Frugal Living: 25 new messages in 12 topics

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Instant Homework Help !
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/9a922167feae3281?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 16 2008 11:51 pm
From: 24hourstutor

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Gasoline "Boycott": The Next Generation
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/7b5aa5d3dc9c38b8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 12:20 am
From: Shawn Hirn

In article <bT15k.3037$JK5.1186@newsfe07.lga>,
The Real Bev <bashley101+usenet@gmail.com> wrote:

> Napoleon wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 12:31:59 -0700, The Real Bev
> >>
> >>Hey, I have Medicare and a Blue Cross supplement. I'm happy.
> >
> > Typical. I've got mine, the rest of you can go to hell.
>
> I would have thought that was obvious. Should I use shorter words?

I know what you mean. I drive a 2008 Prius. My total gas cost dropped by
about half of what I used to pay before I bought my Prius in January.
The more the price of gas goes up, the less traffic there is on my daily
commute, which is a real time saver for me. I am rather enjoying these
gas price increases.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ur Blood will be Freezed to see this Photo [award winner PHOTO]
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/1052fb90bdded1be?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 1:56 am
From: "poonam.arya99@gmail.com"

Friends! Its very hard to see but its truth...

Just see the pic of unfortunate
http://www.merinews.com/bigImage.do?method=Brief&imageID=451&tagIndex=706

Do you know, After 3 months, photographer who taken these photos
suicide due to depression

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Problem with furniture smell (formaldehyde), what to do?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/49080cee2d2ed8dd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 2:48 am
From: jtnospam@yahoo.com

On Jun 16, 6:18 pm, nos...@none.com wrote:
> I have a bedroom furniture set which I purchased 8 month ago from a
> large retailer. It is solid wood with wood veneers, and drawers are
> made of plywoods (uncoated).
>
> I have a big problem with its smell and I believe it is due to the
> formaldehyde in the plywood and glue. I've been trying to air it out
> by opening all the drawers and windows, but it's been 8 month, and
> although it probably is a little better, it still smells strongly if
> windows are closed overnight. The worst part is, I get a bad sour
> throat if I sleep in the room. My wife is pregnant so I am being very
> cautious, we've been sleeping in a different room since we purchased
> the furniture.
>
> The smell is mostly coming from the drawers, which have uncoated
> plywood boards, and a little bit from the veneers, probably from the
> glue. This is consistent with the information I can find on
> formaldehyde. It's kind of a warm paint like smell.
>
> I called the company and explained the problem, but it doesn't look
> like they are willing to take it back. I want to know if someone can
> suggest a better way for me to handle this. I can:
>
> 1) Take my loss and throw out the furniture. It's $3k, but I don't
> want to risk my life or my unborn child's health with it. (We gonna
> need that master bedroom when the kid is born). But 3K is a lot of
> money. I'd rather not go this route if other options are better.
>
> 2) Take a less loss and sell it on craigslist. Used furniture
> unfortunately does not sell much, and I don't know if I'll be able to
> sell it if at all.
>
> 3) Find some companies to come out and test the level of formaldehyde
> in the air or in the product. If I leave the windows and door closed
> overnight, the room definitely smells. If I have some kind of proof
> that the product is a health hazard, then the company may take it
> back. If the product is indeed not safe, I don't want others to be buy
> it either.
>
> What company does these type of testing? I called the manufacturer of
> the furniture, but they claim they follow all standards and smell
> should go away after 2 to 3 days, yeah right! I recall a while ago a
> lady called some company to test the mercury level in the room after
> she broke a florescent light... Is this the same type of company? Who
> did the testing in the lead level in toys? The manufacturers right?
>
> 4) Does the government offer any help in dealing with these type of
> product safety issues? Who should I contact?
>
> The product is made in China. We all heard about the lead paint on
> toys. My gut feeling is the factories that made these plywoods in
> China does not follow the US standards on how much off gasing the
> plywoods can have (for indoor use). What's the best way to get this
> tested one way or the other? If I have to spend some money to test
> this (say $100 or $200, I have no idea how much these things cost) I
> don't mind, but if it cost $1000, then probably not.
>
> Thanks in advance..
>
> Ray

