Frugal Living: misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 8 topics

Monday, June 7, 2010

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

misc.consumers.frugal-living
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en

misc.consumers.frugal-living@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: It wont stay shut by itself
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/b4b28ebf5a595a15?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 10:52 am
From: Whiskers

["Followup-To:" header set to 24hoursupport.helpdesk.]
On 2010-06-06, Meat Plow <mhywatt@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 16:13:54 +0100, The Natural Philosopher ǝʇoɹʍ:
>> Jeff The Drunk wrote:
>>> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 11:06:09 -0400, Ralph Mowery wrote:
>>>> "john hamilton" <bluestarx@mail.invalid> wrote in message
>>>> news:hugc8b$uec$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>> Have tried using the strongest cuboard magnet I can find (In north
>>>>> London u.k.), but if the wind picks up surprisingly it will just not
>>>>> hold. [...]

To the OP: why not install a simple latch on the door? (The sort meant
for house doors, of course!).

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 2:21 pm
From: "newshound"

> Have tried using the strongest cuboard magnet I can find (In north London
> u.k.),

eBay for Rare Earth Magnets, they come in all shapes and sizes including
disks with holes which can be screwed in place. I have them on an awkward
cupboard door which won't hold on normal latches.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How much power does a 120v 15A lighted switch use anyway?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/3870703c69659a21?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 11:07 am
From: SMS

On 17/05/10 6:53 PM, Glenda Copeland wrote:
> Just bought a dozen Leviton decora single pole 15A 120VAC lighted rocker
> switches (model 5611, aka model 105-05611-21S).
>
> Nothing on the box says how much power each of the lighted bulb uses when
> the switch is in the off position.
>
> Do you know how much power a lighted switch uses?

These have an NE-2 neon bulb which draws about 0.6mA, so at 120V it's
around 0.07 watts. So 1000 lighted switches would be a little less than
a 75 watt light bulb.

Suffice it to say, the watt-hours you'd save with even 50 unlighted
versus lighted switches would barely be measurable, even over the course
of a year.

Some people unplug things like phone chargers when not in use. I.e. an
iPhone charger draws 0.2W even when the phone is not connected, close to
3X what a lighted switch draws, but still a trivial amount.

You can buy power strips with individual switches to avoid unplugging
wall warts all the time. But you'd probably never recover the cost of
the power strip in saved electricity.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 12:07 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)

In article <4c0d3566$0$1620$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>, SMS wrote:
>On 17/05/10 6:53 PM, Glenda Copeland wrote:
<I snip a bit to edit for space>

>> Do you know how much power a lighted switch uses?
>
>These have an NE-2 neon bulb which draws about 0.6mA, so at 120V it's
>around 0.07 watts. So 1000 lighted switches would be a little less than
> a 75 watt light bulb.

My experience with a lighted switch is that its neon lamp is either
an A1C ("mini-NE-2H") or a C2A (NE-2H). Those get more like 2 mA.

>Suffice it to say, the watt-hours you'd save with even 50 unlighted
>versus lighted switches would barely be measurable, even over the course
>of a year.

One of these can easily consume 2 KWH per year.

>Some people unplug things like phone chargers when not in use. I.e. an
>iPhone charger draws 0.2W even when the phone is not connected, close to
>3X what a lighted switch draws, but still a trivial amount.

>You can buy power strips with individual switches to avoid unplugging
>wall warts all the time. But you'd probably never recover the cost of
>the power strip in saved electricity.

Plenty of wall warts consume a watt or two even when no load is
connected. As in basically all of the older technology ones that weigh
more and get warm to the touch even when operated unloaded. That is
fairly easily 8 to 16 KWH per year for each one.

--
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What are currently your best saving tips ?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/a23335cb8985c73c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 11:28 am
From: "Rod Speed"

me@privacy.net wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

>> Another obvious example is student loans that can give you
>> the qualifications to get a much better job and it generally
>> doesnt make sense to save for that sort of cost.

> Rod I'm on the fence on student loans

> I have student loans but looking back almost think it best to "pay as you go".

> what you say?

