http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
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Today's topics:
* Doorbell, etc. - Saving $2.50 per month! - 11 messages, 10 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/f28ae8d29331218e?hl=en
* Living in CO - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6530b80539a24694?hl=en
* OT - Survivalism Retail Style - 8 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/da641b3711ca2726?hl=en
* Bubbles are caused by excessive credit. - 2 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d06a55cb7610180d?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Doorbell, etc. - Saving $2.50 per month!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/f28ae8d29331218e?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:19 am
From: "hallerb@aol.com"
On Feb 15, 11:29�am, "Bill" <billnomailnosp...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use electricity
> only when the button was pressed. I also went through my house and placed
> everything I could find which was "always on" on a switch or power strip.
>
> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips which
> have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can turn them off
> when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier which was "always on"
> and I wired a switch to that.
>
> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips (no
> lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV and DVD, or
> playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on components which are
> not being used.)
>
> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer on -
> printer on separate power strip and off when not in use. Everything totally
> off when not in use.
>
> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
> filter replacement).
>
> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small stereos.
> Etc.
>
> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so for the
> rest of my life. That's $30 a year or being as my electric bill is now under
> $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
congrats how much did you spend for all the power strips etc?
some devices may not like being powered off repeatedly like you are
doing
congress should legislate a power off control for people who desire to
save max energy, a added requirement for energy star
the satellite tv uses off hours to doiwnload guide updates, powered
off completely may get you a aging guide.
We use DVRs which arent compatible with no power. Ours record shows
all day and all nite long
== 2 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:24 am
From: clams_casino
Tony Hwang wrote:
>>
>>
> Hi,
> My electricity costs 7 cents per KWh locked for 5 years. What if you
> keep powering up/down multiple devices and a surge cause a damage. The
> repair cost may far exceed the 2.00 per month. If I wanted to save
> electric energy my way would be using more efficient devices or
> minimize the usage by careful planning ahead.
I'm envious. My last electric bill was 18.5 cents / KWhr.
== 3 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:25 am
From: "Charlie Darwin"
"Bill" <billnomailnospamx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6vqu7pFl4f65U1@mid.individual.net...
>I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use electricity
>only when the button was pressed. I also went through my house and placed
>everything I could find which was "always on" on a switch or power strip.
>
> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips which
> have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can turn them off
> when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier which was "always
> on" and I wired a switch to that.
>
> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips (no
> lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV and DVD,
> or playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on components which
> are not being used.)
>
> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer on -
> printer on separate power strip and off when not in use. Everything
> totally off when not in use.
>
> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
> filter replacement).
>
> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small stereos.
> Etc.
>
> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so for the
> rest of my life. That's $30 a year or being as my electric bill is now
> under $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
>
You could also flush only every other time, grow your own veggies, only wash
the sheets and towels once a month and shut off your car engine at red
lights or when going down hill...
== 4 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:32 am
From: "HeyBub"
Bill wrote:
> I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use
> electricity only when the button was pressed. I also went through my
> house and placed everything I could find which was "always on" on a
> switch or power strip.
> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips
> which have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can
> turn them off when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier
> which was "always on" and I wired a switch to that.
>
> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips
> (no lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV
> and DVD, or playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on
> components which are not being used.)
>
> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer
> on - printer on separate power strip and off when not in use.
> Everything totally off when not in use.
>
> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
> filter replacement).
>
> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small
> stereos. Etc.
>
> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so
> for the rest of my life. That's $30 a year or being as my electric
> bill is now under $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
Yeah, but it costs you an hour a day to reset all the blinking "12:00"
things.
== 5 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:40 am
From: aemeijers
Charlie Darwin wrote:
> "Bill" <billnomailnospamx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:6vqu7pFl4f65U1@mid.individual.net...
>> I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use electricity
>> only when the button was pressed. I also went through my house and placed
>> everything I could find which was "always on" on a switch or power strip.
>>
>> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips which
>> have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can turn them off
>> when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier which was "always
>> on" and I wired a switch to that.
>>
>> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips (no
>> lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV and DVD,
>> or playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on components which
>> are not being used.)
>>
>> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer on -
>> printer on separate power strip and off when not in use. Everything
>> totally off when not in use.
