http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living?hl=en
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Today's topics:
* Boo-hoo for bloodsucking retailers - 5 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/81b94728ed0f8519?hl=en
* Soldering eyeglass Frames - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ffd45cd171f652d0?hl=en
* What is the average annual cost of owning a car if paying cash in lump sum
in the beginning? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5aac132998391837?hl=en
* It happened! My pipes froze, they burst today, and my entire bathroom was
FLOODED! - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3cfa54c711f046f4?hl=en
* OT: Why I hate Geico ads - 14 messages, 12 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c126ff8f6e76bda5?hl=en
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TOPIC: Boo-hoo for bloodsucking retailers
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/81b94728ed0f8519?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 12:39 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
Some stupid pig ignorant racecourse bum claiming to be
William Souden <souden@nospam.com> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament
and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
No surprise that its a racecourse bum.
== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:00 pm
From: William Souden
Rod Speed wrote:
> Some stupid pig ignorant racecourse bum claiming to be
> William Souden <souden@nospam.com> desperately
> attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament
> and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
>
> No surprise that its a racecourse bum.
>
>
Know why I like to see clueless people at the track,welfare boy?
Know anything about horse racing other than the fact that you have no
idea how it works?
== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:18 pm
From: "Rod Speed"
Some stupid pig ignorant racecourse bum claiming to be
William Souden <souden@nospam.com> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament
and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
No surprise that its a racecourse bum.
== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:25 pm
From: William Souden
Rod Speed wrote:
> Some stupid pig ignorant racecourse bum claiming to be
> William Souden <souden@nospam.com> desperately
> attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament
> and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
>
> No surprise that its a racecourse bum.
>
>
No surprise you know nothing about racing. Surprise me and tell us
the following:
At the track you are betting against_______________
The odds are determined by___________________
My guess is you will do what you always do when your ignorance is
exposed- post another mindless bot.
== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:26 pm
From: William Souden
Rod Speed wrote:
> Some stupid pig ignorant racecourse bum claiming to be
> William Souden <souden@nospam.com> desperately
> attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament
> and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
>
> No surprise that its a racecourse bum.
>
>
The one time Rod went to the track he could only afford the unreserved
standing room area, lost his welfare stipend and decided it was fixed.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Soldering eyeglass Frames
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/ffd45cd171f652d0?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:31 pm
From: imascot
Richard J Kinch <kinch@truetex.com> wrote in
news:Xns9A2AEE9E496F6someconundrum@216.196.97.131:
>> Any tips?
>
> Cannibalize dollar store readers for a replacement temple piece.
>
> You can braze with propane or MAPP and air.
>
> A soldered butt joint won't typically hold, but it may work if you
> splint with a bit of steel or stainless wire there (any old guitar
> strings around?). You can gammon with fine Nichrome wire sold for
> ignitors on eBay.
This fellow uses silver solder to repair glasses. Not to be a shill for him, but we used him for DH's
glasses, and he did a fine job.
http://www.adamsfashionoptical.com/Services/repair.htm
J.
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:32 pm
From: "Ivan Vegvary"
"Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message news:fmvp8i$rkl$2@news.datemas.de...
> Pete C. wrote:
>
>> Shawn Hirn wrote:
>>>True, but the OP could use the original lenses in new frames. There's no
>>>law that says a frame and lenses must be sold together.
>>
>>
>> They keep changing frame shapes to prevent that (more profits). The
>> lenses may be perfectly fine, but it's very likely you won't find new
>> frames of the same size and shape if it's more than a year or two old.
>
> When my mother's frames broke, the first shop we went to said they didn't
> have frames to fit her lenses, but they could do both frames and lenses.
> When I said we go someplace else, it was amazing how fast they found a
> pair of frames that fit.
>
> Marsha/Ohio
>
Marsha,
That's a horrible story but probably very typical. I've always suspected
that most glasses purchases are a rip-off. I can't see more than a few
dollars worth of materials and labor in a pair of frames.
Fortunately, I need only reading glasses and have never paid more than 3
pairs for $19.95! Other family members need prescription lenses and get
screwed on price all the time.
Ivan Vegvary
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:44 pm
From: "JoeSpareBedroom"
"Ivan Vegvary" <ivan@reelart.us> wrote in message
news:A5Pkj.2340$YH6.337@trndny03...