Your situation was rather different. You already had a
decent well paid job and just wanted something different.

Its different with a kid just out of school. It doesnt necessarily
make much sense for one of those to attempt to save up for
the cost of say medical qualification. It makes more sense to
use a student loan to get qualified and start practicing and
start earning a decent income and then pay off the student loan.

What makes sense does vary with the sort of qualifications
you decide you want. Particularly with engineering, there
have always been some jobs that not only allow you to
qualify while working, actually encourage you to do that.
That doesnt work with say qualifying as a doctor tho.

== 2 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 4:46 pm
From: "krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 11:04:29 -0500, me@privacy.net wrote:

>keith <keithw86@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Student loans are the means to higher priced education, which is why
>>the Demonicrats love them so. Note: Higher price <> better
>
>engineering school here.... for me

Ok? That doesn't change the facts, other than you'll have some chance of
paying it back.

== 3 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:14 pm
From: "Lou"

<krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
news:a0do06tpff9n2ljfuhrhht8nmfpjh8sgvk@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 18:10:47 -0500, The Daring Dufas
> <the-daring-dufas@peckerhead.net> wrote:
>
> >On 6/6/2010 6:03 PM, Lou wrote:
> >> "The Daring Dufas"<the-daring-dufas@peckerhead.net> wrote in message
> >> news:hugng7$km6$2@news.eternal-september.org...
> >>> On 6/6/2010 10:58 AM, Lou wrote:
> >>>> "The Real Bev"<bashley101@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:hufdel$26s$2@news.eternal-september.org...
> >>>>> On 06/05/10 20:53, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> "marco polo"<markphd21@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>
news:d5334a06-add5-44fd-ad9d-9dee8bce3f3c@x27g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> >>>>>>> .
> >>>>>>> in the long run,
> >>>>>>> you are much much better off increasing your income
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> i know it's less fun, but just think about it:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> increase your income, say $1 an hour,
> >>>>>>> or $10 a week, or $25 a month, or whatever,
> >>>>>>> and see what you have at the end of the year,
> >>>>>>> vs saving $1 here or $5 there, is clearly better
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> marc
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Sounds great, but not always easily done. With the present
economy,
> >>>>>> employers have cut OT, cut wages, cut hours, and much of the side
job
> >>>> part
> >>>>>> time stuff has dried up. Increasing income may be better, but
saving
> >>>> money
> >>>>>> is the only way for millions right now.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> AND the money you save isn't taxable!
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Well, that depends. When I lived in Georgia, money sitting in a bank
> >>>> account was taxable. If you had an account, you owed tax on the
balance
> >> and
> >>>> had to pay. After a year went by and tax time rolled around again,
you
> >> had
> >>>> to pay tax on whatever was in that account again, even if you hadn't
> >> touched
> >>>> the account at all. In essence, you paid tax on the same money again
> >> and
> >>>> again, for as long as you had it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Georgia? The state in the U.S.A. or the country of Georgia?
> >>>
> >> Georgia, the state in the U.S.A. All real and personal property in the
> >> state is taxable unless specifically exempted by law. At the time I
lived
> >> there, money in a bank account was not exempt.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Here in Alabamastan, I believe a bank account would be taxed if it
> >earned interest.
>
> Only the interest is taxed, not the principal. That's a normal capital
gains
> tax. Taxing the principal is *not* normal. Personal property is taxed in
> some states but I've never heard of cash being considered personal
property.

What would you call it? Property is generally classified into two types -
real and personal. Real property is land, usually things growing on it
(annual crops in at least some states are not considered real property) and
buildings. All property that is not real property is personal property.

== 4 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:17 pm
From: "Lou"

"Ron" <BigELilE05@msn.com> wrote in message
news:06945bfa-75c2-42bb-bd23-5f4a1ab9106f@i28g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...

(lotsastuff snipped)

> Georgia, the state in the U.S.A. All real and personal property in the
> state is taxable unless specifically exempted by law. At the time I lived
> there, money in a bank account was not exempt.

When did you live there?

