Frugal Living: Jun 17, 2010

Thursday, June 17, 2010

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 22 new messages in 9 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Car Rental Question-Help
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/aeefc75f26d7709a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 15 2010 11:20 pm
From: "Clincher"

"Mark Ratner" <RidgemontRat77884@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a8fdf3dc-3dbd-4dc4-989b-f90fb14c731d@i31g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> Hello.
>
> I don't own an automobile but will be renting a car soon for a trip.
> The fact that I don't own a car means that I don't have car insurance,
> either.
>
> I looked at car rates through priceline, and I see that Priceline
> offers $11 a day for collision coverage. Should I get this? Would that
> be all the insurance I'd need in my case?
>
> Or am I better off getting the insurance that the rental company
> offers?
>
> Do I need both collision and liability coverage?

You need liability.

If you cause an accident that sends a bus full of pro football players off a
cliff, you'll also be on the hook for replacing the several hundred million
dollars of earning potential you just destroyed. Collison coverage won't
help you there. Depending on what state you're in, there are also financial
responsibility laws that make it illegal to drive if you don't have $50,000
(or some other big number) on tap to pay for other guy's losses in a timely
fashion. That's where your need for liability insurance comes in as it's the
only feasible way for most drivers to comply with this requirement.

You may not "need" collision if you're rich enough to pay for the rental car
and the loss of use without going into hock. Of course, the rental company
is free to refuse to rent to you if you don't have proof of collision
coverage and arent' willing to buy their CDW.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 5:24 am
From: "h"

"Clincher" <x@x.x> wrote in message
news:cfSdnVY3nLaB8IXRnZ2dnUVZ_vadnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
>
> "Mark Ratner" <RidgemontRat77884@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a8fdf3dc-3dbd-4dc4-989b-f90fb14c731d@i31g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>> Hello.
>>
>> I don't own an automobile but will be renting a car soon for a trip.
>> The fact that I don't own a car means that I don't have car insurance,
>> either.
>>
>> I looked at car rates through priceline, and I see that Priceline
>> offers $11 a day for collision coverage. Should I get this? Would that
>> be all the insurance I'd need in my case?
>>
>> Or am I better off getting the insurance that the rental company
>> offers?
>>
>> Do I need both collision and liability coverage?
>
> You need liability.
>
> If you cause an accident that sends a bus full of pro football players off
> a cliff, you'll also be on the hook for replacing the several hundred
> million dollars of earning potential you just destroyed. Collison coverage
> won't help you there. Depending on what state you're in, there are also
> financial responsibility laws that make it illegal to drive if you don't
> have $50,000 (or some other big number) on tap to pay for other guy's
> losses in a timely fashion. That's where your need for liability insurance
> comes in as it's the only feasible way for most drivers to comply with
> this requirement.
>
> You may not "need" collision if you're rich enough to pay for the rental
> car and the loss of use without going into hock. Of course, the rental
> company is free to refuse to rent to you if you don't have proof of
> collision coverage and arent' willing to buy their CDW.
>
>
Again, the car rental company ALREADY has liability insurance in place or
they wouldn't be able to rent the car. You're covered because the car is
covered. You don't even need to buy the "extra" insurance they offer to be
covered. At least that's how it is in NY.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I have been blessed
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a98b48c0b4a02cde?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 5:39 am
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 16, 2:54 am, Larry <no...@home.com> wrote:
> "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
> Hammock" <nolionnoprob...@yahoo.com> wrote in news:28d82d53-0e27-48ce-
> 8ac7-fbc8d8885...@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Everything around me is a Christian desert, but I enjoy the bushy
> > Garden of Eden. The evil mosquitoes attack me, but I found the
> > solution. Those blood-suckers are as hard to fight as the Christians.
>
> I live on the waterfront here in the South Carolina swamps of
> Charleston. But, you can sit in my HOT (at the moment) yard and hardly
> be bothered by biting insects.
>
> About 40' up the big oak tree that dominates my front yard are four big
> bathouses so stuffed with sleeping bats in the light of day there are
> bats hanging out the bottom of the boxes sleeping attached to the bats
> above by a toenail. How the bats halfway up the inside of the boxes
> even breathe, much less tolerate the 106F heat under my oak tree before
> the thunderstorms today, is another religious mystery.
>
> At a few minutes before dusk, magic happens in my yard as hundreds of
> tiny bats awaken, all at once, and drop out the open bottom of the
> houses from the blackness inside to start another night of rounding up
> every insect that dares venture to fly in the sonar-intense bat-guarded
> perimeter of my yard, probably a couple of miles, or more. If you are
> standing near the tree when the hoard come alive, it's just aweinspiring
> to see and the neighborhood kids never cease to be fascinated by it.
> The bats will come within a hair of touching you, so close you feel them
> passing in the darkness, but their excellent sonar ranging keeps them
> from bumping you in the darkness, at first quite disturbing, especially
> to the superstitious religionists who know about it. They get
> positively creepy over bats.
>
> ONE little bat can eat 10,000 flying mosquitoes in an 8 hour hunting
> night, along with a million other tiny bugs flying in the darkness. My
> bats are so good at what they do, I do not need a yellow porch light to
> keep the bugs away. No chemicals, no electric bug zappers, just the
> Boys in Black scanning the night. We DO, however,havea backup system
> in place that's also quite successful. That white light that runs all
> night (electronic flourescent - 36W) does attract large millers and
> moths to it the bats seem to ignore at times. No problemo! My other
> squadron of green tree frogs spend their days wedged up into the spaces
> around that light sleeping, waiting for the feed store to open up of the
> aforementioned moths. They sit there, stuck to the light, the wall, the
> frame of the door, all nearby the light, with that long, amazingly fast
> tongue, flicking and sticking the moths right out of the sky! You
> simply see them disappear as that tongue is too fast for the human eye
> without the aid of high speed cameras to see.
>
> Now if I could just get the both of them interested in MASSIVE PALMETTO
> BUGS, the giant roaches we breed by the billions running 40mph across
> the patio the size of a size 16 Nike sneaker....THAT would be neat!
>
> --http://www.goveg.com/feat/agriprocessors/responseToOUStatement.asp
> Watch the FULL video. I dare ya! Shechitah barbarians!
>
> Larry