>
> "Marsha" <mas@xeb.net> wrote in message
> news:fmvp8i$rkl$2@news.datemas.de...
>> Pete C. wrote:
>>
>>> Shawn Hirn wrote:
>>>>True, but the OP could use the original lenses in new frames. There's no
>>>>law that says a frame and lenses must be sold together.
>>>
>>>
>>> They keep changing frame shapes to prevent that (more profits). The
>>> lenses may be perfectly fine, but it's very likely you won't find new
>>> frames of the same size and shape if it's more than a year or two old.
>>
>> When my mother's frames broke, the first shop we went to said they didn't
>> have frames to fit her lenses, but they could do both frames and lenses.
>> When I said we go someplace else, it was amazing how fast they found a
>> pair of frames that fit.
>>
>> Marsha/Ohio
>>
>
> Marsha,
> That's a horrible story but probably very typical. I've always suspected
> that most glasses purchases are a rip-off. I can't see more than a few
> dollars worth of materials and labor in a pair of frames.
> Fortunately, I need only reading glasses and have never paid more than 3
> pairs for $19.95! Other family members need prescription lenses and get
> screwed on price all the time.
>
> Ivan Vegvary
What business are you in? How do you make a living?
==============================================================================
TOPIC: What is the average annual cost of owning a car if paying cash in lump
sum in the beginning?
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/5aac132998391837?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:44 pm
From: mikes1ken@yahoo.com
My calculation is somewhat different from what Consumer Report
magazine does. My calculation factors in inflation cost and
investment returns.
First, some assumptions are inevitable. Suppose I bought Toyota
Corolla ten years ago and paid $15000 total in cash [in 1st year
money]. With annual mileage usage of 12000 mi/year, and no any
accident, and in reasonable good condition, ten year later, the
residual value of the same car is about $2000 [in 10th year money]
according to Used Car book. Suppose the investment return is 5%/year
[remember that S&P500 average is 7% for the past 70 years], and the
inflation is 3%/year.
Suppose we do not factor in insurance premium and routine maintenance
cost such as $25 every 3 months for oil changes. But in the 10 year
duration, you have to buy 4 new tires at least once with cost about
$300 [in 5th year money], buy a new battery about $80 [in 7th year
money], replacing front and rear brake pads and shoes about $500 [in
6th year money]. That's it. Suppose you do not replace timing belt
(although factory recommended at $60000mi), fuel filters, muffler,
oxygen sensor and other things that also likely fail in the 10-year
duration. But assuming we do not fix it unless it breaks. That's fine.
So the TOTAL COST for owning the car after 10 years (in 10th year
money) is
15000*[(1+5%)^9]+300*[(1+5%)^5]+80*[(1+5%)^3]+500*[(1+5%)^4]-2000=22353
The average annual cost can be calculated as follows:
(1) Average annual cost, 1st year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
$2235, or 1st year cost in 1st year money=$2235/[(1+3%)^9]=$1713
(2) Average annual cost, 2nd year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
$2235, or 2nd year cost in 2nd year money=$2235/[(1+3%)^8]=$1764
(n) ...
(10) Average annual cost, 10th year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
$2235
Consumer Report would do the math as follows:
TOTAL COST for owning the car for 10 years is 15000 + 300 +80 +500
-2000= $13888
So, the average annual cost is $13888/10=$1389/year.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:27 pm
From: Al Bundy
mikes1...@yahoo.com wrote:
> My calculation is somewhat different from what Consumer Report
> magazine does. My calculation factors in inflation cost and
> investment returns.
>
> First, some assumptions are inevitable. Suppose I bought Toyota
> Corolla ten years ago and paid $15000 total in cash [in 1st year
> money]. With annual mileage usage of 12000 mi/year, and no any
> accident, and in reasonable good condition, ten year later, the
> residual value of the same car is about $2000 [in 10th year money]
> according to Used Car book. Suppose the investment return is 5%/year
> [remember that S&P500 average is 7% for the past 70 years], and the
> inflation is 3%/year.
