8:51 pm
From: "sr"

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Nov 17 2009 8:53 pm
From: "sr"

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Frugal Living

Blog Archive

Wednesday, November 18, 2009

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 14 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 23 new messages in 13 topics - digest