One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
us the bats. ;)

I have solved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
powerful blowing faster that they can fly. It's not a miracle per se,
but it works like one. I was reading all other remedies (other than
DEET) barely work, including citronella.

Adam & Eve must have had a hard time with the mosquitoes on their
naked bodies, unless they had a secret that we don't know.

== 2 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 9:08 am
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 15, 6:59 pm, Phlip <phlip2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-Hammock"
>
> I do believe "Highness" might be the operative word there...
>
> C-:

You may call it "levitation," except for the fact that I'm suspended
by two straps.

Other than that I consider myself as high as ANY human being out
there. But my wisdom is perhaps a little bit deeper based on actual
observation of animal behavior. It's amazing what you can learn! For
example, the lovely birds are afraid of the lazy cat. The cat itself
is nice, but his very presence scares my winged friends, and that's no
good. Sometimes my girlfriend feeds him milk, and I have been mildly
opposed to it. But someday I may decide to kick the cat just to
restore the balance of nature.

I just wished someone could do the same with our predatory drivers, so
I could come out and ride my bike. But there's no one watching over
that.

== 3 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 10:14 am
From: Jim A

On 06/16/2010 01:39 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
> mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
> us the bats. ;)
>
> I have solved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
> powerful blowing faster that they can fly.

Assuming you have to breathe in occasionally, would you not have to blow
more than twice the speed of a mosquito to keep them away, and what can
you do if they're coming at you from all directions?

--
www.slowbicyclemovement.org - enjoy the ride

== 4 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 12:51 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 16, 1:14 pm, Jim A <j...@averyjim.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On 06/16/2010 01:39 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>
> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> > One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
> > mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
> > us the bats. ;)
>
> > I have solved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
> > powerful blowing faster that they can fly.
>
> Assuming you have to breathe in occasionally, would you not have to blow
> more than twice the speed of a mosquito to keep them away, and what can
> you do if they're coming at you from all directions?
>
> --www.slowbicyclemovement.org- enjoy the ride

Oh, the word "fan" should have been in there. 20" fan can blow away
the most determined bloodsuckers.