>
> Suppose we do not factor in insurance premium and routine maintenance
> cost such as $25 every 3 months for oil changes. But in the 10 year
> duration, you have to buy 4 new tires at least once with cost about
> $300 [in 5th year money], buy a new battery about $80 [in 7th year
> money], replacing front and rear brake pads and shoes about $500 [in
> 6th year money]. That's it. Suppose you do not replace timing belt
> (although factory recommended at $60000mi), fuel filters, muffler,
> oxygen sensor and other things that also likely fail in the 10-year
> duration. But assuming we do not fix it unless it breaks. That's fine.
>
> So the TOTAL COST for owning the car after 10 years (in 10th year
> money) is
> 15000*[(1+5%)^9]+300*[(1+5%)^5]+80*[(1+5%)^3]+500*[(1+5%)^4]-2000=22353
>
> The average annual cost can be calculated as follows:
> (1) Average annual cost, 1st year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
> $2235, or 1st year cost in 1st year money=$2235/[(1+3%)^9]=$1713
>
> (2) Average annual cost, 2nd year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
> $2235, or 2nd year cost in 2nd year money=$2235/[(1+3%)^8]=$1764
>
> (n) ...
> (10) Average annual cost, 10th year cost in 10th year money=$22353/10=
> $2235
>
> Consumer Report would do the math as follows:
> TOTAL COST for owning the car for 10 years is 15000 + 300 +80 +500
> -2000= $13888
> So, the average annual cost is $13888/10=$1389/year.
I'm not going to redo all your numbers to what I would forecast.
However, I must point out that failure to maintain things like the
timing belt can cost you an engine and in turn add $2K to your
numbers. A $200 two bill doesn't make sense either. I would not
insure a car worth less than $5K except for liability. (That would be
self insurance.)
I favor looking at a five year envelope, but keeping the car
maintained and the value up. Also, my options are maintained that way.
If I keep my ride up and also keep my senses open, a steal of a deal
ultimately comes along and saves thousands on a good used vehicle.
In my opinion, when you buy a new car you just pay for all the repairs
up front. Vehicles are like people in that they age differently. Some
older cars are better than some newer ones will turn out to be. If you
seek to be frugal, a single formula like you want doesn't work. As
Tom and Ray say, "The man who seeks to spend the least always ends up
spending the most."
==============================================================================
TOPIC: It happened! My pipes froze, they burst today, and my entire bathroom
was FLOODED!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/3cfa54c711f046f4?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:59 pm
From: GeneCook2008@gmail.com
How I hate that.
I have straw outside my crawl space home to warm the pipes. I had
water dripping from the faucets so that the pipes don't freeze. I
opened the closets underneath the sinks. I had a space heater blowing
warm heat at the pipes, nevertheless they FROZE and bursted today.
I don't think that I get a plummer before Tuesday.
I shut the main water valve off.
Now, my question is: As I am living alone, would you shut the main
water valve off every day before you go to bed and empty all pipes and
open the main water valve the next morning to protect the pipes?
Is there anything that speaks against shutting the main water switch
off every day?
What I am thinking is this: If the plummer is fixing the pipes on
Tuesday, it might cost me dearly. Then he goes, the next day, they
freeze again up on me, etc. And I have to fix them again, and again,
and again, till it is finally spring.
What do you think?
Gene
==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: Why I hate Geico ads
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.consumers.frugal-living/browse_thread/thread/c126ff8f6e76bda5?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:59 pm
From: "Green Xenon [Radium]"
go to show that there was at once a growth of
healthy moral sentiment created among the Chinese, through Sir John
Smale's endeavor, that promised much good for the future had his
course of action been continued. This official planted his feet
squarely upon the doctrine that all buying and selling of human beings
was slavery, and that a human being cannot, in law, "become a slave,
even by his own consent." And moreover this official, with Governor
Hennessey's encouragement, prosecuted his cases without any tender
consideration as to the demands of European libertines, who would be
left with scant opportunities to be self-indulgent unless slaves were
placed at their disposal. The truth is, from the foreign standpoint,
the plea for brothel slavery was based upon the "necessity" of vice,
and from the Chinese standpoint the plea for slavery was based upon
so-called Chinese "custom." The Government was impressed that it must
have consideration for the demands of libertines, and consideration
for Chinese "custom." Neither of these arguments has any worth when
applied to the slave conditions of California, and therefore the most
serious, baffling obstacles to a removal of the evil are out of the
way. Both pretexts, we maintain, were false. There is no necessity for
furnishing vice to libertines; there was no lawful Chinese custom to
be opposed in opposing brothel slavery. But even if these were claimed
to be sufficient arguments across the water, they have no force in
California. There are women, alas! willing to make a trade of their
virtue for _their own gain_, without forcing Chinese women to make a
trade of their virtue for _the gain of masters_. As to Chinese custom:
America is not setting forth inducements for the Chinese to come and
live in our midst, as did Sir Charles Elliott when he promised the
Chinese the privilege of practicing their own social and religious
rites and customs, "pending Her Majesty's pleasure." If Chinese or any
== 2 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:39 pm
From: David Johnston
I would go
at once, and he brought me. I am very glad to live here and lead a
good life."