Formaldehyde is very serious. Go ahead and contact the company that
did your mercury testing, chances are they test for formaldehyde as
well. The typical method is to sample the air thru a glass ampule for
a ppm (parts per million) exposure over a given period. If it were a
workplace, OSHA would have jurisdiction. I suppose that the Consumer
Products Safety Commission has jurisdiction, but Bush has gutted their
funding and has appointed his Texas cronies over Federal agencies,
that have neither the knowledge or the desire to enforce the law,
quite like the response to Katrina and border enforcement. If you live
in a state that takes these things seriously, such as California, you
will get some help from them. With your test results, you could match
the permissible exposure limits (check the code of federal
regulations, EPA on the internet), and you could sue the store to take
it back and refund your money, a laborious process. Another route
would be to contact the media, a local TV station or newspaper, stores
hate bad publicity, but if the store has a large advertising contract
with the station or newspaper, they may spike it.
You are right about goods from China. They have no health,
environmental, safety or industrial standards, and even if they did,
their gov't is so rife with corruption, patronage and bribery that it
would not matter if they did. We have no way of inspecting goods from
China, and politicians here are so dependent on Chinese money that
they have no desire to change the present system. I avoid Chinese
products whenever possible.
If you don't know where to start, just Google "formaldehyde exposure"
and follow the links. Best wishes.-Jitney

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 6:16 am
From: "EXT"

I agree. We checked out some Chinese furniture and found that the condition
of the wood, species of wood (unknown), the construction techniques, and the
finish were all substandard, while the retailer charged as much for it as
many North American made pieces. I avoid Chinese furniture like the plague,
and buy local products.

<jtnospam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:710ce0f4-aa99-4c0c-a6f8-1dd473f4c7af@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 16, 6:18 pm, nos...@none.com wrote:
> I have a bedroom furniture set which I purchased 8 month ago from a
> large retailer. It is solid wood with wood veneers, and drawers are
> made of plywoods (uncoated).
>
> I have a big problem with its smell and I believe it is due to the
> formaldehyde in the plywood and glue. I've been trying to air it out
> by opening all the drawers and windows, but it's been 8 month, and
> although it probably is a little better, it still smells strongly if
> windows are closed overnight. The worst part is, I get a bad sour
> throat if I sleep in the room. My wife is pregnant so I am being very
> cautious, we've been sleeping in a different room since we purchased
> the furniture.
>
> The smell is mostly coming from the drawers, which have uncoated
> plywood boards, and a little bit from the veneers, probably from the
> glue. This is consistent with the information I can find on
> formaldehyde. It's kind of a warm paint like smell.
>
> I called the company and explained the problem, but it doesn't look
> like they are willing to take it back. I want to know if someone can
> suggest a better way for me to handle this. I can:
>
> 1) Take my loss and throw out the furniture. It's $3k, but I don't
> want to risk my life or my unborn child's health with it. (We gonna
> need that master bedroom when the kid is born). But 3K is a lot of
> money. I'd rather not go this route if other options are better.
>
> 2) Take a less loss and sell it on craigslist. Used furniture
> unfortunately does not sell much, and I don't know if I'll be able to
> sell it if at all.
>
> 3) Find some companies to come out and test the level of formaldehyde
> in the air or in the product. If I leave the windows and door closed
> overnight, the room definitely smells. If I have some kind of proof
> that the product is a health hazard, then the company may take it
> back. If the product is indeed not safe, I don't want others to be buy
> it either.
>
> What company does these type of testing? I called the manufacturer of
> the furniture, but they claim they follow all standards and smell
> should go away after 2 to 3 days, yeah right! I recall a while ago a
> lady called some company to test the mercury level in the room after
> she broke a florescent light... Is this the same type of company? Who
> did the testing in the lead level in toys? The manufacturers right?
>
> 4) Does the government offer any help in dealing with these type of
> product safety issues? Who should I contact?
>
> The product is made in China. We all heard about the lead paint on
> toys. My gut feeling is the factories that made these plywoods in
> China does not follow the US standards on how much off gasing the
> plywoods can have (for indoor use). What's the best way to get this
> tested one way or the other? If I have to spend some money to test
> this (say $100 or $200, I have no idea how much these things cost) I
> don't mind, but if it cost $1000, then probably not.
>
> Thanks in advance..
>
> Ray

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:47 am
From:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>I would buy a few cans of spray varnish at a big box hardware store
>and spray everything in sight on the drawers except the fronts which
>should already be finished. Then as soon as the spray varnish has
>driec to handle, put the drawers outside in the sun to air and dry. 3
>or 4 cans shouldd be plenty for one or two dressers. Total cost under
>$25 so worth the effort.

While an excellent idea that will probably work, I wouldn't do this until
all other remedies have been exhausted. I would get the stuff tested, then
insist that the company take it back. Also, immediately contact your state's
Attorney General. Any valid complaint from a consumer with the words "cc:
Attorney General, State of XX" will strike fear into the heart of any
reputable business owner.

If you have no luck with the Consumer Protection Agency or the AG's office
or the company itself, then try the local news stations. Usually they have a
reporter who does consumer issue pieces, and if you play the pregnant
wife/dangerous fumes card, you could get a nice segment aired at 6 and 11.
Even just threatening the store with bad local press ("the segment is airing
next week") could get them to take it back.

