Frugal Living: Oct 13, 2009

Tuesday, October 13, 2009

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

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TOPIC: I remember back when...
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/32a108e42a16b497?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:17 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote
> hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote
>> The Real Bev <bashley101+et@gmail.com> wrote

>>> This was a good group. Looks like the recent spate of political crap has even discouraged Rod from posting.

>>> It's a fucking shame that people are as stupid as they are.

>> There is not a smidgen of doubt in my mind that when that famous
>> internet search engine bought out deja, there was every intention of
>> killing usenet.

No wonder its completely unemployable.

> OTOH, I think just letting deja die, which is what was happening,
> would have accomplished that more quickly. I think the people at
> google at that time LIKED usenet and regarded it as valuable. At
> least I'd LIKE to think that.

Corse they did. Thats why they allowed posting to usenet.

And while that is a problem spam wise, its also where
the absolute vast bulk of the new posters have come from.

>> There is no profit to be made with it, there is little control, and as far as providers, the RIAA and music industry,
>> the government, and so on, it is something that all of them wish would just go away.

> It costs the ISPs money for a decreasing number of users, so add them to the list. I complained to Charter about
> their lousy usenet
> service and there wasn't a single helpdroid (even the ones without
> Indian accents) who knew what usenet is. One guy thought it was that extra-cost satellite internet service that they
> didn't support. I'm surprised that nobody told me it was the evil entity in the
> Terminator movies, but I only talked to a dozen people or so.

>> If someone told me that Rod was getting a supplemental check for services rendered, it wouldn't surprise me. If the
>> shoe spam was somehow sanctioned, it wouldn't surprise me.

> I haven't been getting a lot of that since I switched to
> eternal-september. I also added whatever filters I could
> (Thunderbird doesn't allow an awful lot of filter options). I like E-T.

>> If the cross-posting was
>> done with malicious intent, it wouldn't surprise me. Not saying that
>> any of those are absolutely happening, but I am saying that there is
>> a HUGE amount of money that does not want unfettered, unmoderated,
>> free speech and sharing. Welcome to the 21st century. Sig Heil and
>> newspeak!

> Those who don't know about memory holes should learn.

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TOPIC: There is no "right" to health care
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e14cb160c2e4a0dd?hl=en
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== 1 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:43 pm
From: tmclone

On Oct 13, 1:01 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 03:28:07 -0700, tmclone wrote:
> > On Oct 12, 1:14 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >> On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 06:23:44 -0700, tmclone wrote:
> >> > What a moron. I'm a female homeowner in my 50s and I own my own
> >> > business. I'm a self-employed, life-long democrat. I have lots of
> >> > assests, but I still can't afford health insurance. It's more than my
> >> > mortgage payment with a deductible I could never meet. You lose.
>
> >>https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/individual-health-insurance
>
> >> Says it will cost you $106 per month. So unless you don't have a
> >> mortgage you are jerking us around. As to "meeting" your deductible,
> >> that is irrelevant. Insurance is to protect assets. In that view the
> >> poor don't actually need insurance because they get care in the
> >> emergency rooms and they have no assets.
>
> >>http://www.ehealthlink.com/Washington/IndivRates.asp
>
> >> In Washington state if you are uninsurable it will cost you $400 a
> >> month and again you would need to have a very small mortgage indeed.
>
> > The cheapest insurance I can find (NY) is $500 a month. I bought my
> > house in 1985, and yes, that's more than my mortgage payment. A LOT more
> > than my mortgage payment. If NY wasn't such a nanny state requiring all
> > insurance to be "full-boat" HMO-style, I could just buy catastrophic
> > coverage for things like a heart attack or cancer. I couldn't care less
> > about "well-care" or regular check-ups because I don't do that stuff. I
> > didn't waste my time on that even when I did have insurance 10 years
> > ago. I don't believe in seeing a doctor unless something is actually
> > wrong, like a broken bone, uncontrolled bleeding, etc. Of course, YMMV
> > if you don't have good genes. In my family, on both sides, we die in our
> > beds in our late early 90s. One great-grandfather died of lung cancer in
> > his 50s, but he smoked, so that doesn't count.
>
> As far as I can determine you are selling a load of horse crap. I simply
> do not believe any personal claims. If you want to cite some reputable
> rate tables or such then do so. Your health insurance in the State of
> Massachusetts, which is another "socialized" insurance state,
> would be $288 a month. I live in Washington state. But most insurance
> information is on line in every state. Please provide a rate table for
> New York for healthy people like yourself. I will also say that if you
> are a low income person than both states provide a very good rate less
> than the $288.
>

I don't give a shit what you "believe". I made $500 too much last year
to qualify for the $200/month "Healthy NY" subsidized insurance. I
either make too much, too little, have no children, own a house, own a
business, you name it, I'm screwed because of it. One insurance
company told me outright that because I'm still "of childbearing age"
I'm uninsurable for less than $5500/month. Okay, the fact that I had a
tubal 25 years ago (I'm childfree) should counter that, but it
doesn't. And exactly why the fuck should I waste my time provided info
that you neither need nor care about. PLONK!

== 2 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:27 pm
From: Marsha

JohnDoe@BadISP.org wrote:
> Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:
>> Reading comprehension 101 - I didn't say he wasn't telling the truth. I
>> was alluding to the supposedly poor person who couldn't afford the meds,
>> but manages to smoke two packs a day and get his daily allotment of
>> alcohol. Happens a lot.
>
> Maybe logic is your problem. If he's spent all his money on smokes and
> alcohol he can't afford his meds can he?
>

OMG, now I know for sure you're an idiot. Buhbye.

Marsha

== 3 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:47 pm
From: Topaz

by Frank Roman
and Debbie O'Connor

THE TRAGEDY unfolding before us is the planned disappearance of the
White race through the process of racial blending and replacement.
The corporate media and the bought politicians define any resistance
to this tragedy as "evil racism." According to them, we are not
allowed to resist the continuing obliteration of our race, but are
ordered to appreciate it.

Sometimes this situation can result in discouragement. But then, out
of nowhere, a sign appears that we are actually making a difference
for our people. The most recent sign of progress comes in the form
of a lady from middle Tennessee who contacted your host following
the April 15th Frankly Speaking broadcast entitled "Girls and Women:
Stay True to Yourselves." As a wonderful postscript to that
well-received program I am presenting to you the thoughts and
insights of another racially aware woman, Debbie O'Connor:

"Hello ladies. My name is Debbie O'Connor. I am a mother and a
grandmother. I reside in middle Tennessee and I have a message for
you, woman to woman. I want to start by saying I am very grateful
for National Vanguard's work; and for Frank Roman allowing me to
speak with you about a subject that is of great concern to me and
ought to be important to you.
"First, I was raised in the South and taught to respect everyone who
in turn respected me regardless of their race. I was taught that
needless conflict should not be a way of life for me or anyone else
with good sense. Secondly, I was taught not to cross any racial
lines by dating or becoming involved with men who were not White. As
I matured, I came to cherish the normal gravitation toward my own
race that Nature had intended. Those were different times we lived
in and it went without saying that racial mixing for White women was
out of the question-and I passed that way of life on to my children.

"Compared to what your television, some of your peers, and the
schools tell you this sounds 'outdated' and 'stuffy.' But when you
consider what racial mixing does in the long term it begins to make
more sense. Barely a day goes by I do not see young White girls and
grown White women with mixed race children; children that have no
true racial identity. This, ladies, is a deviation from Nature-
because it kills your valuable European bloodline.
"Deep down inside your maternal soul, you know this is wrong.
"Do you really want your daughter or granddaughter to come home from
the hospital with a mixed race baby that will never be accepted by
its peers of either race? After all, a Black couple can no more give
birth to a White baby than a White couple can give birth to a Black
baby. The reason is because each race was created within a divine
plan; to fulfill its own destiny as only that race is capable of
doing. This is a law of Nature.
"Too many among the present generation of young Whites are
committing racial suicide. I am deeply saddened to see White women
and mothers denying their own maternal instincts for racial survival.
"Consider this: Deep within your womanly intuition, do you honestly
believe that the precious White child with which you have been
blessed is literally no different than a non-White child? Do you
really believe it is a good thing to allow a White child's physical
and spiritual being to eventually merge into an
African-Mexican-Third-World mass?

"Like my friend, National Vanguard's Frank Roman, once said: 'What
could possibly be uplifting about biracial children, loss of
identity, and the corruption of two distinct gene pools?'
"Ladies, even as we speak, census data show that 45 percent of
children under age five are now from a racial 'minority.' And
non-Whites are taught by their parents to honor their race-while
White children are not. Unless something is done now the future of
White children is in terrible danger.

"Are you-by your words, your acts, or your silence-teaching
your child that White identity and White heritage are trivial? To
all the women who can hear me, remember: There is a heavy
responsibility that goes along with being a White mother. It has
nothing to do with 'hate.' It has everything to do with nurturing
your child, helping your child reach his or her true destiny, and
continuing our very identity into a future that will be so much
better with you and your child in it."
The world is indeed a much better place with people like Debbie
O'Connor in it. And our race is blessed as she continues to uphold
the very essence of morality and honor inherent in our people.

If more White parents would direct their children to the upward
path, teaching them that racial self-determination is the highest
value of all, the very pinnacle of morality-then, and only then,
will our people have a future: not only surviving, but flourishing
as the rightful heirs of their own destiny.

http://www.ihr.org/ www.vanguardnewsnetwork.com/

http://www.natvan.com http://www.nsm88.org

http://heretical.com/ http://immigration-globalization.blogspot.com/

== 4 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:51 pm
From: Topaz

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 09:33:54 -0700 (PDT), Lisa Lisa
<harryharry52@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>Look how the racial issue keeps cropping up in the health care debate.

Well it is about Whites giving even more to the Blacks who hate them.