No. 3. The rescuer was requested to meet a girl at the corner of
Stockton and Jackson streets. She did so. K---- Y---- was comely
and refined looking. She had been sold into a brothel at a tender
age. When about 22 she met a young Chinese man who wished to marry
her, and he paid down $600 for her, promising $1,400 more in time.
Another man objected to the sale, because the girl had mortgaged
herself to him for $600. Through the Mission the girl was released
from her bondage, and remained at the Mission one year and then
married the first man, and they left San Francisco and resided for
a time in an inland town. Here an effort was made to kill her in
her own garden one evening. Her husband brought her back to San
Francisco, and later she went back to China.
No. 4. Came from a brothel on Spofford alley. She was occasionally
allowed to attend the (Chinese) theatre. One evening when at the
theatre she had word conveyed to the Mission to come get her
immediately. The rescuer did so, and the girl promptly arose, when
the rescuer entered the room, from the front tier of seats, and
seizing the hand of the missionary in the presence of them
all climbed over t
== 3 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:59 pm
From: "Kris Baker"
lies great peril to American
womanhood. Whether we wish it to be so or not,--whether we perceive
from the first that it is so or not, there is a solidarity of
womanhood that men and women must reckon with. The man who wrongs
another's daughter perceives afterwards that he wronged his own
daughter thereby. We cannot, without sin against humanity, ask the
scoffer's question, "Am I my sister's keeper?"--not even concerning
the poorest and meanest foreign woman, for the reason that _she is
our sister_. The conditions that surround the Hong Kong slave girl in
California are bound in time to have their influence upon the social,
legal and moral status of all California women, and later of all
American womanhood.
In considering the life history of the Chinese woman living in our
Chinatowns in America, therefore, we are studying matters of vital
importance to us. And in order to a clear understanding of the matter,
we must go back to the beginning of the slave-trade which has brought
these women to the West.
Four points on the south coast of China are of especial interest to
us, b
== 4 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 12:36 pm
From: "Kim"
houses for the detention of
kidnaped people." They declare that these
"inveigle virtuous women or girls to come to Hong Kong, at first
deceiving them by the promise of finding them employment (as
domestic servants), and then proceeding to compel them by force
to become prostitutes, or exporting them to a foreign port, or
distribute them by sale over the different ports of China, boys
being sold to become adopted children, girls being sold to be
trained for prostitution." "Your petitioners are of opinion
that such wicked people are to be found belonging to any of the
[neighboring] districts, but in our district of Tung Kun such
cases of kidnaping are comparatively frequent, and all the
merchants of Hong Kong, without exception, are expressing their
annoyance."
Accompanying the petition was a statement of the situation:
"Hong Kong is the emporium and thoroughfare of all the neighboring
ports. Therefore these kidnapers frequent Hong Kong much, it being
a place where it is easy to buy and to sell, and where effective
means are at hand to make good a speedy escape. Now, the laws
of Hong Kong being based on the principle of the liberty of the
person, the kidnapers take advantage of this to further their own
plans. Thus they use with their victims honeyed speeches, and give
them trifling profits, or they use threats and stern words, all in
order to induce them to say they are willing to do so and so. Even
if they are confronted with witnesses it is difficult to show up
their wicked game.... Kidnaping is a crime to be found everwhere,
but there is no place where it is more rife than at Hong Kong....
Now it is proposed to publish everywhere offers of reward to track
such kidnapers and have them arrested.... The crimes of kidnaping
are increasing from day to day."
Thi
== 5 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:32 pm
From: "John A. Weeks III"
in the
way of the working of the Ordinance; and the Government having, at a
very early stage, determined that its efficacy 'should have a fair
trial,' it doubtless received it at all hands."