Well, I've lived in New Jersey around 30 years, so it must be 31 years or so
ago.

== 5 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:18 pm
From: "Lou"

<krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
news:enbo06tkm62npcn4acmjn8l4297d98nfab@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 6 Jun 2010 18:52:38 -0400, "Lou" <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> ><krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
> >news:p2mn0659alncvvct1r39aokfr3pqlc30q1@4ax.com...
> >> On Sun, 6 Jun 2010 11:58:51 -0400, "Lou" <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >"The Real Bev" <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >news:hufdel$26s$2@news.eternal-september.org...
> >> >> On 06/05/10 20:53, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > "marco polo"<markphd21@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >> >
> >>
>news:d5334a06-add5-44fd-ad9d-9dee8bce3f3c@x27g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> >> >> >> .
> >> >> >> in the long run,
> >> >> >> you are much much better off increasing your income
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> i know it's less fun, but just think about it:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> increase your income, say $1 an hour,
> >> >> >> or $10 a week, or $25 a month, or whatever,
> >> >> >> and see what you have at the end of the year,
> >> >> >> vs saving $1 here or $5 there, is clearly better
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> marc
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Sounds great, but not always easily done. With the present
economy,
> >> >> > employers have cut OT, cut wages, cut hours, and much of the side
job
> >> >part
> >> >> > time stuff has dried up. Increasing income may be better, but
saving
> >> >money
> >> >> > is the only way for millions right now.
> >> >>
> >> >> AND the money you save isn't taxable!
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >Well, that depends. When I lived in Georgia, money sitting in a bank
> >> >account was taxable. If you had an account, you owed tax on the
balance
> >and
> >> >had to pay. After a year went by and tax time rolled around again,
you
> >had
> >> >to pay tax on whatever was in that account again, even if you hadn't
> >touched
> >> >the account at all. In essence, you paid tax on the same money again
and
> >> >again, for as long as you had it.
> >>
> >> I've *never* heard of such a thing. Do you have a citation?
> >
> >I'm reporting my experience. I don't have citations for my experience.
> >Possibly, I could dig out my tax returns from that time and post them
> >online, but it's not worth my trouble.
>
> No, I wouldn't expect that, just a pointer so I can see how stupid your
> politicians really are. DO you know what the tax was called? ...and I
kinda
> like Atlanta but maybe it's close enough. ;-)

Don't remember what it was called - as I've said elsewhere it was 30 plus
years ago.

== 6 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:24 pm
From: "Lou"

"Ron" <BigELilE05@msn.com> wrote in message
news:cd172b93-0981-41cd-9503-0f140c04b8cd@z8g2000yqz.googlegroups.com...

>If we are talking about Georgia, USA, it isn't true. It's not income.
>
>Most of my family has lived there their entire life. My father who is
>74 yrs old has never heard of such a thing, and he has lived there all
>but about 12 yrs of his life.
>
>You pay taxes on the interest only.

I don't know how he could never have heard of such a thing - as I recall, it
was on the last page of the state income tax form. You paid taxes on the
interest as part of the state income tax, but on the last page, you paid tax
on the principal. But for all I know, the tax was a county assessment - I
only lived there 15 months.