>>
>> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
>> filter replacement).
>>
>> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small stereos.
>> Etc.
>>
>> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so for the
>> rest of my life. That's $30 a year or being as my electric bill is now
>> under $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
>>
>
> You could also flush only every other time, grow your own veggies, only wash
> the sheets and towels once a month and shut off your car engine at red
> lights or when going down hill...
>
>
Oh, please don't encourage the guy. Of course what he is doing is not
time or cost effective, but if it gives him the illusion of having some
control over his universe, so what?
--
aem sends...
== 6 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:49 am
From: "1D1OT"
"Charlie Darwin" <cd@evo.net> wrote in message
news:gn9j5i$ijm$1@news.motzarella.org...
> You could also flush only every other time, grow your own veggies, only
> wash the sheets and towels once a month and shut off your car engine at
> red lights or when going down hill...
Why wash towels - aren't we clean when we use them?
== 7 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:50 am
From: "Pete C."
Bill wrote:
>
> I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use electricity
> only when the button was pressed. I also went through my house and placed
> everything I could find which was "always on" on a switch or power strip.
>
> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips which
> have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can turn them off
> when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier which was "always on"
> and I wired a switch to that.
>
> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips (no
> lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV and DVD, or
> playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on components which are
> not being used.)
>
> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer on -
> printer on separate power strip and off when not in use. Everything totally
> off when not in use.
>
> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
> filter replacement).
>
> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small stereos.
> Etc.
>
> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so for the
> rest of my life. That's $30 a year or being as my electric bill is now under
> $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
I dropped cable and save $50 per month, every month. I'm saving 20X what
your savings, and I don't have to go to any effort daily for that
savings.
== 8 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:53 am
From: Dennis
On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 12:24:12 -0500, clams_casino
<PeterGriffin@DrunkinClam.com> wrote:
>Tony Hwang wrote:
>
>>>
>>>
>> Hi,
>> My electricity costs 7 cents per KWh locked for 5 years. What if you
>> keep powering up/down multiple devices and a surge cause a damage. The
>> repair cost may far exceed the 2.00 per month. If I wanted to save
>> electric energy my way would be using more efficient devices or
>> minimize the usage by careful planning ahead.
>
>
>I'm envious. My last electric bill was 18.5 cents / KWhr.
Mine was $0.059 / kWh (plus a $7 fixed "customer charge"). PUD in the
PNW.
Dennis (evil)
--
My output is down, my income is up, I take a short position on the long bond and
my revenue stream has its own cash flow. -George Carlin
== 9 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:36 am
From: "Jon Danniken"
"aemeijers" wrote:
> Oh, please don't encourage the guy. Of course what he is doing is not time
> or cost effective, but if it gives him the illusion of having some control
> over his universe, so what?
It's no problem with the fellow in question, but often folks like that tend
to want to spread their "blessings" onto other people who have not become so
"enlightened", and often by force. That's when it no longer becomes cute
and quirky.
Jon
== 10 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:54 am
From: "Rod Speed"
Bill wrote:
> I previously posted about re-wiring my doorbell so it would use
> electricity only when the button was pressed. I also went through my
> house and placed everything I could find which was "always on" on a
> switch or power strip.
> I replaced power strips which had lights on them with power strips
> which have no light. I wired switches to all GFCI outlets so I can
> turn them off when not in use. I have a rooftop TV antenna amplifier
> which was "always on" and I wired a switch to that.
>
> I placed my entertainment center things on 4 individual power strips
> (no lights) so I could turn on only what I was using. (Like just TV
> and DVD, or playstation, or satellite TV - don't need to have on
> components which are not being used.)
>
> I placed several power strips on my computer stuff. So just computer
> on - printer on separate power strip and off when not in use.
> Everything totally off when not in use.
>
> Placed outlet switches on HEPA air cleaners (have always on timers for
> filter replacement).
>
> Placed power strips (no power on light) on bedroom, garage small
> stereos. Etc.
>
> Anyway my electric bill is now $2.50 per month less and will be so for the rest of my life.
Nope, not when you get the oxygen machine.
> That's $30 a year
Pity about the cost of all those plug boards.
> or being as my electric bill is now under $30 a month - one month of free electricity!