During the ten years this law was in operation, there were 411
prosecutions, of which 140 were convictions for keeping unregistered
houses, or houses outside the prescribed bounds. Fines were inflicted
for these offenses and others, adding considerably to the amount
collected regularly each month from each registered house. The
Superintendent of Police, having refused to allow his force to operate
as inspectors of brothels, in 1860 the first inspector was appointed,
and he engaged an English policeman named Barnes to render services as
an informer. This man brought charges in two cases, as to unlicensed
(unregistered) brothels. The second case ended in acquittal,
manifestly on the ground that the charges were trumped up. In the same
year another inspector, Williams, acted as informer, and secured a
conviction against a woman. Later, an inspector by the name of Peam,
who succeeded Williams, employed police constables as informers, and
lent them money f
== 6 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 11:38 am
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
a man with a horse
and wagon, we sprang in and were driven away to where we could
take the street cars for home. The child did some screaming and
crying, at first. But once we were seated in the street car, her
tears were dried and her little tongue rattled along at a rapid
rate; she was delighted to get away.
"The case was in court for some weeks, but the woman was afraid
to appear, and had no one to assist her but the lawyer, and as he
could not prove any good reason why the child should remain with
an immoral woman, we were given the guardianship."
No. 9. A young girl came to San Francisco from China as a
merchant's wife, and missionaries used to visit her at her home in
Chinatown. Once when they went they were told that the wife had
gone to San Jose, but she could not be traced at the latter place,
and the missionary was suspicious. A year passed, and one night
the door bell at the Mission rang, and when it was opened
a Chinese girl fell in a faint from exhaustion, across the
threshold. A colored girl stood by her holding her by the cue.
The colored girl said she saw her running, and divined where she
wished to go, and seizing her by the hair to prevent her being
dragged back, rushed her to the Mission. It was the merchant's
young wife. She had been confined in a brothel not two blocks from
the Mission, and often saw the missionary pass by, but had no
means of attracting her attention. The merchant told her one day
that he wished to take her to a cousin to learn a different way of
dressing her hair, and he would leave her there a day or two while
he was away from town on business. The young wife went without
fear, but never to return to virtue until she escaped to the
Mission. She was tied to a wind
== 7 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 1:24 pm
From: don@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein)
to public prostitution, are too patent facts
to require pointing out."
"The moment we examine closely into Chinese slavery and
servitude," declares Dr. Eitel, "from the standpoint of history
and sociology, we find that slavery and servitude have, with
the exception of the system of eunuchs, lost all barbaric and
revolting features." (!) "As this organism has had its certain
natural evolution, it will as certainly undergo in due time a
natural dissolution, which in fact has at more than one point
already set in. But no legislative or executive measures taken in
Hong Kong will hasten this process, which follows its own course
and its own laws laid down by a wise Providence which happily
overrules for the good all that is evil in the world."
There was, indeed, a certain justice in defending the Chinese as
against the foreigner, on Dr. Eitel's part. But two wrongs do not make
a right. From this time onward, the word of sophistry is put in
the mouth of the advocate of domestic slavery, just as the word of
sophistry had been put in the mouth of the advocate of the Contagious
Diseases Ordinance. Mr. Labouchere had spoken of the latter as a means
of protection' for the poor slaves, and the expression, 'protection,'
has been kept prominently to the front ever since Dr. Eitel suggested,
likewise, not a change in the conditions, but a change in the name by
which they were known. Let it be called 'domestic _servitude_' instead
of 'domestic _slavery_.' All the advocates of this domestic slavery
from that time have called the noxious weed by the sweeter name.
Governor Hennessey asked the opinion of others of his officials. One
Acting Police Magistrate replied 'When the servant girls (or slaves
girls, as some prefer to term them) in the families in this Colony are
contented with their lot, and their parents do not claim them, the
police
== 8 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 12:21 pm
From: TomAldrich@newshosting.com
their life ... They frequently
know neither father nor mother, except what they call a
pocket-mother,--that is, the woman who bought them from others ...
They are owned in Macao and Canton. They are bought as infants.