== 7 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:20 pm
From: aemeijers

Lou wrote:
> <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
> news:enbo06tkm62npcn4acmjn8l4297d98nfab@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 6 Jun 2010 18:52:38 -0400, "Lou" <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
>>> news:p2mn0659alncvvct1r39aokfr3pqlc30q1@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sun, 6 Jun 2010 11:58:51 -0400, "Lou" <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "The Real Bev" <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:hufdel$26s$2@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>> On 06/05/10 20:53, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "marco polo"<markphd21@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>
>> news:d5334a06-add5-44fd-ad9d-9dee8bce3f3c@x27g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>> in the long run,
>>>>>>>> you are much much better off increasing your income
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> i know it's less fun, but just think about it:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> increase your income, say $1 an hour,
>>>>>>>> or $10 a week, or $25 a month, or whatever,
>>>>>>>> and see what you have at the end of the year,
>>>>>>>> vs saving $1 here or $5 there, is clearly better
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> marc
>>>>>>> Sounds great, but not always easily done. With the present
> economy,
>>>>>>> employers have cut OT, cut wages, cut hours, and much of the side
> job
>>>>> part
>>>>>>> time stuff has dried up. Increasing income may be better, but
> saving
>>>>> money
>>>>>>> is the only way for millions right now.
>>>>>> AND the money you save isn't taxable!
>>>>>>
>>>>> Well, that depends. When I lived in Georgia, money sitting in a bank
>>>>> account was taxable. If you had an account, you owed tax on the
> balance
>>> and
>>>>> had to pay. After a year went by and tax time rolled around again,
> you
>>> had
>>>>> to pay tax on whatever was in that account again, even if you hadn't
>>> touched
>>>>> the account at all. In essence, you paid tax on the same money again
> and
>>>>> again, for as long as you had it.
>>>> I've *never* heard of such a thing. Do you have a citation?
>>> I'm reporting my experience. I don't have citations for my experience.
>>> Possibly, I could dig out my tax returns from that time and post them
>>> online, but it's not worth my trouble.
>> No, I wouldn't expect that, just a pointer so I can see how stupid your
>> politicians really are. DO you know what the tax was called? ...and I
> kinda
>> like Atlanta but maybe it's close enough. ;-)
>
> Don't remember what it was called - as I've said elsewhere it was 30 plus
> years ago.
>
>
IIRC, it was 'intangibles tax'.

== 8 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:29 pm
From: "Lou"

"Tony Sivori" <TonySivori@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2010.06.07.05.18.20.351494@yahoo.com...
> Colbyt wrote:
> >
> > Contrary to what someone one else posted this may be true. Kentucky had
> > an intangible property tax like that until a few years ago.
>
> I've lived in and filed taxes in Kentucky for many years. I've never paid
> the first penny of tax on any bank account balance.
>
I don't anything about taxes in Kentucky, but whether or not you actually
paid a certain tax doesn't really tell us anything about whether or not such
a tax existed. It doesn't even tell us if you had a bank balance to pay
taxes on.

== 9 of 9 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 6:27 pm
From: "krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 21:14:31 -0400, "Lou" <lpogoda@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
><krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message
>news:a0do06tpff9n2ljfuhrhht8nmfpjh8sgvk@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 18:10:47 -0500, The Daring Dufas
>> <the-daring-dufas@peckerhead.net> wrote:
>>
>> >On 6/6/2010 6:03 PM, Lou wrote:
>> >> "The Daring Dufas"<the-daring-dufas@peckerhead.net> wrote in message
>> >> news:hugng7$km6$2@news.eternal-september.org...
>> >>> On 6/6/2010 10:58 AM, Lou wrote:
>> >>>> "The Real Bev"<bashley101@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:hufdel$26s$2@news.eternal-september.org...
>> >>>>> On 06/05/10 20:53, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> "marco polo"<markphd21@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>
>news:d5334a06-add5-44fd-ad9d-9dee8bce3f3c@x27g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>> >>>>>>> .
>> >>>>>>> in the long run,
>> >>>>>>> you are much much better off increasing your income
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> i know it's less fun, but just think about it:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> increase your income, say $1 an hour,
>> >>>>>>> or $10 a week, or $25 a month, or whatever,
>> >>>>>>> and see what you have at the end of the year,
>> >>>>>>> vs saving $1 here or $5 there, is clearly better
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> marc
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Sounds great, but not always easily done. With the present
>economy,
>> >>>>>> employers have cut OT, cut wages, cut hours, and much of the side
>job
>> >>>> part
>> >>>>>> time stuff has dried up. Increasing income may be better, but
>saving
>> >>>> money
>> >>>>>> is the only way for millions right now.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> AND the money you save isn't taxable!
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Well, that depends. When I lived in Georgia, money sitting in a bank
>> >>>> account was taxable. If you had an account, you owed tax on the
>balance
>> >> and
>> >>>> had to pay. After a year went by and tax time rolled around again,
>you
>> >> had
>> >>>> to pay tax on whatever was in that account again, even if you hadn't
>> >> touched
>> >>>> the account at all. In essence, you paid tax on the same money again
>> >> and
>> >>>> again, for as long as you had it.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Georgia? The state in the U.S.A. or the country of Georgia?
>> >>>
>> >> Georgia, the state in the U.S.A. All real and personal property in the
>> >> state is taxable unless specifically exempted by law. At the time I
>lived
>> >> there, money in a bank account was not exempt.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >Here in Alabamastan, I believe a bank account would be taxed if it
>> >earned interest.
>>
>> Only the interest is taxed, not the principal. That's a normal capital
>gains
>> tax. Taxing the principal is *not* normal. Personal property is taxed in
>> some states but I've never heard of cash being considered personal
>property.
>
>What would you call it? Property is generally classified into two types -
>real and personal. Real property is land, usually things growing on it
>(annual crops in at least some states are not considered real property) and
>buildings. All property that is not real property is personal property.