Notice I'm trying to fight them by natural means.

Think of all the irregular warfare, and tell me how many have been won
with wind. A wind machine may be able to blow the enemy away, at least
in theory.

== 5 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 12:57 pm
From: Jim A

On 06/16/2010 08:51 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> On Jun 16, 1:14 pm, Jim A<j...@averyjim.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 06/16/2010 01:39 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>>
>> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
>>> One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
>>> mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
>>> us the bats. ;)
>>
>>> I have solved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
>>> powerful blowing faster that they can fly.
>>
>> Assuming you have to breathe in occasionally, would you not have to blow
>> more than twice the speed of a mosquito to keep them away, and what can
>> you do if they're coming at you from all directions?
>>
>> --www.slowbicyclemovement.org- enjoy the ride
>
> Oh, the word "fan" should have been in there. 20" fan can blow away
> the most determined bloodsuckers.
>
> Notice I'm trying to fight them by natural means.
>
> Think of all the irregular warfare, and tell me how many have been won
> with wind. A wind machine may be able to blow the enemy away, at least
> in theory.

ISTR there were three little pigs who eventually found a response to
that one.

--
www.slowbicyclemovement.org - enjoy the ride

== 6 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 1:03 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 16, 3:57 pm, Jim A <j...@averyjim.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On 06/16/2010 08:51 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>
>
>
> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> > On Jun 16, 1:14 pm, Jim A<j...@averyjim.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> >> On 06/16/2010 01:39 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>
> >> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> >>> One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
> >>> mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
> >>> us the bats. ;)
>
> >>> I have solved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
> >>> powerful blowing faster that they can fly.
>
> >> Assuming you have to breathe in occasionally, would you not have to blow
> >> more than twice the speed of a mosquito to keep them away, and what can
> >> you do if they're coming at you from all directions?
>
> >> --www.slowbicyclemovement.org-enjoy the ride
>
> > Oh, the word "fan" should have been in there. 20" fan can blow away
> > the most determined bloodsuckers.
>
> > Notice I'm trying to fight them by natural means.
>
> > Think of all the irregular warfare, and tell me how many have been won
> > with wind. A wind machine may be able to blow the enemy away, at least
> > in theory.
>
> ISTR there were three little pigs who eventually found a response to
> that one.
>

Don't treat it like a toy. I can carry this thing to the park and keep
the homeless away...

http://www.jmfx.net/products/42

== 7 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 1:12 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

See what I mean, the war against the Scottish midges has seen the wind
machine in action...

(I bet you didn't know the enemy was so close)

THEY have prevailed for more than 6,000 years, inflicting misery on
all who invade their territory - from hardy neolithic farmers to
Hollywood heartthrobs. And the bad news is that the enduring problem
of the mighty Scots midge midge, name for any of numerous minute,
fragile flies in several families.

*Janis Hedley contacted an American special effects company called
Snowboy and ordered a 5.5hp petrol-driven wind machine, which
literally blows the midges away. It is fairly noisy and no beauty, but
since last August the machine has successfully blown millions of
midges to kingdom come.*

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/WAR+ON+THE+MIDGE%3B+Secret+weapons+in+6,000-year+battle+against+scourge+...-a0119078456

== 8 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 1:25 pm
From: Jim A

On 06/16/2010 09:12 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> See what I mean, the war against the Scottish midges has seen the wind
> machine in action...
>
> (I bet you didn't know the enemy was so close)
>
> THEY have prevailed for more than 6,000 years, inflicting misery on
> all who invade their territory - from hardy neolithic farmers to
> Hollywood heartthrobs. And the bad news is that the enduring problem
> of the mighty Scots midge midge, name for any of numerous minute,
> fragile flies in several families.
>
> *Janis Hedley contacted an American special effects company called
> Snowboy and ordered a 5.5hp petrol-driven wind machine, which
> literally blows the midges away. It is fairly noisy and no beauty, but
> since last August the machine has successfully blown millions of
> midges to kingdom come.*
>
> http://www.thefreelibrary.com/WAR+ON+THE+MIDGE%3B+Secret+weapons+in+6,000-year+battle+against+scourge+...-a0119078456