>
>It's my opinion that resistance to a more rational system is mostly
>rooted in racial attitudes. Some bigoted white people would rather
>blow money on CEOs, redundant employees and paperwork than direct it
>towards the actual delivery of services.

Can't be many of those. Everyone wants the actual delivery.

> I do believe they'd even be
>willing to bring down the country rather than mainstream blacks.
>They're THAT bigoted.
>

Preserving the White race is more important than mere money.

http://www.ihr.org/ www.vanguardnewsnetwork.com/

http://www.natvan.com http://www.nsm88.org

http://heretical.com/ http://immigration-globalization.blogspot.com/

== 5 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:53 pm
From: Topaz

During World War Two the Germans put Jews and Communists in
concentration camps. The USA locked also up the Japanese and their
political opponents and for less reason. At the end of the war there
was a lot of deaths in the German camps from disease and starvation
because Germany was being bombed to rubble. There is no evidence that
the Germans had gas chambers or an extermination plan.

Newsweek magazine May 15, 1989 says on page 64:

"the way the Nazis did things: the secrecy, the unwritten orders, the
destruction of records and the innocent-sounding code names for the
extermination of the Jews. Perhaps it was inevitable that historians
would quarrel over just what happened"

The real reason there are no records of an extermination plan is
because there was no extermination plan. The Germans planned to deport
the Jews out of Germany. The records show that they planned to move
them to Madagascar.

Here is part of the Leuchter Report:

"Thirty-one samples were selectively removed from the alleged gas
chambers at Kremas I, II, III, IV and V. A control sample was taken
from delousing facility #1 at Birkenau. The control sample was removed
from a delousing chamber in a location where cyanide was known to have
been used and was apparently present as blue staining. Chemical
testing of the control sample #32 showed a cyanide content of 1050
mg/kg, a very heavy concentration. The conditions at areas from which
these samples were taken are identical with those of the control
sample, cold, dark, and wet. Only Kremas IV and V differed, in the
respect that these locations had sunlight (the buildings have been
torn down) and sunlight may hasten the destruction of uncomplexed
cyanide. The cyanide combines with the iron in the mortar and brick
and becomes ferric-ferro-cyanide or prussian blue pigmentation, a very
stable iron-cyanide complex.

"The locations from which the analyzed samples were removed are set
out in Table III.

"It is notable that almost all the samples were negative and that the
few that were positive were very close to the detection level
(1mg/kg); 6.7 mg/kg at Krema III; 7.9 mg/kg at Krerma I. The absence
of any consequential readings at any of the tested locations as
compared to the control sample reading 1050 mg/kg supports the
evidence that these facilities were not execution gas chambers. The
small quantities detected would indicate that at some point these
buildings were deloused with Zyklon B - as were all the buildings at
all these facilities"

Professional holocaust believers have admitted that the "gas chamber"
which is shown to the tourists at Auschwitz was actually built by the
allies after the war was over. This is what they wrote:
Brian Harmon <harmon@msg.ucsf.edu> wrote in article
<080620000051136373%harmon@msg.ucsf.edu>...
"You're confusing Krema I with Kremas II-V. Krema I is a
reconstruction, this has never been a secret. Kremas II-V are in
their demolished state as they were left."
Charles Don Hall <cdhall-nospam@erols.com> wrote in article
<8F4CB71B7NukuNuku@news.erols.com>...
"Certainly not! The word "fake" implies a deliberate attempt to
deceive.
"The staff of the Auschwitz museum will readily explain that the Nazis
tried to destroy the gas chambers in a futile attempt to conceal their
crimes. And they'll tell you that reconstruction was done later on. So
it would be dishonest for me to call it a "fake". I'll cheerfully
admit that it's a "reconstruction" if that makes you happy."
They admit that the "gas chamber" shown to the tourists at Auschwitz
was built by the allies after the war was over. There is no physical
evidence that the Germans had gas chambers. No bodies of people who
died from gas have been found. The Communists were the first to enter
the camps. How do the other allies know the Communists didn't blow up
the buildings? Then they could claim that these demolished buildings
used to be gas chambers.

But then the believers will say the Germans confessed. Their main
confession is from Hoess. Here are the details:
"In the introduction to Death Dealer [Buffalo: Prometheus, 1992], the
historian Steven Paskuly wrote: "Just after his capture in 1946, the
British Security Police were able to extract a statement from Hoess by
beating him and filling him with liquor." Paskuly was reiterating what
Rupert Butler and Bernard Clarke had already described.
In 1983, Rupert Butler published an unabashed memoir (Legions of
Death, Hamlyn: London) describing in graphic detail how, over three
days, he and Clarke and other British policemen managed to torture
Hoess into making a "coherent statement." According to Butler [Legions
of Death, p. 237], he and the other interrogators put the boots to
Hoess the moment he was captured. For starters, Clarke struck his face
four times to get Höess to reveal his true identity.
<quote>
The admission suddenly unleashed the loathing of Jewish sergeants in
the arresting party whose parents had died in Auschwitz following an
order signed by Höss.

The prisoner was torn from the top bunk, the pajamas ripped from his
body. He was then dragged naked to one of the slaughter tables, where
it seemed to Clarke the blows and screams were endless.
Eventually, the Medical Officer urged the Captain: "Call them off,
unless you want to take back a corpse."

A blanket was thrown over Höss and he was dragged to Clarke's car,
where the sergeant poured a substantial slug of whisky down his
throat. Höss tried to sleep.

Clarke thrust his service stick under the man's eyelids and ordered in
Geffnan: "Keep your pig eyes open, you swine."

For the first time Höss trotted out his oft-repeated justification: "I
took my orders from Himmler. I was a soldier in the same way as you
are a soldier and we had to obey orders."

The party arrived back at Heide around three in the morning. The snow
was swirling still, but the blanket was torn from Höss and he was made
to walk completely nude through the prison yard to his cell.
</quote>

An article in the British newspaper Wrexham Leader [Mike Mason, "In a
cell with a Nazi war criminal-We kept him awake until he confessed,"
October 17, 1986] following the airing of a TV documentary on the case
of Rudolf Hoess included eyewitness recollections by Ken Jones:
<quote>

Mr. Ken Jones was then a private with the Fifth Royal Horse Artillery
stationed at Heid[e] in Schleswig-Holstein. "They brought him to us
when he refused to cooperate over questioning about his activities
during the war. He came in the winter of 1945/6 and was put in a
small jail cell in the barracks," recalls Mr. Jones. Two other
soldiers were detailed with Mr. Jones to join Höss in his cell to help
break him down for interrogation. "We sat in the cell with him, night
and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time
he fell asleep to help break down his resistance," said Mr. Jones.
When Höss was taken out for exercise he was made
to wear only jeans and a cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three
days and nights without sleep, Höss finally broke down and made a full
confession to the authorities.
</quote>

The confession Hoess signed was numbered document NO-1210; later
revamped, as document PS-3868, which became the basis for an oral
deposition Hoess made for the IMT on April 15, 1946, a month after it
had been extracted from him by torture...

Since what people confess to after they have been captured by the
Communists and their liberal comrades is not proof of anything, this
leaves only the stories of survivors. These contradict each other and
not believable. One professional survivor said that he could tell if
the Germans were gassing German Jews or Polish Jews by the color of
the smoke.

The fact that there are so many "survivors" is not proof of an
extermination plan. There may be six million survivors. Just about
every Jew that is old says he is a survivor.

The real "holocaust" was when the Communist Jews murdered millions of
Christians. Communism was Jewish. Here is proof:

Article Winston Churchill wrote in 1920:
"This movement amongst the Jews (the Russian Revolution) is not new.
From the days of Spartacus Weishaupt to those of Karl Marx, and down
to Trotsky (Russia), Bela Kuhn (Hungary), Rosa Luxembourg (Germany)
and Emma Goldman (United States), this world wide conspiracy for the
overthrow of civilization and the reconstruction of society on the
basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence, and impossible
equality, has been steadily growing. It played, as a modern writer,
Mrs. Nesta Webster, has so ably shown, a definitely recognizable part
in the tragedy of the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of
every subversive movement during the Nineteenth Century; and now at
last this band of extraordinary personalities has gripped the Russian
people by the hair of their heads and have become practically the
undisputed masters of that enormous empire. There is no need to
exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the
actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international
and for the most part atheistic Jews. Moreover, the principal
inspiration and driving power comes from Jewish leaders." (ibid)

Lev Trotzky wrote a book called "Stalin: An Appraisal of the Man and
His Influence", Harper Bros., New York and London, 1941, translated by
Charles Malamuth.

In this book he told who the principle members of the October Central
Committee were. This group was the leadership of the Bolshevik Party
during the October Revolution. This is what he wrote:

"In view of the Party's semi-legality the names of persons elected by
secret ballot were not announced at the Congress, with the exception
of the four who had received the largest number of votes. Lenin--133
out of a possible 134, Zinoviev--132, Kamenev--131, Trotzky--131."

Of these four top leaders of the Bolshevik Party the last three were
known Jews. Lenin was thought to be a gentile married to a Jewess. It
was later proven that he was one quarter Jewish, London Jewish
Chronicle April 21, 1995, Lenin: Life and Legacy.

David Francis, the American Ambassador to Russia at the time of the
Revolution, wrote:

"The Bolshevic leaders here, most of whom are Jews and 90 percent of
whom are returned exiles, care little for Russia or any other country
but are internationalists and they are trying to start a world-wide
revolution."

The Director of British Intelligence to the U.S. Secretary of State
wrote this:

"There is now definite evidence that Bolshevism is an international
movement controlled by Jews."