Investments aren't generally considered either.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: using bricks to replace driveway?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/f9b05e9d50972b81?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 11:33 am
From: "Rod Speed"

Ohioguy wrote:
> We have an asphalt drive, about 20 feet long, and maybe 18 feet
> wide, which needs replaced.

> I've seen a number of brick streets in the old sections of town, and
> have wondered how in the world they have lasted as long as they did.
> I've considered renting a jackhammer, then laying down a fine layer of
> gravel, and placing brick for our front drive.

> However, Lowe's and the other big hardware stores I've checked only seem to have brick with holes in it.

Yeah, those are the modern extruded bricks.

Those places do have pavers with no holes tho.

> Anybody ever done a project of this size on their own?

Yep, plenty do. Its not that hard.

> I've been quoted between $2k and $4k to have the whole thing replaced with concrete.

I prefer that myself, particularly for working on the car etc.

You may or may not be allowed to work on the car tho,
some US home owner fascist groups dont allow that.

> I could probably cold patch and then seal it for $400.

> Anybody have an idea how much it might cost to do with brick?

Price the pavers.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 3:48 pm
From: a real cheapskate

On Jun 7, 2:33�pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ohioguy wrote:
> > We have an asphalt drive, about 20 feet long, and maybe 18 feet
> > wide, which needs replaced.
> > � I've seen a number of brick streets in the old sections of town, and
> > have wondered how in the world they have lasted as long as they did.
> > I've considered renting a jackhammer, then laying down a fine layer of
> > gravel, and placing brick for our front drive.
> > � However, Lowe's and the other big hardware stores I've checked only seem to have brick with holes in it.
>
> Yeah, those are the modern extruded bricks.
>
> Those places do have pavers with no holes tho.
>
> > � Anybody ever done a project of this size on their own?
>
> Yep, plenty do. Its not that hard.
>
> > I've been quoted between $2k and $4k to have the whole thing replaced with concrete.
>
> I prefer that myself, particularly for working on the car etc.
>
> You may or may not be allowed to work on the car tho,
> some US home owner fascist groups dont allow that.
>
> > I could probably cold patch and then seal it for $400.
> > � Anybody have an idea how much it might cost to do with brick?
>
> Price the pavers.

brick streets in citys tend to be brick over a thick concrete base,
like 1 foot thick concrete covered with brick for appearance.
otherwise the vehicles heavy weight cause high and low areas and over
time poor appearance.

your far better off just repaving to do brick right costs so uch its
far more than repaving

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 7:26 pm
From: gheston@hiwaay.net (Gary Heston)

In article <u49Pn.21827$%u7.9989@newsfe14.iad>, Ohioguy <none@none.net> wrote:
> We have an asphalt drive, about 20 feet long, and maybe 18 feet wide,
>which needs replaced.

> I've seen a number of brick streets in the old sections of town, and
>have wondered how in the world they have lasted as long as they did.
>I've considered renting a jackhammer, then laying down a fine layer of
>gravel, and placing brick for our front drive.

That wouldn't be an adequate base, especially in your area; the ground
freezes up there.