The big problem is that it's been 8 months. I would have returned it after 2
days and voided the credit card sale. You DID use a credit card, right? If
so, contact your issuer and see if they can help. You're always ok within 6
months, but since you've been in contact with the store all along you might
be ok. Explain that they've been telling you the same BS for 8 months,
pregnant wife, yadda yadda, and maybe you'll get some play.

If all else fails, try the varnish route. Polyurethane works too.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:42 am
From: "rick++"

My skin starts turning pink if I so much
walk into a cheap leather goods store
form all the formaldahyde lurking there.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: JEWS WHO FLEECED AMERICA OF A TRILLION BUCKS
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/bf1e12e50bbd4e80?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 3:56 am
From: wismel@yahoo.com

On Mon, 16 Jun 2008 22:50:25 -0400, "ElParedon" <serwad@bellsouth.net>
wrote:

>BOSTON (Reuters) - A former hedge fund manager convicted of fraud is alive
>and on the run a week after staging a suicide on a bridge above New York's
>Hudson River, U.S. authorities said on Monday.
>
>The U.S. Marshals Service confirmed that Samuel Israel III, who engineered
>the $2 trillion hedge fund industry's most brazen and long-running fraud,
>did not leap to his death last Monday when his GMC Envoy was found on a
>bridge above the Hudson River, its engine idling and the words "suicide is
>painless" etched in dust on its hood.
>
>"Suicide has been ruled out," William Dundon, a spokesman for the U.S.
>Marshals Service, said in an e-mail to Reuters.
>
>Another law enforcement official who is familiar with the investigation, but
>not authorized to speak publicly on the matter said "the investigation is
>solely a fugitive investigation now."
>
>Israel, 48, had been due to begin serving a 20-year prison term in Ayer,
>Massachusetts a week ago.
>
>Officials would not say how authorities had learned that Israel, who suffers
>back and heart problems, was alive. But after no body washed up on the
>Hudson's shores for days, police became skeptical he was dead.
>
>In April, Israel was sentenced for fabricating investment returns, making up
>an accounting firm to sign off on documents and ultimately stealing $450
>million from investors, including Indiana's DePauw University.
>
>He was out on bail to allow time for prison officials to prepare his
>medication, court documents show.
>
>In an ironic twist, Israel's disappearance may be especially awkward for his
>lawyers.
>
>Lawyers at Morvillo, Abramowitz, Grand, Iason, Anello & Bohrer, P.C.
>defended Israel plus another fugitive, Jacob "Kobi" Alexander, the former
>chief executive of Comverse Technology Inc, who is wanted in the U.S. on
>stock-options backdating charges. Alexander escaped U.S. authorities in 2006
>and has been living in Namibia since then.
>
>(Editing by Jason Szep)
>

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 5:04 am
From: "BuffettHater@gmail.com"

attaboy, we're number one !!!!

Sorry to piss you off, nice nazi, but hitler was not a suicide and
burning,
he hid in a septic tank and drowned in shit.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:04 am
From: Mani Deli

What about all the Christians who fleeced America. Jails are full of
Christians. So what? Religion has nothing to do with it.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wall insulation renovation
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/d7e64979a4eb8ebd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 5:28 am
From: nicksanspam@ece.villanova.edu

James <jlinn@idirect.com> wrote:

>> >The R Value of air Krete is 3.9 per inch...
>>
>> That's very hard to believe.
>>
>According to their website, they had Dynatech, an independant lab test
>it. The results for a 1.63 inch slab at 75 degrees was R of 6.3, which
>approximates 3.9 per inch. Icynene claims similar results...
>
>You have an experience to contradict their statements?

No. I confused it with R1.05 "aerated concrete." Air Krete is interesting,
at 2.07 lb/ft^3. And $2/ft^2 vs 20 cent fiberglass in a 2x6 wall?
Does that include the wire mesh?

Nick

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 6:20 am
From: James

On Jun 17, 8:28 am, nicksans...@ece.villanova.edu wrote:
> James <jl...@idirect.com> wrote:
> >> >The R Value of air Krete is 3.9 per inch...
>
> >> That's very hard to believe.
>
> >According to their website, they had Dynatech, an independant lab test
> >it. The results for a 1.63 inch slab at 75 degrees was R of 6.3, which
> >approximates 3.9 per inch. Icynene claims similar results...
>
> >You have an experience to contradict their statements?
>
> No. I confused it with R1.05 "aerated concrete." Air Krete is interesting,
> at 2.07 lb/ft^3. And $2/ft^2 vs 20 cent fiberglass in a 2x6 wall?
> Does that include the wire mesh?