In 1945 the FBI arrested six individuals for stealing 1700 highly
confidential documents from State Department files. This was the
Amerasia case they were:

Philip Jaffe, a Russian Jew who came to the U.S. in 1905. He was at
one time the editor of the communist paper "Labor Defense" and the
ringleader of the group arrested.
Andrew Roth, a Jew.
Mark Gayn, a Jew, changed his name from Julius Ginsberg.
John Service, a gentile.
Emmanuel Larsen, nationality unknown
Kate Mitchel, nationality unknown.
In 1949 the Jewess Judith Coplin was caught passing classified
documents from Justice Department files to a Russian agent.

The highest ranking communist brought to trial in the U.S. was Gerhart
Eisler. He was a Jew. He was the secret boss of the Communist Party
in the U.S. and commuted regularly between the U.S. and Russia.

In 1950 there was the "Hollywood Ten" case. Ten leading film writers
of the Hollywood Film Colony were convicted for contempt of Congress
and sentenced to prison. Nine of the ten were Jews. Six of the ten
were communist party members and the other four were flagrantly
pro-communist.

One of the top new stories of 1949 was the trial of Eugene Dennis and
the Convicted Eleven. This group comprised the National Secretariat of
the American Communist Party. Six were Jews, two gentiles, three
nationality unknown.

Also in 1949 the German-born atomic scientist Klaus Fuchs was
convicted for passing atomic secrets to the Russians. Acting on
information obtained from Fuchs the FBI arrested nine other members of
the ring. All of them were convicted. Eight of the nine were Jews.

Here are some quotes from a very pro-Jewish book that was first
published in 1925. The book is "Stranger than Fiction" by Lewis
Browne.

"But save for such exceptions, the Jews who led or participated in the
heroic efforts to remold the world of the last century, were neither
Reform or Orthodox. Indeed, they were often not professing Jews at
all.
"For instance, there was Heinrich Heine and Ludwig Borne, both
unfaltering champions of freedom. And even more conspicuously, there
was Karl Marx, one of the great prophetic geniuses of modern times.
"Jewish historians rarely mention the name of this man, Karl Marx,
though in his life and spirit he was far truer to the mission of
Israel than most of those who were forever talking of it. He was born
in Germany in 1818, and belonged to an old rabbinic family. He was not
himself reared as a Jew, however, but while still a child was baptized
a Christian by his father. Yet the rebel soul of the Jew flamed in him
throughout his days, for he was always a 'troubler' in Europe."
"Then, of course, there are Ludwig Borne and Heinrich Heine, two men
who by their merciless wit and sarcasm became leaders among the
revolutionary writers. Karl Marx, Ferdinand Lassalle, Johann Jacoby,
Gabriel Riesser, Adolphe Cremieux, Signora Nathan- all these of Jewish
lineage played important roles in the struggle that went throughout
Europe in this period. Wherever the war for human liberty was being
waged, whether in France, Germany, Austria, Hungary, or Italy, there
the Jew was to be found. It was little wonder that the enemies of
social progress, the monarchists and the Churchmen, came to speak of
the whole liberal movement as nothing but a Jewish plot."

The book "Soviet Russia and the Jews" by Gregor Aronson and published
by the American Jewish League Against Communism, quotes Stalin in an
interview in 1931 with the Jewish Telegraph Agency. Stalin said:

"...Communists cannot be anything but outspoken enemies of
Anti-Semitism. We fight anti-Semites by the strongest methods in the
Soviet Union. Active anti-Semites are punished by death under the
law."

The following quotes are taken directly from documents available from
the U.S. Archives:
State Department document 861.00/1757 sent May 2, 1918 by U.S. consul
general in Moscow, Summers: "Jews prominent in local Soviet
government, anti-Jewish feeling growing among population...."

State Department document 861.00/2205 was sent from Vladivostok on
July 5, 1918 by U.S. consul Caldwell: "Fifty percent of Soviet
government in each town consists of Jews of the worst type."

From the Headquarters of the American Expeditionary Forces, Siberia on
March 1, 1919, comes this telegram from Omsk by Chief of Staff, Capt.
Montgomery Shuyler: "It is probably unwise to say this loudly in the
United States but the Bolshevik movement is and has been since it's
beginning, guided and controlled by Russian Jews of the greasiest
type" type."

A second Schuyler telegram, dated June 9, 1919 from Vladivostok,
reports on the make-up of the presiding Soviet government: "...(T)here
were 384 'commissars' including 2 negroes, 13 Russians, 15 Chinamen,
22 Armenians, AND MORE THAN 300 JEWS. Of the latter number, 264 had
come to Russia from the United States since the downfall of the
Imperial Government.

The Netherlands' ambassador in Russia, Oudendyke, confirmed this:
"Unless Bolshevism is nipped in the bud immediately, it is bound to
spread in one form or another over Europe and the whole world as it is
organized and worked by Jews who have no nationality, and whose one
object is to destroy for their own ends the existing order of things."

"The Bolshevik revolution in Russia was the work of Jewish brains, of
Jewish dissatisfaction, of Jewish planning, whose goal is to create a
new order in the world. What was performed in so excellent a way in
Russia, thanks to Jewish brains, and because of Jewish dissatisfaction
and by Jewish planning, shall also, through the same Jewish mental an
physical forces, become a reality all over the world." (The American
Hebrew, September 10, 1920 "In the Bolshevik era, 52 percent of the
membership of the Soviet communist party was Jewish, though Jews
comprised only 1.8 percent of the total population." (Stuart Kahan,
The Wolf of the Kremlin, p. 81)

Interestingly, one of the first acts by the Bolsheviks was to make
so-called "anti-Semitism" a capital crime. This is confirmed by Stalin
himself:
"National and racial chauvinism is a vestige of the misanthropic
customs characteristic of the period of cannibalism. Anti-semitism, as
an extreme form of racial chauvinism, is the most dangerous vestige of
cannibalism...under USSR law active anti-Semites are liable to the
death penalty." (Stalin, Collected Works, vol. 13, p. 30).

Here is a quote from Mein Kampf:
"Making an effort to overcome my natural reluctance, I tried to read
articles of this nature published in the Marxist Press; but in doing
so my aversion increased all the more. And then I set about learning
something of the people who wrote and published this mischievous
stuff. From the publisher downwards, all of them were Jews. I
recalled to mind the names of the public leaders of Marxism, and then
I realized that most of them belonged to the Chosen Race- the Social
Democratic representatives in the Imperial Cabinet as well as the
secretaries if the Trades Unions and the street agitators. Everywhere
the same sinister picture presented itself. I shall never forget the
row of names- Austerlitz, David, Adler, Ellonbogen, and others. One
fact became quite evident to me. It was that this alien race held in
its hands the leadership of that Social Democratic Party with whose
minor representatives I had been disputing for months past."

Solzhenitsyn named in his book the six top administrators of the
Soviet death camps. All six of them were Jews.

Here is something the National Socialists wrote:
"The Soviet Union was in fact a paradise for one group: the Jews. Even
at times when for foreign policy reasons Jews were less evident in the
government, or when they ruled through straw men, the Jews were always
visible in the middle and lower levels of the administration."

"Next to slavery, lynching is thought to be the most racist aspect of
American history. A lynching museum exists in Milwaukee that focuses
exclusively on white-on-black lynchings. In 2000, a traveling exhibit
of white-on-black lynching photos came to American's biggest cities.
The lynching exhibit received favorable attention from the major media
including the Washington Post, New York Times and CNN. According to
CNN correspondent Maria Hinojosa, "All photos show voiceless victims
of hate; men and women stripped, lashed, beaten, burned and hung.
Often their only crime was one they could not control-the color of
their skin." She ends her review of the display by claiming, "The
exhibit is a harsh reminder of America's responsibility for a horrible
chapter of racial hatred."

This is the official view of lynching. That it was exclusively whites
who carried it out against innocent blacks. It is portrayed as a
viscous act of officially sanctioned white racism against innocent
blacks, designed to keep "Negroes in their place."

In fact, we know quite a bit about lynching and the facts indicate it
was far from a racist design practiced by whites to terrorize blacks.
From its founding in 1914 until the early 1930's. The New Republic ran
an annual editorial listing the number of lynchings in the United
States for each year. The NAACP's first big crusade was against
lynching and they frequently publicized statistics. The Chicago
Tribune also covered lynching extensively.

Robert Zangrando, cites statistics for the period of 1882-1968 in his
book, The NAACP Crusade Against Lynching. Using figures from the
Tuskegee Institute he finds a total of 4,742 for the 87-year period,
of which 1,297 victims were white and 3,445 were black. Even though
over a quarter of those lynched were white, this does not stop
lynching from being described almost entirely in racist terms..

The claim that lynching was primarily an act of racism against blacks
is almost never supported with evidence. In fact, both whites and
blacks carried out lynchings. Almost all cases of lynchings were
carried out not because of race, but because of viscous crimes -crimes
often perpetrated by blacks.

In Lynching - History and Analysis (1995) Wichita State University
professor Dwight Murphey refutes the case that lynchings were largely
a result white of racism. People often resorted to lynching because
the authorities were a long ride away, and President Andrew Jackson
himself sanctioned the practice when he recommended to Iowa settlers
that they lynch murderers. Likewise in Kansas, a New York Tribune
correspondent reported in 1858 that "[t]here is a very general
disposition to pass over the hopelessly useless forms of Territorial
law and corrupt Federal courts, and try these parties (i.e.
horse-thieves) by Lynch law."

Prof. Murphey notes that contrary to current assumptions, blacks also
formed lynch gangs, mostly to lynch blacks, but sometimes to lynch
whites. In Clarksdale, Tennessee, blacks lynched a white in 1914 for
raping a black woman. The authorities later ruled that this was
justifiable homicide. In 1872 in Chicot County, Arkansas, armed blacks
broke three whites out of jail and shot them to death.