> However, Lowe's and the other big hardware stores I've checked only
>seem to have brick with holes in it.

Stop asking for "bricks" and ask for "pavers". There's a big difference.

> Anybody ever done a project of this size on their own?

No, just seen it done on TV (This Old House Hour). To get some idea of
how it's done, check their web site.

> I've been quoted between $2k and $4k to have the whole thing replaced
>with concrete. I could probably cold patch and then seal it for $400.

I'd go with the concrete, but make sure the quotes are equivalent--same
amount of base, same thickness of slab (you'r probably need 6"), same
finishing, etc.

> Anybody have an idea how much it might cost to do with brick?

A lot more. There's more labor involved.

Gary

--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/

If you want to reduce the level of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere,
go plant trees.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Are you Spanking the Monkey or Teasing the Monkey?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6b4d3d644b1700d7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 1:59 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

See, there's a difference. When you spank the monkey... it's nobody's
business; you are hurting no one. But when you tease the monkey, you
are playing with his brain, a form of torture, making him believe
something it is not true and confusing him.

Take for example the fact that bicycles are vehicles and yet they are
totally ignored on the roads. They better say, "WE DON'T WANT BICYCLES
ON THE ROAD, MONKEY!" Then the monkey knows what he is up against and
goes in his cage...

It's like they say in Brazil, "WE NEED SPACE." And now hear this
dramatic account from the zoo...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3AAdkfiamU&feature=related

-------------------------------------------------

THE WISE TIBETAN MONKEY SAYS

"WE NEED SPACE, WE NEED SPACE, WE NEED SPACE"

http://webspawner.com/users/MASTURBATIONFORPEACE (plan B)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: which chain has the cheapest photo printouts?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/77944da1b9931ee3?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 2:10 pm
From: Ohioguy

I need to get a couple of 2"x2" US Passport Card photos (basically,
they just need to be 2"x2", full face, with white background)

I can take them at home with my digital camera, but I only have a
greyscale laser printer, so I'd need to have these printed out
somewhere. I've never printed out any of our digital photos anyplace,
so I was just wondering where this might be done cheaply, for just
printing the same shot two times?

Thanks!

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 2:39 pm
From: "Rod Speed"

Ohioguy wrote:

> I need to get a couple of 2"x2" US Passport Card photos (basically,
> they just need to be 2"x2", full face, with white background)

> I can take them at home with my digital camera, but I only have a
> greyscale laser printer, so I'd need to have these printed out
> somewhere. I've never printed out any of our digital photos anyplace,
> so I was just wondering where this might be done cheaply, for just
> printing the same shot two times?

Not worth worrying about finding the cheapest with just two prints required.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 2:40 pm
From: Al

On Jun 7, 5:10 pm, Ohioguy <n...@none.net> wrote:
> I need to get a couple of 2"x2" US Passport Card photos (basically,
> they just need to be 2"x2", full face, with white background)
>
> I can take them at home with my digital camera, but I only have a
> greyscale laser printer, so I'd need to have these printed out
> somewhere. I've never printed out any of our digital photos anyplace,
> so I was just wondering where this might be done cheaply, for just
> printing the same shot two times?
>
> Thanks!

Seems like you are majoring in minors here OG. I mean it's just two
pictures. How much could one hope to save?
Go to Wal-mart or CVS and getR'done. What I would do is compress the
photos to the desired 2"X2" first so they will automatically be the
size you need for the PP.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 2:47 pm
From: Shaun

Ohioguy wrote:
> I need to get a couple of 2"x2" US Passport Card photos (basically,
> they just need to be 2"x2", full face, with white background)
>
> I can take them at home with my digital camera, but I only have a
> greyscale laser printer, so I'd need to have these printed out
> somewhere. I've never printed out any of our digital photos anyplace,
> so I was just wondering where this might be done cheaply, for just
> printing the same shot two times?
>
>
> Thanks!

Given the price of gas, the one closest to you house...