Neither of the two products I've seen require any wire wesh. They are
designed to be poured in from a hole in the drywall and fall down,
filling in around pipes and wires. I have seen pictures of the Icynene
sprayed in between roof joists, but its a different formula and has a
lower R value. I'm thinking it would have to be lighter or stick
better since it isn't covered or screened.

In my situation, and I'm sure similar to many others, the cost of
ripping out the drywall to re-insulate justifies the higher cost. The
added benefit is that it creates a vapour barrier as well.

James

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:38 am
From: Jeff

James wrote:
> Due to increasing heating bills, I am looking at re-insulating my
> walls and attic.
>
> The house is a two story house built in the mid 70s, with brick
> exterior on the bottom and aluminium siding on the upper floor. I'm in
> the greater Toronto area, my heating source is all electric baseboard
> and installing a furnace would be a major renovation since I have no
> ductwork. Gas was not available on the street when the place was built
> but has been for sometime. I have also considered bringing in gas to
> put in a natural gas fireplace in the basement, and replacing the
> electric water heater with a gas one.
>
> The attic is straightforward and easy to do myself - the fibreglass
> has settled and I need more.
>
> The walls are another matter. I do think they were insulated at the
> time of building with loose cellulose, but I think over the course of
> 30 years, it has settled and/or shrunk with moisture. I think I will
> be in the home for a while, and I would like to invest in something
> that will really help.
>
> I've read about 2 different foams that may help - Icynene and
> AirKrete. Both are poured into the walls and expand making a vapour
> barrier. Small holes are made in the drywall and the material is
> poured from the top.

You still need to pour below the the firebreak, or you'll have an empty
cavity there.
>
> The R Value of air Krete is 3.9 per inch, Icynene 4.

Dense Pack cellulose is rated at R13 for a 3.5" wall. That works out
to R 3.7. I don't believe there are any settling problems as this is
quite dense.

I don't see the advantage in the foam fill for the cost. Cocoon is 33
SF per $8 bag (2x4 16" center). That should just be a few hundred
dollars for your house. That's provided you do the labor, otherwise the
calculations are different. I *think* Icynene is around $2 SF, or about
8 times as much.

These guys claim dense pack has a higher R value:

http://nationalfiber.com/uploads/universe/docs/wysiwyg/documents/Cellulose_Compared_to_Icynene.pdf

I'd take the money saved and use it elsewhere, perhaps in upgrading
the windows.

I've done the cellulose in my 20's house and like it. Perhaps I would
have liked Icynene also, but I wouldn't have been able to afford it!

At any rate, you are doing the right thing by upgrading your insulation.

Jeff
>
> Has anyone used either of these two products? I think its going to be
> a major investment, and I'd like to make the most out of it. With
> similar R values, its hard to choose between the two on anything other
> than price. I can get grants of up to $1500 from the federal
> government, which should cover a fair chunk of it.
>
> James
>
>
>

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 8:27 am
From: James

On Jun 17, 10:38 am, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:
> James wrote:
> > Due to increasing heating bills, I am looking at re-insulating my
> > walls and attic.
>
> > The house is a two story house built in the mid 70s, with brick
> > exterior on the bottom and aluminium siding on the upper floor. I'm in
> > the greater Toronto area, my heating source is all electric baseboard
> > and installing a furnace would be a major renovation since I have no
> > ductwork. Gas was not available on the street when the place was built
> > but has been for sometime. I have also considered bringing in gas to
> > put in a natural gas fireplace in the basement, and replacing the
> > electric water heater with a gas one.
>
> > The attic is straightforward and easy to do myself - the fibreglass
> > has settled and I need more.
>
> > The walls are another matter. I do think they were insulated at the
> > time of building with loose cellulose, but I think over the course of
> > 30 years, it has settled and/or shrunk with moisture. I think I will
> > be in the home for a while, and I would like to invest in something
> > that will really help.
>
> > I've read about 2 different foams that may help - Icynene and
> > AirKrete. Both are poured into the walls and expand making a vapour
> > barrier. Small holes are made in the drywall and the material is
> > poured from the top.
>
> You still need to pour below the the firebreak, or you'll have an empty
> cavity there.
>
>
>
> > The R Value of air Krete is 3.9 per inch, Icynene 4.
>
> Dense Pack cellulose is rated at R13 for a 3.5" wall. That works out
> to R 3.7. I don't believe there are any settling problems as this is
> quite dense.
>
> I don't see the advantage in the foam fill for the cost. Cocoon is 33
> SF per $8 bag (2x4 16" center). That should just be a few hundred
> dollars for your house. That's provided you do the labor, otherwise the
> calculations are different. I *think* Icynene is around $2 SF, or about
> 8 times as much.
>
> These guys claim dense pack has a higher R value:
>
> http://nationalfiber.com/uploads/universe/docs/wysiwyg/documents/Cell...
>
> I'd take the money saved and use it elsewhere, perhaps in upgrading
> the windows.
>
> I've done the cellulose in my 20's house and like it. Perhaps I would
> have liked Icynene also, but I wouldn't have been able to afford it!
>
> At any rate, you are doing the right thing by upgrading your insulation.
>
> Jeff
Maybe its the sales hype, but the knock against cellulose is that it
settles, and if it gets wet it looses part of its R value.