Nor was lynching by any means a sport in which any black was fair
game. In Tennessee in 1911, four white men hanged a black man and his
two daughters for no good reason. This outrage roused the ire of the
community; the whites were tried and two were hanged.

It is true that blacks were lynched more often than whites, but, as is
the case today, blacks were also more likely to commit violent crimes,
so even if lynching had been entirely race-blind, the number of
executions would still have been racially unbalanced. Prof. Murphey
cites black homicide rates in 1921-22 for Atlanta, Birmingham, Memphis
and New Orleans per 100,000 that were 102.2, 97.2, 116.9 and 46.7
respectively. This corresponded to white rates of 15.0, 28.0, 29.6,
and 8.4. According to Murphey, "These figures are eloquent testimony
that serious crime was the primary provocation for lynching." Even
W.E.B. DuBois wrote disparagingly of "a class of black criminals,
loafers, and ne'er-do-wells who are a menace to their fellows, both
black and white." ...

Coleman E Howard

http://www.ihr.org/ www.vanguardnewsnetwork.com/

http://www.natvan.com http://www.nsm88.org

http://heretical.com/ http://immigration-globalization.blogspot.com/

== 6 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:54 pm
From: Topaz

Capitalism and Communism are both bad. The problem with
capitalism is that it puts no special value on people. Capitalism is
based on supply and demand. A capitalist company that made potato
chips for example would need--X number of potatoes, Y amount of salt,
and Z number of human beings for labor. The human beings have no more
value than the potatoes or the salt. And they consider it good to pay
the humans as little as they possibly can to increase their profits.

According to capitalist theory people must compete to see who
will work for the least pennies per hour. They say everyone must
compete with the people in Mexico and China to see who will work for
the fewest pennies. If a company makes billions in profit while paying
its employees starvation wages that is perfectly fine. At least the
sacred laws of supply and demand are not violated. If the people die
of starvation that is fine too. You can always get more people. If
there is not enough work for everyone to do then they think people
need to die off. Ebenezer Scrooge did everything right according to
the capitalists and followed the beliefs and values of capitalism.

The apologists for the Scrooges correctly point out that
people only start business for a profit. Of course that is true.
Anyone can see that communism is a big mistake. But wouldn't people
start the business for only millions in profits rather than billions?
What if there were laws that made sure working people got a reasonable
share of the profit? Would that be so terrible?

In a hypothetical case suppose technology progressed so far that
all
the work were done by machines. Huge farms gathering food and all
automated. You would think everything would be great, but under
capitalism the people would starve because there wouldn't be enough
jobs.

Capitalists oppose welfare and say that orphans and other needy
people should be helped by charity. How much charity would there be
when capitalists openly say that selfishness is a great virtue? If
there was no welfare then the charitable people would have to pay for
everything while most people would not pay one thin dime. We have
welfare so people all pay their fair share. It is part of having
civilization.

We have many laws that make things better for people.
There are laws that give people extra pay if they work over forty
hours. There are laws that ensure people will have retirement.
Capitalism is for doing away with the laws so businesses can be free
to be as greedy as possible.There are laws that keep people from
getting ripped off when they buy a house. Capitalism is against that.
Capitalism is bad for people.

http://www.ihr.org/ www.vanguardnewsnetwork.com/

http://www.natvan.com http://www.nsm88.org

http://heretical.com/ http://immigration-globalization.blogspot.com/

== 7 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 5:26 pm
From: tmclone

On Oct 13, 6:43 pm, tmclone <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote:
> On Oct 13, 1:01 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 03:28:07 -0700, tmclone wrote:
> > > On Oct 12, 1:14 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > >> On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 06:23:44 -0700, tmclone wrote:
> > >> > What a moron. I'm a female homeowner in my 50s and I own my own
> > >> > business. I'm a self-employed, life-long democrat. I have lots of
> > >> > assests, but I still can't afford health insurance. It's more than my
> > >> > mortgage payment with a deductible I could never meet. You lose.
>
> > >>https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/individual-health-insurance
>
> > >> Says it will cost you $106 per month. So unless you don't have a
> > >> mortgage you are jerking us around. As to "meeting" your deductible,
> > >> that is irrelevant. Insurance is to protect assets. In that view the
> > >> poor don't actually need insurance because they get care in the
> > >> emergency rooms and they have no assets.
>
> > >>http://www.ehealthlink.com/Washington/IndivRates.asp
>
> > >> In Washington state if you are uninsurable it will cost you $400 a
> > >> month and again you would need to have a very small mortgage indeed.
>
> > > The cheapest insurance I can find (NY) is $500 a month. I bought my
> > > house in 1985, and yes, that's more than my mortgage payment. A LOT more
> > > than my mortgage payment. If NY wasn't such a nanny state requiring all
> > > insurance to be "full-boat" HMO-style, I could just buy catastrophic
> > > coverage for things like a heart attack or cancer. I couldn't care less
> > > about "well-care" or regular check-ups because I don't do that stuff. I
> > > didn't waste my time on that even when I did have insurance 10 years
> > > ago. I don't believe in seeing a doctor unless something is actually
> > > wrong, like a broken bone, uncontrolled bleeding, etc. Of course, YMMV
> > > if you don't have good genes. In my family, on both sides, we die in our
> > > beds in our late early 90s. One great-grandfather died of lung cancer in
> > > his 50s, but he smoked, so that doesn't count.
>
> > As far as I can determine you are selling a load of horse crap. I simply
> > do not believe any personal claims. If you want to cite some reputable
> > rate tables or such then do so. Your health insurance in the State of
> > Massachusetts, which is another "socialized" insurance state,
> > would be $288 a month. I live in Washington state. But most insurance
> > information is on line in every state. Please provide a rate table for
> > New York for healthy people like yourself. I will also say that if you
> > are a low income person than both states provide a very good rate less
> > than the $288.
>
> I don't give a shit what you "believe". I made $500 too much last year
> to qualify for the $200/month "Healthy NY" subsidized insurance. I
> either make too much, too little, have no children, own a house, own a
> business, you name it, I'm screwed because of it. One insurance
> company told me outright that because I'm still "of childbearing age"
> I'm uninsurable for less than $5500/month. Okay, the fact that I had a
> tubal 25 years ago (I'm childfree) should counter that, but it
> doesn't. And exactly why the fuck should I waste my time provided info
> that you neither need nor care about. PLONK!- Hide quoted text -
>

Ok, that should have read "$500" a month, not "$5500". Also, I used to
have a fairly great "Small Business Insurance" plan which was run by a
group out of central NY. It cost $2000/a year back in 1996 (although
it went up $500 every year), BUT, you had to have a gross income of at
least $25k, and when the economy tanked my income dropped from $40k to
$20k over 3 years and I was told that "You don't make enough -
obviously you MUST have another source of income - "no one" can live
on less than $25k so we no longer consider you self-employed" and they
dumped me. So...I make both too much and too little to find insurance
as a self-employed 50-something female in the state of NY. If you
don't believe me, I don't give a shit. Go fuck yourself.

== 8 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 5:43 pm
From: tmclone

You can't read, and your spelling/grammar is atrocious.

"than" - you meant "then".
"who's" - you meant "whose"

And you expect others to do your research and call them liars if they
fail to provide same. Just because I know I'm healthy doesn't mean the
insurance companies agree with me. In my family menopause doesn't even
start until age 60 and even though I've had a tubal the insurance
company seems to think I might be stupid enough to squirt spawn (even
if I could do it). I'm not, of course, but they want to make sure
they're covered if I decide to give birth to a (probably) defective
sprog so late in life. You're not only an uninformed asshole you're an
illiterate imbecile as well. You're as bad, if not worse, than are the
insurance companies. Please, do the world a favor and DROP DEAD. And
SHUT THE FUCK UP.

== 9 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:06 pm
From: tmclone

Google the fucking table yourself, dipshit.

== 10 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:11 pm
From: me@privacy.net

tmclone <tmclone@searchmachine.com> wrote:

>And exactly why the fuck should I waste my time provided info
>that you neither need nor care about. PLONK!

They are total idiots

They have no clue of what they talk

No concept of the "tricks" insurers use to keep people
OUT of the system

=========================================================
Try to make me, fuckwit - I'll shoot you dead, and laugh about it over a
beer later. Then I'll stub a cigar butt out on your orphan child's head.-Wilson Woods

== 11 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:13 pm
From: me@privacy.net

tmclone <tmclone@searchmachine.com> wrote:

>$20k over 3 years and I was told that "You don't make enough -
>obviously you MUST have another source of income - "no one" can live
>on less than $25k so we no longer consider you self-employed" and they
>dumped me. So...I make both too much and too little to find insurance
>as a self-employed 50-something female in the state of NY. If you
>don't believe me, I don't give a shit. Go fuck yourself.

Insurance is legal criminal activity

I know people who have PLENTY of money to buy their own
insurance but are denied coverage for some of the
silliest things.......

== 12 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:14 pm
From: me@privacy.net

tmclone <tmclone@searchmachine.com> wrote:

> You're not only an uninformed asshole you're an
>illiterate imbecile as well. You're as bad, if not worse, than are the
>insurance companies. Please, do the world a favor and DROP DEAD. And
>SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Agree

such people are keeping the USA in the stone age!!