You'll have to pardon us if we dont actually cream our jeans or sumfin.
== 11 of 11 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:59 am
From: "1D1OT"
What do you do about the cost of ironing your socks?
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Living in CO
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/6530b80539a24694?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 9:33 am
From: George
William Boyd wrote:
> clams_casino wrote:
>> Our son recently took a job between Denver & Boulder CO. It's been
>> some 30 years since we vacationed in the area, but still have fond
>> memories, having enjoyed that memorable vacation very much.
>>
>> When doing a Best Places comparison, the quality of life, taxes,
>> climate & cost of living look appear very attractive. Sales and
>> income taxes appear moderate while property taxes appear very
>> reasonable. As I approach SS, income taxes have a minimal concern
>> where property taxes will likely be the biggest (tax) cost after
>> retirement. Downside appears to be the 100 inches/yr of snow, but the
>> number of sunny days & moderate temperatures for most of the year
>> appear attractive. General cost of living, quality of life and
>> housing costs appear attractive.
>>
>> Any one have thoughts / experience with retirement living in towns
>> just northwest of Denver?
>
> I can not understand why some one would retire in a cold climate.
Interests, change of seasons and quite a few studies that show people
live longer with varying climate.
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:36 am
From: "DanG"
I just received this from one of my other expatriated Colorado
friends. Every one of them rings so true.
You might be from Colorado if:
When:
98% OF AMERICANS SCREAM BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A
SLIPPERY ROAD. THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM COLORADO AND THEY
SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS.
You're from Colorado if you'll eat ice cream in the winter.
When the weather report says it's going to be 65 degrees , you
shave
your legs and wear a skirt
It snows 5 inches and you don't expect school to be cancelled.
You'll wear flip flops every day of the year, regardless of
temperature.
You have no accent at all, but can hear other people's. And then
you
make fun of them.
'Humid' is over 25%.
Your sense of direction is: Toward the mountains and Away from the
mountains.
You say 'the interstate' and everybody knows which one.
You think that May is a totally normal month for a blizzard.
You buy your flowers to set out on Mother's day, but try and hold
off
planting them until just before Father's day.
You grew up planning your Halloween costumes around your coat.
You know what the Continental Divide is.
You don't think Coors beer is that big a deal.
You went to Casa Bonita as a kid, and as an adult.
You've gone off-roading in a vehicle that was never intended for
such
activities.
You always know the elevation of where you are.
You wake up to a beautiful, 80 degree day and you wonder if it's
going
to snow tomorrow.
You don't care that some company renamed it, the Broncos still
play at
Mile High.
Every movie theater has military and student discounts.
Everybody wears jeans to church.
You actually know that ** South Park ** is a real place not just
a show
on TV.
You know what a 'trust fund hippy' is, and you know its natural
habitat
is Boulder
You know you're talking to a fellow Coloradoan when they call it
Elitches, not Six Flags.
A bear on your front porch doesn't bother you.
Your two favorite teams are the Broncos and whoever is beating the
crap out of the Raiders.
When people out East tell you they have mountains in their state
too,
you just laugh.
You go anywhere else on the planet and the air feels 'sticky' and
you
notice the sky is no longer blue.
FORWARD IF YOU LIVE IN OR ARE FROM COLORADO !!!
--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)
dgriff237@7cox.net
"clams_casino" <PeterGriffin@DrunkinClam.com> wrote in message
news:ErXll.4436$_U5.728@newsfe20.iad...
> Our son recently took a job between Denver & Boulder CO. It's
> been some 30 years since we vacationed in the area, but still
> have fond memories, having enjoyed that memorable vacation very
> much.
>
> When doing a Best Places comparison, the quality of life, taxes,
> climate & cost of living look appear very attractive. Sales and
> income taxes appear moderate while property taxes appear very
> reasonable. As I approach SS, income taxes have a minimal
> concern where property taxes will likely be the biggest (tax)
> cost after retirement. Downside appears to be the 100 inches/yr
> of snow, but the number of sunny days & moderate temperatures
> for most of the year appear attractive. General cost of living,
> quality of life and housing costs appear attractive.
>
> Any one have thoughts / experience with retirement living in
> towns just northwest of Denver?