Part of the process for government rebate is a before and after energy
audit. I chose a company that is independant - it does not install
anything, it only does audits for a living. Hopefully they can help
steer me.

You may be right, maybe its worth doing the cellulose and windows for
the price.

James

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 9:35 am
From: Jeff

James wrote:
> On Jun 17, 10:38 am, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_not.com> wrote:
>> James wrote:
>>> Due to increasing heating bills, I am looking at re-insulating my
>>> walls and attic.
>>> The house is a two story house built in the mid 70s, with brick
>>> exterior on the bottom and aluminium siding on the upper floor. I'm in
>>> the greater Toronto area, my heating source is all electric baseboard
>>> and installing a furnace would be a major renovation since I have no
>>> ductwork. Gas was not available on the street when the place was built
>>> but has been for sometime. I have also considered bringing in gas to
>>> put in a natural gas fireplace in the basement, and replacing the
>>> electric water heater with a gas one.
>>> The attic is straightforward and easy to do myself - the fibreglass
>>> has settled and I need more.
>>> The walls are another matter. I do think they were insulated at the
>>> time of building with loose cellulose, but I think over the course of
>>> 30 years, it has settled and/or shrunk with moisture. I think I will
>>> be in the home for a while, and I would like to invest in something
>>> that will really help.
>>> I've read about 2 different foams that may help - Icynene and
>>> AirKrete. Both are poured into the walls and expand making a vapour
>>> barrier. Small holes are made in the drywall and the material is
>>> poured from the top.
>> You still need to pour below the the firebreak, or you'll have an empty
>> cavity there.
>>
>>
>>
>>> The R Value of air Krete is 3.9 per inch, Icynene 4.
>> Dense Pack cellulose is rated at R13 for a 3.5" wall. That works out
>> to R 3.7. I don't believe there are any settling problems as this is
>> quite dense.
>>
>> I don't see the advantage in the foam fill for the cost. Cocoon is 33
>> SF per $8 bag (2x4 16" center). That should just be a few hundred
>> dollars for your house. That's provided you do the labor, otherwise the
>> calculations are different. I *think* Icynene is around $2 SF, or about
>> 8 times as much.
>>
>> These guys claim dense pack has a higher R value:
>>
>> http://nationalfiber.com/uploads/universe/docs/wysiwyg/documents/Cell...
>>
>> I'd take the money saved and use it elsewhere, perhaps in upgrading
>> the windows.
>>
>> I've done the cellulose in my 20's house and like it. Perhaps I would
>> have liked Icynene also, but I wouldn't have been able to afford it!
>>
>> At any rate, you are doing the right thing by upgrading your insulation.
>>
>> Jeff
> Maybe its the sales hype, but the knock against cellulose is that it
> settles, and if it gets wet it looses part of its R value.

I think if you have water in your walls you have a bigger problem than
insulation. Cellulose breathes a bit and can absorb some moisture with
no ill effects toward it's R value.

As far as settling, I think this is a minor issue if you install
this correctly. All you do is drill a 1" hole a few feet above the
bottom, and another a foot below the top (That ensures that if you have
a fire break, that you are both above and below it). The machines blow
at considerable pressure, and you'll want a machine that you can
throttle back the insulation flow (this is just a gate, but not all
machines have them). You fill first from the bottom and then top off the
top. This is dense packed and when the it stops filling I can assure
you that no more insulation will fill in! It's pretty solid and will
resist poking a finger in. It's about twice the density of loose fill
and actually makes a good sound barrier.

Now, I don't know for a fact if I will get any long term settling,
but I do know that when I insulated walls I had missed two years earlier
that I went back to refill some of the original walls and found that I
could add no new insulation. They were still packed.

The biggest problem in installation is not blocking the nozzle as it
can be hard to clear out. Stop the machine after each cavity is filled
and start at the next. Also, it helps greatly to break up the insulation
before you put it in the machine.

http://greenfiber.com/homeowners/how_to_retrofit.asp

They have a toll free number if you want to talk with someone, I did...