== 13 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:17 pm
From: me@privacy.net

Topaz <mars1933@hotmail.com> wrote:

>The problem with
>capitalism is that it puts no special value on people

very very well said

== 14 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:45 pm
From: tmclone

should be "to provide" rather than "provided"

== 15 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:52 pm
From: tmclone

On Oct 10, 6:33 pm, John Q Public <my2ce...@me.com> wrote:
> On 2009-10-10 15:20:30 -0400, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> said:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 14:50:01 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty wrote:
>
> >>> On Oct 9, 5:42 pm, Geopinion <walk...@easystreet.net> wrote:
> >>>> On Oct 9, 9:17 am, K <Kvisi...@live.con> wrote:
>
> >>>>> In fact, no one has a "right" to any material good or service.
> >>>>> Someone might choose to provide some goods and services to deadbeats,
> >>>>> but that doesn't imply a right to them; and the provider may
> >>>>> subsequently decide to stop providing them.
> >>>>> You have no more "right" to health care than you have to a big screen
> >>>>> TV, Hawaiian holidays, a car, or a lobster dinner. You don't have a
> >>>>> "right" to goods or services. If you want goods and services, you
> >>>>> must pay for them, or you must persuade someone to give them to you
> >>>>> voluntarily. If your powers of persuasion are weak, you'll fare
> >>>>> poorly. That's simply how it is, and it's good and just.
> >>>> There is a right to health care if we, the people, decide there is. We
> >>>> aren't limited to rights specifically outlined in the Constitution,
> >>>> but are assumed to possess a whole host of unenumerated rights. It is
> >>>> also within our power to decide that there are rights and policies
> >>>> that serve the greater good, and there is nothing in the constitution
> >>>> that prohibits that.
>
> >> Where is your "right" to force me to into your health care?
>
> >> Try amendment 9, your rights don't supersede my rights.
>
> > We have the right to protect ourselves from your ingrained stupidity and
> > the damage it causes us.
>
> Your a fucking idiot, your socialist policies you love are what got us
> to this point, the free market
> is the only solution, its not perfect and it doesn't provide your so
> called social justice but in the
> end it always be more efficient and fair than any other system- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

When your spelling/grammar sucks no one can take your comments
seriously. PLONK!

== 16 of 16 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 7:03 pm
From: never@millions.com

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 18:45:04 -0700 (PDT), tmclone
<tmclone@searchmachine.com> wrote:

>On Oct 13, 6:43 pm, tmclone <tmcl...@searchmachine.com> wrote:
>> On Oct 13, 1:01 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 03:28:07 -0700, tmclone wrote:
>> > > On Oct 12, 1:14 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
>> > >> On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 06:23:44 -0700, tmclone wrote:
>> > >> > What a moron. I'm a female homeowner in my 50s and I own my own
>> > >> > business. I'm a self-employed, life-long democrat. I have lots of
>> > >> > assests, but I still can't afford health insurance. It's more than my
>> > >> > mortgage payment with a deductible I could never meet. You lose.
>>
>> > >>https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/individual-health-insurance
>>
>> > >> Says it will cost you $106 per month. So unless you don't have a
>> > >> mortgage you are jerking us around. As to "meeting" your deductible,
>> > >> that is irrelevant. Insurance is to protect assets. In that view the
>> > >> poor don't actually need insurance because they get care in the
>> > >> emergency rooms and they have no assets.
>>
>> > >>http://www.ehealthlink.com/Washington/IndivRates.asp
>>
>> > >> In Washington state if you are uninsurable it will cost you $400 a
>> > >> month and again you would need to have a very small mortgage indeed.
>>
>> > > The cheapest insurance I can find (NY) is $500 a month. I bought my
>> > > house in 1985, and yes, that's more than my mortgage payment. A LOT more
>> > > than my mortgage payment. If NY wasn't such a nanny state requiring all
>> > > insurance to be "full-boat" HMO-style, I could just buy catastrophic
>> > > coverage for things like a heart attack or cancer. I couldn't care less
>> > > about "well-care" or regular check-ups because I don't do that stuff. I
>> > > didn't waste my time on that even when I did have insurance 10 years
>> > > ago. I don't believe in seeing a doctor unless something is actually
>> > > wrong, like a broken bone, uncontrolled bleeding, etc. Of course, YMMV
>> > > if you don't have good genes. In my family, on both sides, we die in our
>> > > beds in our late early 90s. One great-grandfather died of lung cancer in
>> > > his 50s, but he smoked, so that doesn't count.
>>
>> > As far as I can determine you are selling a load of horse crap. I simply
>> > do not believe any personal claims. If you want to cite some reputable
>> > rate tables or such then do so. Your health insurance in the State of
>> > Massachusetts, which is another "socialized" insurance state,
>> > would be $288 a month. I live in Washington state. But most insurance
>> > information is on line in every state. Please provide a rate table for
>> > New York for healthy people like yourself. I will also say that if you
>> > are a low income person than both states provide a very good rate less
>> > than the $288.
>>
>> I don't give a shit what you "believe". I made $500 too much last year
>> to qualify for the $200/month "Healthy NY" subsidized insurance. I
>> either make too much, too little, have no children, own a house, own a
>> business, you name it, I'm screwed because of it. One insurance
>> company told me outright that because I'm still "of childbearing age"
>> I'm uninsurable for less than $5500/month. Okay, the fact that I had a
>> tubal 25 years ago (I'm childfree) should counter that, but it
>> doesn't. And exactly why the fuck should I waste my time provided info
>> that you neither need nor care about. PLONK!- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>should be "to provide" rather than "provided"

Or could be providing. ;)

DCI

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to get rid of a roommate?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a3fd1dedade4e5a6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:43 pm
From: Marsha

Dave C. wrote:
>> You know, Marsha, I think a very effective way of your sister getting
>> her BF out of the house is to cheat on him. I mean have a short-term
>> affair and don't even try to hide it. Let herself get caught, like
>> letting him "accidentally" see a love letter in her email or witness
>> her kissing holding hands with another guy. If her infidelity will not
>> get him out of the house, I do not know what would.
>
> I don't think that would work. The original relationship with the
> houseguest is over. He's getting something other than sex from the
> girlfriend now. I think it is an abuser/abusee relationship. The girl
> fucking another guy would just infuriate the ex-boyfriend and give him
> a good reason to really go ape-shit. It certainly wouldn't convince
> him that it's time to leave. -Dave

Yep. She's already "forbidden" from talking to the neighbor (a friendly
male).

Marsha

==============================================================================
TOPIC: My nephew wrote me for the first time!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/0c3321a9b4b163ea?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 4:36 pm
From: "Bill"

My 18 year old nephew wrote me a letter!

This is the very first time he has done this. He has never before written to
me, has never called me, nor has he ever written me a thank you note for the
gifts I have given him at Christmas time...

In his "form letter", he is asking for a $500.00 donation for a sports
program at his school!

He does get right to the point about the money. Does not waste any ink by
saying hello to me or asking how I am doing or telling me how he is doing.

He will not get a cent from me!

Maybe he will be offended and stop writing to me?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Opposition to Obama's destruction of the health care sector is not
about race
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/28531844efc1bbfe?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 6:49 pm
From: larrylaundry

Wilson Woods wrote:
> Lisa Lisa, a racist looter, wrote:
> > On Oct 13, 12:28 am, SgtMinor <Sa...@the.old.folks.home.invalid>
> > wrote:
> >> Wilson Woods wrote:
> >>> It's about preventing the government from wrecking health care and
> >>> access to it that satisfies most people. Idiot leftist looters who say
> >>> it's about race know they've lost the debate.
> >> It's about the corporate ox being gored. It's about power and money.
> >> Our choice is whether to do this collectively, or continue to live at
> >> the mercy of a system intent on extracting from us our last drop of blood.
> >>
> >> The corporate powers can always count on the support of a group of
> >> ignoramuses to fight their battles. Ignoramuses are not known for any
> >> socially progressive positions, and tend to have little or no racial
> >> tolerance.
> >
> > Yep. Woods is KKK
>
> You have no evidence - *none* - that opposition to Obama's plan to wreck
> American health care is based on race.

It is based on race because that is part of the Republican program.
Being anti-Liberal is part of the program, not actually thinking about
things based on you people political opposition is part of the
program.

It's something that can make Republicans say we need to chop off
peoples hands who steal then say the middle east is evil because they
chop off peoples hands that steal. Everything you people are and do is
based on one than and another.

Racist, anti-liberal, Republican, it's all interchangeable.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 7:11 pm
From: never@millions.com

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 18:49:07 -0700 (PDT), larrylaundry
<larrylaundry@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>
>Wilson Woods wrote:
>> Lisa Lisa, a racist looter, wrote:
>> > On Oct 13, 12:28 am, SgtMinor <Sa...@the.old.folks.home.invalid>
>> > wrote:
>> >> Wilson Woods wrote:
>> >>> It's about preventing the government from wrecking health care and
>> >>> access to it that satisfies most people. Idiot leftist looters who say
>> >>> it's about race know they've lost the debate.
>> >> It's about the corporate ox being gored. It's about power and money.
>> >> Our choice is whether to do this collectively, or continue to live at
>> >> the mercy of a system intent on extracting from us our last drop of blood.
>> >>
>> >> The corporate powers can always count on the support of a group of
>> >> ignoramuses to fight their battles. Ignoramuses are not known for any
>> >> socially progressive positions, and tend to have little or no racial
>> >> tolerance.
>> >
>> > Yep. Woods is KKK
>>
>> You have no evidence - *none* - that opposition to Obama's plan to wreck
>> American health care is based on race.
>
>It is based on race because that is part of the Republican program.
>Being anti-Liberal is part of the program, not actually thinking about
>things based on you people political opposition is part of the
>program.
>
>It's something that can make Republicans say we need to chop off
>peoples hands who steal then say the middle east is evil because they
>chop off peoples hands that steal. Everything you people are and do is
>based on one than and another.
>
>Racist, anti-liberal, Republican, it's all interchangeable.

Where'd get this "you people" stuff?

DCI

==============================================================================
TOPIC: 2012 forcast: Food riots, ghost malls, mob rule, riots, terror
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/e6d8859d25e5ef7b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 7:36 pm
From: phil scott

On Oct 12, 9:47 am, m...@privacy.net wrote:
> phil scott <p...@philscott.net> wrote:
> >Large fixed homes and careers? are insane imo. the house ties you
> >to a local job market where you can be exploited ..when I was
> >engineering I traveled the US, and made 50% more than my local counter
> >parts, and gained skills I could gain no other way. thats next for
> >the rest of us, imo.
>
> What type of engineering did you do Phil?