Thanks for the tip. I'll tell my sister in Scotland. :-)

--
www.slowbicyclemovement.org - enjoy the ride

== 9 of 9 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 1:32 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 16, 4:25 pm, Jim A <j...@averyjim.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On 06/16/2010 09:12 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>
>
>
> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> > See what I mean, the war against the Scottish midges has seen the wind
> > machine in action...
>
> > (I bet you didn't know the enemy was so close)
>
> > THEY have prevailed for more than 6,000 years, inflicting misery on
> > all who invade their territory - from hardy neolithic farmers to
> > Hollywood heartthrobs. And the bad news is that the enduring problem
> > of the mighty Scots midge midge, name for any of numerous minute,
> > fragile flies in several families.
>
> > *Janis Hedley contacted an American special effects company called
> > Snowboy and ordered a 5.5hp petrol-driven wind machine, which
> > literally blows the midges away. It is fairly noisy and no beauty, but
> > since last August the machine has successfully blown millions of
> > midges to kingdom come.*
>
> >http://www.thefreelibrary.com/WAR+ON+THE+MIDGE%3B+Secret+weapons+in+6...
>
> Thanks for the tip. I'll tell my sister in Scotland. :-)
>
> --www.slowbicyclemovement.org- enjoy the ride

Before you use *the other weapons*...

On Jun 16, 4:01 pm, Larry <no...@home.com> wrote:
> "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
> Hammock" <nolionnoprob...@yahoo.com> wrote in news:3688f6d0-5b98-4b6b-
> 853d-d91d5ae6f...@z10g2000yqb.googlegroups.com:
>
> > One of mysteries of the Universe is "Why the hell God created the
> > mosquitoes?" But then you remind me that he was clever enough to give
> > us the bats. ;)
>
> > Ihavesolved my problem though by a very mundane method. Very
> > powerful blowing faster that they can fly. It's not a miracle per se,
> > but it works like one. I was reading all other remedies (other than
> > DEET) barely work, including citronella.
>
> > Adam & Eve musthavehad a hard time with the mosquitoes on their
> > naked bodies, unless they had a secret that we don't know.
>
> Blind, mosquitoes detect you with two physical properties. You're warm,
> theyhavea thermometer. You emit a cloud of stinky sweat from your
> body's evaporative air conditioning system out there in the heat. Ever
> notice how much more you get bit when it's warm? You sweat more and
> make detection much easier. If the wind is blowing, the misquitoes come
> at you from the lee side as the wind blows your heat/moisture cloud away
> from you. In calm, the cloud goes nearly straight up for a long ways.
> Mosquitoes simply fly around scanning the area for an animal target
> meeting the criteria and follow the cloud to the target. Evolutionary
> genius, not some imaginary friend of the Pope.
>
> Anything you do to screw up the cloud's parameters, like put on a
> "repellant", which clouds the moisture in the cloud with oils and
> chemicals to help prevent detection by overhead bugs, slows them down,
> but they adapt quite well. A big blower blowing the cloud and mixing it
> with the air prevents detection.
>
> Now, some smart humanshavecome up with a fake animal running on
> electric and propane that lures the mosquito into a fan trap with heat,
> from a propane burner, and moisture. The bugs see a huge target that
> must be a dinosaur on the patio and go buzzing off to eat lunch, only to
> find a fan sucks them into a bag at the "target". That thing will clean
> a yard for the party in about an hour after first firing it up. Works
> great and the bugshaveNO DEFENSES for it as it mimics the primary
> target perfectly.
>
> The propane trap also emits CO2, further mimicing the target animals.
> The electric ones don't and don't work as well because of it. The bugs
> can detect CO2 near the target for "target verification".
>
> http://www.consumersearch.com/mosquito-traps
>
> Pricey....and a little pricey to operate, but NO BUGS CAN BE WORTH IT!
>
> --http://www.goveg.com/feat/agriprocessors/responseToOUStatement.asp
> Watch the FULL video. I dare ya! Shechitah barbarians!
>
> Larry