Jeff

>
> Part of the process for government rebate is a before and after energy
> audit. I chose a company that is independant - it does not install
> anything, it only does audits for a living. Hopefully they can help
> steer me.
>
> You may be right, maybe its worth doing the cellulose and windows for
> the price.
>
> James

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 10:12 am
From: Anthony Matonak

James wrote:
...
> I've read about 2 different foams that may help - Icynene and
> AirKrete. Both are poured into the walls and expand making a vapour
> barrier. Small holes are made in the drywall and the material is
> poured from the top.

I've heard something about Icynene foam producing cyanide gas
when it burns. You might want to look into polyurethane foam
instead. Even there you might have to make sure they don't
use penta-BDE or deca-BDE for fire protection as there are
rumors it's a bit toxic.

The last time I looked at AirKrete it was very expensive.

Anthony

==============================================================================
TOPIC: supply dior versace armani burberry gucci prada sunglasses
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5d4ba1a28b0d28fd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
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TOPIC: hai huys,
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c6dceb65214001ed?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:26 am
From: yongjunxu.trading@gmail.com

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== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 10:13 am
From: NorgannonTimes@gmail.com

On Jun 17, 10:26 am, yongjunxu.trad...@gmail.com wrote:
> Discount WaTcHeS, Sunglasses,Smet T-shirts, COOGI T-shirts, POLO T-
> shirts, LRG
> Jeans,
> EDhardy Jeans, Evisu Jeans, etc , China supply
>
> (www.86wa tches.com )
>
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> China
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> shirts Designer T-Shirts Helen Coat burberry coat Cheap Jacket Juicy
> Couture bbc hoodies bape hoodies Cheap Designer Hoodies NFL NHL NBA
> MLB Jersey

NorgannonTimes@Gmail.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Capital One Bank overauthorizes then charges high late fee
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ddf6473f33b6ed21?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:45 am
From: seeker

On Jun 13, 9:51 am, George Grapman <sfgeo...@paccbell.net> wrote:
> seeker wrote:
> > Hi i have noticed thatCapitaloneroutinely authorizes more than the
> > account limit only to assess a $39 late fee
>
> Don't go over your limit.

The thing is, when you call for your account balance to get available
credit,it is not always accurate... so you think you have more
available than you actually have

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 10:29 am
From: Cindy Hamilton

On Jun 17, 10:45 am, seeker <mothman20052...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jun 13, 9:51 am, George Grapman <sfgeo...@paccbell.net> wrote:
>
> > seeker wrote:
> > > Hi i have noticed thatCapitaloneroutinely authorizes more than the
> > > account limit only to assess a $39 late fee
>
> > Don't go over your limit.
>
> The thing is, when you call for your account balance to get available
> credit,it is not always accurate... so you think you have more
> available than you actually have

I'll do George Grapman one better:

Don't get so close to your limit. If you have to call the credit card
issuer
to find out if you're close to going over, you're too damn close.

Likewise, if you have to call the bank to find out what your checking
account
balance is supposed to be, you need to get in the habit of reconciling
your
checkbook against your statements every single month.

Cindy Hamilton

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Citizens Bank giving misleading account balances?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/a2bf516c84daeb68?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 7:52 am
From: seeker

I have heard of several people i know getting whacked for courtesy
overdraft fees in the hundreds and aven $12-1500 range. It appears
that pending transactions are not mentioned when customers call them
so they end up revising their check registers with incorrect
balances,causing overdrafts. I also know someone who was issued a
debit card and todl erroneously that the card was to be linked to
their savings, when it could not be. That person went a made a large
number of small transactions, each of which resulted in an overdraft
charge. When the person went to the bank they confiscated that
person's whole paycheck for 2 pay periods and would not reverse
overdraft charges even though bank personnel admitted their error.
This was in NH.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 10:13 am
From: NorgannonTimes@gmail.com

On Jun 17, 10:52 am, seeker <mothman20052...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I have heard of several people i know getting whacked for courtesy
> overdraft fees in the hundreds and aven $12-1500 range. It appears
> that pending transactions are not mentioned when customers call them
> so they end up revising their check registers with incorrect
> balances,causing overdrafts. I also know someone who was issued a
> debit card and todl erroneously that the card was to be linked to
> their savings, when it could not be. That person went a made a large
> number of small transactions, each of which resulted in an overdraft
> charge. When the person went to the bank they confiscated that
> person's whole paycheck for 2 pay periods and would not reverse
> overdraft charges even though bank personnel admitted their error.
> This was in NH.