Industrial systems of all sorts, gas/ oil/ nuclear/ aerospace.. semi
conductor/ control systems. Im still about 50% active.
lately ship board blast freeze systems (fisher/processor vessels to
minus 50F or so).. most of that has been design/ build
contracts.

>
> =========================================================
> Try to make me, fuckwit - I'll shoot you dead, and laugh about it over a
> beer later. Then I'll stub a cigar butt out on your orphan child's head.-Wilson Woods

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 7:58 pm
From: knews4u2chew@yahoo.com

On Oct 11, 6:09 am, martin <martin.secrest...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 10, 1:58 pm, Iconoclast <goldst...@nym.hush.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Is the glass half empty?
>
> >http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=112452
>
> > 2012 forecast: Food riots, ghost malls, mob rule, terror
> > Trends chief says people should brace for 'the greatest depression'
> > Posted: October 10, 2009
> > 12:15 am Eastern
>
> > By Bob Unruh
> > © 2009 WorldNetDaily
>
> > A trends forecaster says the current economic "rebound" from last
> > winter's Wall Street collapse of banks, insurance companies and
> > automobile manufacturers is an artificial blip created by 'phantom
> > money printed out of thin air backed by nothing."
>
> > And Gerald Celente of TrendsResearch.com, says people right now should
> > be bracing for "the greatest recession" which will hit worldwide and
> > will mark the "decline of empire America." Crop failures could be
> > among the minor concerns.
>
> > "Here we are in 2012.

<snip>

Celente might be correct about a decline but "2012" has nothing to do
with it.
The Propagandists will sure use it to spread fear however.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/6300744/2012-is-not-the-end-of-the-world-Mayan-elder-insists.html

==============================================================================
TOPIC: converting mm measurements to american standard
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/016cd728ee0594ca?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 7:41 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)

In article <dfa710d7-f6eb-46d5-a13c-30cf3afc5c09@c3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
noel888 <harri85274@aol.com> wrote:
>On Oct 11, 3:43 pm, ghes...@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston) wrote:
>> In article
><c23d961f-102c-4306-b136-1a9be8603...@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,

>> noel888 <harri85...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >I went to one of those converter tables to find out the equivilant and
>> >it did not make any sense to me...ie..i entered 468 mm and it came
>> >back with 1 feet...the same for 5.5 mm...could someone here with this
>> >knowledge, inform me the correct conversion for both of those that i
>> >mentioned? 468mm= 5.5mm=

>> 1" = 25.4mm, therefore:

>> 468mm = 18.4251"
>> 5.5mm = 0.2165"

>sorry and thanks for answering, but this old fool is still
>mystified ....468 is 18 inches, but what is 4251? .. and the other
>0.2165 is what? if its a fraction, what is it?

They're decimal fractions. 18.4251" = 18 inches, 4 tenths, 2 hundredths,
five thousandths, and 1 ten-thousandth. 18-27/64 inches would be close.

0.2165" = about 7/32 inches.

Gary

--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
"Where large, expensive pieces of exotic woods are converted to valueless,
hard to dispose of sawdust, chips and scraps." Charlie B.s' definition of
woodworking.

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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/52168902795dda98?hl=en
* Opposition to Obama's destruction of the health care sector is not about
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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/28531844efc1bbfe?hl=en
* Illegal Immigration: A Culture of Corruption - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/5d0fd928fb97993e?hl=en
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http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/0cfabc991f0b742b?hl=en
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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 10:12 am
From: Wilson Woods

Michael Coburn wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 03:28:07 -0700, tmclone wrote:
>
>> On Oct 12, 1:14 pm, Michael Coburn <mik...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 06:23:44 -0700, tmclone wrote:
>>>> What a moron. I'm a female homeowner in my 50s and I own my own
>>>> business. I'm a self-employed, life-long democrat. I have lots of
>>>> assests, but I still can't afford health insurance. It's more than my
>>>> mortgage payment with a deductible I could never meet. You lose.
>>> https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/individual-health-insurance
>>>
>>> Says it will cost you $106 per month. So unless you don't have a
>>> mortgage you are jerking us around. As to "meeting" your deductible,
>>> that is irrelevant. Insurance is to protect assets. In that view the
>>> poor don't actually need insurance because they get care in the
>>> emergency rooms and they have no assets.
>>>
>>> http://www.ehealthlink.com/Washington/IndivRates.asp
>>>
>>> In Washington state if you are uninsurable it will cost you $400 a
>>> month and again you would need to have a very small mortgage indeed.
>>>
>>>
>> The cheapest insurance I can find (NY) is $500 a month. I bought my
>> house in 1985, and yes, that's more than my mortgage payment. A LOT more
>> than my mortgage payment. If NY wasn't such a nanny state requiring all
>> insurance to be "full-boat" HMO-style, I could just buy catastrophic
>> coverage for things like a heart attack or cancer. I couldn't care less
>> about "well-care" or regular check-ups because I don't do that stuff. I
>> didn't waste my time on that even when I did have insurance 10 years
>> ago. I don't believe in seeing a doctor unless something is actually
>> wrong, like a broken bone, uncontrolled bleeding, etc. Of course, YMMV
>> if you don't have good genes. In my family, on both sides, we die in our
>> beds in our late early 90s. One great-grandfather died of lung cancer in
>> his 50s, but he smoked, so that doesn't count.
>
> As far as I can determine you are selling a load of horse crap. I simply
> do not believe any personal claims. If you want to cite some reputable
> rate tables or such then do so. Your health insurance in the State of
> Massachusetts, which is another "socialized" insurance state,
> would be $288 a month. I live in Washington state.

I guess I won't be taking that six-figure job at Costco, then.

> But most insurance
> information is on line in every state. Please provide a rate table for
> New York for healthy people like yourself.

You're a fucking moron in addition to be a liar. When I was
self-employed, up to 2005, I paid over $600 a month for Kaiser for my
family (wife and son). I have no doubt it's at least $150-$200 higher
today. If the poster is on an indemnity plan, $500 would be cheap.

You're a goddamned blowhard.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:17 am
From: me@privacy.net

Lisa Lisa <harryharry52@yahoo.com> wrote:

>This is what America has come to. No wonder we're no longer a model
>for the rest of the world.

yep

the rest of world laughs at us cause of old ideas

good ole boy redneck cowboy politics

its result of rightard policies

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:18 am
From: me@privacy.net

Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> You have no "right" to health care, but you do have a right to pay
>> premiums, have your claims denied, and make the CEO and shareholders
>> of Aetna very rich.
>
>That isn't what happens, looter.

yeah right cock sucker

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,564501,00.html

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 12:06 pm
From: never@millions.com

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 08:59:45 -0700, Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>me@privacy.net, a looter, wrote:
>> Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> He likes high premiums coupled with shitty coverage,
>>> No, that's wrong, you racist looter.
>>
>> Prove it baby killing Nazi
>
>More swearing from a lowbrow looter.

Hey! don't worry, his punctuation, or lack thereof, is the signal.
Many such folks have a heavy supraorbital ridge that is an indicator
of where they are on the spectrum of the homo-erectus scale.

DCI

==============================================================================
TOPIC: AT&T Mobility Offers Unlimited Prepaid for $60/month--Compare this with
other Unlimited Prepaid Plans
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/52168902795dda98?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 10:15 am
From: SMS

On Oct 12, 4:27 pm, Steve Sobol <sjso...@JustThe.net> wrote:
> In article <2457d59un5tm86fj85acgg6olbuhikm...@4ax.com>, spamfilter1
> @navasgroup.com says...
>
> > Pity you had to spoil that nice chart with your usual distorted ratings.
>
> Pity both you and Steven have to act like shills. Half of the posts in
> the Verizon newsgroup consist of you two arguing with each other.

I have had Navas kill-filed for a couple of years now. Arguing with
him is pointless. I don't know where you got the idea that I am
arguing with him. Yes, I've occasionally followed up on the posts of
all the others that argue with him, but that's the extent of it.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:05 pm
From: John Navas

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 16:27:25 -0700, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
wrote in <MPG.253d5b33d95baae79897a3@news.justthe.net>:

>In article <2457d59un5tm86fj85acgg6olbuhikmbl5@4ax.com>, spamfilter1
>@navasgroup.com says...
>
>> Pity you had to spoil that nice chart with your usual distorted ratings.
>
>Pity both you and Steven have to act like shills. Half of the posts in
>the Verizon newsgroup consist of you two arguing with each other.

But you're OK with all the iPhone shilling, product and/or service
bashing, libels, ad hominems, and other off-topic noise? ;)

--
Best regards,
John <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 10:40 am
From: Michael Coburn

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 19:03:19 -0700, Wilson Woods wrote:

> It's about preventing the government from wrecking health care and
> access to it that satisfies most people. Idiot leftist looters who say
> it's about race know they've lost the debate.

However, this total lying pig shit from the rightarded is exemplified by
everything "Wilson Woods" presents. The racism of the rightarded is
revealed in every way in most of what they say. And the rightarded are
proud of it and wear it as a badge of honor.

--
"Those are my opinions and you can't have em" -- Bart Simpson

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:27 am
From: me@privacy.net

freeisbest <demeter547opine@yahoo.com> wrote:

>hose
>who have seen a relative die early because s/he can't "afford" medical
>care - those people aren't falling for BigMed's b.s. any more.

agree

I know a lot of people who are denied coverage cause of
some stupid pre-existing condition such as gerd

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 12:00 pm
From: never@millions.com

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 07:25:56 -0700, Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>Robert of St Louis wrote:
>> Yeah I'm with you..."Keep the federal government out of my Medicare"
>
>End Medicare.