Amazing facts about those bloodsuckers. It's like getting to know the
private life of bankers and politicians. ;)

Anyway, I have momentarily found a sweat spot where they are simply
blown away. What weapon of those above will lead to their ultimate
defeat? I have power access.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Big Short, inside the doomsday machine.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/7a5ccd8e6ccb4bc4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 5:59 am
From: mg

. . .
>
> One of the other causative factors noted was the public ownership of
> some Wall Street firms. The point was made that no privately owned
> firm would have ever subjected itself to the risks of 35 to 1
> leverage. But to subject shareholders and the country and the system
> to the risks of 35 to 1 risk - no problem.
>
> But hey - don't take my word for it. Read it.
>
> cole

As I recall, Bush actually allowed them to leverage at a ratio up to
40 to 1, from something like 20 to 1, I think. Then when they failed,
he bailed them out. Here are some excerpts from his bailout speech:

"We've seen triple-digit swings in the stock market. Major financial
institutions have teetered on the edge of collapse, and some have
failed. As uncertainty has grown, many banks have restricted lending,
credit markets have frozen, and families and businesses have found it
harder to borrow money.

We're in the midst of a serious financial crisis, and the federal
government is responding with decisive action.
. . .

So I propose that the federal government reduce the risk posed by
these troubled assets and supply urgently needed money so banks and
other financial institutions can avoid collapse and resume lending.
. . .

With the situation becoming more precarious by the day, I faced a
choice, to step in with dramatic government action or to stand back
and allow the irresponsible actions of some to undermine the financial
security of all.

I'm a strong believer in free enterprise, so my natural instinct is to
oppose government intervention. I believe companies that make bad
decisions should be allowed to go out of business.

Under normal circumstances, I would have followed this course. But
these are not normal circumstances. The market is not functioning
properly. There has been a widespread loss of confidence, and major
sectors of America's financial system are at risk of shutting down.

The government's top economic experts warn that, without immediate
action by Congress, America could slip into a financial panic and a
distressing scenario would unfold.

More banks could fail, including some in your community. The stock
market would drop even more, which would reduce the value of your
retirement account. The value of your home could plummet. Foreclosures
would rise dramatically.
. . .

I know that an economic rescue package will present a tough vote for
many members of Congress. It is difficult to pass a bill that commits
so much of the taxpayers' hard-earned money.
. . .

Under our proposal, the federal government would put up to $700
billion taxpayer dollars on the line to purchase troubled assets that
are clogging the financial system."

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message615581/pg1

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Remove coffee stains on plastic carafe
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/08b5ef0add319fe8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 6:32 am
From: "jcage@lycos.com"

I have a great hamilton beach coffee maker that uses a heavy plastic
plastic carafe to show how much is left in the pot as you push your
cup into this little station to be filled.

Trouble is, after a while the stains start to get pretty back over the
viewing window so I'm looking for a fairly non-abrasive means of
getting those stains off. Gentle baking soda scrub ???

Any ideas are very much appreciated.

TIA

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 11:14 am
From: "Rod Speed"

jcage@lycos.com wrote:

> I have a great hamilton beach coffee maker that uses a heavy
> plastic plastic carafe to show how much is left in the pot as
> you push your cup into this little station to be filled.

> Trouble is, after a while the stains start to get pretty back over the
> viewing window so I'm looking for a fairly non-abrasive means of
> getting those stains off. Gentle baking soda scrub ???

> Any ideas are very much appreciated.