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:51 am
From: "Joan F \(MI\)"
One of my daughters lives in Boulder and loves it. The weather is very
strange, one day it will be 70, the next day it will snow and then in a
couple of days it will be 50.
clams_casino wrote:
| Our son recently took a job between Denver & Boulder CO. It's been
| some 30 years since we vacationed in the area, but still have fond
| memories, having enjoyed that memorable vacation very much.
|
| When doing a Best Places comparison, the quality of life, taxes,
| climate & cost of living look appear very attractive. Sales and
| income taxes appear moderate while property taxes appear very
| reasonable. As I approach SS, income taxes have a minimal concern
| where property taxes will likely be the biggest (tax) cost after
| retirement. Downside appears to be the 100 inches/yr of snow, but
| the number of sunny days & moderate temperatures for most of the year
| appear attractive. General cost of living, quality of life and
| housing costs appear attractive.
|
| Any one have thoughts / experience with retirement living in towns
| just northwest of Denver?
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:53 am
From: "Joan F \(MI\)"
To each his own, I don't understand how people can stand to live in Florida.
--
Retired in Michigan
William Boyd wrote:
|
| I can not understand why some one would retire in a cold climate.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT - Survivalism Retail Style
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/da641b3711ca2726?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:03 am
From: josejarvie@ssnet.net
On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 00:14:33 -0700, in misc.consumers.frugal-living Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net> wrote:
>You can have inflation in one area and deflation in another. Esk
>can't understand that.
>
>I'll bet your stocks and the value of your house is deflating.
>I'll bet your grocery bill is inflating.
Last year we saw relatively dramatic increases in inflation but at the same time unemployment went up.
Inflation was high because the price of oil reached all time highs and the cost of transporting all materials
went up with the increase in oil prices.
At the same time farmers began to sell more of their corn to make fuel instead of food. The reduced food corn
supply caused the price of food corn to up. Then the price of meat and dairy products went up because
animals are fed are fed with corn.
Stock and houses were inflated artificially with bubbles. The stock and housing bubbles are now correcting
back to more rational values. Groceries were going up with the price of oil but the oil bubble has now burst
so why aren't food prices going down? With unemployment on the rise the demand for expensive foods will go
down.
== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:03 am
From: Gunner Asch
On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:20:28 -0500, Strabo <strabo@flashlight.net>
wrote:
>
>In other words gentlemen, we're going back to ca 1957, and you won't
>be able to take technocracy with you.
Why not?
"Upon Roosevelt's death in 1945, H. L. Mencken predicted in his diary
that Roosevelt would be remembered as a great president, "maybe even
alongside Washington and Lincoln," opining that Roosevelt "had every
quality that morons esteem in their heroes.""
== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:55 am
From: EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com
In misc.survivalism Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net> wrote:
> EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
> >In misc.survivalism Jones <jones@jones.com> wrote:
> >
> >> > I see no mitigating indicators in the near term to replace those which will inevitably peter out.
> >
> >> Because you dont have a clue about the basics.
> >
> >That is increasing apparent.
> >
> >Winston - this stuff interests you. But you are confused about basic
> >relationships. You'd enjoy these discussion more if you were on
> >solid ground.
> Who on earth are you talking to? I'm not in this sub thread. Do try
> to get a grip, man!
WTF?
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russell
== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:57 am
From: EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com
In misc.survivalism Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net> wrote:
> Stagflation does not require anything as specific as double digit
> inflation.
OK, I'll bite. If Stagflation does not require double digit inflation,
then what DOES it require?
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russell
== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:59 am
From: EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com
In misc.survivalism Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net> wrote:
> EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
> >In misc.survivalism Ed Huntress <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
> >
> >> <EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com> wrote in message
> >> news:gk2ntk$ih9$2@reader1.panix.com...
> >> > In misc.survivalism Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudgeon@live.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I wonder if it's possible to simultaneously suffer both deflation and
> >> >> inflation?
> >> >
> >> > Winston says Yes.
> >
> >> Winston be wrong. You can have inflation and a contracting economy
> >> (stagflation), or deflation and a contracting economy (recession), but you
> >> can't have aggregate inflation and aggregate deflation at the same time.
> >
> >Yep. But try to tell him that, and he will change the subject.