Whoa, Big Guy, cleaning up Medicare may be in the cards first.

DCI

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 12:09 pm
From: Beam Me Up Scotty

never@millions.com wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 07:25:56 -0700, Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Robert of St Louis wrote:
>>> Yeah I'm with you..."Keep the federal government out of my Medicare"
>> End Medicare.
>
> Whoa, Big Guy, cleaning up Medicare may be in the cards first.
>
> DCI

In all it's years when has MEDICARE been cost efficient and not over
budget with unfunded mandates?

It needs to be looked at as being grandfathered out of existence.

People need something that will be there and NOT bankrupt in 5 years.

Obama will cut 500billion from Medicare if you believe his lies. That
will gut it or Bankrupt the economy by not cutting it, so either way you
will lose your Quality of care soon.

*BE VERY CONCERNED*

Liberal *Nirvana* isn't here yet... but I can hear you lefties "humming"
Koom-Bay-Ya.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 1:17 pm
From: SgtMinor

Beam Me Up Scotty wrote:
> never@millions.com wrote:
>> On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 07:25:56 -0700, Wilson Woods <banmilk@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Robert of St Louis wrote:
>>>> Yeah I'm with you..."Keep the federal government out of my Medicare"
>>> End Medicare.
>> Whoa, Big Guy, cleaning up Medicare may be in the cards first.
>>
>> DCI
>
>
> In all it's years when has MEDICARE been cost efficient and not over
> budget with unfunded mandates?
>
>
> It needs to be looked at as being grandfathered out of existence.
>
> People need something that will be there and NOT bankrupt in 5 years.
>
> Obama will cut 500billion from Medicare if you believe his lies. That
> will gut it or Bankrupt the economy by not cutting it, so either way you
> will lose your Quality of care soon.
>

"Obama will cut 500billion from Medicare..." Do you have a cite for this?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Illegal Immigration: A Culture of Corruption
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/5d0fd928fb97993e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 10:42 am
From: "Speeders & Drunk Drivers are MURDERERS"

martin <martin.secrest220@gmail.com> wrote in news:901cbbfa-3c82-446a-
9236-8d6f8078334b@11g2000yqp.googlegroups.com:

> On Oct 12, 8:19 pm, Red Cloud <mmdir2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Illegal Immigration: A Culture of Corruption
>> By Ronald W. Mortensen, October 12, 2009
>>
>> At a time when 83% of Americans view government corruption as a very
>> important problem, isn't it time that we stop fostering a culture of
>> corruption by failing to control illegal immigration?
>>
>> Most illegal aliens come from countries where corruption is rampant.
>> In 2008, the average corruption score of the ten countries with the
>> largest number of their citizens residing illegally in the United
>> States was 3.43 out of a possible ten signifying a serious to rampant
>> level of corruption.
>>
>> Corruption is involved in virtually everything illegal aliens do. They
>> either sneak into the United States or lie to consular and immigration
>> officials in order to obtain visas and legal entry. Once in the United
>> States, they quickly commit felonies when they obtain and use
>> fraudulent documents, perjure themselves on I-9 forms, and steal the
>> identities of millions of American men, women and children in order to
>> get jobs.
>>
>> Illegal aliens have an exceptionally high incidence of drunk driving
>> infractions. They drive without licenses and without auto insurance.
>> Their advocates try to blackmail public officials into giving them
>> driver's licenses by essentially telling them that "If you don't give
>> us licenses, we will drive anyway and we won't buy auto insurance. We
>> will have auto accidents and we will flee the scene. We may even kill
>> you. So you had better give us what we want or else."
>>
>> Apologists for illegal aliens reveal just how corrupting the system is
>> when they cave in to this blackmail and blame American citizens for
>> illegal alien crimes. Commenting on a proposal to repeal Utah's
>> Driving Privilege Card for illegal aliens, a former Utah state
>> legislator said "So if we repeal them [the Driving Privilege Cards]
>> what we're going to do is we're going to make all these people drive
>> illegally. They're not going to have insurance, so therefore when they
>> hit somebody on the road they're just going to take off and run."
>>
>> This corruption extends to law enforcement agencies that ignore the
>> legal status of individuals as well as many serious crimes committed
>> by illegal aliens in order to maintain good relations with the illegal
>> immigrant community. Rather than upholding the law and prosecuting and
>> deporting drunk drivers, identity thieves, tax cheats, and a myriad of
>> other illegal alien criminals, law enforcement officials ignore legal
>> status and give illegal aliens a pass on many crimes in order to gain
>> their trust.
>>
>> In Utah, at an immigration rally, the state's Attorney General went so
>> far as to publicly tell the illegal aliens present, 75% of whom were
>> likely using false Social Security numbers along with identities
>> belonging to tens of thousands of Utah children, that he would not
>> arrest them.
>>
>> Sanctuary cities offer protection to illegal aliens who are committing
>> serious felonies including drug and human trafficking, identity theft
>> and gang related violent crime. Universities allow illegal aliens to
>> benefit from in-state tuition in spite of the fact that many of these
>> students are committing serious felonies in order to get jobs to pay
>> for their tuition.
>>
>> Religious leaders actively court illegal aliens. They tell them in
>> effect, "Join with us and go forth and continue to commit document
>> fraud, perjury on I-9 forms, and identity theft in order to get jobs.
>> Drive without licenses and insurance. Corrupt other people's medical
>> records with life threatening consequences. Lie and cheat every day as
>> you go about your lives in the United States."
>>
>> These spiritual leaders put the interests of illegal aliens ahead of
>> the rule of law and the American men, women, and innocent children who
>> are the victims of their crimes. This is not only corrupt; it is cruel
>> to both the illegal aliens who learn that crime is acceptable in the
>> eyes of the church and to American citizens who are the victims of
>> their crimes.
>>
>> The corruption extends to the Social Security Administration and
>> Internal Revenue Service. Both of these governmental entities place
>> the collection of taxes ahead of protecting American citizens from
>> illegal alien driven identity theft and document fraud even though
>> they know this is occurring. As a former director of the IRS said: "We
>> want your money whether you are here legally or not and whether you
>> earned it legally or not."
>>
>> This is just the tip of the iceberg. The corruption extends to banks
>> that cater to illegal aliens in order to enhance their bottom lines.
>> It extends to chambers of commerce and to the world's largest
>> professional human resource association as they actively work to
>> prevent the federal and state governments from requiring employers to
>> use E-Verify that would protect millions of American children from
>> illegal alien driven identity theft. It extends to the corrupt
>> landscape contractor, to the family that hires an illegal housekeeper
>> and even to those of us who do business with companies that refuse to
>> use E-Verify.
>>
>> There are many things that we must do if we are to effectively address
>> corruption in America. A good starting point would be to end the
>> culture of corruption that surrounds illegal immigration by enforcing
>> our borders, requiring all employers to use E-Verify, aggressively
>> prosecuting all illegal alien driven document fraud and identity
>> theft, and by refusing to succumb to blackmail by illegal aliens
>
> Picture members of Congress slithering from desk to desk trying to
> fiqure a way to give the illegal alien lobby everything it wants
> without
> offending too many systems. And they arrest ladies for hustling on
> street corners!!!!
>
> tt
>

Yup - all our congressgangsters are taking in millions of $ a year in
bribes to let the illegals enter and run wild. And american citizens are
victimized. It's pure treason on congrss' part but nothing will ever be
done about it.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:28 am
From: Demon Buddha

Demon Buddha wrote:
> martin wrote:
>
>>> Illegal aliens have an exceptionally high incidence of drunk driving
>>> infractions.
>
> Boy, you said it. I was in traffic court one evening about 10 years
> ago - Mr "Hernandez" (Mexican) came before judge. "Mr. Hernandez, this
> is the TWENTY THIRD time you have come before me in the last twenty four
> months for DUI. What are we going to *do* with you?" Mr. Hernandez"
> paid the $300 fine and walked away... again. In NJ, it is supposed to
> be a $3000 fine on first offense with up to, IIRC, 6 months in jail.
> Twenty three arrests for DUI? Why didn't they kick his manky ass back
> to Tijuana where he belonged? Any American, especially a white male,
> would have been doing hard time by they third infraction. One can only
> wonder what is really going on here.

Oops... got that count wrong... it was 13 times in 24 months.

Apologies.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:41 am
From: never@millions.com

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 12:56:27 -0400, Demon Buddha <Nobody@no.where>
wrote:

>martin wrote:
>
>>> Illegal aliens have an exceptionally high incidence of drunk driving
>>> infractions.
>
> Boy, you said it. I was in traffic court one evening about 10 years
>ago - Mr "Hernandez" (Mexican) came before judge. "Mr. Hernandez, this
>is the TWENTY THIRD time you have come before me in the last twenty four
>months for DUI. What are we going to *do* with you?" Mr. Hernandez"
>paid the $300 fine and walked away... again. In NJ, it is supposed to
>be a $3000 fine on first offense with up to, IIRC, 6 months in jail.
>Twenty three arrests for DUI? Why didn't they kick his manky ass back
>to Tijuana where he belonged? Any American, especially a white male,
>would have been doing hard time by they third infraction. One can only
>wonder what is really going on here.

"One can only wonder what really is going on here." Gross
multi-layered stupidity in a broken system.