Try bleach. Let it stand in the carafe overnight, diluted about 5:1

That works fine for white coffee and tea cups.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 12:58 pm
From: dan

jcage@lycos.com wrote:
> I have a great hamilton beach coffee maker that uses a heavy plastic
> plastic carafe to show how much is left in the pot as you push your
> cup into this little station to be filled.
>
> Trouble is, after a while the stains start to get pretty back over the
> viewing window so I'm looking for a fairly non-abrasive means of
> getting those stains off. Gentle baking soda scrub ???
>
> Any ideas are very much appreciated.
>
> TIA

Try Trisodium Phosphate, i.e. dishwasher powder. Dissolve some in hot
water and let it stand in the carafe over night.

/dan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What's the most overpriced used item you've seen for sale lately?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/c0e087b29491fbfd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 7:41 am
From: "Bill"

>
> What's the most overpriced thing you've seen lately?
>

I saw an old computer at Goodwill for $125.00!

These are free at the dump and pretty much about $10/$20 elsewhere.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Derivatives are a hotbed of abuses and bailouts, why are taxpayers
footing the bill?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/7191c1976ed82dcd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 8:35 am
From: tripletask@gmail..com

On Wed, 16 Jun 2010 11:24:24 -0400, lil abner <@daisy.mae> wrote:

>http://www.veteranstoday.com/2010/06/14/derivatives-are-a-hotbed-of-abuses-and-bailouts-why-are-taxpayers-footing-the-bill/

Because we have failing political and economic systems. Big "bagel
benders" have a death grip on Congress and the Executive. Be very,
very, careful in this market. Or perhaps stick with cash. If you think
2010 has been tough experts are very alarmed about 2011.

cole

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hey You Deadbeat Foreclosure Walk-Aways! YOU STILL OWE WHAT YOU DIDN'T
PAY!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/c67a66bbf1fe29ae?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 10:41 am
From: "Palin'sWormyAnus"

YOU'LL NEVER ESCAPE THE LONG ARM OF YOUR BANK!

AND YOU'LL BE DEADBEATS FOREVER!

YA-YA-YA-YA-YAH!

============
"Lenders go after money lost in foreclosures"

By Dina ElBoghdady
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, June 16, 2010; A11

After the bank foreclosed on Fernando Palacios's Gainesville home in
March, he thought he was done with what he described as the most
stressful financial situation of his life.

The bank sold the home for far less than Palacios owed on it, as often
happens with foreclosures. What Palacios did not see coming was the
letter from his lender demanding that he pay the shortfall:
$148,064.02. "I really thought I was through with this house," said
Palacios, who fell behind on payments when the economy soured and his
cleaning business stumbled.

Over the past year, lenders have become much more aggressive in trying
to recoup money lost in foreclosures and other distressed sales,
creating more grief for people who thought their real estate headaches
were far behind.

In many localities -- including Virginia, Maryland and the District --
lenders have the right to pursue borrowers whose homes have sold at a
loss to collect the difference between what the property sold for and
what the borrower owed on it, also called a deficiency.

Before the housing bust, when the volume of foreclosures was
relatively low, lenders seldom bothered to chase after deficiencies
because borrowers had few remaining assets to claim and doing so
involved hassles and costs. But with foreclosures soaring, lenders are
more determined to get their money back, especially if they suspect
borrowers are skipping out on loan they could afford, an increasingly
common practice in areas where home values have tanked.

Palacios said he was committed to staying in his house, which he
bought in 2005. He sunk $20,000 into improving it and hoped to raise
his children there. But his lender refused to modify his loan, he
said. To avoid personal liability for the deficiency, Palacios is
filing for bankruptcy protection, as many people do who are in similar
situations, said Nancy Ryan, his bankruptcy attorney.

"I am definitely seeing more people come through my door who walked
away from houses a year or two ago and thought they were as free as
the dead," Ryan said. "They're stunned when they realize they're not."

Several lenders contacted for this story declined to say how often
they pursue deficiencies. But many said they try to collect the debt
if they conclude the borrower can repay all or part of it.

"Lenders are not going after people who face a hardship," said John
Mechem, a spokesman for the Mortgage Bankers Association. "If they
can't pay their mortgage because they have a loss of income, there is
no point in going after them."