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Removing a polish smell
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/412e284f30c2d434?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 3:26 pm
From: Evan

On Jun 7, 6:47 am, "jkm1" <bluest...@mail.invalid> wrote:
> Need to remove a polish smell thats inside the neighbours recently purchased
> one year old Citroen.
>
> There is a sickly smell that one of the children especially finds very
> unpleasant. It's very subtle and difficult to locate exactly and we suspect
> it might be an interior cleaner or polish thats been used.
>
> Is there some solution that we can make up to wipe over all the surfaces to
> see if it removes the smell. It obviously wouldn't want to be something that
> might adversely affect the plastic and the seats. Thanks.

Without more information on what makes the smell worse, we can't be
of much help ?

Are you using the vent fan or air conditioner when you notice the
smell,
the car may have had a mold problem in the AC coils that was treated
using aerosol chemicals...

It could be a cleaning product used when the car was detailed inside
at the dealership prior to your purchase, in that case ask them what
chemicals they used and then try to find the chemicals and see
which one the child is reacting to...

Otherwise the smell could be from something in the car that shouldn't
be there like mold or rotting leftover food that got down between or
underneath the seats...

Just don't have enough information on what is going on when the
child is reacting to the smell...

~~ Evan

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 3:34 pm
From: Nate Nagel

On 06/07/2010 06:26 PM, Evan wrote:
> On Jun 7, 6:47 am, "jkm1"<bluest...@mail.invalid> wrote:
>> Need to remove a polish smell thats inside the neighbours recently purchased
>> one year old Citroen.
>>
>> There is a sickly smell that one of the children especially finds very
>> unpleasant. It's very subtle and difficult to locate exactly and we suspect
>> it might be an interior cleaner or polish thats been used.
>>
>> Is there some solution that we can make up to wipe over all the surfaces to
>> see if it removes the smell. It obviously wouldn't want to be something that
>> might adversely affect the plastic and the seats. Thanks.
>
>
> Without more information on what makes the smell worse, we can't be
> of much help ?
>
> Are you using the vent fan or air conditioner when you notice the
> smell,
> the car may have had a mold problem in the AC coils that was treated
> using aerosol chemicals...
>
> It could be a cleaning product used when the car was detailed inside
> at the dealership prior to your purchase, in that case ask them what
> chemicals they used and then try to find the chemicals and see
> which one the child is reacting to...
>
> Otherwise the smell could be from something in the car that shouldn't
> be there like mold or rotting leftover food that got down between or
> underneath the seats...
>
> Just don't have enough information on what is going on when the
> child is reacting to the smell...
>
> ~~ Evan

No helpful suggestions, but are you sure that it's not some sort of
citrus fruit smell?

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Venezuela would fulfill an American ultimate Utopia
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6931379855655577?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 4:17 pm
From: Forrest Hodge

On 6/4/2010 2:41 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> On Jun 4, 1:29 pm, D�nk 666<dank...@rocketmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jun 4, 7:28 am, "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>> Movement of Tantra-Hammock"<nolionnoprob...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Imagine, filling the 30 gallon tank of a 1980 Chevy Caprice costs
>>> you... 2 bucks! I was hearing this report in NPR, and this guy proudly
>>> shows off in that stupid vehicle like it was the ultimate dream. It
>>> may be a nightmare for the environment, but --like in America-- gas is
>>> subsidized by their socialist government making it all possible. So,
>>> forget about Obama, Chavez is the way to go if you love your SUVs,
>>> folks.
>>
>> Actually it is hybrid-driving American leftists who love Hugo Ch�vez.
>> Ch�vez' simply uses a common trick seen in other socialist countries
>> to purchase support, currency devaluation.
>>
>> Like Barack Obama, Hugo Ch�vez purchases political support by giving
>> 'free' money away, in this case in the form of gasoline subsidies.
>> But this trick only works if there is money to give away, so either
>> the money must be raised through taxes, or new money must be printed.
>> Ch�vez has chosen the latter option, with Obama soon to follow.
>>
>> Unfortunately, printing new money causes existing money in circulation
>> to lose its value, resulting in inflation. Fortunately, inflation
>> makes people even more dependent on subsidies, making it even easier
>> to purchase their support at election time.
>>
>>> "In many parts of the world, fuel economy has become the gold-standard
>>> for cars. But not in Maracaibo, Venezuela, where old gas guzzlers are
>>> still prized for their sturdy frames and powerful engines."
>>
>> This may have less to do with gasoline subsidies than the fact that
>> devaluation of the bolivar makes it more expensive to import new
>> cars. Cuba is the same way; while the people take pride in their
>> classic American automobiles, the reason they still drive them is that
>> they can't afford to buy new ones.
>
> Oh c'mon, all governments try to secure the loyalty of a certain class
> of people, either the lions or the monkeys. In this case he's pissing
> off the lions without providing any real benefit to the monkeys.
>
> Who wants to drive a big car/SUV but a gorilla?
>
> We would do EVERYTHING DIFFERENT with the Revolution.
>
> More like this...
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swQTTG3NcYY
>
Sorry, but my ideal dreamworld isn't a city with hundreds of thousands
of people living in a square mile of real estate. I'll keep my 2.5 acre
lot, thanks.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 7 2010 4:26 pm
From: "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the Movement of Tantra-
Hammock"