NorgannonTimes@Gmail.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Our Troubled Country - Importing Poverty ( Frosty Wooldridge )
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/47ef53144fdedf82?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 17 2008 12:02 pm
From: billimmelman@yahoo.com

On Jun 17, 3:36 am, wis...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:46:18 GMT, jazzerci...@hotmail.com (-) wrote:
>
> >http://www.rense.com/general82/importing.htm
>
> >Our Troubled Country - Importing Poverty
> >By Frosty Wooldridge
> >6-17-8
>
> >Brian Williams reported to the nation last month that Detroit, Michigan high
> >schools suffer a 76 percent drop-out/flunk-out rate for high school seniors.
> >All totaled, 1.2 million eighteen year olds hit the streets functionally
> >illiterate annually. In Denver, Colorado, 73 percent of children live in
> >poverty.
>
> >U.S. Representative Tom Tancredo said, "Immigration, both legal and illegal,
> >is the cause of a significant part of Colorado's increase in child poverty."
>
> >The number of children under the age of 18 living in poverty increased from
> >104,000 in 2000 to 180,000 in 2006, in Colorado. Colorado led the nation in
> >child poverty, yet features only 4.6 million people-except---that state houses
> >500,000 and as high as 695,000 illegal alien migrants. Colorado schools suffer
> >43 different languages, which cause havoc in classrooms. One in five teachers
> >quits or transfers out of Denver Public Schools every nine months. (Source:
> >Rocky Mountain News)
>
> >"It is irresponsible for the media and the governor to not recognize the fact
> >that immigration is largely to blame for this increase," Tancredo said. "If
> >Colorado were actually enforcing its own laws, we would reduce the number of
> >people in the poverty category."
>
> >However, Colorado Governor Bill Ritter (D) refuses to enforce H.B. 1023. The
> >legislature passed that law in 2006 to fine and imprison employers of illegal
> >aliens. Ritter won't enforce it while Colorado taxpayers shell out $1.1
> >billion annually for all services for illegal aliens and their children.
>
> >The president of the Colorado Children's Campaign gave a lame excuse,
> >"changing demographics of the state." As in Detroit, Chicago, New York,
> >Dallas, Houston and Los Angeles, political correctness disavows the reason for
> >a total breakdown in U.S. schools and accelerating poverty.
>
> >"The research is clear," Tancredo said. "An increase in immigration leads to
> >an increase in poverty. If we truly want to do something about poverty in
> >Colorado and our nation, we must stop importing poverty. We must begin
> >enforcing the laws, primarily against hiring illegal aliens, which will force
> >self-deportation of others in that category."
>
> >How fast do immigrants and illegal migrants pour into the United States? For a
> >stupefying understanding of the numbers, every 30 days, 182,000 to 200,000
> >legal immigrants and illegal aliens arrive in America. To give you an idea of
> >how many people that represents: those immigrants fill two 100,000 seat
> >Pasadena Rose Bowls. At the end of the month, they empty into the streets,
> >communities and states of America at a cost of $346 billion annually to U.S.
> >taxpayers. (Source:
> ><http://www.thesocialcontract.com/>www.thesocialcontract.com) They overload
> >schools, hospitals and prisons. Even the legal immigrants tap into billions of
> >dollars for resettlement into this country.
>
> >During the next month, two more Rose Bowls fill up! Again, they empty out into
> >America, month in and month out, year in and year out.
>
> >Across the nation, every aspect of immigration impedes America's ability to
> >solve poverty, create jobs, maintain living wages, sustain viable educational
> >standards and keep pace with prison populations.
>
> >Both legal and illegal immigrants arrive from third world countries with
> >cultures and educations that remain incompatible with America's first world
> >culture.
>
> >As those immigrants receive aid for their problems, The National Coalition for
> >the Homeless, <http://www.nationalhomeless.org/>www.nationalhomeless.org
> >reported 3.5 million homeless citizens struggled for survival in the streets
> >of America in 2006. Of that number, 1.35 million consist of homeless
> >children. Reports show 13 million American children suffer daily from
> >malnutrition and hunger in America. A shocking 37 million Americans live below
> >the poverty line, which is 12.7 percent of our population.
>
> >As reported by ABC's Charles Gibson, an astounding 28 million Americans live
> >on food stamps in 2008.
>
> >In my travels throughout Mexico, I witnessed our future. On the outskirts of
> >Mexico City with 22 million people, in excess of two million people live in
> >cardboard shacks. They squat for their morning constitutional with their
> >chickens. They live in abject misery, filth, disease and hopelessness.
>
> >Guess what? They're moving to America. Millions of them!
>
> >Third world slums began appearing along our borders (on our side) from
> >Brownsville, Texas to San Diego, California in the 80s. They're called