Those who had a second mortgage, such as a home-equity line of credit,
in addition to their primary mortgage may find themselves particularly
vulnerable, especially if they tapped into the equity line for cash.

Second lenders are last in line to get paid when a distressed property
is sold. There's usually little or no money left over for them, making
it more likely that they will pursue large deficiencies, several
attorneys said.

Gretchen Somers said she and her husband understood the risks last
year when they completed a "short sale," a transaction that allowed
them to sell their Manassas home for about $150,000 less than they
owed on it. But they felt they had no other options.

Somers said her family hung onto the house as long as possible. They
tried but failed to sell it when her husband was transferred to
Arizona for his job in early 2006, just as home prices were softening.
They moved back into the house then tried to sell it again in 2008,
after their adjustable-rate mortgage reset and their monthly mortgage
payment nearly doubled. But home prices had plunged further by then,
making it even tougher to sell.

Last year, their first lender and their home-equity line lender
granted permission for the short sale. But the second lender reserved
the right to come after the couple. Six months later, a collection
agency called demanding $85,000 for related losses.

In hindsight, Somers said she and her husband should have just walked
away from the house. "We took care of the house because we wanted it
to sell," Somers said. "If they were going to come after us anyway, we
shouldn't have done them the favor of making sure it looked good and
cutting the grass even after we moved out, We should have mailed them
the key and said: 'Here you go.' "

Carlos Cortez and his wife managed to escape that fate after their
second lender came after them for $70,000 when their short sale was
completed on his Manassas Park townhouse in 2008.

Cortez knew that was a possibility, but he went through with the sale
because his real estate agent said the lender was engaging in scare
tactics.

James Scruggs, an attorney at Legal Services of Northern Virginia,
said the lender appears to have backed off after Cortez argued that
that the loan officer falsely qualified him and his wife for a home-
equity line by fabricating key details about their finances.

A handful of states do not allow lenders to pursue deficiencies, nor
does a federal program that took effect April 10. Lenders
participating in that initiative are paid for approving short sales
and as a condition, they cannot go after outstanding debt.

In many states, lenders can go after deficiencies, though laws vary
widely, said John Rao, an attorney at the National Consumer Law
Center. Some states limit how long the banks have to file a claim or
collect the debt. Others may calculate deficiencies based on the fair-
market value of the house, Rao said. For instance, if a home sells for
$200,000 yet its fair market value is $250,000, "the borrower who owes
$240,000 on the mortgage would not have a deficiency," he said.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/15/AR2010061505428.html?hpid=topnews

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 2:10 pm
From: jeffj@panix.com (Jeff Jonas)

>YOU'LL NEVER ESCAPE THE LONG ARM OF YOUR BANK!
>AND YOU'LL BE DEADBEATS FOREVER!
>"Lenders go after money lost in foreclosures"

How about going after the USD $3-4 BILLION lost
when Tishman Speyer Properties and BlackRock Realty
"wrote off its investment" in Stuyvesant Town and Peter Cooper Village.
...
On Jan. 8, the owners defaulted on $4.4 billion in loans

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/26/nyregion/26stuy.html

Tishman's "Strategic Default" on Stuyvesant Town
http://blogs.wsj.com/developments/2010/01/25/tishmans-strategic-default-on-stuyvesant-town/

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 7:56 pm
From: Beam Me Up Scotty

Obama has their back....

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Top 10 iPhone apps
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a85ce131db3ede40?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 10:46 am
From: Rocky

There are literally hundreds of thousands of iPhone apps, many of
which are free to download. So what are the best ones? It depends on
what you like to do with your iPhone, but these are 10 of the most
popular (and useful!).

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Simple hack to get $600 to your home.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/9db380d456eb33dc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Jun 16 2010 5:06 pm
From: get money

Simple hack to get $600 to your home
at http://lifeisbeatiful.co.cc

Due to high security risks,i have hidden the cheque link in an
image. in that website on left side below search box, click on image
and enter your name and address where you want to receive your
cheque.please dont tell to anyone.

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