They come to Hong Kong at 13 or 14, and are deflowered at a
special price which goes to the owners. The owner gets the whole
of their earnings, and even gets presents given to the girls, who
are allowed three or four dollars a month pocket-money. When some
of the girls are sent away on account of age, new ones are got
from Canton. If these girls are not slaves in every sense of the
word, there is no such thing as slavery in existence. If this
buying and selling for the purpose of training female children up
for this life is not slave-dealing, then never was such a thing
as slave-dealing in this world. There are 18,000 to 20,000
prostitutes in Hong Kong to 4,000 or 5,000 respectable Chinese
women.... Once in five years the stock has to be renewed. It is
for this purpose, and not for the legiti
== 9 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 11:28 am
From: Daniel Carey
the
family relations of any kidnaped person, who would see to such persons
being restored to their families upon guarantee being given for proper
treatment; and in cases where restoration was impossible or not
advisable, they would take charge of such kidnaped persons, maintain
them, and eventually see them respectably married. It was then decided
that the Magistrates present should draw up a succinct statement of
the provisions of the British law forbidding the sale of persons and
guaranteeing the liberty of the subject, which should be translated
into Chinese, and circulated freely in the neighboring districts.
Although the action on the part of the Chinese merchants in forming
themselves into an organization to put down kidnaping was received
with much appreciation by the Governor and Secretary of State at
London, as well as by many of the officials at Hon' Kong, there were
those who from the first doubted whether the motives of the Chinese in
thus uniting were wholly disinterested on the part of the majority.
Such were confirmed in their doubts by the action of these same
Chinese as soon as Sir John Smale set to work in earnest to
exterminate slavery, and declared in his court a year later than the
formation of this Chinese Society:
"I was given to understand that buying children by respectable
Chinamen as servants was according to Chinese customs, and that to
attempt to put it down would be to arouse the prejudices of the
Chinese.... Humanity is of
== 10 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 11:45 am
From: Daniel Carey
given over to it. "Flower-boats" were probably never unknown to
this river, but, besides their use as brothels, they became stocked
with little girls under training for vice, under the incitement of an
ever-growing slave trade. These little girls were bought, stolen or
enticed from the mainland by these river people, to swell the number
of their own children destined to the infamous slave trade. Chinese
law forbids this kind of slavery, but, as we have seen, the Tanka
people were sort of outlaws, the river life facilitated such a
business, and Hong Kong was near at hand.
In later years Dr. Eitel, Chinese interpreter to the Governor, stated:
"Almost every so-called 'protected woman,' i.e. kept mistress of
foreigners here, belongs to the Tanka tribe, looked down upon and kept
at a distance by all the other Chinese classes. It is among these
Tanka women, and especially under the protection of these 'protected'
Tanka women, that private prostitution and the sale of girls for
concubinage flourishes, being looked upon as a legitimate profession.
Consequently, almost every 'protected woman' keeps a nursery of
purchased children or a few servant girls who are being reared with
a view to their eventual disposal, according to their personal
qualifications, either among foreigners here as kept women, or among
Chinese residents as their concubines, or to be sold for export to
Singapore, San Francisco, or Australia. Those 'protected women,'
moreover, generally act as 'protectors' each to a few other Tanka
women who live by sly prostitution."
When once a man enters the service of Satan he is generally pressed
along into it to lengths he did not at first intend to go. So it
proved in the case of many foreigners at Hong Kong. The foreigner
extended his "protection" to a native mistress. That "protected woman"
extended his name as "protector" over the inmates of her secret
brothel; and into that house protected largely from official
interference, purchased and kidnaped gir
== 11 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:47 pm
From: Shawn Hirn
in her need of money sold me. Took me to
Hong Kong and sold me to a woman; saw the money paid, but do not
know how much; it looked a great deal. This was 3 years ago. The
woman promised my mother to make me her own daughter, and little
did my mother know I was to be a slave, to be beaten and abused by
a cruel mistress. My mother cried when she left me; it was very
hard to part. The big ship, 'City of Pekin,' took me soon out of
sight. I have heard that she is now dead. On arriving we did not
come ashore immediately. I was landed after 4 days. There was
trouble in landing me. I had a red paper, bought at Hong Kong,
that they called a certificate, and there was trouble about it.
The woman who bought me had no trouble getting ashore because she
had lived in California before. She told me what I was to say when
I was questioned. She told me I must swear I was her own daughter.