> But you keep telling me it's wrong for me to keep going back to the
> same subject.
Somehow, I don't think so.
I'll do it your way. Do you have a way or do you just
> run off at the mouth?
I have no idea of what point you are trying to make.
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russell
== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 11:01 am
From: EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com
In misc.survivalism Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net> wrote:
> >Winston be wrong. You can have inflation and a contracting economy
> >(stagflation), or deflation and a contracting economy (recession), but you
> >can't have aggregate inflation and aggregate deflation at the same time.
> You can have inflation in one area and deflation in another. Esk
> can't understand that.
You seem to have ignored the word "aggregate". But you are welcome to
play again.
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russell
== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 11:03 am
From: EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com
In misc.survivalism Ed Huntress <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
> "Winston_Smith" <not_real@bogus.net> wrote in message
> > Still the market deflates. Esk will
> > explain why this isn't really happening in his little world.
> I don't know about his world. What I'm talking about is the economic world
> as it's presently understood and how it influences policy.
Thanks, Ed. You suffer fools more gladly than I.
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russell
== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 11:11 am
From: "Ed Huntress"
<EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com> wrote in message
news:gn9ouf$nem$7@reader1.panix.com...
> In misc.survivalism Ed Huntress <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>> "Winston_Smith" <not_real@bogus.net> wrote in message
>
>> > Still the market deflates. Esk will
>> > explain why this isn't really happening in his little world.
>
>> I don't know about his world. What I'm talking about is the economic
>> world
>> as it's presently understood and how it influences policy.
>
> Thanks, Ed. You suffer fools more gladly than I.
I don't think the main problem here is fools, although there are a few very
weird ones -- or ones wearing very weird personnas. The main problem is...
...too much to get into. d8-)
>
> --
> The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
> certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
> -- Bertrand Russell
Maybe that's it.
--
Ed Huntress
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bubbles are caused by excessive credit.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/t/d06a55cb7610180d?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:53 am
From: "Bill Bonde { No matter what happens, it's caused by global warming )"
B1ackwater wrote:
>
> "(David P.)" <imbibe@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >The main cause of the Population Bubble is also
> >excessive credit, i.e., saying that everyone is a
> >valuable asset as long as they live.
> >L I K E H E L L T H E Y A R E ! !
> >Hordes are no longer viable, due to infirmity,
> >and become a drag on the system.
>
> Been watching "Logans Run" too much I see .....
>
> However, you're not ENTIRELY wrong.
>
> A deliberate effort to poop on the value/virtue
> of mega-motherhood is needed. Breeding alone ought
> not earn anyone any favors or respect.
>
The problem is that the people who should be reproducing either
aren't or aren't reproducing enough and the ones who should be kind
of holding back on the megasized families aren't holding back. Much
of the first world is seeing either zero population growth or
negative growth, excluding immigration.
The idea that old people are a drag on society is wrong. Of course
old people who are very sick or whose mentally facilities have been
lost are a cost, but it might take people until old age before they
figure something important out.
--
He and Evie soon fell into a conversation of the "No, I didn't;
yes, you did" type--conversation which, though fascinating to those
who are engaged in it, neither desires nor deserves the attention
of others.
-+E.M. Forster, "Howards End"
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 15 2009 10:56 am
From: "Bill Bonde { No matter what happens, it's caused by global warming )"
"John A. Weeks III" wrote:
>
> In article
> <0f7f84fa-962a-4b26-892c-d347ebdd8dfd@j35g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>,
> "(David P.)" <imbibe@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> > The main cause of the Population Bubble is also
> > excessive credit,
>
> If that were true, then the highest birth rate should be
> in countries that have the most available consumer credit.
> But the facts show the countries with more available credit
> actually have lower birth rates, and the highest birth rates
> are in countries with little or no consumer credit available.
> Therefore, your assertion is 100% wrong.
>
High birth rates in general are caused by the uncertainty that the
children you've already had will survive. Of course negative birth
rates can be seen as related to the cost of having children. In the
first world, the cost can be enormous.
--
He and Evie soon fell into a conversation of the "No, I didn't;
yes, you did" type--conversation which, though fascinating to those
who are engaged in it, neither desires nor deserves the attention
of others.
-+E.M. Forster, "Howards End"
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