On Jun 7, 7:17 pm, Forrest Hodge <f...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 6/4/2010 2:41 PM, His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
>
> Movement of Tantra-Hammock wrote:
> > On Jun 4, 1:29 pm, D nk 666<dank...@rocketmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Jun 4, 7:28 am, "His Highness the TibetanMonkey, Creator of the
> >> Movement of Tantra-Hammock"<nolionnoprob...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >>> Imagine, filling the 30 gallon tank of a 1980 Chevy Caprice costs
> >>> you... 2 bucks! I was hearing this report in NPR, and this guy proudly
> >>> shows off in that stupid vehicle like it was the ultimate dream. It
> >>> may be a nightmare for the environment, but --like in America-- gas is
> >>> subsidized by their socialist government making it all possible. So,
> >>> forget about Obama, Chavez is the way to go if you love your SUVs,
> >>> folks.
>
> >> Actually it is hybrid-driving American leftists who love Hugo Ch vez.
> >> Ch vez' simply uses a common trick seen in other socialist countries
> >> to purchase support, currency devaluation.
>
> >> Like Barack Obama, Hugo Ch vez purchases political support by giving
> >> 'free' money away, in this case in the form of gasoline subsidies.
> >> But this trick only works if there is money to give away, so either
> >> the money must be raised through taxes, or new money must be printed.
> >> Ch vez has chosen the latter option, with Obama soon to follow.
>
> >> Unfortunately, printing new money causes existing money in circulation
> >> to lose its value, resulting in inflation. Fortunately, inflation
> >> makes people even more dependent on subsidies, making it even easier
> >> to purchase their support at election time.
>
> >>> "In many parts of the world, fuel economy has become the gold-standard
> >>> for cars. But not in Maracaibo, Venezuela, where old gas guzzlers are
> >>> still prized for their sturdy frames and powerful engines."
>
> >> This may have less to do with gasoline subsidies than the fact that
> >> devaluation of the bolivar makes it more expensive to import new
> >> cars. Cuba is the same way; while the people take pride in their
> >> classic American automobiles, the reason they still drive them is that
> >> they can't afford to buy new ones.
>
> > Oh c'mon, all governments try to secure the loyalty of a certain class
> > of people, either the lions or the monkeys. In this case he's pissing
> > off the lions without providing any real benefit to the monkeys.
>
> > Who wants to drive a big car/SUV but a gorilla?
>
> > We would do EVERYTHING DIFFERENT with the Revolution.
>
> > More like this...
>
> >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swQTTG3NcYY
>
> Sorry, but my ideal dreamworld isn't a city with hundreds of thousands
> of people living in a square mile of real estate. I'll keep my 2.5 acre
> lot, thanks.

If all people were like you, we would need a planet the size of
Saturn. But Earth is a rather small planet, where some people are
lucky like you, but others can handle lots of people on bikes and
public transportation.

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Monday, June 7, 2010

misc.consumers.frugal-living - 25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

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