DCI

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 2:53 pm
From: Demon Buddha

never@millions.com wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 12:56:27 -0400, Demon Buddha <Nobody@no.where>
> wrote:
>
>> martin wrote:
>>
>>>> Illegal aliens have an exceptionally high incidence of drunk driving
>>>> infractions.
>> Boy, you said it. I was in traffic court one evening about 10 years
>> ago - Mr "Hernandez" (Mexican) came before judge. "Mr. Hernandez, this
>> is the TWENTY THIRD time you have come before me in the last twenty four
>> months for DUI. What are we going to *do* with you?" Mr. Hernandez"
>> paid the $300 fine and walked away... again. In NJ, it is supposed to
>> be a $3000 fine on first offense with up to, IIRC, 6 months in jail.
>> Twenty three arrests for DUI? Why didn't they kick his manky ass back
>> to Tijuana where he belonged? Any American, especially a white male,
>> would have been doing hard time by they third infraction. One can only
>> wonder what is really going on here.
>
> "One can only wonder what really is going on here." Gross
> multi-layered stupidity in a broken system.

No, something much deeper I suspect. First of all, Evan Broadbelt, the
judge at the time, was running a money mill in Freehold Boro. That
night he must have taken in close to $100K. He finally got popped and
sent to prison for it. But I have noticed this in AZ and WA as well.
The only time it changed was when some stupid MX gang banger decided to
off a Mesa cop as his initiation, thinking it would make him big man for
having such balls. Mesa PD had something of a truce with the gangs
prior to the incident. After that they went berzerk on them letting
them know that gang life would be in the toilet until homey claus was
turned over. A few weeks passed and Mr. Tough Guy's body was found by
Mesa cops in a conspicuous public place. They rubbed the idiot out and
I guess life went back to almost normal.

Anyhow, the sacred cow syndrome is something so widespread that I
figure there must be some unadvertised legal line that municipalities
are called upon to toe. I cannot imagine why else there would be such
uniformity of position in such far flung locations.

Anybody know anything about this?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: "needs" vs "mere wants": a false and useless distinction
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/f6c8d5277333b7c2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 10:51 am
From: Michael Coburn

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:44:47 -0700, mg wrote:

> On Oct 12, 10:16 am, Wilson Woods <banm...@hotmail.com> wrote: . . .
>> No one "needs" health care, in any absolute sense. People want health
>> care in order to affect the quantity and quality of life.
>>
>> A bogus distinction between wants and needs cannot serve as the basis
>> for taking resources from those who produce them and showering them on
>> parasites who don't produce enough value to buy their own medical care.
>
> I've never known anyone who needed health care who didn't get it if they
> tried. They might need to go the an emergency room and wait in line. Or
> they might need to apply at the appropriate government agency, like
> Medicaid, for instance, but they can get health care.
>
> So, the argument isn't about whether or not people should be denied
> health care. The argument is about who pays and how they pay and whether
> we should continue to give insurance companies an exemption from
> anti-trust laws so they can continue to charge whatever the traffic will
> bear.

Thank you.

--
"Those are my opinions and you can't have em" -- Bart Simpson

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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:47 am
From: The Real Bev

Bill wrote:

> "The Real Bev" wrote in message
>> This was a good group. Looks like the recent spate of political crap has
>> even discouraged Rod from posting.
>
> It's like pornography when searching for something on the internet. Search
> for any topic and some porno site will show up in the search (They do this
> by sticking every word in the dictionary on their pages). I know where that
> stuff is if I choose to look at it, but when I'm searching for car repair,
> home repair, whatever, I would like to find those topics.
>
> Same with politics. I know where the political groups are if I choose to
> read that. I don't post frugal topics in the political groups.
>
> Ignore them and they will go away. Also you can respond and delete the
> misc.consumers.frugal-living cross post (leave the others). That will help
> to get them to go away.

Sorry, this seems unlikely. It requires a decision on the part of rabid loons
to do the right thing, which just doesn't happen.

I've tried removing mcfl from the list and setting the follow-up to one of the
political groups, but that doesn't seem to work. Perhaps if we keep doing that
while offering opinions so annoying that they will all respond will help, but I
doubt it.

--
Cheers, Bev
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
When cryptography is outlawed, only outlaws will
qwertzuio asdfghjk pyxcvbnml -- M. O'Dorney

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 11:59 am
From: The Real Bev

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:

> On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 19:26:57 -0700, The Real Bev
> <bashley101+et@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>This was a good group. Looks like the recent spate of political crap has even
>>discouraged Rod from posting.
>>
>>It's a fucking shame that people are as stupid as they are.
>
> There is not a smidgen of doubt in my mind that when that famous
> internet search engine bought out deja, there was every intention of
> killing usenet.

OTOH, I think just letting deja die, which is what was happening, would have
accomplished that more quickly. I think the people at google at that time
LIKED usenet and regarded it as valuable. At least I'd LIKE to think that.

> There is no profit to be made with it, there is
> little control, and as far as providers, the RIAA and music industry,
> the government, and so on, it is something that all of them wish would
> just go away.

It costs the ISPs money for a decreasing number of users, so add them to the
list. I complained to Charter about their lousy usenet service and there
wasn't a single helpdroid (even the ones without Indian accents) who knew what
usenet is. One guy thought it was that extra-cost satellite internet service
that they didn't support. I'm surprised that nobody told me it was the evil
entity in the Terminator movies, but I only talked to a dozen people or so.

> If someone told me that Rod was getting a supplemental check for
> services rendered, it wouldn't surprise me. If the shoe spam was
> somehow sanctioned, it wouldn't surprise me.

I haven't been getting a lot of that since I switched to eternal-september. I
also added whatever filters I could (Thunderbird doesn't allow an awful lot of
filter options). I like E-T.

> If the cross-posting was
> done with malicious intent, it wouldn't surprise me. Not saying that
> any of those are absolutely happening, but I am saying that there is a
> HUGE amount of money that does not want unfettered, unmoderated, free
> speech and sharing. Welcome to the 21st century. Sig Heil and
> newspeak!

Those who don't know about memory holes should learn.

--
Cheers, Bev
=================================================
It's not the speed that kills, it's the stopping.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:12 pm
From: "holarchy"

hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote:

> There is not a smidgen of doubt in my mind that when that famous internet
> search engine bought out deja, there was every intention of killing usenet.

Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have always been completely off with the fucking fairies.

> There is no profit to be made with it, there is little control, and
> as far as providers, the RIAA and music industry, the government,
> and so on, it is something that all of them wish would just go away.

How odd that they actually allow posting to usenet.

> If someone told me that Rod was getting a supplemental check for
> services rendered, it wouldn't surprise me. If the shoe spam was
> somehow sanctioned, it wouldn't surprise me. If the cross-posting was
> done with malicious intent, it wouldn't surprise me. Not saying that
> any of those are absolutely happening, but I am saying that there is a
> HUGE amount of money that does not want unfettered, unmoderated, free
> speech and sharing. Welcome to the 21st century. Sig Heil and newspeak!

How odd that they actually allow posting to usenet.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 3:17 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

The Real Bev wrote
> hchickpea@hotmail.com wrote
>> The Real Bev <bashley101+et@gmail.com> wrote

>>> This was a good group. Looks like the recent spate of political crap has even discouraged Rod from posting.

>>> It's a fucking shame that people are as stupid as they are.

>> There is not a smidgen of doubt in my mind that when that famous
>> internet search engine bought out deja, there was every intention of
>> killing usenet.

No wonder its completely unemployable.

Corse they did. Thats why they allowed posting to usenet.

And while that is a problem spam wise, its also where
the absolute vast bulk of the new posters have come from.

>> If someone told me that Rod was getting a supplemental check for services rendered, it wouldn't surprise me. If the
>> shoe spam was somehow sanctioned, it wouldn't surprise me.

> I haven't been getting a lot of that since I switched to
> eternal-september. I also added whatever filters I could
> (Thunderbird doesn't allow an awful lot of filter options). I like E-T.

> Those who don't know about memory holes should learn.

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==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 1:18 pm
From: Dennis Ferguson

On 2009-10-13, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> George wrote:
>> That wouldn't be the case within say 200 miles of me. Also Sprint is
>> stuck on 1,900 MHz which has less building penetration and range. I am
>> sure you can produce a cite from the "Navas Group" which will claim that
>> well known phenomena isn't true.
>
> LOL, actually he's claimed that the "phenomena" isn't true many times in
> the past, with no cite at all, not even citing himself as he likes to do.
>
> However since in the past week AT&T themselves have stated that 850MHz
> has better in-building coverage and range, I don't think he'll be
> issuing this claim again.

In fact most propagation models don't think indoor propagation is
affected much by frequency, at least the frequencies mobiles use.
Older research found higher frequencies penetrate a little better,
newer measurements usually find lower is a little better (here's a
recent one google found:

http://www.co.it.pt/conftele2007/assets/papers/antennas/paper_16.pdf

), but the difference is usually small. COST231's model for office
propagation at mobile frequencies assumes frequency doesn't matter,
see the bottom of this page:

http://www.wirelesscommunication.nl/reference/chaptr03/indoor.htm

The real issue isn't how much the building knocks down the signal
at different frequencies, that doesn't change much. Instead the
issue is how much signal you have outside the building before
the building penetration knocks it down and here the lower
frequencies have a distinct advantage, the same as with outdoor
coverage.

850 MHz does provide better coverage, but less capacity per unit
area of coverage. More cell towers would provide both better coverage
(indoors and out) and greater capacity. I wonder which AT&T would
prefer?

Dennis Ferguson

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 13 2009 1:35 pm
From: SMS

Dennis Ferguson wrote:

> In fact most propagation models don't think indoor propagation is
> affected much by frequency, at least the frequencies mobiles use.

Pretty sure that AT&T (and the other carriers) are looking at it from
the more practical aspect of having a stronger signal just outside the
building with the lower frequency. True, if you construct two cells
right outside a building then it won't much matter whether it's 800 or
1900 MHz. If the two cells are a few miles away then it matters a lot.

I wish the EPA Ikea would put in some pico cells in their building.
There are towers for all the major carriers within 1/4 mile of the store
so clearly it's not a lack of coverage issue, it's something about the
building's construction.

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Tuesday, October 13, 2009

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

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