The Judge asked, 'Is this your own mother?' and I said, 'Yes.'
This was a lie, but I did not know it was wrong to do as I was
told, and I was afraid of my mistress. The Judge said, 'Did this
woman give you birth?' and I said, 'Yes.' The Judge said, 'Did
anybody tell you to say all this?" and I said, 'No,' because my
mistress had instructed me how to answer this question, if it was
asked me. She taught me on ship-board what to say if I was taken
to cour
== 12 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:59 pm
From: "Joel Olson"
One of our party asking
her if she could sing, she thought the statement was made that she
was not 'sixteen' (the age under which girls are supposed to be
'protected' from going into prostitution by British rule), and
shouted, 'I am _seventeen_.' We stayed only a few minutes, but
were informed that they provided opium and intoxicating liquors
here."
We told our hostess one day that we desired jinrikshas that we might
be conveyed to the Protectorate to interview the Chief Inspector,
having heard that he desired an interview. As we were leaving the
house she detained us a moment to say, timidly: "Ladies, do pardon me,
but I feel I must caution you that that man has a very violent temper,
and it will not do in case you see anything, to criticise,--no matter
what you think. I don't wish to seem to intrude, but I know the man's
reputation as to temper, and I cannot bear to think of his having a
chance to treat you rudely." We thanked her heartily, and promised to
be doubly careful.
We knew the place. A very imposing Government building standing apart
by itself, upon which much money had been expended to give it a fine
appearance. We were soon ushered into the presence of the man who held
the same relation to the work at Singapore that John Lee holds, or at
least held the last we knew, at Hong Kong. Will you believe us, when
we tell you that to our amazement it was that same white-haired old
man to whom we had been introduced at the church gathering as such an
active Christian, "working along much the same lines as ourselves, and
at the head and front of every good work in the Colony?" To be sure we
had heard the name of this Inspector, but we had never in our remotest
conception connected it with the man the Doctor had introduced to us.
Conce
== 13 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 2:42 pm
From: "Unique"
has
sheltered itself under its wing, as it were; and lastly, at Singapore
coolie labor is managed by the same set of officials. What these
officials have done has been accepted by the Oriental people about
them as done by the Christian civilization. It cannot be said that the
evils mentioned above have been the outgrowth of Oriental conditions
and customs, principally. It has been rather the misfortune of
the Orient that there were brought to their borders by Western
civilization elements calculated to induce their criminal classes to
ally themselves with these aggressive and stronger "Christians" to
destroy safeguards which had been heretofore sufficient, for the most
part, to conserve Chinese social morality.
Christian people, even as far back as Sir John Bowring, Governor
of Hong Kong, and up to the present time, both at Hong Kong and
Singapore, have acquiesced in the false teaching that vice cannot be
put under check in the Orient, where, it is claimed, passion mounts
higher than in the Occident, and that morality is, to a certain
extent, a matter of climate; and in the presence of large numbers of
unmarried soldiers and sailors it is simply "impracticable" to attempt
repressive measures in dealing with social vice. These Christians
have listened
== 14 of 14 ==
Date: Sun, Jan 20 2008 11:18 am
From: Anthony Matonak
Oh, that men really gloried in such self-sacrifice, and
held it forth as the worthiest principle of life! Did Sir John Bowring
hold aloft such a Cross as this, and, with his Master, recommend it
to the world as the means of its elevation and emancipation from the
blight of sin? We shall not judge him individually. His example should
be a warning to the fact that even the most religious men can too
often hold very different views of life according to whether they are
embodied in religious sentiments or in one's politics. But nowhere are
right moral conceptions more needed (not in hymn-book nor in church),
as in the enactments by which one's fellow-beings are governed. Other
religious men not so conspicuous as Sir John Bowring, but of more
enlightened days than his, have died and left on earth a testimony to
strangely divergent views and principles, according to whether they
were crystallized in religious sentiments, or in the laws of the land,
and according to whether they legislated for men or for women.
On May 2nd, 1856, Sir John Bowring, Governor of Hong Kong, wrote to
the Secretary of State for the Colonies at London submitting a draft
of an Ordinance which was desired at Hong Kong because of certain
conditions prevailing at Hong Kong which were described in the
enclosures in his despatch. Mr. Labouchere, the Secretary of State for
the Colonies at the time, replied to the Governor's rep
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