> >"Colonias," which in Spanish means "new neighborhoods." They feature shacks,
> >no sewers, no streets, no running water, no electricity, toilet facilities or
> >waste pickup.
>
> >The New York Times, March 3, 1988, "Along the US Border, a Third World is
> >Reborn," reported, "Colonias are rusted trailers and shacks nailed together
> >from tar paper and packing pallets without indoor toiletswith mounds of
> >uncollected trash that attract ratsthe lack of sanitation has polluted the
> >ground water to the point where many residents drink their own wastethe
> >colonias feature Third World levels of hepatitis, dysentery, diarrhea, skin
> >rashes, cholera and tuberculosisthey are contaminated, explosive, fecal,
> >filthy, illegal, miserable, polluted, powder kegs, putrid, shocking, sick,
> >stench filled, suffering and wrenching."
>
> >Since their appearance in the early 80s, according to the Times, the 1988
> >population totaled 185,000; the 1995 population exceeded 500,000; the 2005
> >population exceeded 1.5 million. At the current rate of growth, these human
> >misery settlements shall reach 20 million by 2021. Little known to most
> >Americans, Mexico expects to triple their population from 100 million to 300
> >million in this century. Thus, no end of the line of migrants plodding north
> >to America in search of a better life!
>
> >I spent two weeks filming colonias in Texas. I haven't been as sickened to my
> >stomach since my travels in Asia. It's worse than any description the New York
> >Times or I could give you. Colonias represent human misery at its disturbing
> >worst levels.
>
> >These slums represent a health hazard of unprecedented dimensions. Given
> >enough time, large areas of southern California, Arizona and Texas will
> >resemble the outskirts of Mexico City. Two decades of denial continues the
> >expansion of American "colonias."
>
> >Who becomes the final victim? America and her citizens plunge into poverty via
> >the addition of two Rose Bowls loaded with immigrants every 30 days, month in
> >and month out until our poor and middle class cannot find a job, a home or a
> >place to run from this madness.
>
> >Can anyone name a single, solitary reason for continuing this kind of national
> >suicide? Who brings it to you? Your U.S. States Senate and House of
> >Representatives!
>
> >##
>
> >To take action:www.numbersusa.com
>
> >www.thesocialcontract.com
>
> >www.fairus.org
>
> >www.proenglish.org
>
> >www.capsweb.org
>
> >www.vdare.com
>
> >Final note: I am looking for thinkers, writers and advocates to add to my
> >monthly "Master Mind Think Tank." In reality, our politicians foment the
> >problems that they campaign to solve. They never solve them; thus we spiral
> >into deeper national chaos. I need new ideas and new creative thinkers to help
> >me bring our most pressing issues onto the front burner: overpopulation in
> >America caused by ceaseless legal and illegal immigration. As you know, the
> >recent PEW report shows immigration adding 100 million people to our country
> >in 30 years. We need to stop it and we need to stop it now. Join me in saving
> >our civilization. fros...@juno.com
>
> >Frosty Wooldridge has bicycled across six continents - from the Arctic to the
> >South Pole - as well as six times across the USA, coast to coast and border to
> >border. In 2005, he bicycled from the Arctic Circle, Norway to Athens, Greece.
> >He presents "The Coming Population Crisis in America: and what you can do
> >about it" to civic clubs, church groups, high schools and colleges. He works
> >to bring about sensible world population balance atwww.frostywooldridge.com
>
> >From: Frosty Wooldridge
>
> >This three minute interview with Adam Schrager on "Your Show" May 4, 2008, NBC
> >Channel 9 News, addresses the ramifications of adding 120 million people to
> >USA in 35 years and six million people to Colorado as to water shortages, air
> >pollution, loss of farmland, energy costs and degradation of quality of life.
> >In the interview, Frosty Wooldridge explains the ramifications of adding 120
> >million people to the USA in 35 years. He advances new concepts such as a
> >"Colorado Carrying Capacity Policy"; "Colorado Environmental Impact Policy";
> >"Colorado Water Usage Policy"; "Colorado Sustainable Population Policy".
> >Nationally, the USA needs a "National Sustainable Population Policy" to
> >determine the carrying capacity of this nation for the short and long term.
> >Wooldridge is available for interviews on radio and TV having interviewed on
> >ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and FOX.
>
> >Click the link to view the 3 minute interview with NBC's Adam Schrager:
>
> >http://www.9news.com/video/player.aspx?aid=52364
>
> >Frosty Wooldridge
>
> >www.frostywooldridge.com
>
> >Disclaimer
>
> >MainPage
> >http://www.rense.com
>
> >This Site Served by TheHostPros
>
> Only a comatose public coupled with a whoreish political system allows
> this national tragedy to continue.
>
> ted- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

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Tuesday, June 17, 2008

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